2016 LG C6-B6 owners thread - Page 80 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #2371 of 28237 Old 07-27-2016, 04:25 AM
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Is there a discrete control for Backlight on the B6 (I mean, can I adjust it directly with ie. a Harmony remote without having to go trough the menus)?

Also, is there an automatic light sensor on the B6?

Thanks

/Martin
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post #2372 of 28237 Old 07-27-2016, 05:04 AM
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^ I haven't seen that level of granularity with Harmony remotes on any TV I've ever owned. Typically it's just a 'settings' option as it would be on the original remotes.

I'm not at the TV right now, but I'm quite sure there's a light sensor. I always turn them off.
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post #2373 of 28237 Old 07-27-2016, 12:13 PM
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Sounds like the display Chad & I worked on in Naples...... here
LOL, that's the one....I remember you two drank all my beer too....lol J/K
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post #2374 of 28237 Old 07-27-2016, 05:35 PM
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Is seems to be a problem specifically with LG's WOLED tech, as far as I know RGB OLED has never had this problem. Who knows, it could also be a problem with LG's engineering.

There is no reason to believe it's anything other than purely a video processing issue or short-coming, and has nothing to do with OLED tech itself, LG's or otherwise.
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post #2375 of 28237 Old 07-27-2016, 06:51 PM
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Vignetting and Uniformity are not caused by processing. It very well could be just LG's engineering but unless somebody else starts manufacturing their own WOLED panels we will never know how much of it is LG and how much is the tech itself. Most likely it is a bit of both, but if Sony or Panasonic were doing this we would probably have seen it go away completely by now.
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post #2376 of 28237 Old 07-27-2016, 08:43 PM
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^ That's pure conjecture.
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post #2377 of 28237 Old 07-27-2016, 09:04 PM
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I've been the owner of a 65" c6 for almost 4 weeks now so I'll give my 2 cents for anyone on the fence. No major issues with the set, but I'm another person a bit disappointed with the just above black performance, as well as what seems to be an over exaggeration of any noise in the picture.

Don't understand me wrong, the TV does almost everything phenomenally. I'm coming from a panny vt60 and a kuro elite 9th gen before that, and I think the c6 oled out performs both on many levels.

Where the c6 fails mainly for me is cable TV. The set is very unforgiving of noise and compression, and the additional upscaling sub 1080p to 4k is not handled particularly well. I've seen my father's 2014 panny lcd upscale much better, with many fewer compression artifacts. As I mentioned, the c6 also seems to exaggerate noise, and film grain as well.

However, well made 1080p and 4k discs look amazing, as well as do video games. Hopefully HDR input lag isn't bad, as I'm looking forward to xbox one s and hdr gaming. I'm still 50/50 as to whether I'm keeping the set or returning it. One one hand, HDR is amazing and the TV does so much nearly flawless. One the other, there are still some deficiencies that I don't expect at a premium price, and for the price may not be justified just yet. I may take this back for a vizio p series to hold me over with hdr and the 10 bit panel for another couple of years until LG figures out their processing or another manufacturer gets into the OLED game.

Im not a fan of 3d, but 3d is outrageously cool on this set. If you're a fan of 3d, jump on board!

Btw, my set has not been professionally calibrated, but not sure if this would help the just above black performance or help reduce noise.
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post #2378 of 28237 Old 07-27-2016, 09:12 PM
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Of course, but come on LG's engineering has always been second tier, and that's not really even a bad thing really because there are many tiers. I love that they have delivered us OLED when nobody else has and I really thank them for it, but I sure would never consider them if they weren't the only company making OLED's. right now. They have a great thing going for themselves, they have a monopoly on a fantastic display technology with lots of potential. Potentially even the best display that has so far been commercially available. If they weren't making OLED's how many self proclaimed videophiles would be buying their LED LCD's over the Sony's, and Panasonic's? Unless cost is a problem I don't think many. Hell even the Vizio P Series this year outdoes LG's top 2016 LCD's. On top of that their Plasma's were notoriously behind Panasonic, Pioneer, and even Samsung in black level and overall performance. Their investment into OLED and their current monopoly over it is primarily what has them now accepted as a high end quality manufacturer. I do think though that if a company like Sony or Panasonic got a hold of WOLED (they wont so it doesn't matter) it wouldn't be better right away because there is the matter of experience, but I think one of those companies would quickly find more innovative ways to fix these little issues after just 2 or 3 generations. I would bet on it myself. It would also come at a higher cost for sure, so might not even be worth it for everyone as the current OLED's are for the most part great overall.

