2017 LG C7-B7 Owners' Thread (No Price Talk) - Page 57 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1681 of 36513 Old 05-06-2017, 05:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by poisson View Post
Can anyone share more specifics about the problematic scenes in Arrival? I actually watched this last night while doing other things (I'd already seen it on my old F8500) and didn't really see any issues, but it's possible I may have just missed them.
Saw this posted on another forum. These are for the 1080p BD of Arrival. 4K UHD version has less issues. Good luck!

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First, where she is walking into school through the corridors up the steps (from 4:00). Camera panning over grass field (from 18:48). Next when they first go up into the capsule and travel up (from 26:20). Another is right at the end of the film where the camera pans down from the ceiling to the scene looking out through the window to the sea (from 1:45:25).
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post #1682 of 36513 Old 05-06-2017, 05:27 PM
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Originally Posted by donkrx View Post
I don't disagree with you (that no TV is perfect), but to me this point doesn't seem help with the decision of whether or not to buy any given TV.

The thing is, yes, the C7 is a great TV and I do recommend it. But based on my experience I would recommend a buyer to make sure they understand the common issues, and have an option to exchange it, or get a refund. I knew about the banding issue and purchased it anyway - but until I got to work with it in person, I didn't know what I was dealing with. I could see how some more critical eyes out there might be surprised and disappointed. Right now in 2017 most of the people looking to seriously buy these TVs are going to have a fairly critical eye. There is no "average person" in this realm right now. These sets are very expensive.



That horizontal bar might be worse than my first C7's vertical bar. I'd get rid of it, it looks bad. I think the chance is high that rolling the dice on an exchange will at least get you something better. Just trying to give you the supportive kick in the right direction.

That showed up at 400 hours in? That's shocking and a bit concerning for me. I'll keep an eye out for that.

I'm guessing due to your lack of follow up that the horizontal bar did not go away after the comp cycle? This is one time where I might expect that to work.
I'm not sure until it gets dark so I'll report back later. When the cycle ended during the day it seemed gone but you know how things can change when viewing in total darkness.

Oh and I appreciate the support. This is a great place for the good and the bad that we deal with when it comes to this hobby...er...passion.

The wheels are in motion and I should have a better idea where I'm at in this whole process. It's good to have someone like Robert at V.E. to be there to help make things right.

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post #1683 of 36513 Old 05-06-2017, 05:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aypues View Post
Homeland IS a nightmare on OLED for some reason. I had some major macroblocking and pixelation on my E6, with Homeland being the worst example. I posted some pics of it in the E6 forum. It was SO distracting and frankly disappointing seeing as LCD's handle it like nothing. I ended up selling my E6, and now have a B7 coming on Tuesday. From the reviews they all seem to say near black is much improved but maybe it's just a Homeland streaming/compression problem - although my iPad handled these scenes fine, so maybe it's an OLED problem.
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The thing that annoys me most is the occasional pixilation of near black on some sources. I was getting it on Amazon Prime yesterday watching American Gods in Ultra HD. I thought that problem had been fixed. Maybe I need some calibration.
Those issues are caused by poor color gradation near black on the LG OLEDs. Colors that should have smooth steps and transitions are rendered with exaggerated contouring and posterization. It's been well documented in the gradation tests performed by rtings.com. Their results show that the Sony A1E OLED is improved in this area and I plan to verify this in person soon. I've already looked at the C7 and while it was definitely much better than the E6, it was still noisier near black than other displays. Please let us know your experience when you get your B7.

