2017 LG C7-B7 Owners' Thread (No Price Talk) - Page 1019 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #30541 of 35887 Old 06-30-2018, 06:30 PM
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Originally Posted by cmdrdredd View Post
I don't see the banding or artifacts but what I do notice in the Dunkirk scene you mentioned(you also did point it out as well) is that since OLED light is 100 for HDR10 that the vertical banding in the gray backgrounds is more prominent than it is using the convert to dolby vision option. That scene is a mess on my TV using HDR10 if I'm being honest. I don't have the best panel for vertical banding but it's not super distracting in most content. The highlights and colors are just as bright and vibrant using either method to my eyes. I even tried taking pictures to compare and couldn't tell. I guess ignorance is bliss? lol
Active HDR is plenty bright, however sometimes it's almost too bright, highlights can potentially clip in an ugly fashion, and it can cause some weird artifacts in the shadows. Without active HDR, the image instead becomes needlessly dark if the mastering nit level is high, e.g. the exact same movie will be darker if the metadata is 4000 nits compared to if it's 1000 nits, regardless of whether there's actually anything that bright in it. DV mode seems to be the best of both, or kind of a good middle-ground. Just like in active mode the mastering metadata is ignored and the tone-mapping always looks the same, and it's generally a bit brighter than non-active mode, but without going overboard.
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post #30542 of 35887 Old 06-30-2018, 08:02 PM
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Originally Posted by paku View Post
Active HDR is plenty bright, however sometimes it's almost too bright, highlights can potentially clip in an ugly fashion, and it can cause some weird artifacts in the shadows. Without active HDR, the image instead becomes needlessly dark if the mastering nit level is high, e.g. the exact same movie will be darker if the metadata is 4000 nits compared to if it's 1000 nits, regardless of whether there's actually anything that bright in it. DV mode seems to be the best of both, or kind of a good middle-ground. Just like in active mode the mastering metadata is ignored and the tone-mapping always looks the same, and it's generally a bit brighter than non-active mode, but without going overboard.
Perhaps, I don't think I noticed any clipping using it though. I think what you're seeing is the difference between the player taking the source video stream, processing the metadata and analyzing the scene and applying dynamic tone mapping and sending that as as dolby vision metadata vs the TV doing it's own thing and simply preferring the way the player handles it as well as preferring the TV's tone mapping presets for dolby vision to begin with. It's clear that the TV handles HDR10 differently than dolby vision.

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post #30543 of 35887 Old 07-01-2018, 05:00 AM
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Originally Posted by Valkyre View Post
Guys i noticed that when the screen is black there are some random white flashes twinkles appearing. Any idea what this is? I never noticed them before.
FWIW, that's what we saw before our main board crapped out.
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post #30544 of 35887 Old 07-01-2018, 06:11 AM
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Originally Posted by robnalex View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Valkyre View Post
Guys i noticed that when the screen is black there are some random white flashes twinkles appearing. Any idea what this is? I never noticed them before.
FWIW, that's what we saw before our main board crapped out.
Can you please describe what you saw exacrtly? Did you have any others signs. Like I said in my case it only happens as a flashy dot not the entire screen and it only happens randomly and rarely.

Would love to know if you had the same thing for obvious reasons after what you said!

Thanks.
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post #30545 of 35887 Old 07-01-2018, 08:40 AM
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Originally Posted by paku View Post
Active HDR is plenty bright, however sometimes it's almost too bright, highlights can potentially clip in an ugly fashion, and it can cause some weird artifacts in the shadows. Without active HDR, the image instead becomes needlessly dark if the mastering nit level is high, e.g. the exact same movie will be darker if the metadata is 4000 nits compared to if it's 1000 nits, regardless of whether there's actually anything that bright in it. DV mode seems to be the best of both, or kind of a good middle-ground. Just like in active mode the mastering metadata is ignored and the tone-mapping always looks the same, and it's generally a bit brighter than non-active mode, but without going overboard.
MY JVC projector does not get near that and is to bright at times....
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post #30546 of 35887 Old 07-01-2018, 09:30 AM
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Originally Posted by Valkyre View Post
Can you please describe what you saw exacrtly? Did you have any others signs. Like I said in my case it only happens as a flashy dot not the entire screen and it only happens randomly and rarely.

Would love to know if you had the same thing for obvious reasons after what you said!

Thanks.


