2017 LG C7-B7 Owners' Thread (No Price Talk) - Page 2 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #31 of 36391 Old 03-16-2017, 09:25 AM
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Originally Posted by Cleveland Plasma View Post
Break in is always a choice. If you choose to do it, the slides would be the same.....
Ok thanks.

On another note, my delivery is in limbo. YRC freight tracking is a joke and the company can't give me a reasonable date that it's expected for delivery so I can figure out a work schedule. I understand the storm created delays but I fail to understand how at least a window of a possible day can't be figured out. I guess I'm spoiled with typical delivery options.

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post #32 of 36391 Old 03-16-2017, 09:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimmy6166 View Post
I've finally unpacked my C7 65inch.

Here's the down and dirty.

Pros:
-Improvement in shadow detail as everyone as mentioned. There's a particular scene in the Batman: Dark knight that I use to determine loss of shadow detail which wasn't lost in the C7.
-HDR is also baked into youtube, as the HDR symbol pops up when playing a HDR clip.

Cons:
-The screen seems to be tilting backwards? I've tried all I can, adjusting as much as I can, but it seems to tilt back no matter what. I think I've got a dodgy stand.
-Still a bit of vignetting and slight dark streaks, but nothing as noticeable as my B6.

I'll pop in some pics at 5% for comparison between my B6 and C7

Enjoy!
Which is which? The second 5% pic is significantly worse to my eyes due to color non-uniformity (pinkish hue).
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post #33 of 36391 Old 03-16-2017, 09:57 AM
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Originally Posted by Wizziwig View Post
Have you run any automatic wear compensation cycles on the set before taking those pics? Need to run for 4 hours, then turn off the display and wait.

So far, I think I actually prefer the 5% uniformity of your B6. Pretty mild right side 'zipper' vignetting compared to some of the examples posted here.
I'm still not sure which of his pics is the B6 versus the C7.

By way of comparison, here is the 4% slide from my C6...
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post #34 of 36391 Old 03-16-2017, 09:58 AM
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Originally Posted by venus933 View Post
I don't know, I think the later (C7) would look (in terms of banding) better with most content. In any event it'll be interesting to see how it (slides) looks with some hours on it.
Taking another look, you may be right. The B6 has a touch of reverse-vignetting that will probably produce a bright halo around the darker screen center at low <3% luminance unless you crush blacks to hide it. It's all a total crap shoot. It's pretty clear that LG doesn't actually adjust their ant-vignetting band-aid on a per-tv basis. They apply the same amount on every TV and it rarely matches the amount of actual compensation needed on each individual panel. Hopefully they will address the root cause next year instead of just trying to hide it.
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post #35 of 36391 Old 03-16-2017, 10:38 AM
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Originally Posted by fafrd View Post
Which is which? The second 5% pic is significantly worse to my eyes due to color non-uniformity (pinkish hue).
The second picture is the C7, you can make out the silver/metal stand.

I see what you mean, the banding will probably stay to some extent but the color uniformity may get better with time.

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post #36 of 36391 Old 03-16-2017, 10:42 AM
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Originally Posted by Wizziwig View Post
Taking another look, you may be right. The B6 has a touch of reverse-vignetting that will probably produce a bright halo around the darker screen center at low <3% luminance unless you crush blacks to hide it. It's all a total crap shoot. It's pretty clear that LG doesn't actually adjust their ant-vignetting band-aid on a per-tv basis. They apply the same amount on every TV and it rarely matches the amount of actual compensation needed on each individual panel. Hopefully they will address the root cause next year instead of just trying to hide it.
That would be nice, though honestly, I consider the streaking / vertical fixed-pattern-noise / near-black DSE to be the more significant picture quality defect at this point.

My C6 has some residual vignette including some 'black hinge' but I honestly never, ever notice it on actual content.

Whenever there is a near-black scene, the near-black fixed-pattern-noise becomes visible. It's usually not distracting enough to break immersion, but if there is a pan, forget about it - DSE and distraction up the wazoo...

