2016 LG model OLED motion settings - Page 40 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1171 of 2218 Old 06-22-2017, 05:54 PM
 
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Originally Posted by NashGuy View Post
I've been using DJ 2 and DB at a medium level (was at 7, now at 5) and I'm generally happy with it. I seem to notice fewer/weaker artifacts with DB in the midrange as opposed to 10 or 9, where I originally had it. I have tried turning DB all the way down to 0 but it seems that, in certain instances, I notice less fine detail in quickly moving objects if I have DB at 0 (although the difference is slight).

These TruMotion settings involve trade-offs and, as others have stated, the exact combo that looks best for my eyes may be different from yours.
What TV series and firmware?
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post #1172 of 2218 Old 06-23-2017, 01:00 AM
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All True motion stuff off, for me (:
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post #1173 of 2218 Old 06-23-2017, 04:12 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by jtrosky View Post
The B6 seems to have gotten better at motion during a recent firmware update. I can now, for example, use de-judder=3 and de-blur=9 without the major artifacts that I used to get. It's still not as smooth and artifact-free as my previous LCD, but it seems much better than it was originally.

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Originally Posted by Quebecker View Post
Deblur make the motion less smooth for me and exacerbate those panning shot. Why don't you use 0?
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Originally Posted by 3DBuff View Post
De-Blur needs to be retested with newer firmware. De-Blur had minimum if any impact on 24fps but no harm in using it. It did improve 60fsp video as cutting down frame to frame ghosting. I don't thing I had it tested with 24fps over 60Hz display.

...snip...
Please guys, add the model number to your signature lines so that if there is a difference between how the B6 performs(different SoS) compared to the other models, we might be able to pick up on it. If you're running the Korean software, it might also helpful to include that.

Thanks for all your efforts on this!!!
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post #1174 of 2218 Old 06-23-2017, 07:09 AM
 
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Originally Posted by JimP View Post
Please guys, add the model number to your signature lines so that if there is a difference between how the B6 performs(different SoS) compared to the other models, we might be able to pick up on it. If you're running the Korean software, it might also helpful to include that.

Thanks for all your efforts on this!!!
Valid point! I keep scrolling and searching the thread to find out what system is somebody talking about.
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post #1175 of 2218 Old 06-23-2017, 07:12 AM
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2016 LG model OLED motion settings

Has anyone tried these on the G6? It's posted from AVSForums on YouTube.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?feature=...&v=LmZdrSG5N44


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post #1176 of 2218 Old 06-23-2017, 07:31 AM
 
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Originally Posted by stevenkha View Post
Has anyone tried these on the G6? It's posted from AVSForums on YouTube.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?feature=...&v=LmZdrSG5N44


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I looked through the video quickly. Basically they focus on colour settings and calibration that does not have to be correct to your TV. He is using 60Hz signal all the time. RC is greyed out. He recommends kipping TM off unless for TV signals.
In these settings he will be getting 3:2 pulldown all the time (uneven frame advancement). After 10 years of watching movies on my LCD projectors at correct 24fps 3:2 pulldown bothers me. I like true 1 to 1 24fsp film cadence and I can see 3:2 pulldown.
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post #1177 of 2218 Old 06-23-2017, 10:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stevenkha View Post
Has anyone tried these on the G6? It's posted from AVSForums on YouTube.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?feature=...&v=LmZdrSG5N44


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Since I have been a plasma person for years, 3:2 pulldown is what I am use to. I take it one step further, and I set my OPPO to convert 24hz to 60 hz before sending to tv. For me, it looks better than having the tv perform the 3:2 pulldown. RC will be greyed out and I set TM at 0,0.
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post #1178 of 2218 Old 06-23-2017, 10:49 AM
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Originally Posted by wxman View Post
Since I have been a plasma person for years, 3:2 pulldown is what I am use to. I take it one step further, and I set my OPPO to convert 24hz to 60 hz before sending to tv. For me, it looks better than having the tv perform the 3:2 pulldown. RC will be greyed out and I set TM at 0,0.
I can't wait to try this when my oppo 203 comes in. I've had the green light to buy it for a few weeks now but I haven't had time due to my schedule. Geeze! This weekend though for sure. What about for true 4K disks? Then do you put it back to 24Hz? Or do you leave the oppo at 60Hz for 4k disks and Directv?

