New Nvidia Shield TV Pro announced! Faster SOC, Dolby Vision, new remote! - Page 125 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #3721 of 4513 Old 05-22-2020, 12:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HD-Master View Post
Well..not exactly. A bit of a jumble there.

HDR is HDR. DV, HDR10, HDR10+ and HLG are versions of HDR.

HLG is used primarily for broadcast TV (BBC has used it and some US broadcasters at times)

HDR10 is the baseline standard for HDR and all HDR equipment and content is backwards compatible with HDR10. It offers static metadata, so the HDR values apply to the entire show or movie.

Dolby Vision (DV) and HDR10+ offer dynamic metadata that allow the HDR values to vary from scene to scene.

Dolby Vision requires a licensing fee, while HDR10+ does not require the same licensing fees (it’s not free-use, but much cheaper). The vast majority of competitors haven’t been keen to jump on board, so it is almost exclusively limited to Samsung displays.

Dolby Vision and HDR10+ should offer a better experience than vanilla HDR10, but generally speaking the noticeable differences are minimum or non-existent. A lot of people test both versions of the same UHD’s and don’t see a big difference between them.


My 2019 TCL 6-Series QLED R625 Calibrated Settings

It’s pretty minor and non existent if you have software that does dynamic tonemapping, or even a display that allows you to upload custom tone curves.
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post #3722 of 4513 Old 05-22-2020, 01:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HD-Master View Post
Well..not exactly. A bit of a jumble there.

HDR is HDR. DV, HDR10, HDR10+ and HLG are versions of HDR.

HLG is used primarily for broadcast TV (BBC has used it and some US broadcasters at times)

HDR10 is the baseline standard for HDR and all HDR equipment and content is backwards compatible with HDR10. It offers static metadata, so the HDR values apply to the entire show or movie.

Dolby Vision (DV) and HDR10+ offer dynamic metadata that allow the HDR values to vary from scene to scene.

Dolby Vision requires a licensing fee, while HDR10+ does not require the same licensing fees (it’s not free-use, but much cheaper). The vast majority of competitors haven’t been keen to jump on board, so it is almost exclusively limited to Samsung displays.

Dolby Vision and HDR10+ should offer a better experience than vanilla HDR10, but generally speaking the noticeable differences are minimum or non-existent. A lot of people test both versions of the same UHD’s and don’t see a big difference between them.


My 2019 TCL 6-Series QLED R625 Calibrated Settings
In addition to licensing fees to Dolby, DV defeats all user control of the image in the display, so that the programmer of the metadata knows what the display will look like.

I use a projector, so no DV for me, since they can't know the screen size and reflectivity, so they can't know how bright the image will be.

Instead, I use a projector that does dynamic tone-mapping itself, based not on metadata but on real-time analysis of the incoming image (they call it Frame-Adapt HDR) - and they don't stop users from making their own tweaks to the projector's other settings.

To let us adjust it for the basic brightness of the image the tone mapping has High, Medium and Low settings, as well as the projector's other adjustments like bulb high, medium and low and the maximum opening of the dynamic iris (if you're a photographer, think of that as the lens' maximum f/stop.) I have a large image on a low-reflectivity screen, so I set all the controls for maximum light, and let the projector's dynamic tone-mapping do the rest.

So do I care about DV? Nope.

And I love the Shield's AI upscaling. I only wish I could use it on the output of my disk player for BDs and DVDs - although Oppo has always been very good at upscaling.
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post #3723 of 4513 Old 05-22-2020, 01:31 PM
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New Nvidia Shield TV Pro announced! Faster SOC, Dolby Vision, new remote!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Philnick View Post
In addition to licensing fees to Dolby, DV defeats all user control of the image in the display, so that the programmer of the metadata knows what the display will look like.

I use a projector, so no DV for me, since they can't know the screen size and reflectivity, so they can't know how bright the image will be.

Instead, I use a projector that does dynamic tone-mapping itself, based not on metadata but on real-time analysis of the incoming image (they call it Frame-Adapt HDR) - and they don't stop users from making their own tweaks to the projector's other settings.

