Master OLED image retention/ burn-in thread:with photos - Page 9 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #241 of 3734 Old 05-06-2017, 07:20 PM
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I have burn in on my B6 as a result of the graphics on CNN. It only seems to show up on red/yellow/brown images.

You can see the breaking news graphic in the photo.
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post #242 of 3734 Old 05-06-2017, 07:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Vallis View Post
This is LG's latest & probably last reply.
> Any static image that is displayed on the screen for long a period of time can damage the screen, this includes the ‘banner’ or ‘news reel’ that is displayed at the bottom screen when watching any of the 24 hours news channels such as Sky News, BBC News 24 or Sky Sports News.
>
>
>
> Although I sypathise with your situation it is the opinion of the senior management and technical support teams within LG that you as a consumer are responsible for what you view on your T.V and that if your T.V is damaged as a result of the content that is being viewed we as a manufacturer will not rectify such damage under the warranty.
>
> I must stress at this point that your complaint has been escalated to the highest possible levels within LG and their final decision is to decline your request for a replacement T.V, refund or free of charge repair.
>
Unbelievable. So they are saying their "Ultimate TV" is unfit for use as a display for watching regular TV channels? Where is this stated in their OLED marketing materials? Unless they are lying about the supposed 100K hour lifetime of these panels, there is no way you would see that degree of permanent burn-in in such a short time.

This issue needs to be brought to the attention of the larger review outlets like forbes.com, cnet.com, etc. If they put enough pressure on LG like they did for the "HDR Game Mode" debacle, then you may see some results. Don't let them bully you into silence.
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post #243 of 3734 Old 05-06-2017, 07:22 PM
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Originally Posted by unprocessed View Post
I have burn in on my B6 as a result of the graphics on CNN. It only seems to show up on red/yellow/brown images.

You can see the breaking news graphic in the photo.
What happens if you run the cleaning program?

Also what's that bright yellow spot?

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post #244 of 3734 Old 05-06-2017, 07:26 PM
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Originally Posted by Wizziwig View Post
Unbelievable. So they are saying their "Ultimate TV" is unfit for use as a display for watching regular TV channels? Where is this stated in their OLED marketing materials? Unless they are lying about the supposed 100K hour lifetime of these panels, there is no way you would see that degree of permanent burn-in in such a short time.

This issue needs to be brought to the attention of the larger review outlets like forbes.com, cnet.com, etc. If they put enough pressure on LG like they did for the "HDR Game Mode" debacle, then you may see some results. Don't let them bully you into silence.
Maybe we should write to CNET and the likes.

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post #245 of 3734 Old 05-06-2017, 07:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Vallis View Post
This is LG's latest & probably last reply.



On 04/05/2017 16:36, cic uk wrote:
>
> Dear Mr Vallis,
>
>
>
> I hope you are well.
>
>
>
> Although we cannot be certain of the exact circumstances that caused the screen burn to your T.V and we have no way of knowing whether or not you regularly pause live T.V, we can be certain that the this issue has not been caused by a mechanical or electrical fault and is not the result of a manufacturing defect and therefore is not covered under the LG warranty.
>
>
>
> Any static image that is displayed on the screen for long a period of time can damage the screen, this includes the ‘banner’ or ‘news reel’ that is displayed at the bottom screen when watching any of the 24 hours news channels such as Sky News, BBC News 24 or Sky Sports News.
>
>
>
> Although I sypathise with your situation it is the opinion of the senior management and technical support teams within LG that you as a consumer are responsible for what you view on your T.V and that if your T.V is damaged as a result of the content that is being viewed we as a manufacturer will not rectify such damage under the warranty.
>
> I must stress at this point that your complaint has been escalated to the highest possible levels within LG and their final decision is to decline your request for a replacement T.V, refund or free of charge repair.
>
>
>
> Lastly I know you have run through a lot of diagnostics and troubleshooting with our technical agents but I would strongly advise you to continue to use the clear panel noise feature as this should eventually remove or at least reduce the severity of the screen burn on your T.V.
>
>
>
> Instructions for running clear panel noise
>
>
>
> 1. Press the ‘settings’ button on the remote
>
> 2. Select ‘all settings’
>
> 3. Select ‘Picture’
>
> 4. Select ‘OLED Panel’
>
> 5. Select ‘clear panel noise’
>
> 6. Please note that the clear panel noise function can take several hours to complete.
>
>
>
>
>
> Kind regards
>
>
>
> Richard Ellerbeck
>
> Team leader
>
> LG Resolutions Team
> LG Electronics UK Helpdesk



