US Pricing & Availability for LG OLED TVs Announced - Page 6 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #151 of 178 Old 06-01-2016, 03:50 PM
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Originally Posted by sage11x View Post
That's what I thought but, honestly, it's a lot easier/cheaper/more versatile than I thought.


Most projectors nowadays have more than enough lumens to push an image in even less than ideal settings (lights on, windows open, etc.) and can be easily adjusted to night/dark modes with the press of a button. My projector is relatively short throw and is fairly compact so mounting was a breeze. Fixed screens are now readily available and are inexpensive and simple to assemble/install. Picture quality is astounding for the price. Color accuracy rivals that of my plasma and the image is sharp and free of the issues that plague large LCDs. 3D in particular is much better than what I've experienced on any LCD/plasma.


The rub, of course, is contrast/black level. In the sub $2k market you don't get much of it. $2k to $3k you'll do much better but then you'll start to see the limitations your room has on your picture. By the time you get to the JVCs at $4k you can rival any plasma/OLED but only if you have a dedicated light controlled space.


Still, as a plasma snob who values contrast and black level more than most the step back in blacks hasn't bothered me as much as I thought it would. The truth is 90% of movies have crushed blacks anyway, most projectors ANSI contrast is still superior compared to something like LCD and, to be frank, 65" just can't compete with 100". Not in a million years. Trying to watch movies on a 60-65" set now feels like watching movies on our ipad.


And the best part? Relatives and friends who won't even notice your shiny new flat panel are blown away by the projector. Your place is now the preffered destination for movie night and game day.
I agree. Whenever I've experienced projectors in person, the complete level of immersion makes me forget/overlook black level. Plus, black level on projectors looks good on content because, unlike LCD/LED, a black field is completely uniform (at least on the one's I've seen) with no spotlighting or imperfections whatsoever.
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post #152 of 178 Old 06-01-2016, 03:53 PM
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I've never been impressed by picture quality from projectors. Few high end projectors are ok but they are overpriced and no better than LCDs.
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post #153 of 178 Old 06-01-2016, 04:01 PM
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Originally Posted by imagic View Post
I'm right there with ya. TV has become an afterthought now that I have a 120" 2.40:1 screen (Stewart StudioTek 130). I'm using two projectors, which is my poor-man's solution to the aspect ratio issue. I have a BenQ 1085ST filling the screen for widescreen movies, and a BenQ 4050 on 16x9 duty. Yeah, I have to switch projectors (they are stacked) if content aspect changes, but to me it's a small price to pay. I blacked out my room and that makes a sizeable difference in on-screen black levels. There's no way I'm going back to a TV-sized image since projectors of this quality are available at these affordable prices. The first time friends see the screen, the first thing they do is ask if they can play video games on it.
I LIKE the solution to the aspect ratio, sir! I was going to say above that when I watch 16:9 movies I never even notice the lack of black level depth because I don't see the letterbox bars!


Hopefully we'll be getting more lens memory preset projectors for lower prices in the coming years.

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post #154 of 178 Old 06-01-2016, 04:01 PM
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And then there are the people with both a dinky-sized OLED and a projector who find themselves preferring to watch OLED in owing to its incredible contrast ratio and depth. I hope they check in for balance.
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post #155 of 178 Old 06-01-2016, 04:16 PM
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I've never been impressed by picture quality from projectors. Few high end projectors are ok but they are overpriced and no better than LCDs.
A JVC X550R is only $4k and in the right room can out perform even the very best plasmas ever made in contrast/black levels and can easily push a 120" picture. Considering the price/size ratio I'd say that's a bargain.
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post #156 of 178 Old 06-01-2016, 04:54 PM
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A JVC X550R is only $4k and in the right room can out perform even the very best plasmas ever made in contrast/black levels and can easily push a 120" picture. Considering the price/size ratio I'd say that's a bargain.
Pioneer krp500m have better contrast/black levels. That projector is overpriced. For $4K it should outperform it in every way.
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post #157 of 178 Old 06-01-2016, 05:10 PM
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Pioneer krp500m have better contrast/black levels. That projector is overpriced. For $4K it should outperform it in every way.
Without a doubt it does. But is the difference in black level really worth giving up 70 inches of screen size?

Projectors put up a very natural and uniform picture with excellent motion, just like the Kuro. Plus you don't have to worry about screen burn in.

If I had the logistics at my house, I would much rather spend $4K on a projector than $5K on a 65 inch OLED.