To let us adjust it for the basic brightness of the image the tone mapping has High, Medium and Low settings, as well as the projector's other adjustments like bulb high, medium and low and the maximum opening of the dynamic iris (if you're a photographer, think of that as the lens' maximum f/stop.) I have a large image on a low-reflectivity screen, so I set all the controls for maximum light, and let the projector's dynamic tone-mapping do the rest.

So do I care about DV? Nope.

And I love the Shield's AI upscaling. I only wish I could use it on the output of my disk player for BDs and DVDs - although Oppo has always been very good at upscaling.

Yeah, frame by frame analysis for dynamic tone mapping would be a great feature on the shield.
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post #3724 of 4513 Old 05-22-2020, 01:45 PM
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Hey guys. I've had my 2019 Shield (tube not Pro) set up for a couple of weeks, and it still suffers from a notable number of random audio drops and sometimes slight frame jumps when watching 4k disc rips via Plex. I have confirmed they are random, and not constant, as they are not there when skipping back and replaying. I'm aware of the rolling history of audio drops in this situation, but I thought all of the random drops were all addressed with the recent firmware update. (Shield firmware and Plex server are both up-to-date.)

The Shield (and media PC server) are connected directly to the router via network cable.

Anything I should be looking into to diagnose/validate my setup? Thanks.

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post #3725 of 4513 Old 05-22-2020, 04:30 PM
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I have a Shield Pro 2019 hooked up to my older LG 65C7 OLED in the basement exercise room and had a Sony soundbar that wordless driven. I just swapped that for a LG SL9YG to get ATMOS and better surround impact. It works great, but often when first powering up it appears the soundbar might be impacting the HDCP handshake as Vudu and Disney+ show all the DV titles as HD. If I go into the Shield Device settings and then turn off DV and back on to force the devices to handshake then titles show DV again. Has anyone else had similar issues with the a Shield? I like the soundbar, but will send it back if this is not fixable.

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Man, after getting sick of using WiFi I finally moved the router to the living room, moved my HDD to the router and rescraped my entire Kodi library only to find out the shield is complete trash at mounting to network shares. It constantly fails to connect for no reason. Restarting does nothing. Anyone else or is my unit just garbage?
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Reckoner89 View Post
Man, after getting sick of using WiFi I finally moved the router to the living room, moved my HDD to the router and rescraped my entire Kodi library only to find out the shield is complete trash at mounting to network shares. It constantly fails to connect for no reason. Restarting does nothing. Anyone else or is my unit just garbage?
I have a couple of 2019 Shields, Ethernet to router, then ethernet to Synology NAS. Kodi runs 100% solid, no network share (SMB) issues.

I have had bad experiences in the past trying to use a router to serve up shares.
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post #3728 of 4513 Old 05-22-2020, 08:24 PM
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Originally Posted by Dave_O View Post
I have a couple of 2019 Shields, Ethernet to router, then ethernet to Synology NAS. Kodi runs 100% solid, no network share (SMB) issues.

I have had bad experiences in the past trying to use a router to serve up shares.
I was afraid that might be the problem. I really didn't want to shell out the dough for a NAS right now but it seems I may have to.
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post #3729 of 4513 Old 05-23-2020, 01:08 AM
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Originally Posted by Philnick View Post
In addition to licensing fees to Dolby, DV defeats all user control of the image in the display, so that the programmer of the metadata knows what the display will look like.
Actually, that's not quite accurate. While you can't change to other picture modes (typically things like "vivid", "standard", "sports", etc) you can adjust the image quality in the Dolby Vision mode itself.
As a matter of fact people should do that because I've seen complaints that DV mode was too dark, too bright, etc. - they never bothered to adjust and calibrate their picture in DV mode separately.

HDR10+ is Samsung's attempt to both avoid Dolby licensing and collect licensing on their own - there is a yearly fee as opposed to a per-device fee.
They also have rights to the IP if another manufacturer makes changes to the "open" HDR10+ standard.

