Burn-in worries on 2016 LG OLED - Page 13 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #361 of 439 Old 11-17-2017, 08:11 AM
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I'm pretty sure the issue being discussed here is caused by short-term threshold-shift and is a completely different mechanism than the long-term burn-in caused by a differential in subpixel aging/fading.

Anything caused from 20 hours of use on a WOLED TV with 1000 or 2000 hours of use is not linked to subpixel aging/dimming.

The aging/dimming-related burn-in several members have experienced seems to be caused from 20% or more of the overall TVs use being tied to static logos (meaning 200+ hours on a 1000-hour-old OLED and 400+ hours on a 2000-hour-old WOLED).[/quote]
For the past week and a half I have been researching the LG C7 and Sony x900e, torn between the picture quality of the OLED vs the price and most likely better life span of the LCD. I came across an article from 2012 about OLED pixel aging with some good information about anyone considering buying an OLED. I would suggest reading it to start to understand some of the issues that OLED face.

I am new to posting so I cannot put the link, but if you google search “OLED pixel degradation” it is on the 2nd page, 4th link down with this title.
Using Integrated Optical Feedback to Counter Pixel Aging ... - MIT RLE

If some of you are too lazy to read or don't want to sift through all the technical terms here are some of the key points.

1). If OLEDs are to be used as pixel elements in information displays with 10,000 hours of stable operating lifetime, we show below that operating half-life (measure of time during which the OLED pixel quantum efficiency decays to half of the starting efficiency under constant current driving conditions) has to be extended beyond 300,000 hours. (If you take LG's current 100,000 hour half-life that would put stable operation at 3,333 hours, granted I am unsure how their clear panel noise helps to mitigate this).

2). Stability of pixel brightness in information displays is necessitated by the high sensitivity of human vision to brightness variation, with an average human eye capable of distinguishing a 2% difference in relative intensity of neighboring pixels. (When playing varying content with static logos, black bars, HDR brightness etc. pixels will be aged differently, once a 2% difference is reached it will be visible to the human eye).

3). We estimate that if constant-current-driven OLEDs are to be used in a display with 2% brightness accuracy over 10,000 hours of operation, then the OLED half-life has to be extended beyond 300,000 hours. This not counting other contributing factors such as temperature, brightness, voltage, and more listed in the article).

Based on this info it seems to me that is the reason why there are an increasing amount of reports of issues of pixel aging, or burn in, as the OLED ages. This has me very concerned about long term use and is pushing me towards the 900e. I'm thinking by the time I am ready to replace that TV hopefully OLED will have better stability so you don't suffer from decreased uniformity or burn in after a year or 2 depending on use. I don't believe "Burn In" is an actual issue with OLED but rather how the pixels are aging at different rates. Let me know if you think these concerns are valid.
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post #362 of 439 Old 11-17-2017, 09:58 AM
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Originally Posted by Kenbar View Post
Can't speak for you, but the dead pixels would drive me nuts. So I would return it.

As far as gaming goes...personally I would use some other TV for that. Use the Oled for movies. But you can protect yourself. Purchase the extended Geek Squad warranty. Or consider the Sony A1, they do not exclude uneven wear (BI) from their warranty (you would still want an extended warranty if a gamer).

Take a look at what Sony says about Oleds. Keep in mind these are the same things known to cause uneven wear/permanent image retention/burn in (all look the same)

"Scenarios that may cause image retention

Generally, due to the characteristics of the materials used for OLED displays to achieve high-definition imaging, the display is susceptible to screen image retention.

