2017 LG C7-B7 Owners' Thread (No Price Talk) - Page 58 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1711 of 36582 Old 05-07-2017, 12:16 PM
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Unboxing from Cleveland AV

Ok so here are my unboxing pictures from my OLED65C7P bought from Chris at Cleveland AV. Everything was packaged great, and the box arrived from FedEX pretty much in one piece. The tape on the top has broken loose a little bit, and there was a ding in the side of the outer box, but stuff like that is to be expected. Especially since it was shipped all the way out here to Southern California. Paid for it on Monday, got it in my house by Saturday. Not a bad turn around at all. I probably took way more pictures than I needed, but I figured it would help ease anyone's mind if they were on the fence about purchasing from Chris. I will say this, unboxing this thing was a feat all by itself, so used to being able to just grab and go. Make sure you have someone to help you, especially with the 65" I ended up going with the actual LG mount instead of messing with another one. It was only $80 on amazon, so why not. Also the forum decided to put the pictures from last to first. So far the experience with Chris has been awesome, I would definitely recommend buy from him.
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post #1712 of 36582 Old 05-07-2017, 12:22 PM
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Originally Posted by brec View Post
Is the alleged [see my prior post] automatic run at power-off after 4+ cumulative hours the same process as invoked by the settings menu Picture::OLED Panel Settings::Picture Refresher? The on-screen description says that takes about an hour, and provides a choice of starting at the next manual power off or "now," in which case it powers off, then powers on again when the process is complete.

I just selected the "now"; the C7 looks powered off except the USB thumb drive's status light remains on. Edit: and it powered itself back on after an hour.
The thumb drive status light also stays on after a manual power-off following a session of about 4.25 hr. It stayed on for about 8 or 9 minutes. This presumably is the automatic compensation cycle as discussed upthread and is different, at least in duration, from the Picture Refresher process which takes an hour.
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post #1713 of 36582 Old 05-07-2017, 12:22 PM
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Hmm. Yesterday while setting up I declined to agree to the agreements presented on screen because I noticed they required consent to, among other things, advertising. I don't want advertising.

Now when I click on the Plus channels icon it takes me to those agreements.

So, changing the subject slightly: what kind of advertising is it, when does it appear, and how intrusive is it?
Ya I read that to with the agreements. Sadly, have to pay to play type of thing. So far what I've noticed, like when you are in the apps section, there is a little advertisement in the corner that will play videos. I think it works the same way like google and Facebook does. Say you search for a product on google, than youre surfing on Facebook only to see an add for that very same product. Stuff like that. Also they may or may not keep what you use in your voice searching as well. Google does the same thing too when you use the voice to text feature on your phone. These days you either have to be COMPLETELY cut out of everything, or just dive in head first. There is no more middle ground sadly.
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post #1714 of 36582 Old 05-07-2017, 12:28 PM
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Originally Posted by Theheadsn View Post
Ya I read that to with the agreements. Sadly, have to pay to play type of thing. So far what I've noticed, like when you are in the apps section, there is a little advertisement in the corner that will play videos. I think it works the same way like google and Facebook does. Say you search for a product on google, than youre surfing on Facebook only to see an add for that very same product. Stuff like that. Also they may or may not keep what you use in your voice searching as well. Google does the same thing too when you use the voice to text feature on your phone. These days you either have to be COMPLETELY cut out of everything, or just dive in head first. There is no more middle ground sadly.
Do these ads include audio?

I have to ask rather than dive in and see, because I doubt that after diving in there's a way to climb out.

I would rather have snow and noise on powering on than have ads with audio. If I have to press the Mute button I'd rather it be just once at power-on.
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post #1715 of 36582 Old 05-07-2017, 12:30 PM
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Those issues are caused by poor color gradation near black on the LG OLEDs. Colors that should have smooth steps and transitions are rendered with exaggerated contouring and posterization. It's been well documented in the gradation tests performed by rtings.com. Their results show that the Sony A1E OLED is improved in this area and I plan to verify this in person soon. I've already looked at the C7 and while it was definitely much better than the E6, it was still noisier near black than other displays. Please let us know your experience when you get your B7.
So this is essentially a processing issue and not a panel issue since LG and Sony use the same panels. I wonder if this is something LG can improve on with a firmware update.
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post #1716 of 36582 Old 05-07-2017, 12:54 PM
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Hope so. To be honest though, I'm not sure how excited I'll be to have a tech rip apart my new very expensive TV if that's their response to this issue.
If a technician does anything to your TV it will be to replace the panel and that's ultimately what you want to happen right? My understanding is this isn't a terribly complicated process. First thing first though, you need to convince LG that the amount of vignetting you have passes the threshold of being acceptable. Good luck.
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post #1717 of 36582 Old 05-07-2017, 12:56 PM
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Originally Posted by brec View Post
Do these ads include audio?