Have replied to this stating I do not accept this outcome thus shall be starting court proceedings against the supplier for selling an item not fit for purpose
Here in the UK, consumer law states that within the first 6 months you can get a full refund if an item is either faulty or not fit for purpose.
As the retailer never stated restricted viewing I believe it is not fit for purpose.
I still don't understand why LG would think anybody would "live pause" a news channel for any length of time, rather defeats the purpose of news.(live pause on Sky Q only lasts 30 min anyway).
I will let you know when this is resolved.
To all you fellow sufferers out there, good luck & hope yours is also resolved to your satisfaction.
Oh my TV comes back on Sunday so if you need any more pics with different background colors, let me know.
How many hours when this occured?

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post #246 of 3734 Old 05-06-2017, 07:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Exist_To_Resist View Post
What happens if you run the cleaning program?

Also what's that bright yellow spot?

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About to try the cleaning program. The yellow spot is just a light reflection.
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post #247 of 3734 Old 05-06-2017, 10:50 PM
 
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Originally Posted by turnne1 View Post
I have purchased it for a plasma panel...though I have never made a claim on it for that reason
In my experience..Best Buy warranties are almost no questions asked

They do tend do be more expensive though

I would imagine if there is no other way to fix a burned in image other than replacing the panel...then that is what they would have to do

I would also say that if the TV is more than 2-3 years old they will likely just give you a gift card for your original purchase price
I say that because parts dont seem to stay in production long after a TV model is discontinued

Warren
Yeah, the specific language about possible panel replacement is what I'd look to nail down before purchasing such a warranty. Store credit would be a good outcome as well of course, but it's all about how they define the requirements and such. Historically, the majority of my large purchases have been through local independent retailers, so I don't normally follow the goings-on at BB.
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post #248 of 3734 Old 05-07-2017, 04:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paranoyd androyd View Post
Yeah, the specific language about possible panel replacement is what I'd look to nail down before purchasing such a warranty. Store credit would be a good outcome as well of course, but it's all about how they define the requirements and such. Historically, the majority of my large purchases have been through local independent retailers, so I don't normally follow the goings-on at BB.
To my knowledge
The language in other extended warranties tend to mirror the manufacturer warranty...just as Square Trade as an example

Any manufacturer warranty I have seen for plasma or OLED specifically excludes burn in

Warren
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post #249 of 3734 Old 05-07-2017, 07:13 AM
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Originally Posted by Exist_To_Resist View Post
What happens if you run the cleaning program?

Also what's that bright yellow spot?

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Just rand the program, the burn in is still present.
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post #250 of 3734 Old 05-07-2017, 08:23 AM
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Originally Posted by unprocessed View Post
Just rand the program, the burn in is still present.
****, sorry to hear that. How many hours on the set?

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post #251 of 3734 Old 05-07-2017, 09:45 AM
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Originally Posted by Exist_To_Resist View Post
****, sorry to hear that. How many hours on the set?

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I've had it since last September, I really don't watch too much TV, but I apparently watch too much CNN according to LG.
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post #252 of 3734 Old 05-07-2017, 10:07 AM
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Originally Posted by Exist_To_Resist View Post
How many hours when this occured?

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Don't know how many hours, is there anyway of telling?
Probably around 12 hours a day (I'm retired) for the 4 - 5 months I have had it.
1500 - 2000 hrs
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post #253 of 3734 Old 05-07-2017, 10:14 AM
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Originally Posted by Michael Vallis View Post
Don't know how many hours, is there anyway of telling?
Probably around 12 hours a day (I'm retired) for the 4 - 5 months I have had it.
1500 - 2000 hrs
All Settings - General - About This TV - TV Information - Total Power On Time

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post #254 of 3734 Old 05-07-2017, 12:40 PM
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Originally Posted by Exist_To_Resist View Post
All Settings - General - About This TV - TV Information - Total Power On Time

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Does not have Total Power On Time on my TV Information page.
Mines a LGOLED55E6V (UK Spec) so may be different?
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post #255 of 3734 Old 05-07-2017, 02:57 PM
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What a bunch of BS from LG, marketing their OLEDs by dismissing concerns about burn in. How can watching a news or sports channel not be considered "regular use"?