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post #2379 of 28237 Old 07-27-2016, 09:21 PM
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Originally Posted by MEGATRON 631 View Post
I've been the owner of a 65" c6 for almost 4 weeks now so I'll give my 2 cents for anyone on the fence. No major issues with the set, but I'm another person a bit disappointed with the just above black performance, as well as what seems to be an over exaggeration of any noise in the picture.

Don't understand me wrong, the TV does almost everything phenomenally. I'm coming from a panny vt60 and a kuro elite 9th gen before that, and I think the c6 oled out performs both on many levels.

Where the c6 fails mainly for me is cable TV. The set is very unforgiving of noise and compression, and the additional upscaling sub 1080p to 4k is not handled particularly well. I've seen my father's 2014 panny lcd upscale much better, with many fewer compression artifacts. As I mentioned, the c6 also seems to exaggerate noise, and film grain as well.

However, well made 1080p and 4k discs look amazing, as well as do video games. Hopefully HDR input lag isn't bad, as I'm looking forward to xbox one s and hdr gaming. I'm still 50/50 as to whether I'm keeping the set or returning it. One one hand, HDR is amazing and the TV does so much nearly flawless. One the other, there are still some deficiencies that I don't expect at a premium price, and for the price may not be justified just yet. I may take this back for a vizio p series to hold me over with hdr and the 10 bit panel for another couple of years until LG figures out their processing or another manufacturer gets into the OLED game.

Im not a fan of 3d, but 3d is outrageously cool on this set. If you're a fan of 3d, jump on board!

Btw, my set has not been professionally calibrated, but not sure if this would help the just above black performance or help reduce noise.
The 2016 OLED's will upscale 1080p phenomenally. If you feed it highly compressed 1080p from your cable provider that's another story (part of the reason I refuse to pay for any cable provider).
I use a Tivo strictly OTA and it looks absolutely fine.

I use ISF Dark on my 1080p stuff and things didn't look so great until I did.

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post #2380 of 28237 Old 07-27-2016, 10:09 PM
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I'm playing the beginning of Uncharted 4 and there's significant noise in the sky. It's not supposed to be there and I've seen it in other games where it is not meant to be. These are completely clean sources. This is not film. Some games throw some noise in for effect but it is far and few. These tv's can actually create noise from nothing.
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post #2381 of 28237 Old 07-27-2016, 10:27 PM
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I'm playing the beginning of Uncharted 4 and there's significant noise in the sky. It's not supposed to be there and I've seen it in other games where it is not meant to be. These are completely clean sources. This is not film. Some games throw some noise in for effect but it is far and few. These tv's can actually create noise from nothing.
I haven't played the new Uncharted yet but in The Witcher 3, there is banding noticeable in the night sky. It's more visible on the OLED due to the higher contrast but I can also see it on my IPS computer monitor. What you're seeing might not be the fault of the OLED IMO - do you have another display you can test the game out on?
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post #2382 of 28237 Old 07-27-2016, 10:32 PM
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Yeah, I'm just sick of testing. I'll do it though.
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post #2383 of 28237 Old 07-27-2016, 11:10 PM
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Ok so I tested it on my Sony HX929. There's no noise at all and no posterization on any setting. I cranked brightness and sharpness. Then I went back to my E6. Nothing has an effect on the noise except sharpness. I had it on 18 and lowered it to 5 and it helped a lot. The noise is still there but contained. The posterization is still very evident on certain sections. It seems the sharpness control on some of the newer tv's is extremely touchy. I tried out a Vizio P65 and it was the same thing. If the sharpness was just a little too high on games, the grain would just take over. On that tv, you could completely eliminate it though. You can't on the OLED.
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post #2384 of 28237 Old 07-27-2016, 11:35 PM
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Ok so I tested it on my Sony HX929. There's no noise at all and no posterization on any setting. I cranked brightness and sharpness. Then I went back to my E6. Nothing has an effect on the noise except sharpness. I had it on 18 and lowered it to 5 and it helped a lot. The noise is still there but contained. The posterization is still very evident on certain sections. It seems the sharpness control on some of the newer tv's is extremely touchy. I tried out a Vizio P65 and it was the same thing. If the sharpness was just a little too high on games, the grain would just take over. On that tv, you could completely eliminate it though. You can't on the OLED.
What are you playing on? The reason I ask is because I play on the PC connected to the LG using native 4k resolution and there is no issues at all. When I change to to 1080p output from the PC I notice mostly blurriness despite AA options. Some of the artifacts you mentioned may have resulted from the LG upscaling. If you're playing on the PC I would suggest running it @4k and turn down the other eye candy.

