Master OLED image retention/ burn-in thread:with photos - Page 2 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #31 of 3979 Old 04-18-2017, 11:34 AM
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These are the 1st set of attachments sent in and I spoke to 2 sets of representatives. Neither stated they could see anything more than a red screen. My patience wears a little thin when someone is lying straight to my face. Unless the 3 reps I talked to are either color blind or all severely need an eye exam and a set of glasses.
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post #32 of 3979 Old 04-18-2017, 11:42 AM
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How did you get the menu icons to burn into the display???

I have had not a hint of even IR with my display now, had it since mid-January.
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post #33 of 3979 Old 04-18-2017, 11:51 AM
 
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Can you confirm that you did a Screen panel refresh (noise remover)?
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post #34 of 3979 Old 04-18-2017, 11:53 AM
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Same with me, i have not seen any ir yet on mine either and i have screen shift turned off.
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post #35 of 3979 Old 04-18-2017, 11:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Quebecker View Post
Wait, so the TV setting icon are burned in the TV?

How long were they displayed good Lord?

I have a video game ui with 1000 hours in and there's not a hint of burn in.

I supposed you did a manual panel noise removal?
Turn on the menu icon on your display and tell me how long it stays on the screen before vanishing? On mine it is 124 seconds before it disappears! Stating it is an impossibility for the menu to display for any extended amount of time whatsoever. It would be impossible to fall asleep and wake up 12 hours later with the menu still up. I am a prior plasma owner so yes screen shift was and clear panel noise has been used numerous times. I spent a week trying to get rid of it prior even contacting LG using the Disney WOW pixel flipper and clear panel noise on numerous occasions. Unlike plasma where running the Pixel flipper or screen wipe in torch mode would at least lighten the burn in this doesn't seem to have any affect here. YouTube has numerous fantastic dead pixel, screen burn videos that go upward of 12 hours but after trying I am simply putting hours on the set which is foolish.

Lastly panel variation is going to be a big factor. Panasonic VT series (which I owned, the bright white Oppo logo from my BDP-103 burned in very quickly after buying the set) and ZT60's were very prone to image retention and burn in while the ST and S series were not. Also this is only visible on a red screen (yellow, orange, brown and fleshtones). It is not visible on a white screen, blue screen or a green screen. Also the only menu icons showing the severe IR are the aspect ratio and sound out. The safety (purple), sleep timer (green) and picture mode (blue) icons are not showing IR at all which is bizarre since everything should show the severe IR equally. I first noticed this with content and then putting up the Disney red slide. Using the red color filter has the same effect on a white slide.
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post #36 of 3979 Old 04-18-2017, 12:01 PM
 
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Originally Posted by PRO-630HD View Post
Turn on the menu icon on your display and tell me how long it stays on the screen before vanishing? On mine it is 124 seconds before it disappears! Stating it is an impossibility for the menu to display for any extended amount of time whatsoever. It would be impossible to fall asleep and wake up 12 hours later with the menu still up. I am a prior plasma owner so yes screen shift was and clear panel noise has been used numerous times. I spent a week trying to get rid of it prior even contacting LG using the Disney WOW pixel flipper and clear panel noise on numerous occasions. Unlike plasma where running the Pixel flipper or screen wipe in torch mode would at least lighten the burn in this doesn't seem to have any affect here. YouTube has numerous fantastic dead pixel, screen burn videos that go upward of 12 hours but after trying I am simply putting hours on the set which is foolish.

Lastly panel variation is going to be a big factor. Panasonic VT and ZT60's were very prone to image retention and burn in while the ST and S series were not. Also this is only visible on a red screen (yellow, orange, brown and fleshtones). It is not visible on a white screen, blue screen or a green screen. Also the only menu icons burned in are the aspect ratio and sound out. The safety (purple), sleep timer (green) and picture mode (blue) icons are showing no burn in at all of any kind which is bizarre since everything should have burned in equally.
Humm interesting.

Don't understand why LG don't see the issue.

Keep putting pressure on.
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post #37 of 3979 Old 04-18-2017, 12:03 PM
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That is strange that the color affects it since the LG panels are WOLED and not RGBOLED. With that in mind is it possible somehow the color filters are the issue here?
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post #38 of 3979 Old 04-18-2017, 12:05 PM
 
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Originally Posted by timjohnson1717 View Post
That is strange that the color affects it since the LG panels are WOLED and not RGBOLED. With that in mind is it possible somehow the color filters are the issue here?
Yeah it's really puzzling.

How can a color filter be burned in.

Why only on red.