"OLED Image Retention or Burn-In: Burn-in and image retention are possible on virtually any display. However, with an LG OLED TV, any risk of burn-in or image retention have been addressed through the use of technology that not only helps protect against damage to the screen, but features self-healing properties so that any short-term image retention that may occur is quickly rectified. It is rare for an average TV consumer to create an environment that could result in burn-in."

http://www.lg.com/us/experience-tvs/oled-tv/reliability
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post #256 of 3734 Old 05-07-2017, 03:28 PM
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Well that's from the horse's mouth. Keep calling.

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post #257 of 3734 Old 05-07-2017, 04:26 PM
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I'm sensing there is some kind of image-retention and burn-in resistance lottery on thee panels. Maybe the result of contamination and impurities inside the vacuum chamber as discussed in the paper I linked a few pages back.

Right now there is not enough statistical data on this thread to make any solid conclusions on how common this problem actually is.

One of the burn-in afflicted owners needs to start a poll or can we please add one to the top of this thread?

I'm thinking format something like this:

Visible burn-in with 0-1000 hours.
No burn-in with 0-1000 hours.
Visible burn-in with 1000-2000 hours.
No burn-in with 1000-2000 hours.
Visible burn-in with 2000-3000 hours.
No burn-in with 2000-3000 hours.
Visible burn-in with 3000-4000 hours.
No burn-in with 3000-4000 hours.
Visible burn-in with 4000-5000 hours.
No burn-in with 4000-5000 hours.
Visible burn-in with 5000+ hours.
No burn-in with 5000+ hours.


The post should also link to the "orange screen" youtube video and all voters are required to run that test before adding their results. Also include an example of what burn-in looks like from this thread.

Anyone think of a better format?
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post #258 of 3734 Old 05-07-2017, 04:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wizziwig View Post
I'm sensing there is some kind of image-retention and burn-in resistance lottery on thee panels. Maybe the result of contamination and impurities inside the vacuum chamber as discussed in the paper I linked a few pages back.

Right now there is not enough statistical data on this thread to make any solid conclusions on how common this problem actually is.

One of the burn-in afflicted owners needs to start a poll or can we please add one to the top of this thread?

I'm thinking format something like this:

Visible burn-in with 0-1000 hours.
No burn-in with 0-1000 hours.
Visible burn-in with 1000-2000 hours.
No burn-in with 1000-2000 hours.
Visible burn-in with 2000-3000 hours.
No burn-in with 2000-3000 hours.
Visible burn-in with 3000-4000 hours.
No burn-in with 3000-4000 hours.
Visible burn-in with 4000-5000 hours.
No burn-in with 4000-5000 hours.
Visible burn-in with 5000+ hours.
No burn-in with 5000+ hours.


The post should also link to the "orange screen" youtube video and all voters are required to run that test before adding their results. Also include an example of what burn-in looks like from this thread.

Anyone think of a better format?
A shared out Google sheet would probably work best.

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post #259 of 3734 Old 05-07-2017, 05:17 PM
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May also need to add the brand and model.
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Originally Posted by wxman View Post
May also need to add the brand and model.

add oled light setting, contrast and screen shift on or off.



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post #261 of 3734 Old 05-07-2017, 06:22 PM
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Originally Posted by unprocessed View Post
What a bunch of BS from LG, marketing their OLEDs by dismissing concerns about burn in. How can watching a news or sports channel not be considered "regular use"?

"OLED Image Retention or Burn-In: Burn-in and image retention are possible on virtually any display. However, with an LG OLED TV, any risk of burn-in or image retention have been addressed through the use of technology that not only helps protect against damage to the screen, but features self-healing properties so that any short-term image retention that may occur is quickly rectified. It is rare for an average TV consumer to create an environment that could result in burn-in."

http://www.lg.com/us/experience-tvs/oled-tv/reliability
I'll go out on a limb and suggest there may be some defective TVs out there. I would never dream of corrupting my TV with endless hours of brain-numbing "news" from CNN, but I have repeatedly let 3 football games (somewhat brain-numbing, but at least there's no pretense ) play all day (game day) without a lasting trace of any scoreboard graphic on both an EF9500 and a G6.
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post #262 of 3734 Old 05-07-2017, 06:29 PM
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Originally Posted by video_analysis View Post
I'll go out on a limb and suggest there may be some defective TVs out there. I would never dream of corrupting my TV with endless hours of brain-numbing "news" from CNN, but I have repeatedly let 3 football games (somewhat brain-numbing, but at least there's no pretense ) play all day (game day) without a lasting trace of any scoreboard graphic on both an EF9500 and a G6.
I have to agree. I use it as a computer monitor sometimes, and I play a lot video games on this thing haven't witnessed any burn in or screen retention at all. Mind you I only have 350 hours on my set.