I have to ask rather than dive in and see, because I doubt that after diving in there's a way to climb out.

I would rather have snow and noise on powering on than have ads with audio. If I have to press the Mute button I'd rather it be just once at power-on.
the ones in the app store are video adds. nothing annoying but they do have audio.
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post #1718 of 36582 Old 05-07-2017, 12:56 PM
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Originally Posted by mroot View Post
Just got my 65b7 and loving it. Still trying to get it tweaked to my liking, but I wish it had an LED or something to give me an indication that it is on or off. Still trying to find the code so my DIRECTV remote can turn it off, too.
I have the B7, there is an LED status light centre bottom of the bezel. There is a setting to disable it, yours must have come that way.

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post #1719 of 36582 Old 05-07-2017, 01:32 PM
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Originally Posted by aypues View Post
So this is essentially a processing issue and not a panel issue since LG and Sony use the same panels. I wonder if this is something LG can improve on with a firmware update.
The HDTVTest youtube video review linked a few pages back claimed the reduction in near-black artifacts was the biggest improvement of B7 vs. B6. So you may be satisfied with what the 2017 LG can deliver vs. the older 2016. I have yet to test the Sony to verify if it does any better in real content.

Written B7 review was posted today but I suggest you also check out their video review:

http://www.hdtvtest.co.uk/news/oled5...1705074461.htm
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Last edited by Wizziwig; 05-07-2017 at 03:40 PM.
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post #1720 of 36582 Old 05-07-2017, 01:40 PM
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Originally Posted by venus933 View Post
If a technician does anything to your TV it will be to replace the panel and that's ultimately what you want to happen right? My understanding is this isn't a terribly complicated process. First thing first though, you need to convince LG that the amount of vignetting you have passes the threshold of being acceptable. Good luck.
Yeah you're right. I get kind wigged out when factory fresh equipment is pulled apart. That is unless it's a car and we're doing some modifications.

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post #1721 of 36582 Old 05-07-2017, 02:33 PM
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Originally Posted by brec View Post
Do these ads include audio?

I have to ask rather than dive in and see, because I doubt that after diving in there's a way to climb out.

I would rather have snow and noise on powering on than have ads with audio. If I have to press the Mute button I'd rather it be just once at power-on.
Resetting to factory conditions should opt you out easily.
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post #1722 of 36582 Old 05-07-2017, 02:59 PM
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Resetting to factory conditions should opt you out easily.
More or less, depending on how much I've changed video settings (which I haven't as yet).

I think this is a dumb question, but I ain't scared: if I reset to factory, I wouldn't lose the benefits of break-in slides (if any ) and of the wear compensation/adjustment cycles that occur on power-downs after 4+ hour sessions, right? Those benefits are from physical changes, not just stored parameters?
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post #1723 of 36582 Old 05-07-2017, 03:02 PM
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Correct.

The television screen is the retina of the mind's eye.
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post #1724 of 36582 Old 05-07-2017, 04:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Hresna View Post
I have the B7, there is an LED status light centre bottom of the bezel. There is a setting to disable it, yours must have come that way.
Yes, I just found it. Thanks! The owner's manual is basically worthless.

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post #1725 of 36582 Old 05-07-2017, 05:06 PM
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What are your settings?

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I just got my C7 today. Does anyone have any suggestions. It looks great out of the box. Also what is the thinnest wall mount?

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post #1727 of 36582 Old 05-07-2017, 10:40 PM
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Originally Posted by JerryIII View Post
I just got my C7 today. Does anyone have any suggestions. It looks great out of the box. Also what is the thinnest wall mount?
The LG mount specifically for the tv works awesome. actually just got mine hung up. the back of the tv (where the guts are) sits almost against the wall itself. plus i didnt want to buy this expensive t.v. only to cheap out on the mount. luckily the lg mount is reasonably priced. got it for $80 on amazon
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post #1728 of 36582 Old 05-08-2017, 03:01 AM
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I'm kind of the same as far as lurking around AVS for quite a while before I posted anything. So many here are so much more knowledgeable than me!