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post #1179 of 2218 Old 06-23-2017, 10:50 AM
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Originally Posted by wxman View Post
Since I have been a plasma person for years, 3:2 pulldown is what I am use to. I take it one step further, and I set my OPPO to convert 24hz to 60 hz before sending to tv. For me, it looks better than having the tv perform the 3:2 pulldown. RC will be greyed out and I set TM at 0,0.


What is 0,0 actually doing?


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post #1180 of 2218 Old 06-23-2017, 11:14 AM
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Originally Posted by Superman23 View Post
I can't wait to try this when my oppo 203 comes in. I've had the green light to buy it for a few weeks now but I haven't had time due to my schedule. Geeze! This weekend though for sure. What about for true 4K disks? Then do you put it back to 24Hz? Or do you leave the oppo at 60Hz for 4k disks and Directv?
I leave it at 60hz for UHD and SDR blu ray. Make sure you set the player to 4:2:2, because if you leave it at default of 4:4:4, converting to 60hz will only be at 8 bits for UHD movies, whereas 4:2:2 can be set to 12 bits. I do not have my DirecTV connected to the 203 due to lip sync issues when you attach a device to the HDMI in port on the 203.

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post #1181 of 2218 Old 06-23-2017, 11:17 AM
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Originally Posted by tylerk86 View Post
What is 0,0 actually doing?


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It probably does nothing and acts like TM off. However, Bob Pariseau, the OPPO guru, sets his E6 to 0,0 for both 24hz and 60hz material, mainly because it prevents audio sync issues when switching between the two.
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post #1182 of 2218 Old 06-23-2017, 11:58 AM
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Originally Posted by wxman View Post
I leave it at 60hz for UHD and SDR blu ray. Make sure you set the player to 4:2:2, because if you leave it at default of 4:4:4, converting to 60hz will only be at 8 bits for UHD movies, whereas 4:2:2 can be set to 12 bits. I do not have my DirecTV connected to the 203 due to lip sync issues when you attach a device to the HDMI in port on the 203.
Sweet! Thank you @wxman ! Now I've just gotta order my oppo-203 so I can start enjoying true 4K / Dolby Vision content. Do you have anything connected to the oppo? I've got a Sony 2.1 sound bar, PS4-pro, Nintendo Switch and directv. I'll need to hook something into it so I can hook up all of my devices. Which do you think?

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post #1183 of 2218 Old 06-23-2017, 12:30 PM
 
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I did few quick test shots on my system last night focused on this 3:2 pulldown.
My previous posting regarding TV generating 3:2 pulldown is correct.

Original 24p test posting with information on the test principle:
https://www.avsforum.com/forum/40-ole...l#post53365106



24fps at 24Hz to display.
RC on, 1 to 1 exact film cadence
TM on, DJ 0 cancels RC starts 3:2(6:4) pulldown
TM on, DJ 0 DB 1 to 10 - no visible changes, still 3:2 pulldown, CONFIRMED
TM on, DJ 1 frame transition improvement, correct 24fps film cadence
TM on, DJ 1 to 10 gradual dynamic frame transition to full fluid motion 120fps

In order to get correct 24fps film cadence you need RC on or DJ 1 or greater.
If you use TM with DJ 0 and De-Blur 0, 6 or any other number you will end up with 3:2 pulldown.
This should be correct for all OLED series and all firmware versions. It is the logic behind LG motion controls.


24fps at 60Hz to display
RC is greyed out and disabled
3:2 pulldown is done by player and TV displays 60fps as they come.
TM on DJ 1 or greater will try to even out frames back to 24fps
DB effect is questionable with 24fps film material.