The following are examples of images that may cause image retention:

Content with black bars either on the top and bottom and/or the left and right-hand side of the screen (for example, Letterboxed, 4:3 screen)
Static images such as photos
Video games that might have static content in some part of the screen
On-screen menus, program guides, channel logos etc.
Static content from applications
On-screen tickers, such as those used for news and headlines


http://sony-eur-eu-en-web--eur.custh...8680/related/1
I read the entire linked article. In my opinion, Sony's disclosure is much more forthright (and helpful) than anything I have found published by LG

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post #363 of 439 Old 11-17-2017, 10:51 AM
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To me Sonys instructions sound like:

"To avoid image retention:
...
...
don't turn the TV on."

xD
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post #364 of 439 Old 11-17-2017, 11:21 AM
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Originally Posted by drophex View Post
To me Sonys instructions sound like:

"To avoid image retention:
...
...
don't turn the TV on."

xD
Which may be closer to the truth than "don't worry about it"
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post #365 of 439 Old 11-17-2017, 11:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OLEDcassini View Post
Im going to post a hypothesis based on some information trends I've seen in this thread.

Obviously image retention is a real thing. Burn in has been seen to be prevalent on an outlier basis.

Most of the occurrences happen in big box stores. Some big box stores that have been displaying the same image patterns have no sign of burn in, while others do.

The amount of burn in seen in home use is very minimal, and seems to occur in cases where another party besides the author of the post is present in the situation.

Burn in seems to occur in static images, which are mostly in the center of the tv, or along side the edge.

***I believe that a large amount of the burn in is due to the damage of the TFT layer by improper force applied by incorrectly cleaning the television***
Totally disagree. Burn in developed in one of my E6's without ever cleaning the screen.

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post #366 of 439 Old 11-18-2017, 10:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VoiD. View Post
I'm pretty sure the issue being discussed here is caused by short-term threshold-shift and is a completely different mechanism than the long-term burn-in caused by a differential in subpixel aging/fading.

Anything caused from 20 hours of use on a WOLED TV with 1000 or 2000 hours of use is not linked to subpixel aging/dimming.

The aging/dimming-related burn-in several members have experienced seems to be caused from 20% or more of the overall TVs use being tied to static logos (meaning 200+ hours on a 1000-hour-old OLED and 400+ hours on a 2000-hour-old WOLED).
For the past week and a half I have been researching the LG C7 and Sony x900e, torn between the picture quality of the OLED vs the price and most likely better life span of the LCD. I came across an article from 2012 about OLED pixel aging with some good information about anyone considering buying an OLED. I would suggest reading it to start to understand some of the issues that OLED face.

I am new to posting so I cannot put the link, but if you google search “OLED pixel degradation” it is on the 2nd page, 4th link down with this title.
Using Integrated Optical Feedback to Counter Pixel Aging ... - MIT RLE

If some of you are too lazy to read or don't want to sift through all the technical terms here are some of the key points.

1). If OLEDs are to be used as pixel elements in information displays with 10,000 hours of stable operating lifetime, we show below that operating half-life (measure of time during which the OLED pixel quantum efficiency decays to half of the starting efficiency under constant current driving conditions) has to be extended beyond 300,000 hours. (If you take LG's current 100,000 hour half-life that would put stable operation at 3,333 hours, granted I am unsure how their clear panel noise helps to mitigate this).

2). Stability of pixel brightness in information displays is necessitated by the high sensitivity of human vision to brightness variation, with an average human eye capable of distinguishing a 2% difference in relative intensity of neighboring pixels. (When playing varying content with static logos, black bars, HDR brightness etc. pixels will be aged differently, once a 2% difference is reached it will be visible to the human eye).

3). We estimate that if constant-current-driven OLEDs are to be used in a display with 2% brightness accuracy over 10,000 hours of operation, then the OLED half-life has to be extended beyond 300,000 hours. This not counting other contributing factors such as temperature, brightness, voltage, and more listed in the article).