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post #2385 of 28237 Old 07-28-2016, 03:25 AM
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Originally Posted by MEGATRON 631 View Post
Where the c6 fails mainly for me is cable TV. The set is very unforgiving of noise and compression, and the additional upscaling sub 1080p to 4k is not handled particularly well. I've seen my father's 2014 panny lcd upscale much better, with many fewer compression artifacts. As I mentioned, the c6 also seems to exaggerate noise, and film grain as well.
Part of that exaggeration you're seeing is due to more detail near black that your father's Panasonic simply had no capability of showing.
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Btw, my set has not been professionally calibrated, but not sure if this would help the just above black performance or help reduce noise.
Yes, it should. Getting the gamma curve correct can help with suppression of noise above black that doesn't belong.
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post #2386 of 28237 Old 07-28-2016, 03:31 AM
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Hell even the Vizio P Series this year outdoes LG's top 2016 LCD's.
LCD is all Vizio has, and LG R&D has pretty much relegated LCD to the backburner since 2013/4. so this doesn't surprise me. The only other LG display I bought was a 32-incher for my dad back in 2010. Very reliable but of course not a showstopper for PQ. I know they put out some FALDs in previous years that weren't complete garbage.
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On top of that their Plasma's were notoriously behind Panasonic, Pioneer, and even Samsung in black level and overall performance. Their investment into OLED and their current monopoly over it is primarily what has them now accepted as a high end quality manufacturer. I do think though that if a company like Sony or Panasonic got a hold of WOLED (they wont so it doesn't matter) it wouldn't be better right away because there is the matter of experience, but I think one of those companies would quickly find more innovative ways to fix these little issues after just 2 or 3 generations. I would bet on it myself. It would also come at a higher cost for sure, so might not even be worth it for everyone as the current OLED's are for the most part great overall.
The G6 is $8k already, so I can't imagine OLEDs from the competition being more costly than that at this point (of course we now know there is nothing more videophile-worthy about the G6 than the "lowly" panels underneath it).
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post #2387 of 28237 Old 07-28-2016, 05:52 AM
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Of course, but come on LG's engineering has always been second tier, and that's not really even a bad thing really because there are many tiers. I love that they have delivered us OLED when nobody else has and I really thank them for it, but I sure would never consider them if they weren't the only company making OLED's. right now. They have a great thing going for themselves, they have a monopoly on a fantastic display technology with lots of potential. Potentially even the best display that has so far been commercially available. If they weren't making OLED's how many self proclaimed videophiles would be buying their LED LCD's over the Sony's, and Panasonic's? Unless cost is a problem I don't think many. Hell even the Vizio P Series this year outdoes LG's top 2016 LCD's. On top of that their Plasma's were notoriously behind Panasonic, Pioneer, and even Samsung in black level and overall performance. Their investment into OLED and their current monopoly over it is primarily what has them now accepted as a high end quality manufacturer. I do think though that if a company like Sony or Panasonic got a hold of WOLED (they wont so it doesn't matter) it wouldn't be better right away because there is the matter of experience, but I think one of those companies would quickly find more innovative ways to fix these little issues after just 2 or 3 generations. I would bet on it myself. It would also come at a higher cost for sure, so might not even be worth it for everyone as the current OLED's are for the most part great overall.
You may consider LG's engineering '2nd tier' and others may even consider it third or fourth tier. However, the fact remains they've produced a display that the overwhelming number of professional reviews deem to be the best consumer display in history.

Not bad for second tier engineering. The 'top tier' engineering companies (I'm assuming here we mean Sony, Samsung & Panasonic) have either tried to enter the consumer OLED market and failed, can only do it by using LG's OLED panels and not their own, or simply haven't yet figured out how to do it in an arena other than the professional, broadcast market. And it's LG that's 2nd tier?

So yeah, maybe Sony could make you that perfect 65" OLED without the little LG niggling issues, but would you spend $50,000 for that 65" perfection? Do you think I'm exaggerating? Take a look at Sony's small, professional OLED pricing, extrapolate that price to a 65" display, and then get back to me. My price estimate might be low.

As Joel Silver correctly pointed out at the VE shootout, any of these companies can provide you with perfection on every panel that rolls off their assembly line. The only problem is you couldn't afford it.

