Setting up a MoCA with spectrum as the provider - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1 of 23 Old 02-16-2019, 09:00 PM - Thread Starter
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Setting up a MoCA with spectrum as the provider

Hey guys,

Recently built a home theater in part of my unfinished basement. Turns out I forgot to run an Ethernet cable to my media cabinet and I’m kind of at the point of no return on that oversight....

However, I do have a coax line there for my cable box. I would prefer my AV reciever and Apple TV be hard wired to the internet instead of WiFi as the router and modem are rather far away. Moving the modem/router is also not an option as it’s currently in a specific place upstairs so that other things can be hardwired as well.

I’d like to utilize the coax already in the wall via MoCA adaptors but I’m reading spectrum disables that ability in the modem. Is there away to get around this?

I’ve read in a couple different places that it’s possible with a filter at the POE but I don’t understand what any of this means?

Any help would be greatly appreciated!!!


P.S. Do not want to use a powerline network adapter as they didn’t work for crap in a buddy’s house.

Thanks in advance,

-Sean




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Last edited by SuLax22; 02-17-2019 at 08:12 AM.
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post #2 of 23 Old 02-17-2019, 10:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SuLax22 View Post
Hey guys,

Recently built a home theater in part of my unfinished basement. Turns out I forgot to run an Ethernet cable to my media cabinet and I’m kind of at the point of no return on that oversight....

However, I do have a coax line there for my cable box. I would prefer my AV reciever and Apple TV be hard wired to the internet instead of WiFi as the router and modem are rather far away. Moving the modem/router is also not an option as it’s currently in a specific place upstairs so that other things can be hardwired as well.

I’d like to utilize the coax already in the wall via MoCA adaptors but I’m reading spectrum disables that ability in the modem. Is there away to get around this?

I’ve read in a couple different places that it’s possible with a filter at the POE but I don’t understand what any of this means?

Any help would be greatly appreciated!!!


P.S. Do not want to use a powerline network adapter as they didn’t work for crap in a buddy’s house.

Thanks in advance,

-Sean

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Spectrum really has nothing to do with it. Within a 100 mile radius of me Spectrum has 3-4 different hardware systems for cable. The internet, cable TV, and MoCA all use different frequencies while sharing the same cable/wire.

You'll want to buy a POE filter, Point Of Entry filter. The POE is installed where your cable enters the house. You can do this inside your house between the cable and first splitter, it just screws in, in line with the cable. The POE filter simply stops your MoCA network frequencies from flowing back outside your home where your neighbor or anyone else could share the use of your network.

Make sure that all of your splitters have sufficient bandwidth to pass the MoCA frequencies, 5-1675Mhz. Replace what you have if they don't

Buy/use Bonded MoCA 2.0 adapters. You will need 2 units, one to set-up MoCA at your cable modem and router and one for your remote location.

Wire as per the modifications I made to your diagram.

You can add up to 16 MoCA adapters to the network as you need them anywhere you have a cable drop. I would recommend the Actiontec ECB6200 Bonded MoCA adapters.
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post #3 of 23 Old 02-17-2019, 01:48 PM
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In my experience, you will get Ok but not great bandwidth with MoCA. I am getting about 80 mpbs from the living room to my NAS / Plex server, which is enough to stream 4k from Netflix or even some 4k movies I have on the Plex server. However, I do have a few 4k movies that require more than 80 mbps due to high bitrate, so they cannot be streamed via the MoCA. Overall though, it gets the job done just fine. I have a dedicated HT in another room, and did go through the trouble of running a gigabit ethernet connection from that room to my office (where my cable modem is). These are the MoCA adapters I have, and have been using them for quite a few years.


https://www.actiontec.com/products/ecb2500c/
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post #4 of 23 Old 02-17-2019, 02:32 PM - Thread Starter
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Thank you so much for the illustration and the instructions. That’s beyond helpful!!!

Just a follow up question: how do I know if the coax splitters I have are up to the task?


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post #5 of 23 Old 02-17-2019, 04:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SuLax22 View Post
Thank you so much for the illustration and the instructions. That’s beyond helpful!!!

Just a follow up question: how do I know if the coax splitters I have are up to the task?


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Should be labeled on the front of the splitter.

In our area, Spectrum has been using 5-1002MHz Antronix branded splitters. They should be/can be OK for you but it not you'll need to install 5-1675 MHz units.

