LG 55EF9500 and 65EF9500 OLED Owners Thread - Page 8 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #211 of 24669 Old 09-14-2015, 07:08 AM
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Originally Posted by suge967mari View Post
Not surprised at all. We all knew deep down the flat ef wasn't going to solve the issues.
Still a premature assessment. We've had one that was worse off than the eg, but also one that was better than the eg. I would wager the ones that have been sitting in a warehouse for places such as best buy might still be using older panels, whereas more recent builds might have the fixed panels.
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post #212 of 24669 Old 09-14-2015, 07:16 AM
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Originally Posted by paranoyd androyd View Post
simply incredible, the pictures just keep coming. i wouldn't touch an LG panel at this point regardless of price.

for the unfortunate early adopters, i hope you bought them locally so you can return them without a hassle and be done with it. couldn't imagine having to deal with an online retailer and possible return issues.
really you wouldn't touch an LG panel? Yet you're in here spending your energy commenting.. not to mention you must have some serious bias against them if you cannot see the 9500 is dramatically better than the awful pics of the 9600..

furthermore, what is your alternative? zero off angle viewing of an LCD? blooming? light bleed? poor use of local dimming and motion blur?

Imagine if everyone who owned an LED/LCD refused their sets for the flaws i mentioned above which are much more egregious than the much improved edging of the 9500.

theres no perfect set. won't be one for a long time, if ever. even the owners (not you) are happy with the finished product and thats all that matters. go cry on the panasonic forum.
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post #213 of 24669 Old 09-14-2015, 07:16 AM
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Originally Posted by Wjboshart View Post
Still a premature assessment. We've had one that was worse off than the eg, but also one that was better than the eg. I would wager the ones that have been sitting in a warehouse for places such as best buy might still be using older panels, whereas more recent builds might have the fixed panels.
Wouldn’t ‘all’ of the EF panels be new, as they are flat instead of curved? I would have figured LG would have needed to manufacture completely new panels.

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Originally Posted by marburyno03 View Post

theres no perfect set. won't be one for a long time, if ever. even the owners (not you) are happy with the finished product and thats all that matters. go cry on the panasonic forum.
What I have bolded worries me, to be honest, as there is a part of me that has thought the same thing. Maybe my expectations are high for the electronic world, but I would like to think you can purchase your TV, of your favorite technology, eventually where you don’t have to worry about buying it with known defects.
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post #214 of 24669 Old 09-14-2015, 07:37 AM
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That actually looks extremely good.
I agree, but I can relate to any TV NOT holding a grey scale. Back in the day I ran a Heidelburg Speedmaster full size 10 color printing press, love to see anyone hold a 10% grey scale open on a press.....not going to happen. Just like no TV can, big question is, can you see it during normal viewing........




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post #215 of 24669 Old 09-14-2015, 07:38 AM
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Originally Posted by Wjboshart View Post
Still a premature assessment. We've had one that was worse off than the eg, but also one that was better than the eg. I would wager the ones that have been sitting in a warehouse for places such as best buy might still be using older panels, whereas more recent builds might have the fixed panels.
It seems to me that if LG in fact has mitigated the issue, it would have been addressed some time during the month of August. The first EF sets I've seen have an August build date which would still be a crap shoot to me. So you may be correct. In my estimation, once we start seeing September builds, that will be an indication to me of "as good as its going to get." (Which in most cases already appears to be just fine for normal viewing anyway.)

Still, it's worth scrutinizing in case you happen to get a legitimately bad panel.
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post #216 of 24669 Old 09-14-2015, 07:48 AM
 
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Picture of IR/Burn-in of "LG OLED TV" reportedly taken on 65EF9500 at IFA 2015. Normal image retention or is the higher nits of the HDR set causing problems.

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post #217 of 24669 Old 09-14-2015, 07:48 AM
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Originally Posted by Cleveland Plasma View Post
I agree, but I can relate to any TV NOT holding a grey scale. Back in the day I ran a Heidelburg Speedmaster full size 10 color printing press, >>> Click Here <<< love to see anyone hold a 10% grey scale open on a press.....not going to happen. Just like no TV can, big question is, can you see it during normal viewing........