Lastly, as to the claims by a few of poor upscaling by the LG OLEDs, I say nonsense. I've compared 720p, 1080i and 1080p (satellite broadcasts and BluRay) on both my 65" B6 OLED and my Sony 940c (the best in the business, right?) and at anything even remotely close to normal viewing distance, there is no difference. None. Zero. Nada. In fact, I'll be so bold as to say even at 1/2 of a typical viewing distance you'll see no difference.

If you want to compare differences in 720p scaling by pressing your nose up against the screen, may I suggest you find a new hobby like painting?
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post #2388 of 28237 Old 07-28-2016, 06:17 AM
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Ok so I tested it on my Sony HX929. There's no noise at all and no posterization on any setting. I cranked brightness and sharpness. Then I went back to my E6. Nothing has an effect on the noise except sharpness. I had it on 18 and lowered it to 5 and it helped a lot. The noise is still there but contained. The posterization is still very evident on certain sections. It seems the sharpness control on some of the newer tv's is extremely touchy. I tried out a Vizio P65 and it was the same thing. If the sharpness was just a little too high on games, the grain would just take over. On that tv, you could completely eliminate it though. You can't on the OLED.
I'd bet it's related to the bit depth of your old 929 vs the higher bit depth of your new UHD OLED. I have done multiple posterization tests for people with my Sony 940c and my B6 OLED, to see what, if any, difference exists. I can tell you without a shadow of a doubt, there is no difference, none.

I believe my test is much more valid in that both of my panels are 10 bit panels and both are UHD displays. Both show the same posterization, the same degree of it and in precisely the same areas of the picture.

I have yet to see the OLED add noise where it didn't exist to begin with. I have no doubt if I loaned you my Sony 940c, you'd see the same posterization in your setup.

I told you a while back that you should switch from the B to the E since you blamed every anomaly you saw on the B's processor. I knew that wasn't the case, but once you lose faith you lose faith. Period.

Now you have an E and now you think these issues are the result of OLED in general. They're not, but the most important point is you think they are. You're back to a 'no confidence' position. Personally I've yet to see posterization in high quality, high bit rate sources, on either my LG or Sony.

So at this point, in all sincerity, I'd tell you to abandon OLED and stick with your 929. I wouldn't recommend that you go with any UHD LCD currently out there, because in your setup that won't rid you of your posterization either.

What you may want to do is wait for the Z9D. Sony 'claims' they have processing that will smooth out color gradients. Will it work? Who knows? Will it add other issues as extra processing often does? We'll see.

If viewing angle is not an issue for you and you're OK with the issues that are unique to LCD, that might be your best option.
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post #2389 of 28237 Old 07-28-2016, 07:29 AM
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Are any of you running with any of the noise reduction settings on? I've kept theme off, and sharpness at 0 as that was always the thing to do. Had that changed with this newer technology? Should I have this stuff on at all?

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post #2390 of 28237 Old 07-28-2016, 07:31 AM
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I'd bet it's related to the bit depth of your old 929 vs the higher bit depth of your new UHD OLED. I have done multiple posterization tests for people with my Sony 940c and my B6 OLED, to see what, if any, difference exists. I can tell you without a shadow of a doubt, there is no difference, none.



I believe my test is much more valid in that both of my panels are 10 bit panels and both are UHD displays. Both show the same posterization, the same degree of it and in precisely the same areas of the picture.



I have yet to see the OLED add noise where it didn't exist to begin with. I have no doubt if I loaned you my Sony 940c, you'd see the same posterization in your setup.



I told you a while back that you should switch from the B to the E since you blamed every anomaly you saw on the B's processor. I knew that wasn't the case, but once you lose faith you lose faith. Period.



Now you have an E and now you think these issues are the result of OLED in general. They're not, but the most important point is you think they are. You're back to a 'no confidence' position. Personally I've yet to see posterization in high quality, high bit rate sources, on either my LG or Sony.



So at this point, in all sincerity, I'd tell you to abandon OLED and stick with your 929. I wouldn't recommend that you go with any UHD LCD currently out there, because in your setup that won't rid you of your posterization either.



What you may want to do is wait for the Z9D. Sony 'claims' they have processing that will smooth out color gradients. Will it work? Who knows? Will it add other issues as extra processing often does? We'll see.



If viewing angle is not an issue for you and you're OK with the issues that are unique to LCD, that might be your best option.