I have a 2012 Sammy LCD 60D8000 that I still use occasionally. As far as brightness comparison to the C7P I just purchased a few weeks ago, it's an entirely different beast. The C7P gets far brighter on highlights such as street lamps on a night scene. The Sammy LCD gets marginally brighter on scenes with predominately >75 - 80% white or near white such as snow outdoors or even a large area of blue sky. The C7P is worlds better at bright scenes than my EF9500 from 2015. This is the ABL kicking in assumedly to keep power consumption in check. In real world viewing, I think you will be pleased with the look of the OLED. Just be sure to immediately kill the energy saver settings when you first fire it up. It makes the picture look dingy and very few, if any on this forum use it.

I also have a Sammy KS9000 (which is a light cannon) that has been relegated to the upstairs sitting room in favor of an EF9500 in my master bedroom, even though it has some minor gray banding issues and can't get nearly as bright. Those perfect blacks just keep me hooked on OLED. I mention this only to illustrate how much more important great blacks are to high brightness, at least to me.

As for the white balance settings, I can't help you there as I am satisfied with the factory calibrations. I realize that I'm not a connoisseur of picture quality as most on this forum are, but my untrained eye is happy and that's what counts!
Thanks for the response srust. I've now got my C7 up and running, and it is a fantastic piece of kit - very happy. The brightness is a curious mix when compared to my old LED. The light scenes are very much brighter, certainly spot brightness like a shot of the sun, or a torch beam for example, are very much more intense. In contrast, darker scenes look, well, darker. I think that this is due to those lovely deep shadows, and the sheer richness of the colours.
New amp and UHD player arriving today, so I'll be able to play even more!
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post #1729 of 36582 Old 05-08-2017, 06:39 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Theheadsn View Post
The LG mount specifically for the tv works awesome. actually just got mine hung up. the back of the tv (where the guts are) sits almost against the wall itself. plus i didnt want to buy this expensive t.v. only to cheap out on the mount. luckily the lg mount is reasonably priced. got it for $80 on amazon
Can't help thinking a fixed mount is a bad idea for this TV. For decent 4k content I can sit literally 3 feet away from the screen and still enjoy it. For decent HD, 4-5 feet is about the max. For Live TV, more like 6-8 feet. So being able to move the viewing distance by a meter is pretty handy. (edit: 65")
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post #1730 of 36582 Old 05-08-2017, 09:10 AM
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I was checking out the A1 vs C7 vs Samsung-Q at my local BestBuy/Magnoila (El Camino Mountain View, CA), and they had just been calibrated.
Surly not by D-Nice or Chad B Just because someone says a TV was calibrated means very little. Its all about who did it. There are reports of BB calibration making a TV worse then it once was out of the box......Of course this does not mean every set is worse, you just have to be careful.....All calibrators have reports that show the graphs and that will tell all. Without those, who knows.....
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post #1731 of 36582 Old 05-08-2017, 12:49 PM
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Quote:
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I was checking out the A1 vs C7 vs Samsung-Q at my local BestBuy/Magnoila (El Camino Mountain View, CA), and they had just been calibrated.
Surly not by D-Nice or Chad B Just because someone says a TV was calibrated means very little. Its all about who did it. There are reports of BB calibration making a TV worse then it once was out of the box......Of course this does not mean every set is worse, you just have to be careful.....All calibrators have reports that show the graphs and that will tell all. Without those, who knows.....
when you first turn on the c7, it even asks if the tv is for home or demo display. never take what a television looks like at the store to heart.
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post #1732 of 36582 Old 05-08-2017, 02:47 PM
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Hi. I bought a C7 two weeks ago to replace my beloved Kuro. I tweaked the settings based on several lists that I compared online. Basically the rtings with cinema mode instead of expert (dark room). A couple of nights ago while watching Lalaland (1080p streamed) in some scenes where the character was against a black backfround the dark areas around the character broke into an irregular halo of a dark gray with with a clear demarcation then turning to black. This happened on a couple of scenes but I haven't seen it in other movies. Is this a defect in the settings or an artifact of OLED? Are there specific settings I should check to make black gradation as smooth as possible? Thanks for the advise. I haven't had to tinker with a new tv's settings since 2009.
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post #1733 of 36582 Old 05-08-2017, 02:55 PM
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Quick question about ABL, after reading a few reviews and trying to understand where and when this is a concern.