No kidding. If a 10% grey scale flat (something we will never watch in our life) doesn't look perfect... if that is the only flaw in this TV then this must be the best TV ever made. I can't even begin to list the number of problems LED/LCD has, and those are problems which are apparent with real content and you can even see in the store. What a weird forum this has become over the years (I've been inactive for a while). Now it's like people are running a battery of tests looking for problems... that they will never see! Unless I'm totally mistaken.
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post #218 of 24669 Old 09-14-2015, 07:55 AM
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Yes, you are mistaken. Watch an episode of Game of Thrones on a EG9600 and tell me that you don't see the same issues that you can see on a 10% slide. I did. Using test slides DOES make sense.

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post #219 of 24669 Old 09-14-2015, 07:56 AM
 
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Originally Posted by TheLoveone View Post
No kidding. If a 10% grey scale flat (something we will never watch in our life) doesn't look perfect... if that is the only flaw in this TV then this must be the best TV ever made. I can't even begin to list the number of problems LED/LCD has, and those are problems which are apparent with real content and you can even see in the store. What a weird forum this has become over the years (I've been inactive for a while). Now it's like people are running a battery of tests looking for problems... that they will never see! Unless I'm totally mistaken.
You are mistaken. The black edges and inability to show uniformity a 5-10% grey scale caused many scenes in the Life of Pi demo to be unwatchable during the shootout.
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post #220 of 24669 Old 09-14-2015, 08:40 AM
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Originally Posted by sytech View Post
Picture of IR/Burn-in of "LG OLED TV" reportedly taken on 65EF9500 at IFA 2015. Normal image retention or is the higher nits of the HDR set causing problems.
I don't know...but the edge uniformity in that image looks good.
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post #221 of 24669 Old 09-14-2015, 08:46 AM
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Originally Posted by sillysally View Post
I was afraid you would say that, "missing the curve".
I have been dragging it out getting a refund from LG, because of that.

Can you describe what you mean by "missing the curve"?

ss

I will have my 9500 sometime the middle to the end of this week, depending on when I can pick it up.

After living with the 9300 and the 9600 for so long, I am wondering if I will miss the curve as well.
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post #222 of 24669 Old 09-14-2015, 08:49 AM
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Originally Posted by sytech View Post
Picture of IR/Burn-in of "LG OLED TV" reportedly taken on 65EF9500 at IFA 2015. Normal image retention or is the higher nits of the HDR set causing problems.


I'll have to make sure that I don't watch any content that has static text on it for several hours
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post #223 of 24669 Old 09-14-2015, 08:55 AM
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Originally Posted by TheLoveone View Post
No kidding. If a 10% grey scale flat (something we will never watch in our life) doesn't look perfect... if that is the only flaw in this TV then this must be the best TV ever made. I can't even begin to list the number of problems LED/LCD has, and those are problems which are apparent with real content and you can even see in the store. What a weird forum this has become over the years (I've been inactive for a while). Now it's like people are running a battery of tests looking for problems... that they will never see! Unless I'm totally mistaken.
I think you're mistaken. Obviously, everyone's perception of some arbitrary fault/artifact/limitation/whatever is subjective, and what bothers one person may not even be perceptible to another. However, I can tell you from first hand experience that the vignetting issue I'm experiencing was something I first noticed (like within 2-3 minutes of first using the set) during setup of the set, and then immediately on actual video material (from HBO in 1080p). I'm the first to admit this is not a constant issue on all source material. You (and even I) will likely never notice this while watching football. However, it is something that, at least for me, is noticeable on the dim scenes of nearly everything. The scenes where it bothers me the most is in darker scenes of CGI or animated movies (e.g. Disney, Dreamworks Animation, kids movies in general - and I have kids), where there are lots of smooth gradients or flat, textureless areas. It really pops out then.

As I said earlier, I ran the gray screen and gradient screen tests just to confirm and document what I was already seeing on live video material.

However, as I also already admitted, I'm someone who easily sees defects and artifacts, and who can't NOT see them all the time after I initially spot them. Believe me, I wish I weren't this perceptive, because it makes finding video displays (and computer displays for that matter) that don't bother me a difficult and expensive endeavor. You're totally right about the obvious shortcomings and defects in LCD panels; those bother me even more.
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post #224 of 24669 Old 09-14-2015, 08:57 AM
 
