SONY to debut consumer OLEDs @CES 2017 - Page 6 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #151 of 1616 Old 12-06-2016, 03:33 PM
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Off-topic with more wide-eyed speculation, like so much vaporware that has preceded it. OLED is a rare breed that has actually delivered!
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post #152 of 1616 Old 12-06-2016, 03:39 PM
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Off-topic with more wide-eyed speculation, like so much vaporware that has preceded it. OLED is a rare breed that has actually delivered!
...but QLED will be so much better!
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post #153 of 1616 Old 12-06-2016, 03:41 PM
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Yea, boyee, just you wait. 2020 is OLED's year of reckoning by the QLED/MicroLED tsunami.
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post #154 of 1616 Old 12-06-2016, 04:16 PM
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Sony aint trickin me... same pig...different lipstick!
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post #155 of 1616 Old 12-06-2016, 04:26 PM
 
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Originally Posted by rikkyjames
- LG don't want Sony or anybody else to fail with their OLED release (using their panel). I would imagine the complete opposite is true as that will reflect badly on OLED as a tech moving forward, they need it to be a success.
Not only that LG Display is a wholly separate business unit in the LG cabal from LG Electronics that makes the LG TV's .

LGD never intended to keep OLED TV's an LG Electronics exclusive product , they are probably ramping up OLED TV panel production for anyone that wants them within thier production capacity at any given time and I belive aside from *maybe Panasonic ,maybe Hisense (or someone in the PRC ) has a new homegrown OLED TV panel product .

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post #156 of 1616 Old 12-06-2016, 04:32 PM
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I don't care who makes what with OLED. They have to get the cost of a 75" set within the same ballpark as a 75" LCD and then we are good to go.
NO KIDDING I am never going back to sub 75" so doesn't matter to me who's badge is on front of tv it's all the same if it's 55" or 65"
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post #157 of 1616 Old 12-06-2016, 04:32 PM
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OLED isn't going to stay at 300-650 lines forever. At some point somebodies going to figure out a way to bump it up some with either BFI or Interpolation. I hope all OLED's next year have improved motion rez, both LG and Sony. From some of the rumors it's possible we could finally see an OLED with improved motion rez but we'll wait and see.
I agree that improvement on OLED motion can happen any time. David Mackenzie stated a while back that Sony motion options on one of the OLED monitors was very nice. He would love to see that to trickle down on consumer OLEDs.
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Either way even if the Sony has the same motion resolution it's not just about that, there's many other processing elements that Sony can usually do better than LG.
Based upon Archers follow up article Sony does not want to win the Shootout it wants to beat on price so we should not be to optimistic about the quality of these Sony OLEDs..

Main thing here for me is that there is movement, there is gonna be competition.
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post #158 of 1616 Old 12-06-2016, 04:32 PM
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The interesting question for me is whether these Sony TVs will have 2016 LG panels or 2017 LG panels. If the latter, the lack of a 77" Sony option might suggest that LG is not planning any kind of mass production of the 77" in 2017 and it will be continue to be a vanity product. Not really surprising if so, but disappointing.

Of course that's a lot of 'ifs'. Does anyone know if the Panasonic OLEDs were a year behind the LGs? From memory I think they were. It would explain the price.
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post #159 of 1616 Old 12-06-2016, 04:46 PM
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AFAIK the curent Sony CEO has stated he won't be selling the (now profitable ) Sony TV subsidiary (it's not a Sony corp. division anymore ) like Sony sound or Sony optical sensors or Sony games , entertainment and music (Sony Movies ,TV and Music ) , Sony banking ,medical and insurance and so on.

It will be interesting to see Sony LCD vs the newer High emd ZD9 type LCD products if that should happen
It looks like the top Sony LCd's are getting better and below that they get worse based upon comments i am reading here. The ZD9 is a Sony exclusive which is here to stay, it is suppost to be better than the other LCd's they are selling.

Just because Sony builds a one LED per zone LCd does not mean others will do to. Actually it looks that there is lots of movement in the Sony camp while the other manufacturers are moving slow and carefully. I would not expect to much from them exept from Samsung though the QLED is still a few years away.
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post #160 of 1616 Old 12-06-2016, 04:51 PM
 
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I read Sony TV at one time stated they were not too fond of an RGBW OLED product for them like LG OLED TV's .

They allegedly said the RGB OLED panels (they prefer) like they use in their premium professional monitors are too costly for a consumer TV .

OTOH it's plausible (now) that Sony could make OLED TV product with LGD RGBW panels to get some OLED market share from the OLED videophiles and enthusiasts that wont necessarily buy an LCD of any kind or they can plausibly slot it in below the VP9 LCD and above or with the other premium 55" - 65" LCD product prices or vs versa .
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post #161 of 1616 Old 12-06-2016, 04:56 PM
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Originally Posted by teepeey View Post
The interesting question for me is whether these Sony TVs will have 2016 LG panels or 2017 LG panels. If the latter, the lack of a 77" Sony option might suggest that LG is not planning any kind of mass production of the 77" in 2017 and it will be continue to be a vanity product. Not really surprising if so, but disappointing.