Is adjusting OLED light down to avoid ABL only a concern on SDR content? What I mean is, do I only need to consider reducing OLED light to avoid ABL for all SDR video modes (including HDR effect?), or do I also need to make this consideration when making adjustments in HDR modes?

I have been trying to slowly learn all of the ins and outs of the various settings and options without getting too confused. Trying to tackle one thing at a time

Thanks in advance for any feedback! And happy to test and report back on other things (on my 55" B7) if people have suggestions or questions. I have so far avoided checking any of the near black slides during my initial time with the set, so I can't comment on the performance there.
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post #1734 of 36582 Old 05-08-2017, 04:14 PM
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Originally Posted by Chad B View Post
LG’s OLED televisions have won the admiration of home theater enthusiasts with their rich blacks, flexible viewing angles, and unmatched dimension and pop.

However, the road to stardom hasn’t been perfectly smooth. Issues, ranging from serious deal breakers to odd curiosities, have at times prevented the LGs from achieving their full potential. Recently, I enjoyed the company of an LG 65C7, which Cleveland AV owner Chris Majoros pulled from his stock, in my home theater for about two weeks.

The C7 is a versatile set, with strong light output and a screen that tends to soak up ambient light very well. In addition, there was almost no change in image quality even at extreme angles. The profile is so thin and fragile looking that my wife and I were almost afraid to unpack it, but it turned out to be more than robust enough.

Technical info:

Break in:
The C7 was broken in for a total of 200 hours, with multiple power and compensation cycles throughout. Cinema mode was chosen to track the C7’s break in since it is one of the more accurately measuring modes, while the ISF Expert modes would be reserved for calibration and other testing. Fresh out of the box with just a normal warm up time, after turning the power save feature off the C7’s Cinema mode measured extremely well. The previous 6 series’ familiar greenish emphasis in the mid tones was significantly reduced, and color tracking at different brightness levels and saturation points was excellent and greatly improved over the 6 series. Even the skin tone simulations measured with the correct tint and saturation, a feat that eluded the 6 series. Initial picture impressions were somewhat surprising; unlike the previous 6 series OLEDs which tended to have overly rich color and dark shadow detail, the C7’s color was polite, with slightly pale skin tones, and most content did not seem to be lacking in dark textures.

After 97 hours, the C7 was remeasured under identical conditions and settings. As the break in process progressed, the gamma shifted lower which tends to slightly reduce the depth perspective and wash out the image. There was also a tiny bit more green in the white balance.

Finally, at 200 hours the C7 was measured again, with the same settings and under the same conditions. Between 97 and 200 hours, the gamma lowered only a tiny bit more, but the green emphasis in the white balance increased to the point where it would become more visibly intrusive.

The resulting pre calibration picture was good, but watching Blu Ray movies within the initial 150 hour period showed a mixture of both enjoyable and annoying characteristics. First, the motion had the unnatural Soap Opera Effect along with fleeting jagged edges and general weirdness around the borders of moving objects. Blacks looked superb, but depth and dimensionality of the image was not as great as hoped; and whites often seemed compressed. Dark picture content just above black was easy to see and very well delineated. Skin tones, while generally natural and inoffensive, sometimes had a jaundice tinge. The image had excellent pop and a great photo realistic quality.

Windows and fields:
Some other surprising departures from previous LG OLED models included differences with various size and style measurement windows. Previously, there had been no significant change in the way different standard window sizes and styles measured. With the C7, shadow detail measured a tiny bit stronger with small windows than with medium to large windows, and significantly stronger than with APL style windows. This is shown as an increase in gamma at the low end with larger and APL windows. Measurements attached for 2, 10, and 25% size conventional windows and 10% size/25% APL windows.