If you are talking about sparkles, that usually can be resolved by replacing the HDMI cables.
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post #30547 of 35887 Old 07-01-2018, 10:24 AM
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I'm also pretty sure the sparkles are nothing more serious than the cable. I get them intermittently on my PC that's running 2160p60 on a slightly longer cable, but I've never seen them on my Oppo running 2160p24 on a short cable, or the internal Netflix app.
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post #30548 of 35887 Old 07-01-2018, 11:33 AM
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So I know that lip sync issues aren't all TV related, but I wanted to ask now that I have collected more data on my issues. First off, regarding the internal tv speakers being off, I have found that while the optic out to my AVR from my TV box has the sound correct, I have to delay it 140 ms to match the sound the TV speakers are putting out. I know I'm not the only one having this issue. I did find someone on the LG forum say that they were told to unplug the TV, then hold the power button for 15 seconds, and then plug it back in and that fixed their issue. Does anyone know what that actually does to the set?

Secondly, am I the only one who need to use several different settings for lip sync? Last night I put on Battle Royal on blu ray. I was using the Sony X700, technicolor SDR mode, and I found a scene that would really help me dial in my settings with a basketball bouncing in slow motion and then into someone's hand. I found that I needed a setting of approx 220 ms to get it right. But the I put that same scene on Netflix using the app from the same player and the same picture mode, and the new setting that I needed to make it right was approx 140 ms. And for HDR modes I find I need somewhere around 180-190 ms (eyeballed) to get it to not look too far off. Is that normal, or am I just too sensitive to this issue?


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post #30549 of 35887 Old 07-01-2018, 01:05 PM
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Since the TV send's a DD+ over ARC from the built-in Netflix app, is it possible to get DD+ via ARC from other sources such as an Apple TV 4k which is connectly to HDMI4? The receiver doesn't support 4k video from the Apple TV and I'm only getting DD via ARC from the Apple TV.


Any information would be appreciated.

Thanks.
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post #30550 of 35887 Old 07-01-2018, 01:28 PM
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Originally Posted by Omni009 View Post
I love how even my blu rays look like they got a facelift when watching them on this set. I watched Star Trek : First Contact last night, and it looked really nice with the total black of space and the bright highlights of the weapons fire. I'm excited to see how others like Star Wars, LOTR, etc look too when upscaled.

I wish Tron Legacy was getting a UHD. That would be THE go to audio, video, and even 3D demo title.
I assume you mean forced DV for legacy content blu-ray? I assume it's not 'accurate' but might be "pleasing" to some titles. Though for me I would prefer not to spoil an upgrade on something like Star Wars where you know a UHD disc will come out... There are just certain ones probably less likely to see an upgrade to 4K I would absolutely do that mode on

BTW, as to bolded? Holy hell I want Tron:Legacy on UHD blu-ray so badly! Not sure it won't suffer from the Disney audio issues in recent years on ATMOS for the UHD blu-rays from that studio.... my only concern!
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post #30551 of 35887 Old 07-01-2018, 01:43 PM
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I assume you mean forced DV for legacy content blu-ray? I assume it's not 'accurate' but might be "pleasing" to some titles. Though for me I would prefer not to spoil an upgrade on something like Star Wars where you know a UHD disc will come out... There are just certain ones probably less likely to see an upgrade to 4K I would absolutely do that mode on

BTW, as to bolded? Holy hell I want Tron:Legacy on UHD blu-ray so badly! Not sure it won't suffer from the Disney audio issues in recent years on ATMOS for the UHD blu-rays from that studio.... my only concern!
I just meant watching a regular blu ray, upscaled, on this set on techicolor mode with no forced anything. I read someone else describe what looks like an upgrade to me as really good tone mapping on these set for regular SDR content. Keep in mind I'm coming from a plasma which while nice, soft, and accurate was not exactly bright and couldn't do total black. So with the same movie, brights are brighter and blacks are deeper. For all the sci-fi I own, it's like a brand new disk.

My future UHD wishlist grows daily as well. Aside from the big ones I mentioned, I was also looking at stuff like The Crow, Dark City, or Event Horizon from my catalog.
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post #30552 of 35887 Old 07-01-2018, 01:44 PM
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So, sadly I think I'm going to return my B7. The other day I posted a couple pics from a scene in Westworld that showed color banding. It's an issue I've had not only in watching TV shows and movies but more noticeably in playing games. Now I'm very well aware that the source and bandwidth factor into this issue but it's also how the TV processes it. Here's a comparison shot of the same scene on the Sony X930E:


LG B7
Sony X930E


I took both pictures from the same HBO Now app. It's really a shame that the 7 series has no feature like "smooth gradation" built in to handle this. I stream alot of my content...TV shows, movies and I game quite a bit so for me this isn't acceptable. Plus the ABL is a little too aggressive when playing some games for my liking. I'm going to miss the inky blacks and better viewing angles, oh and WebOS.
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post #30553 of 35887 Old 07-01-2018, 02:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Valkyre View Post
Can you please describe what you saw exactly? Did you have any others signs? Like I said in my case it only happens as a flashy dot, not the entire screen and it only happens randomly and rarely.