Of course that's a lot of 'ifs'. Does anyone know if the Panasonic OLEDs were a year behind the LGs? From memory I think they were. It would explain the price.
Well next year there's supposed to be 2 different 77" models from LG. One 77" G7 and a Flexible 77" W7. Obviously the flexible 77" will be the priciest of all, probably at least what the current 77G6 is (20K). The 77G7 will probably reach 15K, so it will improve in price and yeild but it wont "breakthrough" just yet. They need a little more time to get it to typical 70+ LCD prices. My guess is 2018-2019 at the very latest for a 10K non-flexible 77 inch OLED.
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post #162 of 1616 Old 12-06-2016, 05:01 PM
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Originally Posted by synccoil View Post
I read Sony TV at one time stated they were not too fond of an RGBW OLED product for them like LG OLED TV's .

They allegedly said the RGB OLED panels (they prefer) like they use in their premium professional monitors are too costly for a consumer TV .

OTOH it's plausible (now) that Sony could make OLED TV product with LGD RGBW panels to get some OLED market share from the OLED videophiles and enthusiasts that wont necessarily buy an LCD of any kind or they can plausibly slot it in below the VP9 LCD and above or with the other premium 55" - 65" LCD product prices or vs versa .
Not shure what they want. The ZD9 rumors made no sense still they put it on the market in three sizes. Same thing with the OLED rumors. LG OLED was not good enough/profitable enough for them yet now it looks like there will be at least two sizes, relatively cheap, next year. Looks like they want a piece of the OLED cake early on while not giving up on LCd.
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post #163 of 1616 Old 12-06-2016, 05:05 PM
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This time in 2018 there will be a new TV in my house
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post #164 of 1616 Old 12-06-2016, 05:10 PM
 
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It looks like the top Sony LCd's are getting better and below that they get worse based upon comments i am reading here. The ZD9 is a Sony exclusive which is here to stay, it is suppose to be better than the other LCd's they are selling.

Just because Sony builds a one LED per zone LCd does not mean others will do to. Actually it looks that there is lots of movement in the Sony camp while the other manufacturers are moving slow and carefully. I would not expect to much from them except from Samsung though the QLED is still a few years away.

Right , I think the 55"/65" IPS panel Sony X850D vs last years VA panel X850C (blacks and contrast ) are the main complaints about the 2016 Sony's.

The 2016 X930D/940D are probably as good or better than the 2015 product they have a new processing /scaler X-1 something engine that is reliably reported to be better than the excellent one in the 2015 product.

OTOH in a bright room or with any lights on or an ambient back light like I have in here the 55"/65" 2016 Sony X850D should be fine or nearly so .

My 2015 X850C is real decent all around . Glad I have 3 more years left on the Costco square trade warranty but if it breaks anthing short of a panel or bonded panel tab connection I can fix it after the warranty anyway.

Sure some or most of all that you posted is all plausible and it's good to see Sony innovating like (usually) only Sony and maybe Panasonic could for decades .

I haven't seen the VP9 but I intend to even though I'm not planing to buy a new TV soon .

I'm sure it's very good and ofc Samsung LCD QLED will probably be at least competitive or nearly so with the Sony ZD9 at some point

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post #165 of 1616 Old 12-06-2016, 05:17 PM
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Have to believe Sony is not happy that the oled association CEO let the entire cat out of the bag, including prices. Could hurt 65" Z9D sales.

Which raises another question, will sony release a dumbed down oled to still give its z9d the preferred hdr monitor?
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post #166 of 1616 Old 12-06-2016, 05:18 PM
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I'm sure it's very good and ofc Samsung LCD QLED will probably be at least competitive or nearly so with the Sony ZD9 at some point
Sorry to nit pick... but "LCD QLED" isn't a thing. QDEF and the upcoming QDFC tech are Samsung's QD LCD hybrids. "QLED" is an Emissive Quantum Dot display that does not utilize any liquid crystals technology in any way.
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post #167 of 1616 Old 12-06-2016, 05:23 PM
 
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Sorry to nit pick... but "LCD QLED" isn't a thing. QDEF and the upcoming QDFC tech are Samsung's QD LCD hybrids. "QLED" is an Emissive Quantum Dot display that does not utilize any liquid crystals technology in any way.
Thanks for correcting me QLED" Emissive display sounds interesting .IIRC I may have read something about that and forgot about it and conflated it with some kind of new Samsung LCD maybe I imagined thay might make (or not) or QDFC

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post #168 of 1616 Old 12-06-2016, 05:39 PM
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no idea if this will present a tv i actually WANT, but it's definitely going in the right direction. the more companies that can put their spin on OLED, the more likely the 'perfect' model will be out there for everybody.
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post #169 of 1616 Old 12-06-2016, 05:45 PM
 
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Whoever said there was gonna be a second gen Z9 in the first place?

