Sony A1E Calibration Thread - Page 29 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #841 of 1142 Old 07-21-2018, 06:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AdamAttewell View Post
I thought WOLED's were vertually impossible to calibrate in HDR mode?


That is the info Ted gave me: ...
Ted always has great info, had never thought about how the white subpixel affects HDR calibration. Makes sense why HDR seems to look better on LCD. For me the amount of HDR viewed at this point is 1% or less of what I watch so no biggie, I still think it looks great though. And I'm again glad I got the Sony OLED over LG for how Sony handles HDR calibration extrapolated from SDR calibration, as we now know you can't really accurately calibrate HDR on a (W)OLED.
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post #842 of 1142 Old 07-26-2018, 12:50 PM
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I may be able to borrow a friends i1 Display Pro - i watch most of my movies using Kodi/Plex/MadVR. I should be able to calibrate, and then use 3D LUT for MadVR for even better results?

I'm not sure what 3D LUT can do, does it just add a vast number of "points" to calibration? Or can it actually correct panel uniformity? Say top right of the A1E shifts towards red more so than the middle left - can 3D LUT correct that area/pixels?

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post #843 of 1142 Old 07-26-2018, 12:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jerrolds View Post
I may be able to borrow a friends i1 Display Pro - i watch most of my movies using Kodi/Plex/MadVR. I should be able to calibrate, and then use 3D LUT for MadVR for even better results?

I'm not sure what 3D LUT can do, does it just add a vast number of "points" to calibration? Or can it actually correct panel uniformity? Say top right of the A1E shifts towards red more so than the middle left - can 3D LUT correct that area/pixels?
3D LUTs deal with calibrarion. It can not correct panel defects.
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post #844 of 1142 Old 07-26-2018, 01:13 PM
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Originally Posted by D-Nice View Post
3D LUTs deal with calibrarion. It can not correct panel defects.
Cool - would it effectively make the Sony A1E comparable to a 2018 LG w/ Calman 3D LUT - if using madvr to play movies?

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post #845 of 1142 Old 07-26-2018, 01:20 PM
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Originally Posted by jerrolds View Post
Cool - would it effectively make the Sony A1E comparable to a 2018 LG w/ Calman 3D LUT - if using madvr to play movies?
CalMAN has issues right now so you will need to use alternative LUT creation software. Once you do that it will be superior to the LG/CalMAN combo.
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post #846 of 1142 Old 07-27-2018, 06:35 AM
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Originally Posted by D-Nice View Post
CalMAN has issues right now so you will need to use alternative LUT creation software. Once you do that it will be superior to the LG/CalMAN combo.
What is wrong with CALMAN?

Theater: Sony A1E OLED 4K Ultra HD, Oppo-205, Anthem AVM60, 7.1.4 B & W CM 7 LR,CDM-cse, CM 1, CM 1 S2, Silverline minuet , SVS SB13 Ultra, Rotel RMB 1555, Parasound A23, Naim NAP 100, EEcolor lut box. Calman, MobileForge, I1D3 & I1pro 2.
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post #847 of 1142 Old 07-27-2018, 06:17 PM
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What is wrong with CALMAN?
Visit the calibration forum and join the discussion.
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post #848 of 1142 Old 07-28-2018, 10:03 AM
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Hi everybody, I am trying to calibrate the Sony Oled 65A1E using X-Rite EyeOnePro (spectrophotometer), Rev D, and HCFR.


I started calibrating SDR content using AVSHD patterns on a blu-ray disc (using Panasonic UB820 UHD Player).


1) My first doubt is about HCFR settings on Advanced menu>Preferences>References: Which standard shoud I use? And in 'Gamma calculation' what's the right option (Display Gamma black compensation or BT.1886?
In Advanced menu>Preferences>Advanced Tab what should I set in Delta E Highlight?
2) I tried to calibrate using Display Gamma Black compensation option and flagged Override black with 0 value in the box. Color space UHDTV Rec2020/Rec709. Grey scale was easily calibrated using CinemaPRO profile and Expert 1 in TV, with a few clicks in offset/gain controls. About Gamma, I keep Gamma setting on TV at 0 and used 10pt color settings to adjust gamma (using green to raise or lower luminance Y). Gamma is perfectly at 2.2.
About colors, in absence of CMS there's not too much to do. I keep color setting at 53 and red luminance is around 21% of white luminance.
3) Another doubt is about the use of Peak luminance control on TV (previously called Xtended Dynamic Range). I like to set it on Medium. With brightness control at 30 and contrast at 95 i read 90nits on a white 100% full screen field, while in a 10% window (100% white) i read around 170nits. Is this right or wrong? Should I calibrate with Peak Luminance control off, and put it on medium after calibration?


Bigger problems came when I tried to calibrate HDR content using Masciola's patterns on a USB drive:


1)First of all I don't know what are the correct HCFR settings in Preferences EOTF(HDR) menu and in color space.
2) Gray scale wasn't as good as the one I calibrated in SDR mode, but if I change white balance here it affects SDR too. HDR and SDR share the same color and white balance settings. How can I fix it?
3) Gamma is totally far from reference and the charts (gamma and luminance) are unreadable.

Can you please give some advices?? I am quite a newbie in calibration. In the past I calibrated only my projector in Rec709 and never had those kind of issues.
Thnaks for Your assistance.