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post #3730 of 4513 Old 05-23-2020, 04:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Reckoner89 View Post
I was afraid that might be the problem. I really didn't want to shell out the dough for a NAS right now but it seems I may have to.
For a different perspective, I've got the 2019 Pro connected via GB ethernet, using Kodi to play local content. Some is on a 3TB Seagate Share (poor man's NAS?), some on a 6TB external HD connecting to my Netgear router's USB port. None run 24/7 like a real NAS, so oftentimes when I first try to connect Kodi can't find them because they are just starting to spin up, but then I "OK" out of error messages and things work fine. YMMV

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Originally Posted by Suntan View Post
Hey guys. I've had my 2019 Shield (tube not Pro) set up for a couple of weeks, and it still suffers from a notable number of random audio drops and sometimes slight frame jumps when watching 4k disc rips via Plex. I have confirmed they are random, and not constant, as they are not there when skipping back and replaying. I'm aware of the rolling history of audio drops in this situation, but I thought all of the random drops were all addressed with the recent firmware update. (Shield firmware and Plex server are both up-to-date.)

The Shield (and media PC server) are connected directly to the router via network cable.

Anything I should be looking into to diagnose/validate my setup? Thanks.

I have a similar HTPC (Plex/Ethernet)->Router->2019 Shield (Plex/Ethernet) set up and Plex worked well except for high bit rate files. On the HTPC I set up SMB shares to the video files, installed VLC on the 2019 Shield, but still had audio issues. Digging into the VLC advanced audio settings I changed the default "Audio Track" to "OpenSL ES" and then playback using VLC on the Shield had zero issues, including the highest bit rate rips.

I'd give that a try to see if it can help your situation. I could never get the Plex player reliably playing high bit rate rips so there maybe alternate solutions but this one worked for me.
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post #3732 of 4513 Old 05-23-2020, 07:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Philnick View Post
In addition to licensing fees to Dolby, DV defeats all user control of the image in the display, so that the programmer of the metadata knows what the display will look like.

I use a projector, so no DV for me, since they can't know the screen size and reflectivity, so they can't know how bright the image will be.

Instead, I use a projector that does dynamic tone-mapping itself, based not on metadata but on real-time analysis of the incoming image (they call it Frame-Adapt HDR) - and they don't stop users from making their own tweaks to the projector's other settings.

To let us adjust it for the basic brightness of the image the tone mapping has High, Medium and Low settings, as well as the projector's other adjustments like bulb high, medium and low and the maximum opening of the dynamic iris (if you're a photographer, think of that as the lens' maximum f/stop.) I have a large image on a low-reflectivity screen, so I set all the controls for maximum light, and let the projector's dynamic tone-mapping do the rest.

So do I care about DV? Nope.

And I love the Shield's AI upscaling. I only wish I could use it on the output of my disk player for BDs and DVDs - although Oppo has always been very good at upscaling.

No, you can change most picture image settings. A few are grayed out but definitely not “all”.


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post #3733 of 4513 Old 05-23-2020, 07:55 AM
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I stand corrected about the ability to tweak the image when running in Dolby Vision. That's what I had read, explained by that they wanted it to be a sealed system with known behavior.

If you folks can tweak it, I believe you and am just puzzled.

Phil
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post #3734 of 4513 Old 05-23-2020, 09:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Reckoner89 View Post
Man, after getting sick of using WiFi I finally moved the router to the living room, moved my HDD to the router and rescraped my entire Kodi library only to find out the shield is complete trash at mounting to network shares. It constantly fails to connect for no reason. Restarting does nothing. Anyone else or is my unit just garbage?
No problems here with my 2017 or 2019 Shields using Kodi to access my network content. I have three unRAID servers and several NAS devices on my netwrok.

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Quote:
Originally Posted by HD-Master View Post
Well..not exactly. A bit of a jumble there.

HDR is HDR. DV, HDR10, HDR10+ and HLG are versions of HDR.

HLG is used primarily for broadcast TV (BBC has used it and some US broadcasters at times)

HDR10 is the baseline standard for HDR and all HDR equipment and content is backwards compatible with HDR10. It offers static metadata, so the HDR values apply to the entire show or movie.

Dolby Vision (DV) and HDR10+ offer dynamic metadata that allow the HDR values to vary from scene to scene.