Perhaps a QDFC and or QLED Sony Z10 and maybe Z11 with Samsung panels ?
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OTOH in a bright room or with any lights on or an ambient back light like I have in here the 55"/65" 2016 Sony X850D should be fine or nearly so .
Nah, a bias lighting was not enough.

IPS glow. That glow was disgusting. I was mad to learn that 850c has a better panel and the same brightness in HDR.

Anyway now that this trash is sold, every night when I turn on my B6, I have a big smile on my face.

Sony OLED could be cool though.
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post #171 of 1616 Old 12-06-2016, 08:27 PM
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For those curious...


Here's the Sony professional oled monitor vs the OLED LG consumer tvs.



http://zsyst.com/2016/11/sony-pvm-x5...n-monitor-faq/
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post #172 of 1616 Old 12-06-2016, 08:38 PM
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For those curious...


Here's the Sony professional oled monitor vs the OLED LG consumer tvs.



http://zsyst.com/2016/11/sony-pvm-x5...n-monitor-faq/
Interesting, thanks. Looks like LG left itself lots of room for improvement.
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post #173 of 1616 Old 12-06-2016, 09:37 PM
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What a load...tries to paint the LG product as a child's toy. I suppose I can't good too mad. The 55" is going for "only" a little over $23k at one reliable online outlet.

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post #174 of 1616 Old 12-06-2016, 09:41 PM
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Comparing Sony's Professional OLED monitors to LG's consumer WOLED TV's isn't really a fair or necessary comparison. It's just about pointless. They exist in 2 completely different markets, they aren't competing and neither LG nor anybody looking to get into OLED should look to them as a standard for a consumer TV.
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post #175 of 1616 Old 12-06-2016, 10:01 PM
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I have heard from a couple of sources that Sony would be doing OLED in 2017, based on LG panels, since right around the time the Z9 came out. I did not hear any rumors about pricing, but the $2k/$3k seems a bit low for a first-gen Sony display product...I would remain cautious in regards to that price point. They may have a "budget" and "upmarket" OLED, not really sure what would differentiate two such models though.

Hopefully we get some more details next month. Almost as intriguing to me is where this will leave their backlight master drive tech, and if their OLED will be positioned above, below, or alongside the Z9D (or whatever its potential successor may be). But if Sony can drop the X1 Extreme or something similar into a B6 I think we have a winner for sure.
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If Sony has a 2K 55 inch OLED with an X1 Extreme or even a regular X1 processor I'm all over it. Even at 2.5K I could probably do it since it's several months away. This is of course assuming most reviews find it to truly be superior to whatever LG is offering in 2017. If it's 3K or more there's probably no way I can do it. I got too many other things to worry about financially and I currently work in fast food...
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post #177 of 1616 Old 12-06-2016, 10:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ray0414 View Post
For those curious...


Here's the Sony professional oled monitor vs the OLED LG consumer tvs.



http://zsyst.com/2016/11/sony-pvm-x5...n-monitor-faq/
The PVM-X550 in that article is not what we use in post production. That's a new display and does not go bright enough for HDR. It's only rated to 400 nits and uses a different WRGB OLED design.

The Sony RGB OLED that you usually find in facilities is the BVM-X300 which can do 1000 nits. The difference between that and an LG OLED is even greater than what the article describes.

I think the interesting thing to watch for if Sony adopts LG panels in consumer displays is if they can improve the processing, and also what they choose to do instead of Dolby Vision.
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post #178 of 1616 Old 12-06-2016, 11:25 PM
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Ah yes... I forgot a Sony OLED will probably not have DV. Also they have a much lesser Smart TV OS than LG, but I've never owned a Smart TV in my life and I'm not sure how much I care about that feature. The DV thing might be a problem, though. Especially since next year DV content is supposed to increase. I'm still open minded to a 2017 LG set. Got plenty of time to figure this all out, we don't even know the details yet.....
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post #179 of 1616 Old 12-06-2016, 11:59 PM
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What a load...tries to paint the LG product as a child's toy. I suppose I can't good too mad. The 55" is going for "only" a little over $23k at one reliable online outlet.


Compared to mastering and professional monitors, all home equipment is in the category of "child's toys". So let's not try to get too offended here. But all it truly means, is that these oleds can still be greatly enhanced. 12-16 bit panels, professional processing, true RGB structure. In 5 years we'll all be looking back and laughing at these tvs we have now.

Sony jumping into oled pushes everyone to get better and truly puts Samsung on the hot seat. Until qled we can now let LG and Sony have oled wars.
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post #180 of 1616 Old 12-07-2016, 12:02 AM
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only if they could get me a 75 inches for $5k
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