24p test shows 3:2 pulldown coming from the player. When DJ is 1 or greater test file shows correct even frame exposure but this is only true with this test file. The LG motion processor is performing complex algorithms to detect objects in motion and directions of movement few frames in advance. It is easier to detect pattern of squares and correct frames compared to real movie. When playing Hell or High Water opening scene from external player using 60Hz and DJ setting of 3 or 4 I can still see uneven frame advancement, somehow stuttering rather than 3:2 sequential pulldwon.

I played this opening scene few times and experiment with combinations of DJ 3, 4 and DB anything from 0 through 5, 6 all the way to 10. I couldn't see any difference at all by eye. I didn't have time to make slow motion videos but if I can't see by eye it's not that significant if anything at all. Small adjustments on DJ from 3 to 4 make a big difference but DB 0 or 10 seems like nothing at all.

Test pictures from 24p test confirming film cadence:

Display frequency is in the file name. Moire pattern is coming from camera sensor to screen pixels pattern and based on auto focus.
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post #1184 of 2218 Old 06-23-2017, 12:40 PM
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Originally Posted by tylerk86 View Post
What is 0,0 actually doing?


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It's the same as TM=OFF and RC=ON with the 2017.

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post #1185 of 2218 Old 06-23-2017, 12:40 PM
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It's the same as TM=OFF and RC=ON with the 2017.

- Rich


And with a 2016?


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post #1186 of 2218 Old 06-23-2017, 12:45 PM - Thread Starter
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I just had one of those lightbulb over the head moments.

What does deblur do or maybe a better question is how do they do it?

Seems that it has something to do with the refresh frequency but I'm not sure.
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post #1187 of 2218 Old 06-23-2017, 12:56 PM
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Originally Posted by tylerk86 View Post
And with a 2016?


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Check out 3DBuff post above:

"TM on, DJ 0 cancels RC starts 3:2(6:4) pulldown"

That is not what I see with the 2017. The only reason to use TM=ON, DJ=0, DB=0 is to keep a fixed processing delay.

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post #1188 of 2218 Old 06-23-2017, 01:03 PM
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Originally Posted by Superman23 View Post
Sweet! Thank you @wxman ! Now I've just gotta order my oppo-203 so I can start enjoying true 4K / Dolby Vision content. Do you have anything connected to the oppo? I've got a Sony 2.1 sound bar, PS4-pro, Nintendo Switch and directv. I'll need to hook something into it so I can hook up all of my devices. Which do you think?
I have the audio out on the OPPO going directly to my AVR and the video out going directly to tv. UHD can sometimes stress the max output of HDMI 2.0, so separating audio from video may eliminate audio issues. The OPPO comes with a premium certified HDMI cable, which is what you need for UHD. If you use audio out from the OPPO directly to your soundbar, that cable can be any HDMI cable. The video out HDMI cable should that premium certified cable. Plus you will want a direct connection from OPPO to tv for video as I doubt your soundbar will pass DV HDR.
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Originally Posted by tylerk86 View Post
What is 0,0 actually doing?


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Quote:
Originally Posted by RichB View Post
It's the same as TM=OFF and RC=ON with the 2017.

- Rich
I think it is a bit different. In order to get TM 0,0 RC will get deactivated. RC on - everything else has to be off, unless you are in 1080i.

RC ON - it is true 24fps film cadence

RC off, TM on, TM 0,0 DJ0 and any other combination here as long as DJ is 0 is all the same with 3:2 pulldown output.
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Originally Posted by RichB View Post
Check out 3DBuff post above:

"TM on, DJ 0 cancels RC starts 3:2(6:4) pulldown"

That is not what I see with the 2017. The only reason to use TM=ON, DJ=0, DB=0 is to keep a fixed processing delay.

- Rich
Are you on 60Hz? Can you run 24p test and post results?
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Originally Posted by wxman View Post
I have the audio out on the OPPO going directly to my AVR and the video out going directly to tv. UHD can sometimes stress the max output of HDMI 2.0, so separating audio from video may eliminate audio issues. The OPPO comes with a premium certified HDMI cable, which is what you need for UHD. If you use audio out from the OPPO directly to your soundbar, that cable can be any HDMI cable. The video out HDMI cable should that premium certified cable. Plus you will want a direct connection from OPPO to tv for video as I doubt your soundbar will pass DV HDR.
Ok so sound bar connected into oppo AV out and then the oppo video out connected to ARC HDMI input of B6?