Dolby Vision requires a licensing fee, while HDR10+ does not require the same licensing fees (it’s not free-use, but much cheaper). The vast majority of competitors haven’t been keen to jump on board, so it is almost exclusively limited to Samsung displays.

Dolby Vision and HDR10+ should offer a better experience than vanilla HDR10, but generally speaking the noticeable differences are minimum or non-existent. A lot of people test both versions of the same UHD’s and don’t see a big difference between them.


My 2019 TCL 6-Series QLED R625 Calibrated Settings
I knew I wasn't explaining it very well. Thanks for the excellent correction!

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post #3736 of 4513 Old 05-23-2020, 11:43 AM
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Maybe I am a dimbulb. But, I see no menu item labeled as pass through. Explain how to do it. Thanks
Display & Sound - Advanced sound settings: switch off Dolby audio processing.

Available formats: Auto

Stereo upmix: Off

Added:

You also have to set up your player/app for passthrough/bitstream.

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Originally Posted by Philnick View Post
I stand corrected about the ability to tweak the image when running in Dolby Vision. That's what I had read, explained by that they wanted it to be a sealed system with known behavior.

If you folks can tweak it, I believe you and am just puzzled.
There are MANY aspects to Dolby Vision. If you think about it though, there's no such thing as a "sealed system with known behavior". That's because no two viewing environments are exactly the same. Then you have display technology differences. Dolby Vision can be calibrated just like any other picture mode on LG OLED TV's (although to varying degrees of success. Some of us just adjust the service menu white point and call it a day for Dolby Vision and HDR). The dynamic metadata is supposed to inform the display's tone mapping algorithm, but, again, that all depends on a great many factors. Ideally you want a 10000 nit TV so no tone mapping is ever required. In that case, if you calibrate it properly for your viewing environment, then you will always get the colorist's intent. But on current consumer display technology, we're not even close and at the mercy of our display's tone mapping. So definitely NOT a known behavior.

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post #3738 of 4513 Old 05-24-2020, 06:55 AM
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Is there a Downloadable Full User Manual for the 2019 Nvidia Shield TV Pro?

Thanks in advance.

Murray Kerdman
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For those 2019 Nvidia Shield Pro Owners with JVC NX5/NX7/NX9 Projectors, what are the best Picture Quality Settings for AI, Tone Mapping and HDR for these two devices working together on 4K Rip Playback?

Thanks in advance,

Murray Kerdman
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post #3740 of 4513 Old 05-24-2020, 08:08 AM
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Originally Posted by mkerdman View Post
For those 2019 Nvidia Shield Pro Owners with JVC NX5/NX7/NX9 Projectors, what are the best Picture Quality Settings for AI, Tone Mapping and HDR for these two devices working together on 4K Rip Playback?

Thanks in advance,
I've recently gotten the 2019 Tube Shield (the Pro was out of stock) and I'm very pleased with its image projected over 11 feet wide by my JVC RS1000 (a/k/a the N5 and NX5).

It's largely displaced my 4K Roku Ultra and 4K Amazon FireStick for most streaming because of its gigabit Ethernet jack and its AI Upscaling to 4K, which is very good. Of course, it only upscales sources that are 1080 and below. (PS In first setting it up I used its wifi connection, which worked about as well.)

I haven't seen any settings for Tone Mapping, and HDR displays are auto-recognized by the Shield. On our projectors there's no reason to choose DV. (I don't know of any projectors that support DV.)

I use the default Medium setting for the AI Upscaling most of the time, though I flirt with High now and then. (High makes small details on 480 material look too blocky.) If you used a Darbee Darblet (or the version built into the Oppo 103D), you can think of the AI Upscaling in the Shield as an improved version of Darbee that goes beyond local contrast enhancement to actually adding deduced detail. (Like in Trek, when they say, "Enlarge and enhance.")

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Last edited by Philnick; 05-24-2020 at 08:24 AM.
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post #3741 of 4513 Old 05-24-2020, 09:33 AM
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Is there a Downloadable Full User Manual for the 2019 Nvidia Shield TV Pro?