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post #158 of 178 Old 06-01-2016, 05:23 PM
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Originally Posted by makaveddie81 View Post
Without a doubt it does. But is the difference in black level really worth giving up 70 inches of screen size?

Projectors put up a very natural and uniform picture with excellent motion, just like the Kuro. Plus you don't have to worry about screen burn in.

If I had the logistics at my house, I would much rather spend $4K on a projector than $5K on a 65 inch OLED.
For me it's all about picture quality vs size. Black level/contrast is most important factor. If I get a projector, it has to have the best black level/contrast that matches/exceeds OLEDs and no projectors provide that.
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post #159 of 178 Old 06-01-2016, 05:44 PM
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I take a 3 solution approach:
1. Projector with 92" screen for Blu-ray
2. Kuro for TV shows
3. 65" B6 for Sports
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post #160 of 178 Old 06-01-2016, 10:00 PM
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For me it's all about picture quality vs size. Black level/contrast is most important factor. If I get a projector, it has to have the best black level/contrast that matches/exceeds OLEDs and no projectors provide that.
Pretty much agree. I also think both TV and Projection produce somewhat different kinds of experiences and I wouldn't want to just replace one over the other because of size or something like that. I like keeping projection at the theater because it's a more immersive and powerful experience I don't want to spoil, where as watching a nice BR on my 50 inch Kuro can be a more personal experience while still being pretty damn immersive at times. And it can be more beautiful than the theater with the right content. Besides, no projector will ever come close to what it's like to actually experience IMAX 70mm so I would rather just have an amazing TV with it's own unique benefits and keep the ultimate immersive experience as something really special instead of trying (and ultimately failing) to imitate it.
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post #161 of 178 Old 06-01-2016, 10:31 PM
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Originally Posted by makaveddie81 View Post
Without a doubt it does. But is the difference in black level really worth giving up 70 inches of screen size?

Projectors put up a very natural and uniform picture with excellent motion, just like the Kuro. Plus you don't have to worry about screen burn in.

If I had the logistics at my house, I would much rather spend $4K on a projector than $5K on a 65 inch OLED.
For me it's all about picture quality vs size. Black level/contrast is most important factor. If I get a projector, it has to have the best black level/contrast that matches/exceeds OLEDs and no projectors provide that.
Fair enough.

I'd still argue that the JVC projectors can rival an OLED but ONLY if your room is right. The beautiful thing about OLED and flat panels in general is you can just just plop the thing down in the room and you're done. With a projector, to get every last drop of performance you need to have light control and that doesn't mean simply having the ability to shut the lights off. Once you place a 2000 lumen projector pointed at a 100"+ reflective screen a seemingly dark room won't be so dark anymore.

As for my Projector: it can't compete with my VT60 in terms of black level or contrast. But I still love watching it and currently you can have my same projector, my mount and my screen for right around $1k. If you think that's a poor value then that's your opinion but for me: I think it's an insane value! How much flat screen does $1000 buy you these days? A 60"? Maybe a fancy 55" or a not so fancy 65"?

Look, I really hope OLED is successful and these prices begin to fall. The picture quality of OLED is astounding! I just feel that at these prices it represents a poor value (to me). I always appreciated plasma as whether you were buying the top shelf model or the entry level you were still getting one hell of a picture. My VT60 sits right next to my lowly S30 (literally, they share a stand). The S30 doesn't look nearly as nice as my VT but you'd never guess that the VT was over three times it's price! That's the value that plasma represented. Even when viewed side by side the S30 acquits itself amazingly well.

