Sony A1E 4K HDR OLED TV Thread (No Price Talk) - Page 107 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #3181 of 8123 Old 05-07-2017, 08:41 PM
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Originally Posted by 10k View Post
could be. Lg definitely improved abl but it's still there. Fortunately most movies are in the 15-25% apl range so it really shouldn't be too much of an issue except for use as a pc monitor.


Ya that is the problem I am seeing for computer use. Even at minimum brightness and XDR off, it ABLs. Come on Sony, is that really necessary?
Try other combo, back off contrast and turn off/lower ACE.
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post #3182 of 8123 Old 05-07-2017, 09:16 PM
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Ya that is the problem I am seeing for computer use. Even at minimum brightness and XDR off, it ABLs. Come on Sony, is that really necessary?
You must be doing something different. Maybe it's the picture mode or other setting. Multiple reviews have stated that there is no ABL with XDR disabled.
Just one example from rtings.com:

"When the 'X-tended Dynamic Range' option is disabled the TV's ABL is also disabled, so it remains at a very dim 130 cd/m2 no matter the content displayed, as shown in this plot."

http://i.rtings.com/images/reviews/a...-off-large.jpg

As you can see in above image, brightness stays the same regardless of size of white window. Similar to what's been reported for the C7.
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post #3183 of 8123 Old 05-07-2017, 09:42 PM
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Ya I guess what I was seeing was ACE dynamically changing the contrast. So turning off XDR does remove ABL. Kinda sucks though as XDR is one of the reasons to get this TV.
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post #3184 of 8123 Old 05-07-2017, 09:50 PM
 
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Thanks for your opinion. The 79 X900B with the dumbo ears was maxed out in my elevator (Condo). Essentially 82" will be the max width. Since I don't like going down in size, I'm aiming for a thin-bezel 88"--which "might" be in the Sony cards. However, wife says the 79" is too big, so I may be at 75/77", if I give in. Surely, in larger screens 75" is the sweet spot now. Oh well, if I could just get her to sit closer than 10'--but the room just doesn't "look right" to her with the sofa closer.
Wait for the 77" A1E like the rest of us.
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post #3185 of 8123 Old 05-07-2017, 10:39 PM
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^^^There is another option. Most large size format TV's are edge lit unless you want to spend big dollars and like a curve. Then the FALD UN88KS9810 comes to mind. In the same price range too. That is a 30.3% larger screen. The old size VS quality issue......
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post #3186 of 8123 Old 05-08-2017, 04:12 AM
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Looking good for new panel. 55" or 65" size?
it's a 55 inch, thanks everyone for your replies.
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post #3187 of 8123 Old 05-08-2017, 04:26 AM
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Ya I guess what I was seeing was ACE dynamically changing the contrast. So turning off XDR does remove ABL. Kinda sucks though as XDR is one of the reasons to get this TV.
You do have the "Light Sensor" toggled to "OFF" right?
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post #3188 of 8123 Old 05-08-2017, 04:33 AM
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All you looking for 77-inch. Why not buy four - 55s and run them in an array? 110-inch effective diagonal. Or during football season you could have 4 different games @ same time. It would cost <77-inch $
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post #3189 of 8123 Old 05-08-2017, 04:34 AM
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Originally Posted by Callsign_Vega View Post
Ya I guess what I was seeing was ACE dynamically changing the contrast. So turning off XDR does remove ABL. Kinda sucks though as XDR is one of the reasons to get this TV.
If your primary application is PC monitor use, then you're probably going to be more satisfied with the C7. It maxes out at ~150 nits before ABL kicks in vs. ~130 on the A1E. Once you exceed those brightness limits, the C7 continues to have a less aggressive ABL if you look at the brightness plots at rtings. Sony starts losing max brightness above 25% sized white window while the LG can hold max brightness up to 50%. Looking forward to reading your comparisons once you get your C7. Are you going to keep both?
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post #3190 of 8123 Old 05-08-2017, 05:21 AM
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i am highly considering the 65 version of the A1E as my next TV, Why are you guys picking this over the LG G7?
i personally own the LG OLED EC9300 from 2 years ago, the motion processing and smoothness left alot to be desired on that set but the black levels and contrast is incredible but its time for me to upgrade to 4k and im going to need a new TV very soon so i need to decide if i go with LG once again or if i should go with a Sony.
Probably worth your grabbing a good something to drink and peruse this thread from the beginning.

There are some early reviews out and links to them throughout this thread if you want 3rd-Party technical input/critique -- including references and videos by those reviewers between LG/Sony OLED. There are also a handful of early owners here that have provided their more subjective POVs on the LG vs Sony question -- some being owners of both -- across dozens if not hundreds of upthread posts with discussion on most of that in-between.