I'd rather see a 2018 panel with the same amount of vignette/reverse-vignette and greatly reduced near-black vertical fixed pattern noise / streaking than the converse.
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post #37 of 36391 Old 03-16-2017, 10:46 AM
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Originally Posted by venus933 View Post
The second picture is the C7, you can make out the silver/metal stand.
Got it - thanks.

How come no one else is commenting on the poor color uniformity of the C7?

Perhaps it's because he has not calibrated whitpoint / greyscale yet, but that C7 shows a marked shift to pink on either side of the screen that is far worse than my C6 demonstrated out-of-the-box...
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post #38 of 36391 Old 03-16-2017, 11:50 AM
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Originally Posted by VidPro View Post
Ok thanks.



On another note, my delivery is in limbo. YRC freight tracking is a joke and the company can't give me a reasonable date that it's expected for delivery so I can figure out a work schedule. I understand the storm created delays but I fail to understand how at least a window of a possible day can't be figured out. I guess I'm spoiled with typical delivery options.

I have heard bad stories about them.



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post #39 of 36391 Old 03-16-2017, 11:52 AM
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Originally Posted by fafrd View Post
Got it - thanks.



How come no one else is commenting on the poor color uniformity of the C7?



Perhaps it's because he has not calibrated whitpoint / greyscale yet, but that C7 shows a marked shift to pink on either side of the screen that is far worse than my C6 demonstrated out-of-the-box...

I have to agree there , first thing I noticed but is the camera exaggerating the effect ?



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post #40 of 36391 Old 03-16-2017, 11:53 AM
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Believe me, after the first call I searched out reviews. Sounds like people who get their deliveries are lucky. I'm waiting for a change in the est. delivery date of tomorrow.

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post #41 of 36391 Old 03-16-2017, 12:49 PM
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Originally Posted by fafrd View Post
I'd rather see a 2018 panel with the same amount of vignette/reverse-vignette and greatly reduced near-black vertical fixed pattern noise / streaking than the converse.
I guess I sort of gave up on a fix for the streaking because it seems like a larger problem due to the fact it covers the entire panel. I classify it similar to clouding/mura and DSE on LCD panels. That LCD problem had never been solved and likely never will be.

Since the vignetting is restricted to the borders of the TV and fairly consistent on the 65", it seemed like something more likely to get fixed. Heck, they could solve it today by just adding a fat bezel around the screen that covers it up - just cut the panels a bit larger so you don't lose full 4K resolution.
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post #42 of 36391 Old 03-16-2017, 12:53 PM
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Originally Posted by fafrd View Post
That would be nice, though honestly, I consider the streaking / vertical fixed-pattern-noise / near-black DSE to be the more significant picture quality defect at this point.

My C6 has some residual vignette including some 'black hinge' but I honestly never, ever notice it on actual content.

Whenever there is a near-black scene, the near-black fixed-pattern-noise becomes visible. It's usually not distracting enough to break immersion, but if there is a pan, forget about it - DSE and distraction up the wazoo...

I'd rather see a 2018 panel with the same amount of vignette/reverse-vignette and greatly reduced near-black vertical fixed pattern noise / streaking than the converse.
You truly got an exemplary panel (and you got it for a song). I'd kill for one like that. These complaints somehow ring hollow.
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post #43 of 36391 Old 03-16-2017, 12:58 PM
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I can pretty much guarantee that if you're sensitive to detail, you'll easily spot that in content - particularly content that contains dimly lit scenes that are heavy on gray, but not quite black. I went through it with my B6 and thought I could live with it, but couldn't. It's kind of like DSE on those snow/sky pans. Once you see it, it's kind of hard to ignore it.