OLED is a premium only display. That's fine for those that have the means and desire to pay the price but this is why I argue that OLED isn't a direct replacement for plasma.
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post #162 of 178 Old 06-01-2016, 10:59 PM
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Pretty much agree. I also think both TV and Projection produce somewhat different kinds of experiences and I wouldn't want to just replace one over the other because of size or something like that. I like keeping projection at the theater because it's a more immersive and powerful experience I don't want to spoil, where as watching a nice BR on my 50 inch Kuro can be a more personal experience while still being pretty damn immersive at times. And it can be more beautiful than the theater with the right content. Besides, no projector will ever come close to what it's like to actually experience IMAX 70mm so I would rather just have an amazing TV with it's own unique benefits and keep the ultimate immersive experience as something really special instead of trying (and ultimately failing) to imitate it.
So I have to laugh at this a little bit but only because of this story. Right before it exited the theaters my girlfriend and I finally went to see DeadPool at our local Cineplex. During the film my girlfriend remarked that she would rather be at home so she could be in her PJs, put her feet up and "the picture is better on our screen anyway". At the time I thought this was just a little ego stroking for my benefit but fast forward to a couple weeks ago when the bluray came out and we're sitting there watching the movie on a Tuesday night and she remarks again: "holy crap this looks better on our projector-- why do we pay to go to the theater?". You know what? I agree with her. Movie night at home is the best.
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post #163 of 178 Old 06-02-2016, 04:34 AM
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So I have to laugh at this a little bit but only because of this story. Right before it exited the theaters my girlfriend and I finally went to see DeadPool at our local Cineplex. During the film my girlfriend remarked that she would rather be at home so she could be in her PJs, put her feet up and "the picture is better on our screen anyway". At the time I thought this was just a little ego stroking for my benefit but fast forward to a couple weeks ago when the bluray came out and we're sitting there watching the movie on a Tuesday night and she remarks again: "holy crap this looks better on our projector-- why do we pay to go to the theater?". You know what? I agree with her. Movie night at home is the best.
I've come to the same conclusion. My wife....not there yet.

On the flip side, going to the movies is counted as a date night where sitting on the sofa watch the same movie wouldn't.
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post #164 of 178 Old 06-02-2016, 01:11 PM
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Fair enough.

I'd still argue that the JVC projectors can rival an OLED but ONLY if your room is right. The beautiful thing about OLED and flat panels in general is you can just just plop the thing down in the room and you're done. With a projector, to get every last drop of performance you need to have light control and that doesn't mean simply having the ability to shut the lights off. Once you place a 2000 lumen projector pointed at a 100"+ reflective screen a seemingly dark room won't be so dark anymore.

As for my Projector: it can't compete with my VT60 in terms of black level or contrast. But I still love watching it and currently you can have my same projector, my mount and my screen for right around $1k. If you think that's a poor value then that's your opinion but for me: I think it's an insane value! How much flat screen does $1000 buy you these days? A 60"? Maybe a fancy 55" or a not so fancy 65"?

Look, I really hope OLED is successful and these prices begin to fall. The picture quality of OLED is astounding! I just feel that at these prices it represents a poor value (to me). I always appreciated plasma as whether you were buying the top shelf model or the entry level you were still getting one hell of a picture. My VT60 sits right next to my lowly S30 (literally, they share a stand). The S30 doesn't look nearly as nice as my VT but you'd never guess that the VT was over three times it's price! That's the value that plasma represented. Even when viewed side by side the S30 acquits itself amazingly well.