That's what I've been leaning towards since the Z9D announcement. The E does have better motion than the B though. The stuttering issue is minimized.
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post #2391 of 28237 Old 07-28-2016, 07:33 AM
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What are you playing on? The reason I ask is because I play on the PC connected to the LG using native 4k resolution and there is no issues at all. When I change to to 1080p output from the PC I notice mostly blurriness despite AA options. Some of the artifacts you mentioned may have resulted from the LG upscaling. If you're playing on the PC I would suggest running it @4k and turn down the other eye candy.

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I was playing on PS4 last night. I play on PS4 and Xbox One. I was playing Uncharted 4 last night.
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post #2392 of 28237 Old 07-28-2016, 07:35 AM
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I'm playing the beginning of Uncharted 4 and there's significant noise in the sky. It's not supposed to be there and I've seen it in other games where it is not meant to be. These are completely clean sources. This is not film. Some games throw some noise in for effect but it is far and few. These tv's can actually create noise from nothing.
Google search and there have been issues with uncharted 4 as far as artificats being caused by how that game pushes the ps4 to its limits basically. And even the witcher 3 has articles online about the banding in the skies. I played until dawn and saw massive posterization and thought maybe it's my e6 then I tried it on a lcd and the posterization was clearly there as well.
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post #2393 of 28237 Old 07-28-2016, 07:55 AM
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That's what I've been leaning towards since the Z9D announcement. The E does have better motion than the B though. The stuttering issue is minimized.
The Z9D LCD may be the right choice for you. But I'll bet it won't eliminate the posterization you're seeing. If Sony's claims are right, it might be minimized, but probably not eliminated. Remember, there are no perfect displays, you may eliminate/minimize an OLED issue and in the process you'll inherit LCD issues. Pick your poison.

As for the motion, the stutter to me is such a minor issue in terms of motion. It's seldom seen and easily missed with the blink of an eye. I saw it on the first chapter of The Martian and haven't seen it at all on some other UHD movies. I still don't buy it's processor related, but whatever.

Judder is what most people see due to its magnitude and frequency, and that's exactly the same in all models. I see it on my 940c too.
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post #2394 of 28237 Old 07-28-2016, 08:02 AM
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Originally Posted by macmane View Post
Google search and there have been issues with uncharted 4 as far as artificats being caused by how that game pushes the ps4 to its limits basically. And even the witcher 3 has articles online about the banding in the skies. I played until dawn and saw massive posterization and thought maybe it's my e6 then I tried it on a lcd and the posterization was clearly there as well.
Precisely. I've said it before, every issue I've seen on my OLED I've been able to duplicate on my Sony. People who think these issues are unique to OLED simply haven't checked it thoroughly enough with a comparable UHD display of a different tech. Having both a UHD LCD and UHD OLED, is a great 'laboratory' to check these things for consistency. Checking an issue on a UHD OLED to see if you can duplicate it on an HD LCD, is not a good approach.

Now the only exception to these issues is the stutter issue. I was not able to duplicate that issue on my Sony, but I did see another poster saying that he did on his 940c.
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post #2395 of 28237 Old 07-28-2016, 08:42 AM
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HDR Test Patterns available

FYI, There is a set of reasonably priced HDR calibration patterns available at the link below.

http://rmadvancedcaldisc.com/rm-uhdhdr-10.html

Even without a colorimeter the basic patterns were helpful to set brightness, color and tint to get closer to the standard using the built in color filter.

More importantly for those of with with meters this includes the specific patterns necessary to calibrate the grayscale of our OLED TV's per LG's instructions here:
http://www.lg.com/us/support/product...0Procedure.pdf


The author has a forum here..
https://www.avsforum.com/forum/139-di...-patterns.html
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post #2396 of 28237 Old 07-28-2016, 10:21 AM
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Scratches and BreakIn

Well I joined the OLED party with a C 55 inch. I found a subtle 2 inch scratch on the panel when I got it. Very hard to see.

Have others had their sets come with a scratch(es).

Also, I am running a 30 hr break in period with 4K/HDR/pattern videos. Has anyone else done this before calibration?
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post #2397 of 28237 Old 07-28-2016, 11:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slowcarboost View Post
I'm playing the beginning of Uncharted 4 and there's significant noise in the sky. It's not supposed to be there and I've seen it in other games where it is not meant to be. These are completely clean sources. This is not film. Some games throw some noise in for effect but it is far and few. These tv's can actually create noise from nothing.