Based on this info it seems to me that is the reason why there are an increasing amount of reports of issues of pixel aging, or burn in, as the OLED ages. This has me very concerned about long term use and is pushing me towards the 900e. I'm thinking by the time I am ready to replace that TV hopefully OLED will have better stability so you don't suffer from decreased uniformity or burn in after a year or 2 depending on use. I don't believe "Burn In" is an actual issue with OLED but rather how the pixels are aging at different rates. Let me know if you think these concerns are valid.
Some interesting stuff here - but me and many others have found that the our OLED sets get better with use, not worse. Mine had some slight, yet noticeable right-side vignetting when I first got it but after about 2-3 motnhs of regular use its almost completely gone and is only noticeable on specific gray colored screens. Even then its trivial and not bothersome at all. Never shows with any regular content.

But hey, who knows? Ive had my set about a year now and occasionally Ill throw a full red or yellow screen up there to check for IR or burn in and I have zero of either. If by year two my set gets worse or does start to have issue then screw it - Im either out of OLED if they dont make it better or Ill get ready to buy the next best thing. For now though, I really love the PQ on my set and will keep devouring content.

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post #367 of 439 Old 11-24-2017, 09:35 AM
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I going to return it. Ive opted for the Sony X930E. Samsung fell hard this year.

Its really a shame OLED tech suffers from this issue. Bottom line, i dont want to have to worry about "abusing" my tv. By "abuse" i mean my sometimes extended gaming sessions. Followed by watching something with a static logo.

When it comes to burn in, im finding conflicting results as to how and when. It definitely suffers from it though and the gap ive found is just to big for me to gamble whether or not I will have it in 6 months, 1 year, 2 years.

I found another dead pixel during a red screen, but it looks like it could be a small cluster of 2-3 pixels. Sucks though, i really had my heart set on OLED. I guess i'll wait 5 years and see whats new.

My wife complains I buy a tv every 2 years lol. Which is kinda true and it seems like a waste of money.

Theres nothing wrong with my Samsung 55 JS8500 (minus some dead pixels), but the reason i bought the OLED was the drop in price. Its my fault for not extensively researching OLED tech. I could have avoided all this by doing so and just kept my Samsung. Its hanging downstairs now and thats where it will stay.

Thanks for the responses.

Edit: Uhg, nope, wife wont let me take it back lol! We discussed everything and the compromise is if the OLED every gets burn-in, I put the LG downstairs and Samsung back up stairs.

BOOSH!

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post #368 of 439 Old 06-26-2018, 11:04 AM
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I'm at about 8000 hours on my 55c6p it has burn in of netflix logo that is t very visible except red screens worst is where closed captions would be i have two bars several inches long where text would be in that is visible in most content
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Originally Posted by tw1st3dss View Post
I'm at about 8000 hours on my 55c6p it has burn in of netflix logo that is t very visible except red screens worst is where closed captions would be i have two bars several inches long where text would be in that is visible in most content
You should take pictures and post in the master image Burn-in thread.
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post #370 of 439 Old 06-27-2018, 01:15 AM
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Yikes, I guess 8k hours is the potential point at which caption damage takes hold.
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post #371 of 439 Old 06-29-2018, 10:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tw1st3dss View Post
I'm at about 8000 hours on my 55c6p it has burn in of netflix logo that is t very visible except red screens worst is where closed captions would be i have two bars several inches long where text would be in that is visible in most content
I don't know how many of those 8000 hours you believe displayed the Netflix logo or the closed captions were displayed, but here is what burn-in on a red field should look like on a 2016 WOLED following ~1700 hours (21% of your viewing time):

What do you have OLED Light set to?

Also, are your closed captions in white or yellow?
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post #372 of 439 Old 06-29-2018, 01:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tw1st3dss View Post
I'm at about 8000 hours on my 55c6p it has burn in of netflix logo that is t very visible except red screens worst is where closed captions would be i have two bars several inches long where text would be in that is visible in most content
I don't know how many of those 8000 hours you believe displayed the Netflix logo or the closed captions were displayed, but here is what burn-in on a red field should look like on a 2016 WOLED following ~1700 hours (21% of your viewing time):

What do you have OLED Light set to?

