Official Owners Thread 2015 LG 55EG9600 / 65EG9600 4k - Page 7 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #181 of 5758 Old 03-29-2015, 03:13 PM
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They really shouldn't be calibrated until they are broken in. The same was true with plasma although it seems that OLED needs more break in than plasma needed if the hours Robert mentioned to me are accurate.
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post #182 of 5758 Old 03-29-2015, 03:19 PM
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If you guys are interested in more owners impressions, photos and videos check out the owners thread in british avforums: https://www.avforums.com/threads/lg-...hread.1948687/
Three british owners of the 55EG9600 since yesterday who seem to be very happy with their sets. No noticeable tints, one of them actually returned the 55EC9300 for that specific reason, and they don't see any near black issues either, though the latter sounds too good to be true to me. Maybe they just didn't chose the "right" patterns yet to see the banding, the wrong picture settings or I don't know what. Interested what calibrators such as Chad will say about it. Maybe those issues will really only appear after several hrs of running time.

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post #183 of 5758 Old 03-29-2015, 03:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JWhip View Post
They really shouldn't be calibrated until they are broken in. The same was true with plasma although it seems that OLED needs more break in than plasma needed if the hours Robert mentioned to me are accurate.
You raise a valid point sir.
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post #184 of 5758 Old 03-29-2015, 03:41 PM
 
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Originally Posted by *UFO* View Post
Kaldaien, a few questions. When dejudder is turned on, is the motion comparable to a good plasma? Does it add the SOA? Also, the image you posted that shows the banding and cloudy blacks, is it as bad as it looks in the photo? If so, I am not sure how someone could tolerate that? Especially for the price?
With de-judder turned on, the motion is much better but still not as natural looking as a plasma with no motion processing. I can tell that something artificial has been done to the image when I turn de-judder on, but it is not as bad what I've seen on 120 Hz LCDs. You can tweak de-judder and de-blur (creates extremely artificial images) separately, so if you're just dealing with low framerate content, low de-judder can help without creating an intolerable soap opera effect.

It's worth mentioning that Panasonic's 48 and 96 Hz modes are perfectly acceptable to my eyes. A lot of people hate the flickering it causes when watching 24 fps content, so I clearly have different visual preferences.


The black performance is exactly how it looks in that image, for that particular scene. That was the worst I could find (the thing to pay attention to there is actually the difference between the sides and the center). You might get the impression from the difference in performance on the sides that I've been watching a lot of 4:3 content, but that was taken after 100 hours of cycling between solid colors. The screen should have aged relatively uniformly.

In most situations (with an adequately high contrast image) it does not show up at all, and if you don't care about black crushing you can completely eliminate it by turning brightness down. I'm only at 200 hours operation, and was only at 110 when that was taken, so there's a chance that it will settle down over the next 200 hours. I didn't realize just how long you need to break-in an OLED.

Last edited by Kaldaien; 03-29-2015 at 03:51 PM.
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post #185 of 5758 Old 03-29-2015, 04:16 PM
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For open minded OLED owners:

Try to use external speakers so you can disable the tv's speakers: better motion and cleaner image

Go inside TruMotion menu, once inside go to User sub menu, then use 0 for both Deblur and Dejudder, finaly turn off TruMotion.

Even tough it shouldn't interfere with picture quality, motion and a more clean picture, I have found that disabling certain settings helps in these areas:
Turn Off Auto Off inside SimpLink menu
Turn Off Software Update
Go inside the 3D Menu, once inside disable Pattern Recognition
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post #186 of 5758 Old 03-29-2015, 04:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaldaien View Post
With de-judder turned on, the motion is much better but still not as natural looking as a plasma with no motion processing. I can tell that something artificial has been done to the image when I turn de-judder on, but it is not as bad what I've seen on 120 Hz LCDs. You can tweak de-judder and de-blur (creates extremely artificial images) separately, so if you're just dealing with low framerate content, low de-judder can help without creating an intolerable soap opera effect.

It's worth mentioning that Panasonic's 48 and 96 Hz modes are perfectly acceptable to my eyes. A lot of people hate the flickering it causes when watching 24 fps content, so I clearly have different visual preferences.