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post #6 of 23 Old 02-17-2019, 04:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by m0j0 View Post
In my experience, you will get Ok but not great bandwidth with MoCA. I am getting about 80 mpbs from the living room to my NAS / Plex server, which is enough to stream 4k from Netflix or even some 4k movies I have on the Plex server. However, I do have a few 4k movies that require more than 80 mbps due to high bitrate, so they cannot be streamed via the MoCA. Overall though, it gets the job done just fine. I have a dedicated HT in another room, and did go through the trouble of running a gigabit ethernet connection from that room to my office (where my cable modem is). These are the MoCA adapters I have, and have been using them for quite a few years.


https://www.actiontec.com/products/ecb2500c/

Your reported speeds are in the MoCA 1.0 version range. Your link is pointing to MoCA 2.0 version hardware which has been available for ~2 years now. MoCA 2.0 will support gigabit now. Maybe you want to take a look at your MoCA hardware.
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post #7 of 23 Old 02-17-2019, 04:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by b curry View Post
Your reported speeds are in the MoCA 1.0 version range. Your link is pointing to MoCA 2.0 version hardware which has been available for ~2 years now. MoCA 2.0 will support gigabit now. Maybe you want to take a look at your MoCA hardware.
Hadn’t given it much thought, but would probably be worth it if the speeds are that much faster. I have had these actiontec devices at least 5 years. Thanks for the info!
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post #8 of 23 Old 02-17-2019, 05:04 PM
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Hadn’t given it much thought, but would probably be worth it if the speeds are that much faster. I have had these actiontec devices at least 5 years. Thanks for the info!
Yeah, it's worth a look. I've v1.1 installed which are spec'ed at 175Mbps and I get around 120-150Mbps. MoCA v1.0 was spec'ed at 100Mbps. I'm looking at upgrading to Bonded v2.0 which is spec'ed at 1Gbps.

There is a v2.5 now but it seems to be impossible to your hands on the hardware. It's rated at 2.5Gbps with security protocol built in, no POE filter required.
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post #9 of 23 Old 02-23-2019, 11:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by b curry View Post
Make sure that all of your splitters have sufficient bandwidth to pass the MoCA frequencies, 5-1675Mhz. Replace what you have if they don't
Quote:
Originally Posted by SuLax22 View Post
Just a follow up question: how do I know if the coax splitters I have are up to the task?
Holland's GHS-PRO-M series (e.g.) is preferable, not just because they're spec'd to cover the MoCA frequency spectrum (through 1675 MHz), but also because they're designed to have lower output port isolation at MoCA frequencies ... valuable for MoCA's port jumping needs.

MoCA can work with most cable-rated splitters, but splitters designed for MoCA become more important as the size/complexity of the MoCA network expands. (MoCA has a 57 dB node-to-node loss limit.)


Quote:
Originally Posted by m0j0 View Post
In my experience, you will get Ok but not great bandwidth with MoCA. I am getting about 80 mbps ... These are the MoCA adapters I have...

https://www.actiontec.com/products/ecb2500c/
Right, just MoCA 1.1 adapters ... and not really even that, if push comes to shove, since Actiontec used a Fast Ethernet port in them, rather than Gigabit ... limiting their throughput to FastE's 100 Mbps max. MoCA 1.1 adapters with Gigabit ports (ECB3500T, WCB3000N, FiOS MI424-WR gateway) are typically capable of 150 Mbps.

But MoCA 2.0, as recommended by b_curry, offers significant increases ... theoretical 400 Mbps for standard 2.0, 800 Mbps bonded ... each with an add'l 25% performance boost for 2-node TURBO setups (e.g.). Just keep in mind that, being peer-to-peer, two nodes will negotiate a connection at the highest MoCA spec supported by both nodes.


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Originally Posted by b curry View Post
Your link is pointing to MoCA 2.0 version hardware which has been available for ~2 years now.
Well, to be fair, the link *is* for the ECB2500C, but Actiontec is overlaying a redirect prompt to take you to the ECB6200. Click "No Thanks" and you'll be on the ECB2500C page.


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Originally Posted by b curry View Post
I would recommend the Actiontec ECB6200 Bonded MoCA adapters.
Any particular reason for this recommendation over the Motorola MM1000 Bonded 2.0 adapters (product page, Amazon)?
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post #10 of 23 Old 02-24-2019, 06:54 AM
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Any particular reason for this recommendation over the Motorola MM1000 Bonded 2.0 adapters (product page, Amazon)?
No, more semantics than anything. My recommendation or point was for installing Bonded technology vs. brand name. There is still some Actiontec ECB6000K02 MoCA 2.0 (not bonded) product floating around and usually for a very small cost difference one can step-up to Bonded units and pick up the extra bandwidth.