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post #1192 of 2218 Old 06-23-2017, 01:16 PM
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Ok so sound bar connected into oppo AV out and then the oppo video out connected to ARC HDMI input of B6?
You won't need to connect to ARC HDMI. Any port will do. You could try connecting all your devices to tv and then use ARC out port on tv to soundbar. I would try that first without a separate audio cable from OPPO to soundbar. If you notice audio drops with the OPPO, then connect audio out from player to soundbar. You could also connect all devices to tv, and instead of using arc, use optical out from tv to soundbar. Optical will pass 5.1 just like ARC, without some of the issues that ARC may produce.

I use optical out from my tv to my AVR for everything else, but the OPPO. That way I have 4 available HDMI ports and wont waste one of them for ARC from tv to AVR.
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post #1193 of 2218 Old 06-23-2017, 01:18 PM
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Are you on 60Hz? Can you run 24p test and post results?
I was eyeballing 24Hz test patterns using Spears and Munsil V2 and comparing RC=On TM=Off with RC=ON and TM=ON, DJ=0,DB=0.
The looked the same. There are a lot of combinations.

My goal is to make 24Hz look as cinematic as possible.
For the B6 and C7 I left RC=ON, TM=ON, DJ=2, DB=0.

Cinema projection motion blurs and does not jump. These OLEDs sample and hold appear to jump. DJ does a good job of removing some of the jump but OLED handling sharpens which can move it further from the cinematic experience.

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post #1194 of 2218 Old 06-23-2017, 01:22 PM
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You won't need to connect to ARC HDMI. Any port will do. You could try connecting all your devices to tv and then use ARC out port on tv to soundbar. I would try that first without a separate audio cable from OPPO to soundbar. If you notice audio drops with the OPPO, then connect audio out from player to soundbar. You could also connect all devices to tv, and instead of using arc, use optical out from tv to soundbar. Optical will pass 5.1 just like ARC, without some of the issues that ARC may produce.

I use optical out from my tv to my AVR for everything else, but the OPPO. That way I have 4 available HDMI ports and wont waste one of them for ARC from tv to AVR.
Cool thank you! I like the optical out idea as that will free up my ARC HDMI port to use for one of my devices. Right now I've got Directv into HDMI 1, Sony sound bar into ARC HDMI 2, PS4-Pro into HDMI 3 and Nintendo Switch into HDMI 4.

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post #1195 of 2218 Old 06-23-2017, 01:26 PM
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Cool thank you! I like the optical out idea as that will free up my ARC HDMI port to use for one of my devices. Right now I've got Directv into HDMI 1, Sony sound bar into ARC HDMI 2, PS4-Pro into HDMI 3 and Nintendo Switch into HDMI 4.
The only thing you lose is that the tv won't turn the soundbar on via ARC anymore and you won't be able to control the volume of the soundbar via the LG remote.
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post #1196 of 2218 Old 06-23-2017, 01:30 PM
 
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Originally Posted by JimP View Post
I just had one of those lightbulb over the head moments.

What does deblur do or maybe a better question is how do they do it?

Seems that it has something to do with the refresh frequency but I'm not sure.
I'm not an expert on this but I did few tests on my C6.
On previous firmware 04.31.00 it looked like it was defining objects within fast motion blur and closing up background trails. I can't go back with firmware to confirm it.

The latest firmware 04.90.10 it appears to work only on true 60fps video material by generating additional middle frame to 120Hz. Take a look at slow motion videos. This was filmed at 240fps and played back at 60.


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post #1197 of 2218 Old 06-23-2017, 01:44 PM
 
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Originally Posted by RichB View Post
I was eyeballing 24Hz test patterns using Spears and Munsil V2 and comparing RC=On TM=Off with RC=ON and TM=ON, DJ=0,DB=0.
The looked the same. There are a lot of combinations.