One way to remedy this issue is to stick to higher quality content. When there are no neighboring large blocks of a single color (as in highly compressed content), the gradation problem is less obvious. It ends up being masked and lost in a sea of single-pixel noise - effectively it's dithered away.
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post #1684 of 36513 Old 05-06-2017, 06:03 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks to whoever tipped me off... Setting deblur to zero cleared up all my motion issues, without making any difference to the picture quality. Go figure. I'm struggling to find negatives at this point. Haven't seen near black pixilation this week.. maybe episode 2 of American Gods will be a reminder but just now couldn't be more happy with my C7
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post #1685 of 36513 Old 05-06-2017, 06:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adamadamadam View Post
Thanks to whoever tipped me off... Setting deblur to zero cleared up all my motion issues, without making any difference to the picture quality. Go figure. I'm struggling to find negatives at this point. Haven't seen near black pixilation this week.. maybe episode 2 of American Gods will be a reminder but just now couldn't be more happy with my C7
You see any banding issues? Is your C7 at max brightness?
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post #1686 of 36513 Old 05-06-2017, 06:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adamadamadam View Post
Thanks to whoever tipped me off... Setting deblur to zero cleared up all my motion issues, without making any difference to the picture quality. Go figure. I'm struggling to find negatives at this point. Haven't seen near black pixilation this week.. maybe episode 2 of American Gods will be a reminder but just now couldn't be more happy with my C7
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post #1687 of 36513 Old 05-06-2017, 06:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adamadamadam View Post
Thanks to whoever tipped me off... Setting deblur to zero cleared up all my motion issues, without making any difference to the picture quality. Go figure. I'm struggling to find negatives at this point. Haven't seen near black pixilation this week.. maybe episode 2 of American Gods will be a reminder but just now couldn't be more happy with my C7
the true torture test is Homeland streaming. i had major near black pixelation on my E6. Hoping my new B7 will handle that material better. my iPad even handled it fine.
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post #1688 of 36513 Old 05-06-2017, 06:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by venus933 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by adamadamadam View Post
Thanks to whoever tipped me off... Setting deblur to zero cleared up all my motion issues, without making any difference to the picture quality. Go figure. I'm struggling to find negatives at this point. Haven't seen near black pixilation this week.. maybe episode 2 of American Gods will be a reminder but just now couldn't be more happy with my C7
Quit while you're ahead and stay clear of this thread?
Lmao.
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post #1689 of 36513 Old 05-06-2017, 06:29 PM
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Originally Posted by Wizziwig View Post
Those issues are caused by poor color gradation near black on the LG OLEDs. Colors that should have smooth steps and transitions are rendered with exaggerated contouring and posterization. It's been well documented in the gradation tests performed by rtings.com. Their results show that the Sony A1E OLED is improved in this area and I plan to verify this in person soon. I've already looked at the C7 and while it was definitely much better than the E6, it was still noisier near black than other displays. Please let us know your experience when you get your B7.

One way to remedy this issue is to stick to higher quality content. When there are no neighboring large blocks of a single color (as in highly compressed content), the gradation problem is less obvious. It ends up being masked and lost in a sea of single-pixel noise - effectively it's dithered away.
Weird that the B6 had 9.5 and the C7 had 9.0 for the gradient score (you would think it would be the other way around) though the verbiage is very similar in that the darker shades have small imperfections. Perhaps we're more critical being enthusiasts or maybe I'm misunderstanding you. Of course the Sony A1E was outstanding in this aspect.
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post #1690 of 36513 Old 05-06-2017, 07:28 PM
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Finally received my 65C today from Chris at Cleveland AV. I'm uploading pictures as we speak to post of the unboxing. But for anyone who has been on the fence about purchasing the TV online (like I definitly was), everything with Chris was smooth and seamless. If you want this TV at a great price, talk to him first.

I cant check my grey scale right now because I have a slider with no covering. Have to wait till its dark.

But so far so good

Thanks again Chris
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post #1691 of 36513 Old 05-06-2017, 07:36 PM
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Originally Posted by venus933 View Post
Weird that the B6 had 9.5 and the C7 had 9.0 for the gradient score (you would think it would be the other way around) though the verbiage is very similar in that the darker shades have small imperfections. Perhaps we're more critical being enthusiasts or maybe I'm misunderstanding you. Of course the Sony A1E was outstanding in this aspect.
You need to look at how they calculate that gradient score. It is "Subjectively assigned" based on how TV displays all of the thousands of possible colors. Most of the brighter colors making up that pattern don't have a problem so the set still received a high score. They also seem to focus on high-quality HDR content and not dark compressed sources. No review site is perfect and it's difficult to put an objective measure on everything. I still like their approach of hard facts and figures than subjective opinions we get elsewhere.

You don't need to take their opinion, just download their gradient results and see for yourself. It's pretty evident to me that the LG OLEDs have visible color banding approaching black that you just don't see on some of the other high-end sets.
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post #1692 of 36513 Old 05-06-2017, 08:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wizziwig View Post
You need to look at how they calculate that gradient score. It is "Subjectively assigned" based on how TV displays all of the thousands of possible colors. Most of the brighter colors making up that pattern don't have a problem so the set still received a high score. They also seem to focus on high-quality HDR content and not dark compressed sources. No review site is perfect and it's difficult to put an objective measure on everything. I still like their approach of hard facts and figures than subjective opinions we get elsewhere.

You don't need to take their opinion, just download their gradient results and see for yourself. It's pretty evident to me that the LG OLEDs have visible color banding approaching black that you just don't see on some of the other high-end sets.
Thanks for taking the time to explain further. I took your suggestion and downloaded the gradient results and yeah, the Sony A1E looks notably smoother. It helps that my 65C7 (hopefully it arrives on Tuesday) is $2K cheaper and IMO the more straightforward design is much more appealing.
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post #1693 of 36513 Old 05-06-2017, 08:26 PM
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Originally Posted by Wizziwig View Post
Saw this posted on another forum. These are for the 1080p BD of Arrival. 4K UHD version has less issues. Good luck!
Interesting, I didn't know the 4K version was better. For anyone following my notes, I have been reporting based on a 15GB 1080p Bluray rip of Arrival.