This is mysterious and interesting
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post #39 of 3979 Old 04-18-2017, 12:37 PM
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The advise I got was put the display into store mode which I did as it refreshes the settings every few minutes. I did this and put the display into torch mode (Vivid) and played 12 hours of dead pixel screen burn RGB flash videos. These videos are nice because they will generally go from one dead pixel video to the next so little risk of it getting stuck on a static display of youtube videos.

Now in dealing with LG The 1st representative I talked to named Kyle stated "these displays are prone to burn in" verbatim and this was an out of warranty issue. Talking to Danny an LG Rep who sets up the wall displays at Best Buy stationed out of Indianapolis was very aware of the burn in issue as well and had seen it on numerous occasions with the BB displays. He was very professional unlike what I had dealt with before and was lucky enough to run into him as a fluke in my local store. He simply stated this should never ever be an issue you have to deal with and under no circumstances should the menu system ever show severe IR on the display. I also have always used the LG presets being ISF modes and HDR Bright with dynamic contrast turned down. Granted HDR Bright probably being the most dangerous with Oled light and contrast at 100, medium color temp which is the brightest and wide color gamut, but if those settings are prone to severe IR they shouldn't be presets from the factory. I also am stating if it was anything but the menu icons showed extreme IR I would take the hit. Any of the settings or presets within the LG TV is on the company.

Now off to a service center to diagnose at my expense and see if LG steps up to the plate and does the right thing concerning the repair that is well within the 1 year warranty.

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post #40 of 3979 Old 04-18-2017, 12:45 PM
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I would imagine the issue is common with the BB displays as they play the same content in a loop with settings maxed out. Worse case scenario for anything burn in related.
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post #41 of 3979 Old 04-18-2017, 12:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by timjohnson1717 View Post
I would imagine the issue is common with the BB displays as they play the same content in a loop with settings maxed out. Worse case scenario for anything burn in related.

they also don't run comp cycles in some cases, this instance is bizarre . yet to see anything other than very temporary ir on my set.



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post #42 of 3979 Old 04-18-2017, 03:08 PM
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^Exactly, what happens in the store is inconsequential. Until they load a forced comp. cycle at startup while in store mode, it's going to keep happening.

As for Pro-630hd's issue, that is certainly a freak occurrence. You're going to get me pulling out my color slides now looking for more than just pixel defects.
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post #43 of 3979 Old 04-18-2017, 04:51 PM
 
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Originally Posted by video_analysis View Post
.

As for Pro-630hd's issue, that is certainly a freak occurrence. You're going to get me pulling out my color slides now looking for more than just pixel defects.
That's what I just did.

Found nothing and I'm a huge gamer and recently HDR gamer, so a full backlight displaying a static UI for hours long.

Pro-630hd problem is still really strange.
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post #44 of 3979 Old 04-18-2017, 09:11 PM
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Originally Posted by timjohnson1717 View Post
I would imagine the issue is common with the BB displays as they play the same content in a loop with settings maxed out. Worse case scenario for anything burn in related.
Granted but the loop is dynamic data only. It shouldn't burn in period, there is no static imagery in the loop. It is like playing The Good the Bad & the Ugly on a loop over and over again. Since the material is dynamic and constantly moving it shouldn't burn in in the first place.
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post #45 of 3979 Old 04-19-2017, 03:04 PM
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Pics?
You can see it across his red bag. Most prominent with red but also shows on green.
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post #46 of 3979 Old 04-19-2017, 03:33 PM
 
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You can see it across his red bag. Most prominent with red but also shows on green.
Can you take more pictures. Closer if possible.

Try using a full red pattern.
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post #47 of 3979 Old 04-19-2017, 04:14 PM
 
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Also can both of you guys tell us what model you have and size?
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post #48 of 3979 Old 04-19-2017, 05:17 PM
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Pretty sure Pro has the C6, and it looks like Michael has the E6. It proves that burn-in certainly can still happen...I think I've heard 3 instances of it happening on the 2016 models in people's homes now, with one of them getting a free screen replacement. Pro is entitled to the same treatment at the very least. There is no way that menu should so easily cause such an imprint.
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post #49 of 3979 Old 04-19-2017, 05:22 PM
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Originally Posted by video_analysis View Post
Pretty sure Pro has the C6, and it looks like Michael has the E6. It proves that burn-in certainly can still happen...I think I've heard 3 instances of it happening on the 2016 models in people's homes now, with one of them getting a free screen replacement. Pro is entitled to the same treatment at the very least. There is no way that menu should so easily cause such an imprint.
Makes me wonder if the compensation circuitry in his panel has a defect (or the main processing board which could be blocking it from occurring).
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post #50 of 3979 Old 04-19-2017, 05:25 PM
 
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Makes me wonder if the compensation circuitry in his panel has a defect.
In any case, he clearly need a new panel... For free!