Also, are your closed captions in white or yellow?
Closed captions yellow with black box around most of the time i was default cinema mode with energy saver off
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post #373 of 439 Old 06-29-2018, 01:49 PM
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Yellow'll do it. I have some PIXAR Blu-rays that default to yellow for captioning, and they are very nerve-wracking to my psyche knowing what we know about accelerated aging of red/yellow/orange hues.
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post #374 of 439 Old 07-03-2018, 10:38 PM
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Originally Posted by stevesiu View Post
We are considering a two count complaint in small claims 1) breach of UCC (Uniform Commercial Code) warranty that the product be fit for the purpose for which it was intended (watching tv) and 2) misrepresentation by LG on their website that BI is not a problem on their OLED, a misrepresentation that we reasonably relied upon before purchasing the product. Worth a shot IMHO. Also complaint with BBB Huntsville , Alabama.

What do we have to lose but time and filing and service fees in Small Claims Court , Florida
What was the result of the court case? Were you able to get your money back?
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post #375 of 439 Old 07-04-2018, 10:00 AM
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Lawsuit vs LG for Burn In on OLED

Consulted an attorney and was advised that express language of the LG warranty specifically barred any claims under the Uniform Commercial Code (Warranty that the product is fit for the purpose it was intended) or for misrepresentation in the LG advertising for the product. The warranty supersedes any claims LG may have made about the product. We also bought a Square Trade Warranty that extends the coverage of the LG Warranty for an additional year. In other words, it extends the "no coverage for Burn In" for another year. Waste of money. We still may file a complaint with BBB to warn others besides posting here.

Obviously, LG was aware the technology had a problem with Burn In, and carefully drafted their warranty to defeat all possible claims for it. The other manufacturers all buy their OLED panels from LG and their warranties mirror the language in the LG warranty, barring claims for Burn In.

We have Xfinity cable which allows us to cover the bottom 25% of the screen with semi-transparent light grey bar when the "Xfinity" menu button is hit on the remote. It is still possible to read text through the bar, with some difficulty. This is our attempt to limit further degradation of the damaged pixels when watching channels with ID logos or scrolling banners. However, this is "closing the barn door after the horse is gone", since the damage is done. I recently saw a post here by someone claiming LG has felt the pressure from the many Burn In complaints and has changed their policy, and now allow such claims. We would be interested in confirming this since as recently as last March(2018), they were adamant in denying all Burn In claims.

My next tv will not be an OLED unless the manufacturer provides warranty coverage for Burn In. BTW, our set is a LG OLED65B6P purchased December 2016. Started noticing the problem after about 6 months but wasn't sure what it was initially. Later LG repair tech confirmed problem and LG then denied the claim.

Last edited by stevesiu; 07-04-2018 at 11:03 AM.
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post #376 of 439 Old 07-04-2018, 11:16 AM
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Originally Posted by stevesiu View Post
Consulted an attorney and was advised that express language of the LG warranty specifically barred any claims under the Uniform Commercial Code (Warranty that the product is fit for the purpose it was intended) or for misrepresentation in the LG advertising for the product. The warranty supersedes any claims LG may have made about the product. We also bought a Square Trade Warranty that extends the coverage of the LG Warranty for an additional year. In other words, it extends the "no coverage for Burn In" for another year. Waste of money. We still may file a complaint with BBB to warn others besides posting here.

Obviously, LG was aware the technology had a problem with Burn In, and carefully drafted their warranty to defeat all possible claims for it. The other manufacturers all buy their OLED panels from LG and their warranties mirror the language in the LG warranty, barring claims for Burn In.

We have Xfinity cable which allows us to cover the bottom 25% of the screen with semi-transparent light grey bar when the "Xfinity" menu button is hit on the remote. It is still possible to read text through the bar, with some difficulty. This is our attempt to limit further degradation of the damaged pixels when watching channels with ID logos or scrolling banners. However, this is "closing the barn door after the horse is gone", since the damage is done. I recently saw a post here by someone claiming LG has felt the pressure from the many Burn In complaints and has changed their policy, and now allow such claims. We would be interested in confirming this since as recently as last March(2018), they were adamant in denying all Burn In claims.