Unless you're incredibly OCD, I'd say just watch it and accept it as a weakness. Realistically, you won't see it unless you're looking for it - and even then, it's bound to show up pretty rarely depending on what it is you're watching.
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post #44 of 36391 Old 03-16-2017, 01:30 PM
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^^Sidebar: Do you really think Sony is going to eradicate those and, if so, without some kind of artifacts? I think you might be expecting a miracle.
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post #45 of 36391 Old 03-16-2017, 01:31 PM
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Originally Posted by video_analysis View Post
You truly got an exemplary panel (and you got it for a song). I'd kill for one like that. These complaints somehow ring hollow.
Well first, I wasn't complaining, just pointing out that future improvements to near-black vertical-streaking/DSE would be more important than future improvements to further reduce residual vignette (at least to me ).

And second, to the extent that many/most of us AVSers are locked in a Sisyphean quest for PQ perfection, the occassional near-black DSE I notice during pans is probably a notch or two less frequent than the occassional motion stutter that jumps out at me, both of which are are less distracting / objectionable than the frequent local-dimming artifacts I put up with on my Vizio P70...
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post #46 of 36391 Old 03-16-2017, 01:36 PM
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Understood, context is (almost) everything. Part of my outburst was admittedly fueled by jealousy.
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post #47 of 36391 Old 03-16-2017, 01:49 PM
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Understood, context is (almost) everything. Part of my outburst was admittedly fueled by jealousy.
I did end up with a pretty exemplary 2016 panel, but I also paid my dues - this was the last of 9 OLED panels to grace my living room over a 2-year period .

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post #48 of 36391 Old 03-16-2017, 01:58 PM
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That was rough, I only went through one EF9500 (missing my 15-day window at BB ended up being a blessing). I'm up to 6 TVs now over the same intervening period. Guess I have 5 more to go until November to attain the lofty status afforded to you by the TV gods.
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post #49 of 36391 Old 03-16-2017, 02:16 PM
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I have heard bad stories about them.



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Well at least the status changed to enroute to Boston. It seems like their CSR aren't that up to date. LOL.

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post #50 of 36391 Old 03-16-2017, 02:27 PM
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^^Sidebar: Do you really think Sony is going to eradicate those and, if so, without some kind of artifacts? I think you might be expecting a miracle.
It's the same panels they're using, right? If they do, LG better figure out the magic formula. I can deal with not having perfection but easily seeing that while watching regular content is not gonna make me happy.

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post #51 of 36391 Old 03-16-2017, 02:57 PM
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Yes, what's not known is if they'll be handpicked to a higher standard or not. I'm sorry you had to suffer the wait caused by the blizzard...all this banding talk regarding a TV you're about to receive (that you may very well find to be an overblown issue) must be excruciating.
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post #52 of 36391 Old 03-16-2017, 03:16 PM
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That's a good way to put it. I should have added the therapy option to the extended warranty I purchased.

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post #53 of 36391 Old 03-16-2017, 03:16 PM
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Do you have a link on that?


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Originally Posted by D-Nice View Post
Even with the above issue, the C7 is still better than the 2016s. It is much brighter in SDR mode, has far better color tracking, less noise in the image....minus what I pointed out in my last post, slightly better uniformity and slightly better motion performance using the True Motion setting.





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post #54 of 36391 Old 03-16-2017, 03:21 PM
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Do you have a link on that?


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Originally Posted by D-Nice View Post
Vignetting is still present on the C7. Saw it at 8% and below along with banding. However......


The C7 is far better than any 2016 or prior LG OLED. I need to look at my graphs/numbers again but there is only roughly a 1-2 fl drop in brightness between 10% windowed patterns and full field white. On top of that gamma tracking based on the same parameters is essentially identical. The CMS works....color tacking is excellent (DeltaE 2000 average error is 1 ). That new 17x17x17 internal LUT is doing its job. All of this is with SDR material so far. I'll do HDR tonight or tomorrow along with all the technical measurements/details of this TV everyone wants. Right now I just want to enjoy the view since this is the fist TV I can say is finally worth replace all of my Kuros with..... yes this TV is THAT good.