OLED is a premium only display. That's fine for those that have the means and desire to pay the price but this is why I argue that OLED isn't a direct replacement for plasma.
It has to get to that point, and that is going to take patience. Every type of consumer display starts out as a Premium only product and if it's successful it has a breakthrough at some point. OLED is getting there. I do agree with you that the took a step back this year with their pricing but LG has to know that they can't keep it that way for long.
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post #165 of 178 Old 06-02-2016, 01:19 PM
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Moreover, they have to know that they can't meet a sales forecast that calls for selling more than they ever had before (1 million) AND price it a premium greater than that of previous years.
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post #166 of 178 Old 06-02-2016, 01:32 PM
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Yeah exactly. LG might have something up their sleeve, some big sale planned at some point in the year or something. Hopefully it's not a price cut so good I instantly regret buying my used 111FD
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post #167 of 178 Old 06-03-2016, 01:15 AM
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It has to get to that point, and that is going to take patience. Every type of consumer display starts out as a Premium only product and if it's successful it has a breakthrough at some point. OLED is getting there. I do agree with you that the took a step back this year with their pricing but LG has to know that they can't keep it that way for long.
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Moreover, they have to know that they can't meet a sales forecast that calls for selling more than they ever had before (1 million) AND price it a premium greater than that of previous years.
I think they are feeling out their price point. They will sell high to those who don't have the patience or the luxury of time, but I can only imagine that sales at those prices will drop quickly. Once sales drop we will start seeing deals that will get more and more aggressive as the year goes on and supply increases.
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post #168 of 178 Old 06-03-2016, 07:35 AM
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OLED has the best picture I have ever seen but like many other people here it's just not worth it. I too have a projector in a blacked out room and having a big picture just outweighs the blacklevel of a smaller OLED. And again at these prices they are selling them at you can get a VERY good projector and then with a DIY screen you just get way more for your money. And lastly TVs are getting newer tech in them every generation and trying to sell one second hand is like selling a receiver. You won't get sh*t for it - projectors are usually not too bad in that regard. In the future there will hopefully be paper thin 120" OLED screens that that you just roll out on your wall like a projector screen. The trick will be to make it sound transparent lol
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post #169 of 178 Old 06-03-2016, 08:40 AM
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In the future, maybe. But in order to get there we need people to buy these current LG OLED's that are priced at a premium or else we will never get there.
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post #170 of 178 Old 06-03-2016, 05:02 PM
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In the future, maybe. But in order to get there we need people to buy these current LG OLED's that are priced at a premium or else we will never get there.
In other words, sacrificial lambs jk
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post #171 of 178 Old 06-04-2016, 08:13 AM
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OLED has the best picture I have ever seen but like many other people here it's just not worth it. I too have a projector in a blacked out room and having a big picture just outweighs the blacklevel of a smaller OLED. And again at these prices they are selling them at you can get a VERY good projector and then with a DIY screen you just get way more for your money. And lastly TVs are getting newer tech in them every generation and trying to sell one second hand is like selling a receiver. You won't get sh*t for it - projectors are usually not too bad in that regard. In the future there will hopefully be paper thin 120" OLED screens that that you just roll out on your wall like a projector screen. The trick will be to make it sound transparent lol
This is the true promise of OLED in my mind: a flexible display rolled into a tube which I can easily transport and then unroll onto my wall. It sounds a little science fiction and maybe it is but the theory is sound with what product demos LG has shown in the past. The issue with flatscreens is they become fairly unwieldly in the largest sizes. While a lot of my friends tease me for what they perceive as the great effort of mounting a projector to a ceiling joist and hanging a lightweight screen on a wall I assure them it was far easier than carrying an 80"+ flat screen through my house and then mounting that to a wall. In fact: you could do the projector install all by yourself-- something you can't say for a flatscreen any large than maybe 50" in size.

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post #172 of 178 Old 06-04-2016, 08:39 AM
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If thats the way it goes, totally flat and flexible OLED screens that can be made in any number of sizes, I supposed it could not only replace peoples projectors but movie theater projectors too maybe? Of course Quentin Tarantino and Christopher Nolan would probably kill themselves
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post #173 of 178 Old 06-04-2016, 11:13 PM
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Instant rebates are in effect for all models now. Best Buy etc have $1000 off the B6 and C6 models as of midnight.
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post #174 of 178 Old 06-05-2016, 12:08 AM
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Instant rebates are in effect for all models now. Best Buy etc have $1000 off the B6 and C6 models as of midnight.
That makes infinitely more sense than those being the same price as the E6. The fact that a big box already has them at $3000 makes my scheme to pick a 55" up eventually in the low $2000s from a discount place seem less harebrained.

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post #175 of 178 Old 06-06-2016, 08:03 AM
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65c6 & b6 msrp $4,999

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Instant rebates are in effect for all models now. Best Buy etc have $1000 off the B6 and C6 models as of midnight.
These aren't instant rebates, these places are just selling at MSRP. LG has now listed on their website the 65B6 and C6 at $4,999 MSRP. If you wait a couple of weeks, maybe even now, you should be able to get one of the two somewhere between $4K and $4.5K. As we approach the holidays I'll bet you could grab one for under $4K. If you want one of these closer to $3K, you'll probably have to wait until next summer.
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post #176 of 178 Old 06-06-2016, 08:19 AM
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I am hoping around the 4th of July we see some type of sales incentive be it a discount or a free tv. A sale price of $4500 would be great.
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post #177 of 178 Old 06-23-2016, 11:08 PM
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Okay now I'm confused. Somehow I've been under the impression that the $3K price on the 55 inch B6 and C6 were the actual MSRPs, but BH has me second guessing now with this: "Offer ends: Jun 25 '16 at 11:59 PM EDT".

And Best Buy lists it as $3K on sale from $4K. Has the listing looked like that all along? Happens to be the same day the Samsungs are supposed to go up according to BH and Costco. Are prices really going to go up?

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post #178 of 178 Old 06-26-2016, 12:23 AM
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^^^Well turns out the price came down by $200. MSRP is now $2799 - a good sign that I'll get the price I want by years end!

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