Who knows maybe the retention and burn in get worse as the TV ages.

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post #263 of 3734 Old 05-07-2017, 06:35 PM
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The G6 was at 2500 hours when I moved it to a sideroom, and there didn't seem to be any alteration in the IR behavior (but I don't do gaming or watch much in the way of stationary graphics beyond sports).
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post #264 of 3734 Old 05-07-2017, 06:57 PM
 
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Food for thought.

LG release an HDR game patch not too long ago. People complained that it is dimmer than regular mode.

Maybe because they're starting to realise there's burn in potential with high luminosity and static image.
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post #265 of 3734 Old 05-07-2017, 06:58 PM
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Possibly, the first thing I did when I got my tv was turn down the OLED light and Brightness.

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post #266 of 3734 Old 05-07-2017, 07:19 PM
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We need to keep the poll simple initially just to obtain some ballpark numbers. The model and settings are not really relevant during this phase and will just confuse the issue. Based on feedback in this thread, I also don't think they matter. If we see there is a significant portion of owners who can reproduce the BI issues reported here, then we can move on to further diagnosis.

It sounds like everyone who reported burn-in thus far was able to see it on this video?

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post #267 of 3734 Old 05-07-2017, 08:25 PM
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I always did break in on my plasmas, this procedure aged the pixels and helped with IR or Burn in. Never got a BI on my plasmas.

I did a break in on my Oled with the comp cycles.I have 0 BI .
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post #268 of 3734 Old 05-07-2017, 08:33 PM
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Originally Posted by losservatore View Post
I always did break in on my plasmas, this procedure aged the pixels and helped with IR or Burn in. Never got a BI on my plasmas.

I did a break in on my Oled with the comp cycles.I have 0 BI .
Even though they say OLED doesn't have burn in I'm cautious with my TV. All electronics have a burn in period.

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post #269 of 3734 Old 05-07-2017, 09:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Exist_To_Resist View Post
Even though they say OLED doesn't have burn in I'm cautious with my TV. All electronics have a burn in period.

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Do you mean a break in period?
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post #270 of 3734 Old 05-07-2017, 10:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wizziwig View Post
I'm sensing there is some kind of image-retention and burn-in resistance lottery on thee panels. Maybe the result of contamination and impurities inside the vacuum chamber as discussed in the paper I linked a few pages back.

I found the article you linked absolutely fascinating. Sort of reminds me of a paint booth at an vehicle assembly plant. The cleanliness of the booth, equipment, nozzles, and HVAC are all paramount in keeping dust and other particles from landing on the car's body and affecting the finished product. We're still in relative infancy on large, mass-produced OLED displays, so who knows what other QC and fabrication issues are present that we're simply unaware of.

Here's my 65EG9600 with 2000 hours on the clock. This is the living room TV and gets completely abused by news channel banners, static images from paused TV shows and movies, and anything else bad for OLED that you could throw at it. Not a hint of IR or burn-in. I was shocked, because we were glued to both the 2016 presidential election coverage (over many months) as well as the NFL season which, of course, fills the bottom screen with scorecards for hours on end.

I share this because of your comment - that the lottery could also encompass burn-in resistance - in addition to backplane uniformity and the myriad of other things that we've seen as variances across different examples of the same models. My first foray into OLED was buying an open box unit that when viewed at home clearly displayed the demo mode letters "4K OLED" burned into the middle of the screen. It was quickly boxed up and returned for the one below.

The only thing I've done from the start with every OLED set I've owned is use color slides at full brightness/saturation/OLED light for the first 100 hours, turning the TV off every so often to let the comp cycles run. I did this out of force of habit with my old Kuros and ZT60. Whether or not it helped prevent burn-in is unknown, but it's at least a data point. It certainly has not helped the vignetting on my 65E6es, but that seems to be a different component of the panel lottery that color slides don't help remedy.

Regarding the UK owner who's been denied warranty service by LG, I would contact my credit card company and look into whatever consumer protection that card offers. Most channels have some sort of banner, station identification logo or other static image that is completely unavoidable and that LG has come to the conclusion that it's not their responsibility is absolutely insane. I'd also ring every social media bell in the tower to raise awareness of this, provided of course that the burn-in occurred within reasonable use of the set.
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Reply OLED Technology and Flat Panels General

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blacks , burn in , burn-in , lg oled , lg tv , lg-tv , oled , plasma

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