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post #55 of 36391 Old 03-16-2017, 03:38 PM
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Originally Posted by Jimmy6166 View Post
I've finally unpacked my C7 65inch.

Here's the down and dirty.

Pros:
-Improvement in shadow detail as everyone as mentioned. There's a particular scene in the Batman: Dark knight that I use to determine loss of shadow detail which wasn't lost in the C7.
-HDR is also baked into youtube, as the HDR symbol pops up when playing a HDR clip.

Cons:
-The screen seems to be tilting backwards? I've tried all I can, adjusting as much as I can, but it seems to tilt back no matter what. I think I've got a dodgy stand.
-Still a bit of vignetting and slight dark streaks, but nothing as noticeable as my B6.

I'll pop in some pics at 5% for comparison between my B6 and C7

Enjoy!
Sounds like you need a shim
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post #56 of 36391 Old 03-16-2017, 04:41 PM
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Thank you for this feedback !
Couple of questions :

- Have you tried HDR on UHD Blu-Ray ? How is the peak brightness ? Is it good ?
- Do you see this vignetting and streaks on real content ?

Unfortunately I don't have a UHD player. (I'm too cheap to invest in a player and discs, but maybe later? I'm more of a a streamer)
Regarding the tilting, maybe it's normal ?
Thanks
Its noticeably brighter than the B6. I've used the HDR effect on medium setting for SDR content, and find it enjoyable. It makes the content pop a lot more, it's visually stimulating that once turned off makes the prior SDR content appear dull. It's really bright to use in a dark room though because the OLED light is maxed out, and it does introduce dithering/noise to black scenes.

I'm hoping the tilt isn't normal, as it's irritating and noticeable from my seated position. Time will tell once other owners get their set. I'm not sure whether I should call LG to ask about the tilt..


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Originally Posted by Wizziwig View Post
Have you run any automatic wear compensation cycles on the set before taking those pics? Need to run for 4 hours, then turn off the display and wait.

So far, I think I actually prefer the 5% uniformity of your B6. Pretty mild right side 'zipper' vignetting compared to some of the examples posted here.
Nope. Not running it yet. I didn't have any dead pixels on my B6 to begin, but after running multiple compensation cycles, I noticed a dead pixel. I read somewhere that if you run too many compensation cycles. it can result in dead pixels ? Not proven though. I do know that the streaking effect got better with compensation cycles though. The right side "zipper" effect hasn't been noticed in normal content. It's hard to tell which is better in terms of screen uniformity, but the overall better picture quality (brightness and shadow detail) makes the screen uniformity a non-issue for me I can now have shadow detail without having to raise the black level, so the screen looks like it's floating when watching in the dark with true black borders. (at least for now.. )

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Congrats. Can you post pictures of the 2-tone bezel? What's the motion like?
Actually compared to my B6, the borders are a matte black, and there's not much contrast between the borders which is AWESOME. I didn't really like the silver tone on the edge of borders of the B6. The screen is also thinner, as it's display bonded on metal. Similar to display on glass of the E and G series. The B6 appears thicker due to the glass being encased rather than bonded.
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post #57 of 36391 Old 03-16-2017, 04:42 PM
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Originally Posted by venus933 View Post
The second picture is the C7, you can make out the silver/metal stand.

I see what you mean, the banding will probably stay to some extent but the color uniformity may get better with time.
Correct!
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post #58 of 36391 Old 03-16-2017, 04:44 PM
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Sounds like you need a shim
If it's not meant to be tilted, then I don't want to use a shim. It should be right out of the box!
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post #59 of 36391 Old 03-16-2017, 05:08 PM
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If it's not meant to be tilted, then I don't want to use a shim. It should be right out of the box!
I don't think it is meant to be tilted. I think that is what Sony is doing. I guess check that the panel is seated properly in the stand.
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