Would love to know if you had the same thing for obvious reasons after what you said!

Thanks.
We saw exactly what you described, but only once:
  • Screen went black.
  • Single line of scrolling white horizontal dots, left to right, I think (3-4 seconds).
  • Dead as a doornail.
After that, the TV would not turn on. We'd get 3 blinks from the standby light, then nothing.

Don't know if this is the same thing you're seeing (it only happened once for us before the TV died) but if you're seeing this regularly, you probably out to call LG support.
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post #30554 of 35887 Old 07-01-2018, 05:44 PM
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Dolby Vision Fixed For Me

I just manually upgraded firmware to version 71.00 today and I can confirm that the elevated black issues that I was experiencing in the 4K Valerian disc have been corrected. For me this disc showed the issue numerous times in Dolby Vision.

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post #30555 of 35887 Old 07-01-2018, 06:08 PM
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Originally Posted by 2Turbofan View Post
I just manually upgraded firmware to version 71.00 today and I can confirm that the elevated black issues that I was experiencing in the 4K Valerian disc have been corrected. For me this disc showed the issue numerous times in Dolby Vision.


Did you experience elevated blacks on other titles or sources that are also fixed?

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post #30556 of 35887 Old 07-01-2018, 06:13 PM
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I just check both my UHD disk and Netflix. It's the source. My disk doesn't show the kind of banding that netflix does there.
You get what you pay for. UHD discs are for enthusiasts and streaming is for the budget conscious. I get the attraction for streaming but it just isn't the best quality.
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post #30557 of 35887 Old 07-01-2018, 06:15 PM
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You get what you pay for. UHD discs are for enthusiasts and streaming is for the budget conscious. I get the attraction for streaming but it just isn't the best quality.
Depends on the streaming source too. I hear Apple TV 4K is really good streaming quality...aside from the audio. But the video is not worlds apart.

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post #30558 of 35887 Old 07-01-2018, 06:17 PM
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Originally Posted by Setzer View Post
So, sadly I think I'm going to return my B7. The other day I posted a couple pics from a scene in Westworld that showed color banding. It's an issue I've had not only in watching TV shows and movies but more noticeably in playing games. Now I'm very well aware that the source and bandwidth factor into this issue but it's also how the TV processes it. Here's a comparison shot of the same scene on the Sony X930E:


LG B7
Sony X930E


I took both pictures from the same HBO Now app. It's really a shame that the 7 series has no feature like "smooth gradation" built in to handle this. I stream alot of my content...TV shows, movies and I game quite a bit so for me this isn't acceptable. Plus the ABL is a little too aggressive when playing some games for my liking. I'm going to miss the inky blacks and better viewing angles, oh and WebOS.


You are missing the smooth gradation feature the Sony’s have , lg has added a version of that in the 2018 models though it comes coupled with noise reduction .


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post #30559 of 35887 Old 07-01-2018, 06:26 PM
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Originally Posted by Omni009 View Post
Depends on the streaming source too. I hear Apple TV 4K is really good streaming quality...aside from the audio. But the video is not worlds apart.
Not disrespecting the streamers but my theory is if I the best TV available at the time of release then I want to give it the best source. The convenience off streaming cant be faulted same as iTunes picking and choosing music without but the entire album.
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post #30560 of 35887 Old 07-01-2018, 06:35 PM
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^I'm still not sold on replacing my hard copies, simply because I've seen the differences, and oleds have a habit of exposing flaws!
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post #30561 of 35887 Old 07-01-2018, 06:41 PM
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^I'm still not sold on replacing my hard copies, simply because I've seen the differences, and oleds have a habit of exposing flaws!
I'm sitting on about 2400 hard copies from DVD to UHD. I have an Oppo 103 which I use for Blu ray and my Panasonic 900 which is only for UHD and has never played a standard Blu ray. That's just me.
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post #30562 of 35887 Old 07-01-2018, 06:43 PM
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2400, lol you got me beat by a mile...I have been eyeballing that pany uhd to pair with my c8 though!
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post #30563 of 35887 Old 07-01-2018, 06:49 PM
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2400, lol you got me beat by a mile...I have been eyeballing that pany uhd to pair with my c8 though!
Probably better waiting for the 820. DV compatable. Will be curious at the US price as we are getting the 820 for $650AU.
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post #30564 of 35887 Old 07-01-2018, 06:52 PM
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^oh yeah I forgot about the 820, thanks for the heads up...gonna do my due diligence on that one!
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post #30565 of 35887 Old 07-01-2018, 06:55 PM
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2017 LG C7-B7 Owners' Thread (No Price Talk)