The black performance is exactly how it looks in that image, for that particular scene. That was the worst I could find (the thing to pay attention to there is actually the difference between the sides and the center). You might get the impression from the difference in performance on the sides that I've been watching a lot of 4:3 content, but that was taken after 100 hours of cycling between solid colors. The screen should have aged relatively uniformly.

In most situations (with an adequately high contrast image) it does not show up at all, and if you don't care about black crushing you can completely eliminate it by turning brightness down. I'm only at 200 hours operation, and was only at 110 when that was taken, so there's a chance that it will settle down over the next 200 hours. I didn't realize just how long you need to break-in an OLED.
Ok thanks for the information. As far as ABL is concerned, how is it in relation to late gen Panasonic plasmas? Which would be brighter, a plasma with a full white field (as in not windowed), or the EG9600 with the same full white field (with panel brightness at max), and by how much? Would you be able to take a picture showing this?
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post #187 of 5758 Old 03-29-2015, 05:06 PM
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Some of those pictures of Paddington Bear almost looked like watercolor. I'd say it's the phone doing that, but it was stated they were taken with an iPhone and that phone would not cause that issue while snapping a photo of a television.
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post #188 of 5758 Old 03-29-2015, 05:58 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by *UFO* View Post
Ok thanks for the information. As far as ABL is concerned, how is it in relation to late gen Panasonic plasmas? Which would be brighter, a plasma with a full white field (as in not windowed), or the EG9600 with the same full white field (with panel brightness at max), and by how much? Would you be able to take a picture showing this?
I have no way to measure the light output, and in fact I cannot put my VT60 next to this TV for direct comparison because there's not enough room. But a 50" GT30 with max panel brightness produced the following results side-by-side (see attachment).

While I can't measure the light level, I can measure the power consumption.

This test _strongly_ favors the OLED because of its white pixels. I actually measured the power consumption of a full white screen at peak brightness on the LG vs. a full red screen and the results are interesting. White uses 180w, and red (least efficient color) uses 250w. Meanwhile, the plasma sucks about 360w regardless which color it's displaying at max panel brightness. Brightness and efficiency are definitely not something you want to compare on a plasma vs. OLED, it's downright embarrassing.

Incidentally, the Panasonic is limited to 360w no matter which of the 3 settings I choose, and to my eyes low brightness appears to produce a marginally brighter image.
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post #189 of 5758 Old 03-29-2015, 06:12 PM
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So it seems the OLED is a large amount brighter when it comes to full screen white? I wonder why people are complaining about OLED's ABL?
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post #190 of 5758 Old 03-29-2015, 06:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by *UFO* View Post
So it seems the OLED is a large amount brighter when it comes to full screen white? I wonder why people are complaining about OLED's ABL?
I guess it is because some people use Vivid video mode, with OLED Light at 100, contrast at 100 etc. The brighter the tv is configured, the more evident the abl's effect.

I suggested this to an OLED owner who had this abl problem. He used vivid mode, so I suggested using calibrated settings. H e was never bothered by abl again.
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post #191 of 5758 Old 03-29-2015, 06:31 PM
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One might ask an even better question : Why do these TV's not come from the Factory ISF Calibrated? Since this is required to get the most out of a television and get the most accurate display. You would think spending $8999 on a 65 inch television is more than enough money for this to also be included
No manufacturer does this.
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post #192 of 5758 Old 03-29-2015, 06:31 PM
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You might get the impression from the difference in performance on the sides that I've been watching a lot of 4:3 content, but that was taken after 100 hours of cycling between solid colors. The screen should have aged relatively uniformly.
You really should not assume that OLEDs age like a plasma or LCD. As I explained a few times on this forum, these TVs perform regular wear-compensation every 4 hours when power is turned off. By running them non-stop, 24x7, using break-in slides, you are interfering with that normal wear-compensation process. I'm pretty sure that LG tested their algorithm for the way a normal consumer uses their set (typical 5 hours per day before powering off) so who knows what delaying the compensations will do to the set. I guess most stores will also use it without powering off so hopefully it can handle such heavy early usage without problems.
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post #193 of 5758 Old 03-29-2015, 06:32 PM
 