Thankfully, the white balance was very consistent with all sizes even up to full fields. Peak light output when calibrated to 50 fL was basically unchanged with 50% windows and an extremely impressive 43.1 fL with full fields. The dynamic brightness pattern on the AVS 709 disc looked similar to past OLEDs with only a slight darkening of 10-30% as the APL changed. These results suggest that, while shadow detail may now suffer from small dynamic shifts, ABL (undesirable brightness limiting with full white screens) is pretty much a thing of the past.

Color:
A second departure from previous models concerns color reproduction and behavior of the color gamut selection and color filter functions. The C7’s color reproduction seemed too relaxed at times, lacking in richness, despite measurements suggesting nearly perfect color accuracy with color gamut at the default Auto setting. While measurements are generally the preferred way of setting and testing color, LG provides a color filter function to aid in color calibration in the absence of a suitable meter. Surprisingly, the C7’s color had to be increased to 72 with a tint of G2 for the result to be correct with the color filter function, with the image looking surprisingly decent but at odds with the measurements. Changing the color gamut selection to wide “fixed” that problem, indicating perfect color alignment at default color and tint settings with the color filter. Reference screencaps looked impressive in Wide, but the measurements showed colors were oversaturated. The same experiment was done on the 6 series, which did not show the same color gamut differences with the color filter function. The 6’s color gamut selection behaves as expected, with colors ranging from merely rich in Normal color gamut to over the top in Wide.

As with the C, E, and G6, the C7’s CMS behavior is somewhat less than desirable. While an improvement over the CMS behavior of the B6 and earlier OLEDs, the C7’s CMS tends to have sharp adjustment transitions which can lead to artifacts on some content. In addition, in between color shades such as skin tones tend not to be touched at all by the C7’s CMS. CMS behavior was tested with color gamut set to both Wide and Auto with slightly modified but ultimately similar results. It is therefore advisable to keep CMS calibration to a minimum.

HDR:
HDR was significantly improved over the 6 series, in more ways than just higher peak light output. The grayscale and gamma can now be calibrated nicely over the entire range, though a modified “code value” adjustment remains as the multipoint control. By running very closely spaced measurement runs, it was possible to determine exactly which brightness level the different code values adjusted. The lower three and uppermost three controls had a wide coverage area (like Q factor in the audio world), while the middle 14 controls adjusted a fairly narrow range. The stimulus level each code value adjusted, with contrast and brightness at default, will be listed in an attached document. I was able to use the levels editor of CalMAN to make a special set of measurements that lined up with these levels, which facilitated calibration.

Uniformity and misc:
There was an inconsistent change in light output when switching the screen shift function off in the OLED panel settings menu. The screen shift caused resolution patterns to garble slightly as the screen shifted. Turning it off caused a puzzling loss of peak light output, going from 50 fL to 42 fL, though cycling the picture modes or power seemed to bring the light output back up.

After break in, dark uniformity was the best I’ve seen on an OLED. Full fields were examined coming out of black in 1% increments. There was no vignetting (though I believe I caught glimpses of it earlier in the break in process), and banding was only slightly visible on a 3% field, though it did not look like it would be visible at all on any real image. With bright 50%-100% fields, uniformity was good, though the right side looked slightly warmer than the left. Measurements of the C7’s near black behavior showed excellent shadow detail with gamma near ideal from .5% to 5%. This is dramatically better than the 6 series, and proof of the C7’s superior shadow detail and near black performance.

Input lag with any picture mode except game and any combination of motion settings was 88 ms. Game mode measured an impressive 21 ms. Relabeling the input to PC was not tested.

Even with sharpness set to 0 and all enhancements switched off, there was some edge enhancement on sharpness patterns with 1080P or lower resolutions. 4K/UHD sharpness and resolution patterns looked superb, with full resolution and no artifacts.

Viewing:


UHD HDR Blu Ray looked amazing on the C7. The image had a punchy, powerful quality while at the same time not seeming overexposed or artificially enhanced as HDR can sometimes look. Motion, after adjustment of the Tru Motion settings, was authentic and natural. Detail was razor sharp. With the C7’s lack of backlight issues, the image outclassed that of any LED LCD, even flagship full array local dimming models.

Normal Blu Ray, upscaled to 4K by the player, was outstanding. After watching several movies, my general impression was that of an exquisite photorealistic quality, with strong shadow detail. Colors were lifelike, and the slightly jaundice skin tones were eliminated with calibration. My most familiar movies, such as The Dark Knight, looked rich, beautiful, and dynamic in a good way. There were occasions where the color seemed too tame and whites looked a bit compressed on some of the less familiar movies.