IMHO since the biggest part of both OLEDs is the same (the display), either panel could be a good decision -- it's the nuances of each that could sway you one way or the other depending on whats important to you (e.g. design aesthetics, built-in sound quality, the Sony tilt-stand or panel depth if wall mounting, webOS vs Android TV, processing preference of one or the other, availability, cost, brand loyalty, etc.). Good luck with your decision.
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post #3191 of 8123 Old 05-08-2017, 07:39 AM
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I received my 55A1 yesterday.
My god this is an amazing screen, cant keep my eyes of it.


This is the first OLED I own and I was a fool for not stepping over sooner.
In dark room viewing it beats my 55XD93 by miles.... deep blacks and no clouding even on HDR mode.


I finally know what they mean with "Once you go black, you cant go back"


Still fumbling around with xd reality and motion settings to see what I prefer.


I am so happy with this purchase so far, I was anxious before it came in on paying the high price.
But this thing delivers! The design is amazing too.
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post #3192 of 8123 Old 05-08-2017, 07:45 AM
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Originally Posted by leftyguitar1963 View Post
All you looking for 77-inch. Why not buy four - 55s and run them in an array? 110-inch effective diagonal. Or during football season you could have 4 different games @ same time. It would cost <77-inch $
I have thought about that You do need a processor for that. NEC used to have this processor built in to do this on there large commercial LED's.
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post #3193 of 8123 Old 05-08-2017, 09:14 AM
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^^^ it's a really interesting idea. Wonder if such a processor is available at real-world prices. Obviously they exist as it's done commercially all the time. Bezel width?

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post #3194 of 8123 Old 05-08-2017, 09:31 AM
 
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^^^ it's a really interesting idea. Wonder if such a processor is available at real-world prices. Obviously they exist as it's done commercially all the time. Bezel width?
That is how Sony CLEDIS panels work and Samsung showed this concept at CES last year. This could actually be a viable option with 4K OLED. They could build special two sided zero bezel 55" models and at normal viewing distances it would be almost impossible to see the gap. You would only need the edges on the inside to be bezel-less. 110" 4K OLED for 10K. I guess they are looking to get they wallpaper model cheap enough instead.
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post #3195 of 8123 Old 05-08-2017, 09:37 AM
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Moderator

this is an owners thread for the Sony A1E

could we limit posts to owners of the Sony A1E please?

we are receiving lots of reports

Thanks in advance
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post #3196 of 8123 Old 05-08-2017, 09:48 AM
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Moderator

this is an owners thread for the Sony A1E

could we limit posts to owners of the Sony A1E please?

we are receiving lots of reports

Thanks in advance
And thank you!
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post #3197 of 8123 Old 05-08-2017, 12:02 PM
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My quick summary after a night of testing for computer/gaming use:

1. A1E is physically gorgeous. I really love minimalist designs.
2. OLED panel, image is amazing. Not much else to say here.
3. TV has froze on me. Not totally sold on Android for TV's. IMO LG's OS is better.
4. A1E sound is good enough for listening to sports/talking. My normal HiFi speakers were obviously much better for music/movies.
5. 4K 4:4:4 60 Hz input lag (30ms) is noticeable but not super annoying. [Game mode]
6. Clarity "high" setting in which the panel is strobed 8ms on and 8ms off at 60 Hz is unusable. Very noticeable flicker. Resultant MPRT of 8ms was of course much clearer than the normal sample-and-hold 16ms MPRT of 60 Hz, but flicker precludes its use.
7. Using motion smoothing outside of game/graphics mode (only place you can enable) as expected is unusable. Frame interpolation (120 Hz) once again cuts the MPRT down to 8ms from 16ms, but large input lag and motion artifacts precludes its use.
8. TV is silly heavy. I think they went a bit overboard on this.
9. Disappointing that the max brightness is less than the LG's. ABL is also noticeable.
10. The TV will display an image above 60 Hz, but will frame skip rendering that moot.

11. Easter egg. Setting a custom 1080p resolution at 4:4:4 12-bit color at 120 Hz in game mode drops the input lag down to a tested average 15-20ms! This is a great TV for 1080p gamers. You get the 8ms MPRT motion clarity of 120 Hz sample-and-hold and also get that 120 Hz quick/smoothness with barely perceptible input lag. Just don't turn Clarity to "high", it still only strobes at 60 Hz rendering the other 60 Hz in darkness!
6.
There isn't much Sony can do for the flicker, right? I mean, if they shorten the strobe (off duration) it would be less clear. In order to attain the clearness we want, we have to strobe 8ms on 8ms off... or use interpolation, which no one would want to do. The only good way to get around this is to have a true 120hz signal. And even then, I bet it would be nice to have 4ms on 4ms off to get clarity as if it was a 240hz signal (I'd imagine at some point our brain has to max out though)--but the flicker would probably not be very noticeable then.