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Originally Posted by *UFO* View Post
So it seems the OLED is a large amount brighter when it comes to full screen white? I wonder why people are complaining about OLED's ABL?
I have absolutely no idea. I heard similar complaints, but after using this TV I can only imagine they are used to LCD screens with ridiculously bright backlights. The TV gets much brighter than anyone should ever need, even in a bright livingroom.
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post #194 of 5758 Old 03-29-2015, 06:41 PM
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Originally Posted by Yappadappadu View Post
If you guys are interested in more owners impressions, photos and videos check out the owners thread in british avforums: https://www.avforums.com/threads/lg-...hread.1948687/
Three british owners of the 55EG9600 since yesterday who seem to be very happy with their sets. No noticeable tints, one of them actually returned the 55EC9300 for that specific reason, and they don't see any near black issues either, though the latter sounds too good to be true to me. Maybe they just didn't chose the "right" patterns yet to see the banding, the wrong picture settings or I don't know what. Interested what calibrators such as Chad will say about it. Maybe those issues will really only appear after several hrs of running time.
I'm more inclined to believe they are still in the honey-moon phase and will spot all the usual OLED defects after a few days of watching a larger variety of content. Have not seen anyone post a <10% Gray slide without banding or darker sides.

Otherwise, we might be looking at a panel lottery where the EU sets are somehow free of defects compared to the ones sold in USA. I wonder how LG distributes the panels coming from M1 and M2 manufacturing lines. Maybe we can compare dates or serial numbers to find a pattern?
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post #195 of 5758 Old 03-29-2015, 07:17 PM
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No manufacturer does this.
Kind of weird imo that somebody would ship an uncalibrated TV. You'd think you'd want it to look its best. I know some manufacturers used to ship calibrated TVs to reviewers like Consumer Reports, but not to the public. That's why Consumer Reports doesn't take review samples and goes and buys a set (supposedly).
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post #196 of 5758 Old 03-29-2015, 07:21 PM
 
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You really should not assume that OLEDs age like a plasma or LCD. As I explained a few times on this forum, these TVs perform regular wear-compensation every 4 hours when power is turned off. By running them non-stop, 24x7, using break-in slides, you are interfering with that normal wear-compensation process. I'm pretty sure that LG tested their algorithm for the way a normal consumer uses their set (typical 5 hours per day before powering off) so who knows what delaying the compensations will do to the set. I guess most stores will also use it without powering off so hopefully it can handle such heavy early usage without problems.
Good to know. I didn't actually run it for 24 hours straight because I have a PC generating the patterns and it's used during the daytime for actual work. I was tempted to use some sort of automated slide system, but this TV doesn't even have an SD card slot.
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post #197 of 5758 Old 03-29-2015, 07:42 PM
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No manufacturer does this.
He's not entirely off though. Computer monitors are starting to pop up that come calibrated from the factory and even come with a sheet to show you the calibration report for your display.
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post #198 of 5758 Old 03-29-2015, 08:37 PM - Thread Starter
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It would nice if that could be done at the factory.
Last I was told they do not even power on production sets in the factory, they have a way of running tests and knowing they will fire, but never actually powered up.


Break in was always a matter of opinion for even a plasma display. Same here, would love to see a test where 5 units where broken in, 5 where not, then tested for 2 years after that point. To each his own, I never broke in my personal plasma's, will not be doing it on my OLED's either ...... Now if I was paying full price for a calibration, I would wait about 500-1000 hours before I had it done on any set.


From what I have seen/heard since the 55EA9800, 55EA8800, and the 55EC9300 came out, only one report of image retention that I recall. No burn in and ruined OLED's yet. Keep in mind, dear old LED's can not get burn in, but there have been reports of images stuck on the screen.
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Last edited by Cleveland Plasma; 03-29-2015 at 08:50 PM.
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post #199 of 5758 Old 03-29-2015, 08:51 PM
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He's not entirely off though. Computer monitors are starting to pop up that come calibrated from the factory and even come with a sheet to show you the calibration report for your display.
Yes, LG does do this for some of its high end computer monitors. My 34UM95 came with a factory calibration.
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post #200 of 5758 Old 03-29-2015, 09:28 PM
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Any word on whether this set accepts 4:4:4 4K 60Hz from a PC? (Sorry if I missed it earlier.)
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post #201 of 5758 Old 03-29-2015, 09:51 PM
 
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Any word on whether this set accepts 4:4:4 4K 60Hz from a PC? (Sorry if I missed it earlier.)
Yes, I run mine at 4:4:4 4K @ 60 Hz. This of course requires an HDMI 2.0 capable GPU :P Some older NV GPUs without HDMI 2.0 found an interesting way to do 4:2:0 4K at 60 Hz over HDMI 1.4.
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post #202 of 5758 Old 03-29-2015, 10:08 PM
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Yes, I run mine at 4:4:4 4K @ 60 Hz. This of course requires an HDMI 2.0 capable GPU :P Some older NV GPUs without HDMI 2.0 found an interesting way to do 4:2:0 4K at 60 Hz over HDMI 1.4.
Thank you, Kaldaien!