The Actiontec units are easier to find in store's in my area. If you're ordering online might as well buy on price and the Motorola MM1000 has a better price. Truth be known, they are both probably using the same chipset.
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post #11 of 23 Old 02-24-2019, 07:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by krkaufman View Post
Any particular reason for this recommendation over the Motorola MM1000 Bonded 2.0 adapters (product page, Amazon)?
No, more semantics than anything. My recommendation or point was for installing Bonded technology vs. brand name. There is still some Actiontec ECB6000K02 MoCA 2.0 (not bonded) product floating around and usually for a very small cost difference one can step-up to Bonded units and pick up the extra bandwidth.

The Actiontec units are easier to find in store's in my area. If you're ordering online might as well buy on price and the Motorola MM1000 has a better price. Truth be known, they are both probably using the same chipset.
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post #12 of 23 Old 09-20-2019, 07:45 AM
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Hello Piggy-backing off this post -


I, too, have Spectrum (internet only, no cable) in a 5 yr old house wired with coax (PPC 9-port CATV MoCA compatible) in every room .


I am looking into getting a MoCA adapter for use with my tv. All of our viewing is streaming off a WiFi signal.


Given that PPC says my CATV is MoCA compatible:
  • Do I still need to purchase the POE filter referenced in this thread?
  • If yes, would I attach it between the incoming cable and the port labeled "Input"?



Feel free to reply as if you're explaining to a child; I am not a technician of any kind. Thanks in advance.
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post #13 of 23 Old 09-20-2019, 08:33 AM
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I also, sorry, want to jump in on this. My router is upstairs and im running wifi to my HT downstairs. I also wanted to have a wired connection. I have spectrum cable run to my downstairs.
After reading this am i not able to put a splitter on the cable and run one line back to the box and one to a modem?

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post #14 of 23 Old 09-20-2019, 08:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EllieD View Post
Hello Piggy-backing off this post -


I, too, have Spectrum (internet only, no cable) in a 5 yr old house wired with coax (PPC 9-port CATV MoCA compatible) in every room .


I am looking into getting a MoCA adapter for use with my tv. All of our viewing is streaming off a WiFi signal.


Given that PPC says my CATV is MoCA compatible:
  • Do I still need to purchase the POE filter referenced in this thread?
  • If yes, would I attach it between the incoming cable and the port labeled "Input"?



Feel free to reply as if you're explaining to a child; I am not a technician of any kind. Thanks in advance.



Yes and yes.

The POE is a Point Of Entry filter. It's purpose is to keep your network data from flowing back outside. In other words it blocks the MoCA frequencies from feeding back outside and keeps it inside your MoCA network.

The POE filter is positioned at the point where the cable comes into your house, typically before any splitters inside.

Looks like PCC has two versions of that amplifier/splitter. The tear sheet that you've attached shows that apparently it does not have the MoCA POE filter, but it looks like they have a version that does. You'll need to sort that out.

You can see both and the difference here:

https://www.ppc-online.com/drop-ampl...-and-splitters
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post #15 of 23 Old 09-20-2019, 09:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeff5347 View Post
I also, sorry, want to jump in on this. My router is upstairs and im running wifi to my HT downstairs. I also wanted to have a wired connection. I have spectrum cable run to my downstairs.
After reading this am i not able to put a splitter on the cable and run one line back to the box and one to a modem?

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MoCA is designed to use your existing cable runs as a network.

The first MoCA adapter is connected to your Modem/Router or Router to establish the MoCA network. The second and or additional MoCA adapters are essentially drops at the end of a cable, in another room usually, where a device that requires an Ethernet connection can connect.

MoCA works by modulating (up converting) and de-modulating (down converting) the Ethernet signal. So Ethernet frequenciey > MoCA frequency over tv coax cable > back to Ethernet frequency.

I don't fully understand your question, but no, you should not have to use a splitter and an additional cable. You would establish the MoCA network at the Router and a second MoCA adapter at the end of the cable down stairs.

Don't forget a POE filter where the cable enters your house.
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Yes and yes.

The POE is a Point Of Entry filter. It's purpose is to keep your network data from flowing back outside. In other words it blocks the MoCA frequencies from feeding back outside and keeps it inside your MoCA network.

The POE filter is positioned at the point where the cable comes into your house, typically before any splitters inside.

Looks like PCC has two versions of that amplifier/splitter. The tear sheet that you've attached shows that apparently it does not have the MoCA POE filter, but it looks like they have a version that does. You'll need to sort that out.