Using a Roku 4 to send 1080P to the C7 (the Roku 4 refused to send 4K UHD resolution to the C7, no matter how it was set) was the only major disappointment in our time with the C7. We had been watching The Following on Netflix on our Panasonic VT60 plasma via the same Roku 4; and despite some scenes looking better than others, we were enjoying the series. As we started our first episode on the C7, the graininess was striking and so distracting we couldn’t finish. I cycled through picture modes, and it went from bad to worse, confirming it wasn’t a problem with the calibration. Edge enhancement does tend to exaggerate graininess, so my theory is that the edge enhancement noted with 1080P and lower scan rates was pushing the film grain past the threshold of tolerability. Although it seems upscaling the 1080P signal to 4K with a good external processor or receiver should solve the problem, that was not tested as this occurred at the end of our time with the C7.

With rare exception, the C7 pushes the state of the art to new heights. Near black uniformity, shadow detail, and HDR performance are all significantly improved over LG’s already beautiful previous OLEDs.
Chad B,

I appreciate your review. I just got one of these and was wondering what your settings were?

LG 65C7p | Sony PS3 | Sony PS4 | Apple Ariport Express | Emotiva UMC-200 | Parasound HCA2003a | Parasound HCA1000a x 2 | Monster HTS3500 | AC Infinity Aircom T8 x 2 | NHT 1.5 | NHT VS2 | NHT Super Ones | SVS SB16 Ultra w/ sound isolation feet | Harmony Elite | Salamander Venice 237 | Sound Anchors Cone Coasters | Vibrapods
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post #1735 of 36582 Old 05-08-2017, 05:12 PM
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How do I enable ARC on this tv?

LG 65C7p | Sony PS3 | Sony PS4 | Apple Ariport Express | Emotiva UMC-200 | Parasound HCA2003a | Parasound HCA1000a x 2 | Monster HTS3500 | AC Infinity Aircom T8 x 2 | NHT 1.5 | NHT VS2 | NHT Super Ones | SVS SB16 Ultra w/ sound isolation feet | Harmony Elite | Salamander Venice 237 | Sound Anchors Cone Coasters | Vibrapods
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post #1736 of 36582 Old 05-08-2017, 06:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brec View Post
Do these ads include audio?

I have to ask rather than dive in and see, because I doubt that after diving in there's a way to climb out.

I would rather have snow and noise on powering on than have ads with audio. If I have to press the Mute button I'd rather it be just once at power-on.
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Originally Posted by JerryIII View Post
How do I enable ARC on this tv?
Settings, Sound, Sound Out. There you can configure HDMI or Optical
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post #1737 of 36582 Old 05-08-2017, 07:08 PM
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Mine doesn't have that setting. I am not sure how old the hdmi cable is. Could it be that the tv will not offer the option if the hdmi cable won't support it?

LG 65C7p | Sony PS3 | Sony PS4 | Apple Ariport Express | Emotiva UMC-200 | Parasound HCA2003a | Parasound HCA1000a x 2 | Monster HTS3500 | AC Infinity Aircom T8 x 2 | NHT 1.5 | NHT VS2 | NHT Super Ones | SVS SB16 Ultra w/ sound isolation feet | Harmony Elite | Salamander Venice 237 | Sound Anchors Cone Coasters | Vibrapods
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post #1738 of 36582 Old 05-08-2017, 08:14 PM
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Originally Posted by brec View Post
Is there a way to ascertain which version is currently installed?
General::About this TV
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post #1739 of 36582 Old 05-08-2017, 09:09 PM
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Best 65

For those of you with 65" screens and who aren't constrained by other needs: what eye-to-screen viewing distance have you chosen?
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post #1740 of 36582 Old 05-08-2017, 09:54 PM
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About 10 feet.

Watching Thirteen Reasons Why tonight was a real torture test. Lots of elevated blacks to bring out the vignetting. Strangely enough, the vertical banding was barely visible at times but that might be my watching distance.

The television screen is the retina of the mind's eye.
Sony XBR-65A1E OLED/Denon X4300H/Oppo 203/Klipsch RVX‑42/PS4 Pro/Xbox One X/5.1.2
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