My next tv will not be an OLED unless the manufacturer provides warranty coverage for Burn In. BTW, our set is a LG OLED65B6P purchased December 2016. Started noticing the problem after about 6 months but wasn't sure what it was initially. Later LG repair tech confirmed problem and LG then denied the claim.
Do you have any other LG products and receipts? LG will sometimes do a burn-in repair, if you are a regular customer and say you will not buy any more in the future.
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post #377 of 439 Old 07-04-2018, 01:19 PM
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Following your reply, I once again called LG Customer Service and told them we are long time LG customers. We have previously purchased two LG refrigerators, a microwave, dishwasher, oven, and now a television. However, we were so upset that LG denied our claim for "burn in" on our 2016 B6 OLED, that we were unlikely to ever buy another LG product of any kind. The customer service rep located our earlier claim and burn in pictures, and put me on hold while he discussed the matter with his supervisor. He then said the same thing LG has said all along, "Burn In" is not covered, no exceptions. I told him we would never buy another LG product. He said he was sorry to hear that, but understands. He said he hopes I change my mind and buy a new LG. I said never again, it would be a Sony.
Any rumors that LG has reconsidered their (today is July 4, 2018) policy that no burn in claims will be honored can be put to rest. I was told in no uncertain terms that there were no exceptions, no matter how you claim your tv was used or how many LG products you had purchased in the past.

I also found this post on the BBB website for Northern Alabama where the Huntsville headquarters for LG Electronics is located. It is a complaint from an LG B6 OLED customer who complained about BI.

What follows is the customers complaint as well as a "boiler plate" response from LG:

LG Electronics Alabama 10/23/17
Bill W.
Negative
BBB Verified Reviewer

I bought a LG OLED65c6p television on January 15th, 2017. I noticed at the bottom of the screen a distortion and what appears to be an image burn. I called them today and they stated that it wasn't covered under warranty. I expressed my frustration with them that the TV was less than a year old and I was having a problem and I expected them to cover it under warranty. They said that the image burn was not covered under warranty. In no way was this even discussed or insinuated when I bought it. So LG doesn't stand behind their product and is leaving the general public out of the know of such issues and how to protect against such issues. Very poor business model and lack of respond from LG.

Comments
Comment from the Business:

We have carefully reviewed the customer's information. Unfortunately the concern presented is not covered by the limited warranty. Image burn is caused by external forces, not a manufacturing defect. We cannot speak to any conversations prior to purchase as that would be with the customer's chosen dealer. The warranty information as well as limitations are available for review prior to any purchase on lg.com. We are truly apologetic for the customer's experience, we would be unable to assist with a necessary repair.


by Business on Oct. 24, 2017



As you can see, it is a complete waste of time to complain to LG about your tv. They don't care. However, complaints on public forums such as the Better Business Bureau serve to warn others and are useful. I did note that BBB site for Northern Alabama posted that they will no longer handle complaints about LG. Potential complaints about LG are now directed to a BBB website in New Jersey, with no explanation provided.

Last edited by stevesiu; 07-04-2018 at 01:27 PM.
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post #378 of 439 Old 07-04-2018, 02:18 PM
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Just as a brief update to my situation (which I posted about several months ago), the burn-in never went away for me, and I'm sure at this point it's permanent, but I also just stopped worrying about it. The TV's gonna burn in for me. For a bit, I was stressing about it so much, I wasn't enjoying what I wanted to, and I just realized that's not worth it. This TV was not abused, and just please be aware IF you watch channels with logos multiple hours a day or IF you play games and they have static HUD elements, especially reds/yellows, you REALLY CAN get burn-in even if you mix up content and just watch those channels/play those games a few hours a day. (Keep in mind, for Zelda, I put hundreds of hours in before I was finished with it. But never more than 3-4 hours at a time, and more often less like 1-2, with plenty of other content and days I didn't play at all in between. And on red/yellow/blue backgrounds, the hearts are quite noticeable if you're at all looking for them.