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Originally Posted by bigzee3 View Post
I'm sitting on about 2400 hard copies from DVD to UHD. I have an Oppo 103 which I use for Blu ray and my Panasonic 900 which is only for UHD and has never played a standard Blu ray. That's just me.


Can’t imagine storing 2400 hard copies...I’m having trouble storing my growing UHD collection which is at about 50 right now. I buy a lot of the releases and use the digital code on all of them but sell most as I only keep the hard copies that are good movies or are good quality even if the movie isn’t.


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post #30566 of 35887 Old 07-01-2018, 07:14 PM
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Can’t imagine storing 2400 hard copies...I’m having trouble storing my growing UHD collection which is at about 50 right now. I buy a lot of the releases and use the digital code on all of them but sell most as I only keep the hard copies that are good movies or are good quality even if the movie isn’t.


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post #30567 of 35887 Old 07-01-2018, 07:31 PM
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Did you experience elevated blacks on other titles or sources that are also fixed?
Spiderman played fine as well. Valerian was really bad for me and I haven’t tested anything else yet including Apple 4k TV.

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post #30568 of 35887 Old 07-01-2018, 08:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Setzer View Post
So, sadly I think I'm going to return my B7. The other day I posted a couple pics from a scene in Westworld that showed color banding. It's an issue I've had not only in watching TV shows and movies but more noticeably in playing games. Now I'm very well aware that the source and bandwidth factor into this issue but it's also how the TV processes it. Here's a comparison shot of the same scene on the Sony X930E:


LG B7
Sony X930E


I took both pictures from the same HBO Now app. It's really a shame that the 7 series has no feature like "smooth gradation" built in to handle this. I stream alot of my content...TV shows, movies and I game quite a bit so for me this isn't acceptable. Plus the ABL is a little too aggressive when playing some games for my liking. I'm going to miss the inky blacks and better viewing angles, oh and WebOS.
You should upgrade your playback sources rather than downgrade your TV. The video examples you provided are 8 bit color SDR, and your playback source is making the TV kick into 12 bit wide color mode when there isn't any wide color data - which is causing the banding in the first place.

As an example, if you had an AppleTV 4K - with dynamic range matching turned on - you wouldn't see any banding because the panel would drop to 8 bit and match the color range of the signal.

The "smooth gradation" feature offered by the Sony is artificially predicting (guessing) what the true colors should be in between the bands. Most of the time they will get it right, and sometimes they don't. Either way, it's all a bunch of additional processing which will also show up when you don't want it to.
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post #30569 of 35887 Old 07-01-2018, 08:33 PM
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^great explanation their.
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post #30570 of 35887 Old 07-01-2018, 08:50 PM
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Originally Posted by sonoftumble View Post
You should upgrade your playback sources rather than downgrade your TV. The video examples you provided are 8 bit color SDR, and your playback source is making the TV kick into 12 bit wide color mode when there isn't any wide color data - which is causing the banding in the first place.

As an example, if you had an AppleTV 4K - with dynamic range matching turned on - you wouldn't see any banding because the panel would drop to 8 bit and match the color range of the signal.

The "smooth gradation" feature offered by the Sony is artificially predicting (guessing) what the true colors should be in between the bands. Most of the time they will get it right, and sometimes they don't. Either way, it's all a bunch of additional processing which will also show up when you don't want it to.
Upgrade my playback sources? Where do I get the HBO 4k app? There is none because it's not supported and I already pay for DirecTV not about to drop more money down for Apple TV just to fix an issue the TV should do a better job of processing.


Also, what about the games? I have a PS4 Pro and an Xbox One X. What source should I upgrade to there for gaming so I don't get the banding?


How about the more expensive TV have features built in to correct this? If Sony can put it in there so can LG.
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