You can see both and the difference here:

Thank you, b curry, for taking the time to reply.


I found a PPC branded POE filter (can't use links yet) and it looks like a simple install. Should I turn off the power to the amp before fiddling with the incoming cable?
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post #17 of 23 Old 09-20-2019, 12:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EllieD View Post
Thank you, b curry, for taking the time to reply.


I found a PPC branded POE filter (can't use links yet) and it looks like a simple install. Should I turn off the power to the amp before fiddling with the incoming cable?
Yes, it's a good idea.

It should be a simple inline screw in device.
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post #18 of 23 Old 09-27-2019, 09:49 AM
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Help!


All parts have arrived - POE filter, 2 MoCA adapters. I installed the POE filter at the incoming line/amp panel. I'm not sure how to proceed as I've run into some problems.


Here's what I've got:
A modem with only 2 ports

  • 1 coax
  • 1 ethernet

A wifi router with

  • 1 incoming ethernet port
  • 4 outgoing ethernet ports
Normally, coax cable goes into modem, ethernet cable goes from modem to wifi router, everything works fine.



The MoCA directions tell me to plug the coax cable into the adapter and ethernet cable from adapter to ethernet port of modem/router. This is where I get hung up:
  1. My modem has only 2 ports - one for incoming coax and one for outgoing ethernet. So if I follow the instructions, there is no way to connect the modem to the router, as there is not a 3rd port.
  2. When I test out the modem only (coax cable from wall to adapter, ethernet cable from adapter to modem), my modem does not recognize internet service
I tried running coax cable to MoCA adapter, ethernet from adapter to ROUTER ethernet port outgoing, ROUTER ethernet incoming port to modem ethernet. No joy.


Help?
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EllieD View Post
Help!


All parts have arrived - POE filter, 2 MoCA adapters. I installed the POE filter at the incoming line/amp panel. I'm not sure how to proceed as I've run into some problems.


Here's what I've got:
A modem with only 2 ports

  • 1 coax
  • 1 ethernet

A wifi router with

  • 1 incoming ethernet port
  • 4 outgoing ethernet ports
Normally, coax cable goes into modem, ethernet cable goes from modem to wifi router, everything works fine.



The MoCA directions tell me to plug the coax cable into the adapter and ethernet cable from adapter to ethernet port of modem/router. This is where I get hung up:
  1. My modem has only 2 ports - one for incoming coax and one for outgoing ethernet. So if I follow the instructions, there is no way to connect the modem to the router, as there is not a 3rd port.
  2. When I test out the modem only (coax cable from wall to adapter, ethernet cable from adapter to modem), my modem does not recognize internet service
I tried running coax cable to MoCA adapter, ethernet from adapter to ROUTER ethernet port outgoing, ROUTER ethernet incoming port to modem ethernet. No joy.


Help?
I forgot to add (and can't edit)


The 2nd adapter is setup upstairs in my media room. The setup I'm struggling with is the incoming internet.
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post #20 of 23 Old 09-27-2019, 10:43 AM
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Ok, I thought I found my problem. I had disconnected the splitter the first time it didn't work. I've reconnected it.



Connections seem to be proper. My modem will not register Online.
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post #21 of 23 Old 09-27-2019, 12:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EllieD View Post
Ok, I thought I found my problem. I had disconnected the splitter the first time it didn't work. I've reconnected it.



Connections seem to be proper. My modem will not register Online.
I think you still need an ethernet cable between your modem and router.

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post #22 of 23 Old 09-27-2019, 12:48 PM
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Just looking at your drawing again, and with your set up, I'm not even sure you need that splitter. You should be able to go Coax from the wall to the Moca Adapter. Coax out from the adapter to the Modem. Ethernet from the Modem to the Router, and then Ethernet from the Router back to the Moca Adapter. I think that should work.

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post #23 of 23 Old 09-28-2019, 06:59 AM
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I have 3 Motorola MM1000s. One is connected to my router and the others are in two different room. My house is wired with RG59 and I use my old Dish Network diplexers from 2003 to split OTA/internet. I dropped Dish in 2008 and just use OTA and cable internet. I have read the diplexers are only necessary for OTA channels above 50 MHz. With OTA repack coming soon to my area I probably don't even need them but since everything is working I'll leave well enough alone.


Anyway, I get around 920 mbps to all rooms.


I've been thinking of adding a fourth MM1000 to the system in a room where I'm only getting 58% wi-fi strength (at best). Price has jumped up to $70 (was $60 when I got them earlier this year) but that's a small price to pay to not have to hack up my drywall.
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