So, yes, I have two rows of Zelda hearts in the upper left hand corner and the beginning of a CNN logo in the lower right. I do try to vary content up and not leave anything static for huge amount of times, but as I game with this TV, that's not really practical, and I've since stopped worrying about it so much. I also didn't find decreasing brightness or other things that could have helped acceptable solutions, for me anyways - I like a bright picture. The TV's 2 years old, and along with some other minor issues (sound sync for one, though the latest firmware might have improved some of that - I still need to test more), I'll be considering a different model before too long. (Waiting to see if there's a new Sony Z this year, as the Z9D was one I was thinking about, so I'm curious what the rumored F might have.)

Even with its flaws, this was far from a bad TV and if I forget about the burn-in, it still has a really great picture in 98% of circumstances - it's just not a perfect TV either, and I really do feel like I was a little misled about burn-in, both from LG's advertising and an early article I read claiming OLED shouldn't be very susceptible to burn-in when considering a purchase (the latter being partially my fault for not doing more due diligence). All that said, I'd probably be hesitant as far as going OLED in the future, since I do game, and since I don't want to worry about HUD elements or static logos. The other technologies just make more sense for my uses.
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post #379 of 439 Old 07-05-2018, 05:47 AM
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Just as a brief update to my situation (which I posted about several months ago), the burn-in never went away for me, and I'm sure at this point it's permanent, but I also just stopped worrying about it. The TV's gonna burn in for me. For a bit, I was stressing about it so much, I wasn't enjoying what I wanted to, and I just realized that's not worth it. This TV was not abused, and just please be aware IF you watch channels with logos multiple hours a day or IF you play games and they have static HUD elements, especially reds/yellows, you REALLY CAN get burn-in even if you mix up content and just watch those channels/play those games a few hours a day. (Keep in mind, for Zelda, I put hundreds of hours in before I was finished with it. But never more than 3-4 hours at a time, and more often less like 1-2, with plenty of other content and days I didn't play at all in between. And on red/yellow/blue backgrounds, the hearts are quite noticeable if you're at all looking for them.

So, yes, I have two rows of Zelda hearts in the upper left hand corner and the beginning of a CNN logo in the lower right. I do try to vary content up and not leave anything static for huge amount of times, but as I game with this TV, that's not really practical, and I've since stopped worrying about it so much. I also didn't find decreasing brightness or other things that could have helped acceptable solutions, for me anyways - I like a bright picture. The TV's 2 years old, and along with some other minor issues (sound sync for one, though the latest firmware might have improved some of that - I still need to test more), I'll be considering a different model before too long. (Waiting to see if there's a new Sony Z this year, as the Z9D was one I was thinking about, so I'm curious what the rumored F might have.)

Even with its flaws, this was far from a bad TV and if I forget about the burn-in, it still has a really great picture in 98% of circumstances - it's just not a perfect TV either, and I really do feel like I was a little misled about burn-in, both from LG's advertising and an early article I read claiming OLED shouldn't be very susceptible to burn-in when considering a purchase (the latter being partially my fault for not doing more due diligence). All that said, I'd probably be hesitant as far as going OLED in the future, since I do game, and since I don't want to worry about HUD elements or static logos. The other technologies just make more sense for my uses.
Well spoken and very reasonable too. I’m sorry that you did experience burn in. There is no doubt that it does effect some users. I think a lot of us will probably be safe and not experience it so I still think it’s a relatively uncommon problem. However, it is perfectly understandable that next time around you’d want to try a different technology. If t happened to me I’d go in a different direction myself. The higher end LCDs are solid performers these days and while I still prefer OLED to LCD, they have come a long way towards improving some of the issues they’ve always had.

Good luck.