LG, move your arse!
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post #51 of 3979 Old 04-19-2017, 05:26 PM
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In any case, he clearly need a new panel... For free!

LG, move your arse!
Thinking about it (I edited while you were posting ) I think they should replace the entire set.
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post #52 of 3979 Old 04-19-2017, 05:54 PM
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Unfortunately, that's only wishful thinking. They won't adjust their workflow for any reason. Comp. circuitry defect is a plausible theory...which is even more concerning since burn-in could easily become worse without warning.
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post #53 of 3979 Old 04-19-2017, 07:22 PM
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I have heard some OLED TV owners complain of screen burn after only 5 minutes of a static image being on screen. Is this true?
Not even remotely true for my C7.

I use my C7 as a hybrid gaming monitor and TV display. Static imagery is often present with the way I use the display and I have not seen even a hint of image retention or burn in.
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post #54 of 3979 Old 04-19-2017, 07:39 PM
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Makes me wonder if the compensation circuitry in his panel has a defect (or the main processing board which could be blocking it from occurring).
Neither are out of the realm of possibilities, but would be extremely rare occurrences.
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post #55 of 3979 Old 04-19-2017, 10:46 PM
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These are the 1st set of attachments sent in and I spoke to 2 sets of representatives. Neither stated they could see anything more than a red screen.
If they're looking at the photos on a typical PC LCD screen, then I'm not surprised.

Perhaps you'd have better luck with a gamma-adjusted photo? I reduced the gamma to 30% on the attached photo, and it's really easy to see now.
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post #56 of 3979 Old 04-19-2017, 11:45 PM
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I have heard some OLED TV owners complain of screen burn after only 5 minutes of a static image being on screen. Is this true?
Its not true on my 65"B6. I have 500 plus hours on the set and image retention has never been an issue let alone burn-in.

I used to own a Samsung f8500 Plasma and that tv had image retention issues for me. I constantly had to baby the screen and minimize the on screen time of tickers, logos, black movie bars, etc. and that was with 600 hours on the tv. It had a nice picture but I was always worried about ruining the screen. So when I took the leap to OLED Image retention was a concern for me too. I have had the B6 for 1.5 years less time than i had the f8500 and the B6 is now approaching the same hours as i had on the f8500! That is because I know I can watch the B6 and not worry about what I am watching and just enjoy the beautiful picture these OLED's have. I am so happy Image retention/burn-in is a non issue for me.
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post #57 of 3979 Old 04-20-2017, 02:48 AM
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Originally Posted by video_analysis View Post
Unfortunately, that's only wishful thinking. They won't adjust their workflow for any reason. Comp. circuitry defect is a plausible theory...which is even more concerning since burn-in could easily become worse without warning.
I suspect a defect like this is more likely to happen during manufacturing and very few sets would slip by without it working. And so not too likely to become a problem or this would be cropping up more as presumably people are starting to wrack up some decent hours on the the earlier OLED sets. It is true that eventually the comp (and anti-aging) circuitry will eventually no longer work and the panel will slowly degrade after that having reached its end of life, if at that point burn in becomes a problem then rather than slowly degrade it may abruptly degrade, however the anti-burn in measures may continue to work for a while. Hopefully none of this will occur until the sets reach at least 50,000 hours and more hopefully the 100,000 LG claims.


Edit:
I've found this a good starting point discussion (technical) for trying to figure out what is going on during the compensation cycles it kind of picks up in the middle of the patent process along these lines but summarizes earlier efforts:
https://www.google.com/patents/US6995519
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post #58 of 3979 Old 04-20-2017, 05:34 AM
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Originally Posted by Michael Vallis View Post
You can see it across his red bag. Most prominent with red but also shows on green.
Blatantly obvious! You would have to be blind not to see that! Extremely distracting when watching content and for anyone curious do a youtube search and you will see the severe image retention on Oled's is generally specific to certain colors. Thanks for posting this! I am amazed people are denying this is an issue when I have seen multiple instances of this on display models alone and that is within a 50 mile radius of where I live.

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post #59 of 3979 Old 04-20-2017, 05:38 AM
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Can you take more pictures. Closer if possible.

Try using a full red pattern.
Sorry about the angle but camera struggles when full on. Pic does not show the fault up as much as my eyes but you can clearly see the "time" part of the info banner in the L/H bottom corner.

My TV is an LG OLED 55E6.
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post #60 of 3979 Old 04-20-2017, 05:45 AM
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Update:
Currys repair company "KnowHow" are picking it up tomorrow, I'll update in a couple of weeks.
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