Not sure of the wisdom of using one of these as a full time, work horse, computer monitor (e.g., MS Office, coding, browsing, gaming) and at this price tag, but I do have a GTX 980 with I believe the requisite HDMI 2.0.
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post #203 of 5758 Old 03-29-2015, 10:12 PM
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Originally Posted by Kaldaien View Post
Yes, I run mine at 4:4:4 4K @ 60 Hz. This of course requires an HDMI 2.0 capable GPU :P Some older NV GPUs without HDMI 2.0 found an interesting way to do 4:2:0 4K at 60 Hz over HDMI 1.4.
Are you able to enable HDCP 2.2 on your graphics card? Probably not as I doubt anybody is trying to protect their PC output .
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post #204 of 5758 Old 03-29-2015, 10:23 PM
 
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Are you able to enable HDCP 2.2 on your graphics card? Probably not as I doubt anybody is trying to protect their PC output .
I have HDCP enabled, while outputting 4:4:4, so I'm going to assume that means it's HDCP 2.2. NVidia's control panel is rather vague, it just says "HDCP Enabled: <Green Check>"
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post #205 of 5758 Old 03-29-2015, 10:33 PM
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Originally Posted by Kaldaien View Post
I have HDCP enabled, while outputting 4:4:4, so I'm going to assume that means it's HDCP 2.2. NVidia's control panel is rather vague, it just says "HDCP Enabled: <Green Check>"
Cool! So I guess we FINALLY got confirmation that this TV can do 4K @ 60Fps @ 4:4:4 *WITH* HDCP 2.2. Guess that means we're 18Gbps.


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post #206 of 5758 Old 03-30-2015, 05:26 AM
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Originally Posted by Morning5 View Post
For open minded OLED owners:

Try to use external speakers so you can disable the tv's speakers: better motion and cleaner image

Go inside TruMotion menu, once inside go to User sub menu, then use 0 for both Deblur and Dejudder, finaly turn off TruMotion.

Even tough it shouldn't interfere with picture quality, motion and a more clean picture, I have found that disabling certain settings helps in these areas:
Turn Off Auto Off inside SimpLink menu
Turn Off Software Update
Go inside the 3D Menu, once inside disable Pattern Recognition
Finally a constructive post.
I believe that, instead of emphasizing problems, it's better to find workarounds that may help having the most out of your display.
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post #207 of 5758 Old 03-30-2015, 05:29 AM
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Originally Posted by Kaldaien View Post
Good to know. I didn't actually run it for 24 hours straight because I have a PC generating the patterns and it's used during the daytime for actual work. I was tempted to use some sort of automated slide system, but this TV doesn't even have an SD card slot.
Don't you have an USB flash drive or hard disk?
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post #208 of 5758 Old 03-30-2015, 05:34 AM
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Originally Posted by *UFO* View Post
So it seems the OLED is a large amount brighter when it comes to full screen white? I wonder why people are complaining about OLED's ABL?
People stopped complaining about plasma's inability to output light.
So no one(owner) will ever complain about OLED inability to output light.

Only LED advocates will do so, as it appears(and that's not for sure) that this is the only measured detail that still favors LED.
Black levels - No game
CR - No game
Color - Equal
Motion - ?
Light output - Hurray LED wins
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post #209 of 5758 Old 03-30-2015, 05:57 AM
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Plz it doesn't exists any panel with the name LED. It is LCD
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post #210 of 5758 Old 03-30-2015, 06:35 AM
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@Kaldaien :
The british owners noticed the following when playing Netflix/Amazon content:
Quote:
When watching content on Netflix and Amazon Prime, the timeline/audio subtitles menu pops up for a second or so intermittently.
What about your set?

LG C7D
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