My goal is to make 24Hz look as cinematic as possible.
For the B6 and C7 I left RC=ON, TM=ON, DJ=2, DB=0.

Cinema projection motion blurs and does not jump. These OLEDs sample and hold appear to jump. DJ does a good job of removing some of the jump but OLED handling sharpens which can move it further from the cinematic experience.

- Rich
"My goal is to make 24Hz look as cinematic as possible." I have the same goal

The closest thing is DJ 2 or 3 depend on movie content.

Rich, how do you get RC on and TM on DJ2 at the same time?
As soon as you click on TM the RC gets greyed out and even if it is showing greyed out ON it is off (disabled). Trust me, every test prove this theory. RC will retain last state greyed out but not active and disabled.
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post #1198 of 2218 Old 06-23-2017, 02:05 PM
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Originally Posted by 3DBuff View Post
"My goal is to make 24Hz look as cinematic as possible." I have the same goal

The closest thing is DJ 2 or 3 depend on movie content.

Rich, how do you get RC on and TM on DJ2 at the same time?
As soon as you click on TM the RC gets greyed out and even if it is showing greyed out ON it is off (disabled). Trust me, every test prove this theory. RC will retain last state greyed out but not active and disabled.

I leave it and it is grayed as you say it is grayed (not selectable).
It seems that it also means not used but in the LG's I am not sure that is always the case.
There are HDR settings shown that are grayed. That may mean they are not used, that they have these values and not changeable, or some random combination of both


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post #1199 of 2218 Old 06-23-2017, 02:25 PM
 
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Originally Posted by 3DBuff View Post
I did few quick test shots on my system last night focused on this 3:2 pulldown.
My previous posting regarding TV generating 3:2 pulldown is correct.

Original 24p test posting with information on the test principle:
https://www.avsforum.com/forum/40-ole...l#post53365106



24fps at 24Hz to display.
RC on, 1 to 1 exact film cadence
TM on, DJ 0 cancels RC starts 3:2(6:4) pulldown
TM on, DJ 0 DB 1 to 10 - no visible changes, still 3:2 pulldown, CONFIRMED
TM on, DJ 1 frame transition improvement, correct 24fps film cadence
TM on, DJ 1 to 10 gradual dynamic frame transition to full fluid motion 120fps

In order to get correct 24fps film cadence you need RC on or DJ 1 or greater.
If you use TM with DJ 0 and De-Blur 0, 6 or any other number you will end up with 3:2 pulldown.
This should be correct for all OLED series and all firmware versions. It is the logic behind LG motion controls.


24fps at 60Hz to display
RC is greyed out and disabled
3:2 pulldown is done by player and TV displays 60fps as they come.
TM on DJ 1 or greater will try to even out frames back to 24fps
DB effect is questionable with 24fps film material.

24p test shows 3:2 pulldown coming from the player. When DJ is 1 or greater test file shows correct even frame exposure but this is only true with this test file. The LG motion processor is performing complex algorithms to detect objects in motion and directions of movement few frames in advance. It is easier to detect pattern of squares and correct frames compared to real movie. When playing Hell or High Water opening scene from external player using 60Hz and DJ setting of 3 or 4 I can still see uneven frame advancement, somehow stuttering rather than 3:2 sequential pulldwon.

I played this opening scene few times and experiment with combinations of DJ 3, 4 and DB anything from 0 through 5, 6 all the way to 10. I couldn't see any difference at all by eye. I didn't have time to make slow motion videos but if I can't see by eye it's not that significant if anything at all. Small adjustments on DJ from 3 to 4 make a big difference but DB 0 or 10 seems like nothing at all.

Test pictures from 24p test confirming film cadence:

24fps at 24Hz


























24fps at 60Hz







What about DJ1 with some deblur, what's the cadence.
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post #1200 of 2218 Old 06-23-2017, 02:34 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Quebecker View Post
What about DJ1 with some deblur, what's the cadence.
DJ1 with some deblur is perfect 24fps film cadence on 24Hz output. On 60Hz it looks 24fps cadence on the test. Not sure about it using real movies.

File ...88 is 24Hz, file ...97 is from 60Hz
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