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I'll have to make sure that I don't watch any content that has static text on it for several hours
So not a gamer, huh? I have bad visions of burned in BF4 and COD HUDs.
Hopefully, it is just IR that goes away when it does power off conditioning.
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post #225 of 24669 Old 09-14-2015, 08:59 AM
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Originally Posted by Sunset1982 View Post
Some Pics of my new 55EG5609... beside the vignetting I got a nice crossfade over the display...
But what does content look like? Can you post some pics of blurays? Or cable content? I returned an EG9600 for dark edge-banding far worse than anything shown here. It resembled flames shooting from the sides. I took a full refund. Purchased a Sony 930C and TOTALLY REGRET my choice. I want to see what the EF9500 can do over many venues, not merely one test environment.
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post #226 of 24669 Old 09-14-2015, 09:00 AM
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So not a gamer, huh?
nope
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post #227 of 24669 Old 09-14-2015, 09:08 AM
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Originally Posted by marburyno03 View Post
furthermore, what is your alternative? zero off angle viewing of an LCD? blooming? light bleed? poor use of local dimming and motion blur?
i like how every OLED thread turns into LCD/LED bashing. come on, guys.

i know it's pure lottery but my edge lit TV with local dimming has NONE of those issues. and yes, it can display any gray test pattern without any banding or dark stripes on the sides. the fact that you're trying to justify a $5k TV with those issues is amusing, to say the least.

should i start bashing OLED or want it to fail because my edge lit is perfectly fine? of course not. but blindly protecting these LG "prototypes" while their reps are lying that they have no idea about any of these issues probably make them laugh all the way to the bank.
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post #228 of 24669 Old 09-14-2015, 09:09 AM
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I don't know...but the edge uniformity in that image looks good.
This is a good example of what I was saying in my previous post. You say this looks like good edge uniformity. To me, I see the vignetting problem even in this image. It's not that bad, but it's there along the entire right edge of this image. It looks more like a color shift then vignetting, but it's there.

Remember that OLED panels, unlike LCD panels, have absolutely no issues with color shifts or contrast deterioration based on viewing angles. I can confirm that you can look at the image looking almost perpendicularly to the display and what you see - color-wise, brightness-wise, contrast-wise - is just fine. That's one reason why curved OLED panels really make no sense whatsoever. I think many people have become so used to the problems with LCD viewing angles that they look at this image (of screen burn in, but that's another issue) and either don't see the vignetting or edge-nonuniformity or they dismiss it, almost without thinking about it, as an inevitable artifact due to the change in viewing angle across the panel as viewed from any non-optimal angle. This should be and is a non-issue with OLED displays.

There could be other reasons for what I see in that image, such as something being reflected from off to the right of the camera. But that seems like an unlikely coincidence.
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post #229 of 24669 Old 09-14-2015, 09:12 AM
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Originally Posted by denpom View Post
i know it's pure lottery but my edge lit TV with local dimming has NONE of those issues.
Your LCD doesn't have issues with off axis viewing? That must be a magic TV.
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post #230 of 24669 Old 09-14-2015, 09:17 AM
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should i start bashing OLED or want it to fail because my edge lit is perfectly fine? of course not.
It seems like just did (bash) and you kinda do (want it to fail)
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post #231 of 24669 Old 09-14-2015, 09:19 AM
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[QUOTE=Hobbun;37281274]
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Originally Posted by Wjboshart View Post
Still a premature assessment. We've had one that was worse off than the eg, but also one that was better than the eg. I would wager the ones that have been sitting in a warehouse for places such as best buy might still be using older panels, whereas more recent builds might have the fixed panels.
Wouldn?t ?all? of the EF panels be new, as they are flat instead of curved? I would have figured LG would have needed to manufacture completely new panels

From the sounds of some of the people that were in the anticipation thread they made it sound like some stores have had these models sitting in a warehouse dating back to August. Even some August eg panels were still bad. Just now in September have we started seeing "better" pabels
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post #232 of 24669 Old 09-14-2015, 09:19 AM
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Originally Posted by Gabatta View Post
Your LCD doesn't have issues with off axis viewing? That must be a magic TV.
it does start losing color saturation at about 30 degree angle like any typical VA panel but i never watch it under any of those conditions. so, it's not magical but i don't have that problem in my case.
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post #233 of 24669 Old 09-14-2015, 09:26 AM
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Originally Posted by denpom View Post
it does start losing color saturation at about 30 degree angle like any typical VA panel but i never watch it under any of those conditions. so, it's not magical but i don't have that problem in my case.
And OLED owners don't watch 10% gray content but do watch it with their friends and family (at an angle). I guess everyone is happy.