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post #380 of 439 Old 07-05-2018, 07:56 AM
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Some interesting stuff here - but me and many others have found that the our OLED sets get better with use, not worse. Mine had some slight, yet noticeable right-side vignetting when I first got it but after about 2-3 motnhs of regular use its almost completely gone and is only noticeable on specific gray colored screens. Even then its trivial and not bothersome at all. Never shows with any regular content.

But hey, who knows? Ive had my set about a year now and occasionally Ill throw a full red or yellow screen up there to check for IR or burn in and I have zero of either. If by year two my set gets worse or does start to have issue then screw it - Im either out of OLED if they dont make it better or Ill get ready to buy the next best thing. For now though, I really love the PQ on my set and will keep devouring content.
Though all of what the other poster said is possible (early pixel degradation on certain colors when the panel is abused) I still think those having this issue with normal use have bad panels. I mean if someone is seeing the NetFlix logo burnt in unless they've accidentally left their menu up for hours at at time there is no way that would cause BI unless IMO opinion the panel was defective somehow. I have changed none of my habits since purchasing my C6 in May of 2016 and like you its actually improved over the past year.
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post #381 of 439 Old 07-05-2018, 10:14 AM
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Though all f what the other poster said is possible (early pixel degradation on certain colors when the panel is abused) I still think those having this issue with normal use have bad panels. I mean if someone is seeing the NetFlix logo burnt in unless they've accidentally left their menu up for hours at at time there is no way that would cause BI unless IMO opinion the panel was defective somehow. I have changed none of my habits since purchasing my C6 in May of 2016 and like you its actually improved over the past year.
Yeah, I’m thinking that some panels left the factory with a propensity for burn in and that explains the fact that you have some people reporting it from what would be considered very reasonable use. Sure, there are some who did abuse it and other edge use cases but we’ve seen enough reports from what appear to be genuine cases of burn in that shouldn’t have happened.

Then, you have a large number of us that use the set as we please and have no issues whatsoever after thousands of hours of use. It simply can’t be a widespread problem or we’d all have it and LG would be sunk at this point from the lawsuits and warranty claims. Right?

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"But never more than 3-4 hours at a time, and more often less like 1-2, with plenty of other content and days I didn't play at all in between."

That's what worries me. I can mix up content no problem. But if the effect is cumulative, then eventually I'm going to get this too with as many hours as it takes to go through some of these RPG's.

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post #383 of 439 Old 07-05-2018, 07:28 PM
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"But never more than 3-4 hours at a time, and more often less like 1-2, with plenty of other content and days I didn't play at all in between."

That's what worries me. I can mix up content no problem. But if the effect is cumulative, then eventually I'm going to get this too with as many hours as it takes to go through some of these RPG's.
Why not buy a cheapo LCD for gaming...CNN watching ect? Save the Oled for movies.

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post #384 of 439 Old 07-05-2018, 07:55 PM
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Why not buy a cheapo LCD for gaming...CNN watching ect? Save the Oled for movies.
I have neither the money nor the space to do that. I still have the plasma that it replaced with no place to put it lol.

Our house is set up as such that there is one main TV. And I'm gonna baby the hell out of this one. Avoiding long sessions of CNN and Fox News isn't an issue, but I wanted to game on one of the best tv's for gaming out there, and that's the B7 by many accounts. I had to come here to hear about the burn in issues. Fingers still crossed that I got a good IR resistant panel.

And from other people's BI accounts, my Super NES classic is not coming anywhere near this thing.

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Just a few comments, and thanks for the comments I got.