I recall Chad B. said in his review of this year's model(s) that there was a slight amount of non-defeatable edge enhancement, i.e. added noise, in the image. However, if true, this is something that likely could be fixed via a firmware update. Any added EE -- not matter how slight, would not be acceptable to me, but I'm hyper sensitive to added EE. To each is own, but it would be a deal breaker for me.
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post #2398 of 28237 Old 07-28-2016, 11:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rhinoballz View Post
Well I joined the OLED party with a C 55 inch. I found a subtle 2 inch scratch on the panel when I got it. Very hard to see.

Have others had their sets come with a scratch(es).

Also, I am running a 30 hr break in period with 4K/HDR/pattern videos. Has anyone else done this before calibration?
My first panel had what appeared to be drip or fluid marks on the screen that would not come off. I had to exchange at best buy. I haven't noticed any scratches or marks on the replacement panel
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post #2399 of 28237 Old 07-28-2016, 11:46 AM
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Originally Posted by Ken Ross View Post
You may consider LG's engineering '2nd tier' and others may even consider it third or fourth tier. However, the fact remains they've produced a display that the overwhelming number of professional reviews deem to be the best consumer display in history.

Not bad for second tier engineering. The 'top tier' engineering companies (I'm assuming here we mean Sony, Samsung & Panasonic) have either tried to enter the consumer OLED market and failed, can only do it by using LG's OLED panels and not their own, or simply haven't yet figured out how to do it in an arena other than the professional, broadcast market. And it's LG that's 2nd tier?

So yeah, maybe Sony could make you that perfect 65" OLED without the little LG niggling issues, but would you spend $50,000 for that 65" perfection? Do you think I'm exaggerating? Take a look at Sony's small, professional OLED pricing, extrapolate that price to a 65" display, and then get back to me. My price estimate might be low.

As Joel Silver correctly pointed out at the VE shootout, any of these companies can provide you with perfection on every panel that rolls off their assembly line. The only problem is you couldn't afford it.

Lastly, as to the claims by a few of poor upscaling by the LG OLEDs, I say nonsense. I've compared 720p, 1080i and 1080p (satellite broadcasts and BluRay) on both my 65" B6 OLED and my Sony 940c (the best in the business, right?) and at anything even remotely close to normal viewing distance, there is no difference. None. Zero. Nada. In fact, I'll be so bold as to say even at 1/2 of a typical viewing distance you'll see no difference.

If you want to compare differences in 720p scaling by pressing your nose up against the screen, may I suggest you find a new hobby like painting?
I don't really disagree with anything you have said here. I don't think "second tier" is a terrible thing to be, and it's definitely possible for a company not generally known to make the very best products to deliver one that blows most people away. I just don't think they are as good as tightening up the loose ends as some of the other companies are. There are also companies with way worse QC as well. The first OLED's were by some distance the best looking pictures with the least problems compared to any other first like the first Plasma or LCD. I think that says more about how great OLED is than LG is.

And for the record I probably would not be one of those people paying Sony prices for a Sony OLED because I can just barely afford an LG OLED.
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post #2400 of 28237 Old 07-28-2016, 11:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Ross View Post
The Z9D LCD may be the right choice for you. But I'll bet it won't eliminate the posterization you're seeing. If Sony's claims are right, it might be minimized, but probably not eliminated. Remember, there are no perfect displays, you may eliminate/minimize an OLED issue and in the process you'll inherit LCD issues. Pick your poison.



As for the motion, the stutter to me is such a minor issue in terms of motion. It's seldom seen and easily missed with the blink of an eye. I saw it on the first chapter of The Martian and haven't seen it at all on some other UHD movies. I still don't buy it's processor related, but whatever.



Judder is what most people see due to its magnitude and frequency, and that's exactly the same in all models. I see it on my 940c too.


The posterization is not that big of a deal to me but it's there and obvious. The subpar motion handling is a big deal to me and that would not be an issue on a Sony. I'm sure of that.

I have a big problem with the black crush and near black issues. It crushes blacks pretty hard. You shouldn't really have to get your set calibrated to eliminate or minimize significant black crush. I have a problem with the fact that it makes subpar cable sources look a lot worse than other tv's do. You can a/b a lot of these issues and see them on other tv's but you notice them a lot less because the OLED's exacerbate these issues.

As I've said before, when it looks good, it's the best picture I've ever seen but more often than not, I'm looking at something that looks worse because of the aforementioned issues. I was leaning towards dealing with it but the Sony Z9D seems to be a viable choice for a replacement that would make me happy. We will see. I still have a little over a month on my E6 if I want to return or exchange. That should give me enough time to hear some early feedback on the Z9D.
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