I do think it would be nice if Sony offered a couple more settings than just high. For instance, medium could do 12ms on 4ms off for less flicker but also less clarity.

Personally, I can see lights flicker when others do not, but am willing to use the BFI for the clearness. For me, it is noticeable, but not bad once you're into the game your playing. Brighter scenes are obviously more noticeable, but once again, I'd rather have it than not, and I don't know what more you could do (other than a true 120hz signal as I mentioned above). I will say, the flicker of Sony's active 3D drove me nuts, and this 60hz BFI does not. Those glasses also cover some of your peripheral, which seems more sensitive to flickering and fast motion.

10.
So you did NOT get any frameskipping when feeding it a solid 120hz signal, right? I know you did at 121hz, but I just want to confirm you didn't get it at 120hz.

11.
Awesome... I can confirm that 120hz is waaaaay snappier feeling on this TV using my gaming PC vs. 60hz. Huge difference.

If you think that setting it to 120hz bypasses some of Sony's processing... I wonder if some other custom resolution at a lower refresh rate would do the same. Maybe using a different timing format at 60hz or manually setting the timings at 60hz.

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post #3198 of 8123 Old 05-08-2017, 12:57 PM
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Audio return channel

Has anyone gotten the audio return channel to work?
Normally we stream Netflix and sometimes Amazon, and the Netflix stream looks very nice directly on the Sony .
However, I'm unable to get the sound out via HDMI 3 to the anthem pre-pro . I could probably get the sound out of the optical output.

It seems that an alternative would be to get a separate streamer like a Roku ultra or Nvidia shield TV. In this case it would be easier to do the switching on the preamp and see the volume on the TV, but I might end up with an extra remote. Any suggestions? Which will have the highest video quality?

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post #3199 of 8123 Old 05-08-2017, 01:38 PM
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Has anyone gotten the audio return channel to work?
Normally we stream Netflix and sometimes Amazon, and the Netflix stream looks very nice directly on the Sony .
However, I'm unable to get the sound out via HDMI 3 to the anthem pre-pro . I could probably get the sound out of the optical output.

It seems that an alternative would be to get a separate streamer like a Roku ultra or Nvidia shield TV. In this case it would be easier to do the switching on the preamp and see the volume on the TV, but I might end up with an extra remote. Any suggestions? Which will have the highest video quality?

ARC is working fine for me to my Denon x4200w. I've been using it to watch Netflix on this TV. Make sure that you go into settings on the TV/SOUND and set it to Audio System. Also, try enabling HDMI control on your pre and the Sony.
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ARC is working fine for me to my Denon x4200w. I've been using it to watch Netflix on this TV. Make sure that you go into settings on the TV/SOUND and set it to Audio System. Also, try enabling HDMI control on your pre and the Sony.
Yes I already tried these things and it did not work with my anthem pre-pro

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post #3201 of 8123 Old 05-08-2017, 01:48 PM
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Yes I already tried these things and it did not work with my anthem pre-pro
Does the TV ever say switching to external audio? Are you getting audio out of the TV or no audio?

Also, I'd recommend you do a full reboot (not resetting the settings, but reboot) of the TV. Hold down the power button on the remote until it does a restart, or do it through the Android Settings.

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Does the TV ever say switching to external audio? Are you getting audio out of the TV or no audio?

Also, I'd recommend you do a full reboot (not resetting the settings, but reboot) of the TV. Hold down the power button on the remote until it does a restart, or do it through the Android Settings.
TV says that it is going into theater mode, and claims that audio will be directed to Ext sound system, but the pre-pro does not get any audio over HDMI ARC connection.

I will try the rebooting later, it seems like the problem is more on the anthem side. I did turn on CEC and ARC etc. on the anthem. I worry about compatibility.

Theater: Sony A1E OLED 4K Ultra HD, Oppo-205, Anthem AVM60, 7.1.4 B & W CM 7 LR,CDM-cse, CM 1, CM 1 S2, Silverline minuet , SVS SB13 Ultra, Rotel RMB 1555, Parasound A23, Naim NAP 100, EEcolor lut box. Calman, MobileForge, I1D3 & I1pro 2.
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post #3203 of 8123 Old 05-08-2017, 02:05 PM
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TV says that it is going into theater mode, and claims that audio will be directed to Ext sound system, but the pre-pro does not get any audio over HDMI ARC connection.

I will try the rebooting later, it seems like the problem is more on the anthem side. I did turn on CEC and ARC etc. on the anthem. I worry about compatibility.
It would be wild if compatibility is an issue, since ARC is part of the HDMI standard. I've have it before where the TV (both the A1E and my 930C) would not output to my audio system or would even keep blacking out, a full reboot fixed it each time. Android TV is buggy and pretty crappy when it comes to stability... but it has a great app store ;-). Please let us know if the full reboot fixes it.