Omni009, it's definitely very possible you'll experience this too, but not definite - it did seem cumulative in my case. The Zelda hearts are red, and red is one of the worst offenders for this set, apparently, so color of HUD elements may be a factor. (Also, that game displays the hearts for almost it's entirety - there are only a few screens where they don't show...so they're basically there all the time.) Some people also have recommendations to decrease brightness, etc. to prolong life. I didn't find that solution acceptable myself as I wanted to keep things brighter, BUT, some people are very happy with their picture despite reducing brightness, so it's something you could consider if you wanted to. All that said, the burn-in I did get (and I'm somewhere around 2 years of ownership) is frustrating, but it doesn't effect my enjoyment of the television in most scenarios. I've learned not to worry about it/focus on it, and while I still do notice it sometimes, it's not something I notice every day or can't get past for now. If it becomes jarring enough, it'll be time to find a replacement, but I still feel like it's manageable at the moment until a TV offers everything I want and I decide it's time to upgrade.

Re getting a "cheapo LCD for gaming", as a gamer, I want the best picture possible as well, so that doesn't really cut it, and like Omni009, I don't have the space for several setups anyways. Not to mention gaming isn't all just about picture - my best sound setup is also where the current TV is. There's really not a good reason in 2018 a high-end TV shouldn't be able to do both well without a great deal of burn-in risk. This particular technology just may not be as well suited for it, unfortunately. I'll be curious as new OLED's roll out if this gets better. If it does, I could still consider OLED in the future, but for right now, I may go for a LED LCD next time. For me, static content is common enough that if burn-in is a real concern, it's enough to push me to another technology. We shall see.

Whatever people decide, I've been much happier realizing 1) No technology is going to be perfect in all areas and 2) Try to focus on the good and not the issues as much as you can, and you'll be happier. =oP
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post #386 of 439 Old 07-05-2018, 08:14 PM
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Thanks for the advice, I'll definitely be playing Zelda in handheld mode then. I also have Xenoblade 2 in the wings, hopefully that doesn't have any HUD issues.

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I have neither the money nor the space to do that. I still have the plasma that it replaced with no place to put it lol.

Our house is set up as such that there is one main TV. And I'm gonna baby the hell out of this one. Avoiding long sessions of CNN and Fox News isn't an issue, but I wanted to game on one of the best tv's for gaming out there, and that's the B7 by many accounts. I had to come here to hear about the burn in issues. Fingers still crossed that I got a good IR resistant panel.

And from other people's BI accounts, my Super NES classic is not coming anywhere near this thing.
Well...you can always drop the olight and color level way down. Age the stationary pixels slower...

Yea, I know. Sucks to do that...but....

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Well...you can always drop the olight and color level way down. Age the stationary pixels slower...

Yea, I know. Sucks to do that...but....
For HDR gaming I'm going OLED light at 100. To turn that one down almost defeats one of the main purposes of buying the set. But for SDR gaming and everything else, I go with OLED light at 50. Too high?

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post #389 of 439 Old 07-05-2018, 08:34 PM
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For HDR gaming I'm going OLED light at 100. To turn that one down almost defeats one of the main purposes of buying the set. But for SDR gaming and everything else, I go with OLED light at 50. Too high?
Well, as you probably know reds, oranges and yellow are the main culprits. Staying aware of those stationary colors will probably help a lot.
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post #390 of 439 Old 08-04-2018, 10:07 AM
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For HDR gaming I'm going OLED light at 100. To turn that one down almost defeats one of the main purposes of buying the set. But for SDR gaming and everything else, I go with OLED light at 50. Too high?

Honestly, yes, I think 50 for OLED light is still too high when displaying the same yellow/orange/red static elements in the same locations on the screen for hundreds of cumulative hours. Our BI happened at OLED Light 60 after about 4 hours of MSNBC a day over about 6 months. That's on a B6. Our case was very much in line with what other B6 owners with BI have reported in terms of total cumulative hours and OLED light levels.


I'd suggest for bright yellow/orange/red static elements on screen, to lower that OLED light even more, as low as possible. The more you lower it, the more total hours those static elements can be displayed before they start showing signs of burn-in.


When playing/watching at night, it helps to turn off all room lighting, so that when you turn the OLED Light level down, the TV will appear brighter (than with any room lighting on).

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