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I'm not sure until it gets dark so I'll report back later. When the cycle ended during the day it seemed gone but you know how things can change when viewing in total darkness.

Oh and I appreciate the support. This is a great place for the good and the bad that we deal with when it comes to this hobby...er...passion.

The wheels are in motion and I should have a better idea where I'm at in this whole process. It's good to have someone like Robert at V.E. to be there to help make things right.
Yeah, please do report back. Did that horizontal bar show up all at once or gradually over time? (I realize you may not know for sure)

I also got mine from Robert at ValueElectronics. He and his staff were very nice and understanding about the problem with my set, and I had no issues getting it exchanged.
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post #1694 of 36513 Old 05-06-2017, 09:55 PM
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Originally Posted by donkrx View Post
Interesting, I didn't know the 4K version was better. For anyone following my notes, I have been reporting based on a 15GB 1080p Bluray rip of Arrival.



Yeah, please do report back. Did that horizontal bar show up all at once or gradually over time? (I realize you may not know for sure)

I also got mine from Robert at ValueElectronics. He and his staff were very nice and understanding about the problem with my set, and I had no issues getting it exchanged.
Just to update on the horizontal IR...it is gone now so the comp cycle did its job.
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post #1695 of 36513 Old 05-06-2017, 10:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Jimmy6166 about a slight backward tilt of the screen View Post
... I've already contacted LG, and they are sending me out another stand. ...
How did that go?

I just received my 65" C7 today, and it has the same slight tilt.
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post #1696 of 36513 Old 05-07-2017, 12:44 AM
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Does this C7 get brighter than the A1?
I was checking out the A1 vs C7 vs Samsung-Q at my local BestBuy/Magnoila (El Camino Mountain View, CA), and they had just been calibrated, even turned down the lights for me. Watched the last half of Rogue One (Blu-Ray on Oppo, through some "coax distribution") and the A1 was noticeably bighter — the Q looked horrible, blooming in the bottom black bar and washed out color watching from a wide angle. They had the 55"s in out-of-the-box-torch-mode — weird color and with bad SoE for contrast.

Didn't notice any differences in motion or color other then slightly more bightness of the Sony. Will stop by again to see if I can try some 4K/UHD content (Arrival ), and see if I can discern the motion differences.

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post #1697 of 36513 Old 05-07-2017, 02:11 AM - Thread Starter
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Quit while you're ahead and stay clear of this thread?
But the thread is half the fun. No one else I know cares less about this stuff. They all think I'm mental when I mention it (they may be right.)
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post #1698 of 36513 Old 05-07-2017, 05:46 AM
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... Every time you turn the TV off, it will perform wear compensation if it's been more than 4 hours since the last compensation. You can see when it's happening because there will be some dim light coming out the back of the vent openings on the back of the set. Once it's done, the light turns off and you hear an audible click as the set fully powers down. ...
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You need 4 hours total between power cycles before the automatic compensation cycle is triggered. It's a running total so doesn't need to happen all at once. You could watch 2 hours, turn off, then watch another 2 hours the next day and it would trigger on the second day when you turn it off. Every time you cross 4 hours of total "on-time" since the last compensation, it will trigger another compensation when it's powered down. If you watch 8 hours consecutively without powering off, it will only run one compensation. Best not to turn it back on immediately until it finished the cycle. I don't recall how long it takes - I think 5-10 minutes or so but things could have changed on the 2017 models. As I explained in my previous post, you can tell when it's running either by watching the dim light in the back, plugging in some USB device with a status light, or just listening and waiting for the "click" after you turn TV off. If you don't notice the delayed power-off, then it hasn't been on long enough.
My 65" C7 was unboxed about 11 hours prior to this reply. Twice, after more than four hours of continuous power-on, when I powered-off I saw no light from vents in the back (which -- the lower one facing back or the upper one facing up, or both?). This is in a very, albeit not totally, dark room at night. The back is about 9" from a wall, so I can't look directly into the lower vent. The only light I see is the red standby indicator light at the bottom front.

My original break-in color slides USB thumb drive doesn't have a status light, but now I've switched to one that does. So I'll see in 4+ hours if that light remains on after power-off. If it does, I'll update this reply.
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post #1699 of 36513 Old 05-07-2017, 06:15 AM
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Originally Posted by RichB View Post
[The wear compensation cycles] run on their own, but it does not hurt to run them manually.
Is the alleged [see my prior post just above] automatic run at power-off after 4+ cumulative hours the same process as invoked by the settings menu Picture::OLED Panel Settings::Picture Refresher? The on-screen description says that takes about an hour, and provides a choice of starting at the next manual power off or "now," in which case it powers off, then powers on again when the process is complete.