Thanks in advance.
Yes. https://www.nvidia.com/en-us/shield/...shield-tv-pro/
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What is the name of the tech that lights up the buttons on the remote when you move it? Is it available for my iPhone? I have found that the phone app for the Harmony Hub works pretty nicely for device control but leaves the phone lit when you lay it down on the armrest. If I suspend the lighting I have to “Slide to unlock” in order to use it again.

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post #3743 of 4513 Old 05-24-2020, 12:16 PM
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How do I download that to a local PDF, or is it an Online Only Manual?

Murray Kerdman
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post #3744 of 4513 Old 05-24-2020, 12:19 PM
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Originally Posted by AVRams View Post
Display & Sound - Advanced sound settings: switch off Dolby audio processing.

Available formats: Auto

Stereo upmix: Off

Added:

You also have to set up your player/app for passthrough/bitstream.
Probably by dumb luck I had it right. Now if I could get HULU to not black screen on opening a program and Dolby Vision to work on Amazon Prime, I'd be a really happy camper.
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post #3745 of 4513 Old 05-24-2020, 12:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Philnick View Post
I've recently gotten the 2019 Tube Shield (the Pro was out of stock) and I'm very pleased with its image projected over 11 feet wide by my JVC RS1000 (a/k/a the N5 and NX5).

It's largely displaced my 4K Roku Ultra and 4K Amazon FireStick for most streaming because of its gigabit Ethernet jack and its AI Upscaling to 4K, which is very good. Of course, it only upscales sources that are 1080 and below. (PS In first setting it up I used its wifi connection, which worked about as well.)

I haven't seen any settings for Tone Mapping, and HDR displays are auto-recognized by the Shield. On our projectors there's no reason to choose DV. (I don't know of any projectors that support DV.)

I use the default Medium setting for the AI Upscaling most of the time, though I flirt with High now and then. (High makes small details on 480 material look too blocky.) If you used a Darbee Darblet (or the version built into the Oppo 103D), you can think of the AI Upscaling in the Shield as an improved version of Darbee that goes beyond local contrast enhancement to actually adding deduced detail. (Like in Trek, when they say, "Enlarge and enhance.")

Do you Use/Setup the 2019 Shield when playing back 4K UHD HDR Files on your JVC RS1000?

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post #3746 of 4513 Old 05-24-2020, 01:37 PM
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Can someone tell me if the Nvidia Shield Tube/Pro using the Hulu app will output 5.1 audio for CSI the original Las Vegas one? I only get stereo DD+ on both my Roku SS & Fire TV 4K stick. Is there another device where 5.1 audio works? Thanks

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post #3747 of 4513 Old 05-24-2020, 01:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mkerdman View Post
Do you Use/Setup the 2019 Shield when playing back 4K UHD HDR Files on your JVC RS1000?
I don't have any 4K UHD files. I either play 4K streams or disks. I don't rip or download movies.

The Shield's AI Upscaling is inactive on 4K material, but I have seen it said here that the Shield allows unmodified playback of lossless soundtracks, apparently unlike other streamers that transcode them to lossy formats.

Phil
True 4K/HDR10/3D JVC DLA-RS1000 (N5/NX5) projector, 7.2.4 Paradigm/Boston Acoustics/Onkyo speakers. Yamaha RX-A3070 (w/ Denon 2307CI to power 4 overheads). Oppo UDP-203, 4K Nvidia Shield, 4K Roku Ultra, 4K Amazon FireStick, Comcast 4K cable box, Win 10 PC.
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post #3748 of 4513 Old 05-24-2020, 02:03 PM
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The Shield's AI Upscaling is inactive on 4K material, but I have seen it said here that the Shield allows unmodified playback of lossless soundtracks, apparently unlike other streamers that transcode them to lossy formats.
I use my Denon AVR to playback lossless music, which I don't think does any downrezzing or transcoding.

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post #3749 of 4513 Old 05-24-2020, 02:12 PM
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How do I download that to a local PDF, or is it an Online Only Manual?
Have not checked to see if it is the same but I downloaded this one, here.
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post #3750 of 4513 Old 05-24-2020, 03:48 PM
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Have not checked to see if it is the same but I downloaded this one, here.
Thanks. No, not the same as the "Online" Manual.

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