Let's wait for more pictures posted by owners and calibration of 55/65EF9500 before we start bashing OLED.
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post #234 of 24669 Old 09-14-2015, 09:51 AM
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The shadow detail is far superior to my returned EG. Im seeing detail in the shadows in this set I could not see in the EG. Brightness is at 51. Hope that helps. Negatives? Some white crush and possibly the previous motion settings of 2 Judder and 10 De-Blur may not apply on this set as they did on the EG. I need more screen time. Being named organic, seems apropos- these sets seem dynamic in the way they seem to uniquely "breathe" and improve with use.
Is the 4K upconversion better on the EF model when compared to the EG model or about the same?
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post #235 of 24669 Old 09-14-2015, 09:59 AM
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Originally Posted by denpom View Post
i know it's pure lottery but my edge lit TV with local dimming has NONE of those issues.
I think you set yourself up with your statement. Your statement even states, panel lottery. So you fully admit that LED's have issues, but every once is a while a good unit is made, as winning a lottery is rare. So your set is very hard to come by out of the thousands made.....

We have one single "US" owner chime in with pictures and yet we all know every Flat OLED set made is no good. Geese can we maybe look at another set or should we just throw in the towel now....... LOL........wow..........

Even if you had a perfect TV and take a picture, do you know how hard it would be to take a clean shot of a GREY SCALE ??? Heck how do we know the monitor you, yes you are looking at these pictures with does not have a grey scale issue ??
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post #236 of 24669 Old 09-14-2015, 10:07 AM
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Is the 4K upconversion better on the EF model when compared to the EG model or about the same?
Perhaps so, all I can say this set looks much better in all regards to my returned EC and EG all within a period of 3 weeks. I wouldn't have returned the other 2 if I was satisfied- certainly I was unhappy with the performance of those two. It seems the variability of the panels (panel lottery) may be at play here and that I finally got a good one that satisfies me. Vignetting is minimal (still there on certain solid gray backgrounds) but not visible to me in source material that I observed with this set compared with the EG, that aggravated me to no end. EF seems sharper, more shadow detail and at a lower brightness setting (51 compared to EG at 54). I really can't say or know that LG improved or even tweaked the 4k upscaler but I do know that the panel is a keeper giving me a better and more pleasing picture.
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For those who have, and those who will have, an EF9500 display, please accomplish a basic setup before commenting on items such as shadow detail. It's all about the Brightness Control and there is only one correct setting. It's done visually and requires a setup disc. Get one.

AVSHD - free, and don't forget to download the patterns manual

Better yet, for a few bucks, Ted's Disc. It's very comprehensive.
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post #238 of 24669 Old 09-14-2015, 10:31 AM
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Buying and watching a TV should be fun. It should be relaxing, exciting even. It seems that buying one of these LG OLEDs is far from that, more like annoying. I have seen a ton of these TV (not the new ones or the flat ones) and they all have the issues I see on these photos. Yes, it IS visible in regular content and in many types of content, not just dark scenes. The uniformity issue raises its ugly head in different colors, with the day time sky being the chief among many. I was hopeful that LG would have fixed this problem but it looks like they haven't. I posted this over a year ago but I don't think LG has a clue how to deal with it. I have NO interest at all in playing the panel lottery game. Maybe Panasonic will be the savior of OLED with their better processing, if they are even making TVs in a year or two. Sorry to be so harsh guys but what I see here in terms of the pictures is a disgrace.

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post #239 of 24669 Old 09-14-2015, 10:57 AM
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Originally Posted by paranoyd androyd View Post
yeah, and have you seen the EF9500 pictures from different owners? they're just as terrible. LG has major QC problems.
I've seen 3 owners post pics and only one of the 3 had what looked like bad issues while the pics from the other two looked fine.

Me personally, I'll wait for more owners to get their sets and (possibly) post pics before I conclude that the entire line is terrible and each set needs to be recalled.
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post #240 of 24669 Old 09-14-2015, 11:00 AM
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For those who have, and those who will have, an EF9500 display, please accomplish a basic setup before commenting on items such as shadow detail. It's all about the Brightness Control and there is only one correct setting. It's done visually and requires a setup disc. Get one.

AVSHD - free, and don't forget to download the patterns manual

Better yet, for a few bucks, Ted's Disc. It's very comprehensive.
So is “Ted’s disc” considered as ‘calibrating’ the TV? I’m guessing not as you are not using equipment to do so.
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