I just selected the "now"; the C7 looks powered off except the USB thumb drive's status light remains on. Edit: and it powered itself back on after an hour.

Last edited by brec; 05-07-2017 at 07:23 AM.
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post #1700 of 36513 Old 05-07-2017, 06:20 AM
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The only input to my new 65" C7 is from Wi-Fi; I've "cut the [cable/satellite] cord." When I power on, I get video and audio noise until I select an app. Is there a way I can avoid the power-on noise?
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post #1701 of 36513 Old 05-07-2017, 07:22 AM
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How did that go?

I just received my 65" C7 today, and it has the same slight tilt.
I see a tilt back on my screen too and it's wall mounted. The tilt on my C7 is more of a bend though. Starting where it gets really thin. I really wish they would stop with all this razor thin TV stuff and worry about picture quality.
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post #1702 of 36513 Old 05-07-2017, 08:17 AM
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There is updated firmware 3.51.20 you can download from LG's website. It is not available via auto update
Is there a way to ascertain which version is currently installed?
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post #1703 of 36513 Old 05-07-2017, 10:07 AM
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Originally Posted by brec View Post
Is the alleged [see my prior post just above] automatic run at power-off after 4+ cumulative hours the same process as invoked by the settings menu Picture::OLED Panel Settings::Picture Refresher? The on-screen description says that takes about an hour, and provides a choice of starting at the next manual power off or "now," in which case it powers off, then powers on again when the process is complete.

I just selected the "now"; the C7 looks powered off except the USB thumb drive's status light remains on. Edit: and it powered itself back on after an hour.

I see no indication that an automatic compensation cycle (B6 Clear panel noise) occurs but I assume it does. The 7 series appears to behave like the 6's in that clearing now turns off the screen for about an hour.


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post #1704 of 36513 Old 05-07-2017, 10:13 AM
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I see a tilt back on my screen too and it's wall mounted. The tilt on my C7 is more of a bend though. Starting where it gets really thin. I really wish they would stop with all this razor thin TV stuff and worry about picture quality.
It's hard to be certain because it's slight, but mine looks straight and tilted rather than having a bend. Of course the fireplace edge that I'm using as a vertical reference could be tilted.
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post #1705 of 36513 Old 05-07-2017, 10:28 AM
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Now take my C7. PLEASE! A little Henny Youngman there...anyway take my C7. With the right content like horror movies which are typically set in the dark for a lot of scenes, seeing vignetting or banding (which for me is not a deal breaker within reason) it pulls me right out of it and I think about vignetting instead. LOL!
Well we all know LG will usually take care of issues like that.
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post #1706 of 36513 Old 05-07-2017, 11:33 AM
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Interesting, I didn't know the 4K version was better. For anyone following my notes, I have been reporting based on a 15GB 1080p Bluray rip of Arrival.
I watched a 4K copy of the movie last night, checking the scenes mentioned above, and I did not notice any issues at all.
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post #1707 of 36513 Old 05-07-2017, 11:43 AM
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The only input to my new 65" C7 is from Wi-Fi; I've "cut the [cable/satellite] cord." When I power on, I get video and audio noise until I select an app. Is there a way I can avoid the power-on noise?
Turn on the plus channels (basically the internet channels) and once you do that, press the channel up or down. Itll switch over to ip-# . so the next time you turn it on if its not on an app, itll be on a channel instead of snow
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post #1708 of 36513 Old 05-07-2017, 11:55 AM
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Well we all know LG will usually take care of issues like that.
Hope so. To be honest though, I'm not sure how excited I'll be to have a tech rip apart my new very expensive TV if that's their response to this issue.

The television screen is the retina of the mind's eye.
Sony XBR-65A1E OLED/Denon X4300H/Oppo 203/Klipsch RVX‑42/PS4 Pro/Xbox One X/5.1.2
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post #1709 of 36513 Old 05-07-2017, 12:07 PM
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Just got my 65b7 and loving it. Still trying to get it tweaked to my liking, but I wish it had an LED or something to give me an indication that it is on or off. Still trying to find the code so my DIRECTV remote can turn it off, too.
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post #1710 of 36513 Old 05-07-2017, 12:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Theheadsn View Post
Turn on the plus channels (basically the internet channels) and once you do that, press the channel up or down. Itll switch over to ip-# . so the next time you turn it on if its not on an app, itll be on a channel instead of snow
Hmm. Yesterday while setting up I declined to agree to the agreements presented on screen because I noticed they required consent to, among other things, advertising. I don't want advertising.

Now when I click on the Plus channels icon it takes me to those agreements.

So, changing the subject slightly: what kind of advertising is it, when does it appear, and how intrusive is it?
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