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post #3204 of 8123 Old 05-08-2017, 03:20 PM
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FYI guys, the 77 inch Sony weighs 134.5 pounds!! I don't understand why it's so heavy. The new W7 LG's are so much lighter.
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post #3205 of 8123 Old 05-08-2017, 03:49 PM
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i am highly considering the 65 version of the A1E as my next TV, Why are you guys picking this over the LG G7?
i personally own the LG OLED EC9300 from 2 years ago, the motion processing and smoothness left alot to be desired on that set but the black levels and contrast is incredible but its time for me to upgrade to 4k and im going to need a new TV very soon so i need to decide if i go with LG once again or if i should go with a Sony.
Motion. I knew the PQ would be amazing...I just wanted to make sure motion handling was top-notch.

By the way...it is. I had been reluctant to give up my 141 Kuro. I waited and waited. Now that I have the A1E...I have zero regrets. It is an amazing display.
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post #3206 of 8123 Old 05-08-2017, 04:09 PM
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FYI guys, the 77 inch Sony weighs 134.5 pounds!! I don't understand why it's so heavy. The new W7 LG's are so much lighter.
The easel stand is heavy. It has a piece that attaches to it (for stabilization I am sure) that is the majority of the weight. I wall-mounted my 65" and without that piece it was not particularly heavy.
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post #3207 of 8123 Old 05-08-2017, 04:27 PM
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Motion. I knew the PQ would be amazing...I just wanted to make sure motion handling was top-notch.

By the way...it is. I had been reluctant to give up my 141 Kuro. I waited and waited. Now that I have the A1E...I have zero regrets. It is an amazing display.
I have a question for you and all the owners of the A1E.

Where do you put your motion flow settings? Do you guys turn it off completely? Put it to low, etc?

What is the difference between the LG OLED 2017 models with trumotion completely off and the Sony A1E with motion flow completely off? Is the Sony still better with motion or do they become pretty much identical to one another?

I'm asking because I usually put the motion processing to off on my TVs.

I'm not speaking of gaming here because you need to turn the motion processing off for gaming. I'm more speaking about video viewing, mainly 24p blu-ray or uhd blu-rays or 30 fps videos. 60 fps videos are going to look just fine with motion enhancements off.

In fact you can add 30 fps gaming in the mix for the gamers out there. I remember my E6 last year (returned them because of banding) had bad judder movement in forza horizon 3 demo on xbox one, possibly because of less motion blur on OLED than on LCD. I was in game mode with trumotion off of course.

Thanks in advance for any replies!

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post #3208 of 8123 Old 05-08-2017, 06:24 PM
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Originally Posted by eganz1 View Post
TV says that it is going into theater mode, and claims that audio will be directed to Ext sound system, but the pre-pro does not get any audio over HDMI ARC connection.

I will try the rebooting later, it seems like the problem is more on the anthem side. I did turn on CEC and ARC etc. on the anthem. I worry about compatibility.

I was having the same issues, I bought new hdmi cables and I can now get Netflix sound either thru the TV speakers or my Marantz 6011. The TV notifies me if and what it switches to external Speakers speakers or the TV speakers

Last edited by jphillips63; 05-08-2017 at 06:40 PM.
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post #3209 of 8123 Old 05-08-2017, 09:30 PM
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I have a question for you and all the owners of the A1E.



Where do you put your motion flow settings? Do you guys turn it off completely? Put it to low, etc?



What is the difference between the LG OLED 2017 models with trumotion completely off and the Sony A1E with motion flow completely off? Is the Sony still better with motion or do they become pretty much identical to one another?



I'm asking because I usually put the motion processing to off on my TVs.



I'm not speaking of gaming here because you need to turn the motion processing off for gaming. I'm more speaking about video viewing, mainly 24p blu-ray or uhd blu-rays or 30 fps videos. 60 fps videos are going to look just fine with motion enhancements off.



In fact you can add 30 fps gaming in the mix for the gamers out there. I remember my E6 last year (returned them because of banding) had bad judder movement in forza horizon 3 demo on xbox one, possibly because of less motion blur on OLED than on LCD. I was in game mode with trumotion off of course.



Thanks in advance for any replies!


I've had the same thoughts. I hate motion flow so anything related to that is not interesting to me.

I believe that the major advantage of the Sony AE1 is improved handling of gradient color bands. The question then become if this is worth the cost differential between the sets.


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post #3210 of 8123 Old 05-08-2017, 10:21 PM
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The choice is tv speakers or audio out. You cannot select both. No simultaneous sound using just the Sony.
So who wants to see if they can hack into the speakers directly and send the center channel sound direct to the speakers? This is a major oversight on Sony's part. How much would it cost to add an analog input?
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