Last edited by Giak; 07-28-2018 at 10:07 AM.
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post #849 of 1142 Old 07-31-2018, 04:09 PM
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So i just picked up an i1 display pro - should i be using i1 profiler? I quickly ran thru it and i didnt get those cool pre/post calibrations graphs that I see on various sites

Is that with CALMAN or something else?

TV: 65" Sony OLED XBR65A1E Speakers: KEF LS50 LCR Front Stage Subs: SVS PB2000 & PB1000 [B] AVR: Denon X3300W DSP: Dirac Live Full Suite
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post #850 of 1142 Old 08-01-2018, 07:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jerrolds View Post
So i just picked up an i1 display pro - should i be using i1 profiler? I quickly ran thru it and i didnt get those cool pre/post calibrations graphs that I see on various sites

Is that with CALMAN or something else?
Yes, CALMAN

Theater: Sony A1E OLED 4K Ultra HD, Oppo-205, Anthem AVM60, 7.1.4 B & W CM 7 LR,CDM-cse, CM 1, CM 1 S2, Silverline minuet , SVS SB13 Ultra, Rotel RMB 1555, Parasound A23, Naim NAP 100, EEcolor lut box. Calman, MobileForge, I1D3 & I1pro 2.
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post #851 of 1142 Old 08-02-2018, 01:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Giak View Post
Hi everybody, I am trying to calibrate the Sony Oled 65A1E using X-Rite EyeOnePro (spectrophotometer), Rev D, and HCFR.


I started calibrating SDR content using AVSHD patterns on a blu-ray disc (using Panasonic UB820 UHD Player).


1) My first doubt is about HCFR settings on Advanced menu>Preferences>References: Which standard shoud I use? And in 'Gamma calculation' what's the right option (Display Gamma black compensation or BT.1886?
In Advanced menu>Preferences>Advanced Tab what should I set in Delta E Highlight?
2) I tried to calibrate using Display Gamma Black compensation option and flagged Override black with 0 value in the box. Color space UHDTV Rec2020/Rec709. Grey scale was easily calibrated using CinemaPRO profile and Expert 1 in TV, with a few clicks in offset/gain controls. About Gamma, I keep Gamma setting on TV at 0 and used 10pt color settings to adjust gamma (using green to raise or lower luminance Y). Gamma is perfectly at 2.2.
About colors, in absence of CMS there's not too much to do. I keep color setting at 53 and red luminance is around 21% of white luminance.
3) Another doubt is about the use of Peak luminance control on TV (previously called Xtended Dynamic Range). I like to set it on Medium. With brightness control at 30 and contrast at 95 i read 90nits on a white 100% full screen field, while in a 10% window (100% white) i read around 170nits. Is this right or wrong? Should I calibrate with Peak Luminance control off, and put it on medium after calibration?


Bigger problems came when I tried to calibrate HDR content using Masciola's patterns on a USB drive:


1)First of all I don't know what are the correct HCFR settings in Preferences EOTF(HDR) menu and in color space.
2) Gray scale wasn't as good as the one I calibrated in SDR mode, but if I change white balance here it affects SDR too. HDR and SDR share the same color and white balance settings. How can I fix it?
3) Gamma is totally far from reference and the charts (gamma and luminance) are unreadable.

Can you please give some advices?? I am quite a newbie in calibration. In the past I calibrated only my projector in Rec709 and never had those kind of issues.
Thnaks for Your assistance.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Giak View Post
Hi everybody, I am trying to calibrate the Sony Oled 65A1E using X-Rite EyeOnePro (spectrophotometer), Rev D, and HCFR.


I started calibrating SDR content using AVSHD patterns on a blu-ray disc (using Panasonic UB820 UHD Player).


1) My first doubt is about HCFR settings on Advanced menu>Preferences>References: Which standard shoud I use? And in 'Gamma calculation' what's the right option (Display Gamma black compensation or BT.1886?
In Advanced menu>Preferences>Advanced Tab what should I set in Delta E Highlight?
2) I tried to calibrate using Display Gamma Black compensation option and flagged Override black with 0 value in the box. Color space UHDTV Rec2020/Rec709. Grey scale was easily calibrated using CinemaPRO profile and Expert 1 in TV, with a few clicks in offset/gain controls. About Gamma, I keep Gamma setting on TV at 0 and used 10pt color settings to adjust gamma (using green to raise or lower luminance Y). Gamma is perfectly at 2.2.
About colors, in absence of CMS there's not too much to do. I keep color setting at 53 and red luminance is around 21% of white luminance.
3) Another doubt is about the use of Peak luminance control on TV (previously called Xtended Dynamic Range). I like to set it on Medium. With brightness control at 30 and contrast at 95 i read 90nits on a white 100% full screen field, while in a 10% window (100% white) i read around 170nits. Is this right or wrong? Should I calibrate with Peak Luminance control off, and put it on medium after calibration?


Bigger problems came when I tried to calibrate HDR content using Masciola's patterns on a USB drive:


1)First of all I don't know what are the correct HCFR settings in Preferences EOTF(HDR) menu and in color space.
2) Gray scale wasn't as good as the one I calibrated in SDR mode, but if I change white balance here it affects SDR too. HDR and SDR share the same color and white balance settings. How can I fix it?
3) Gamma is totally far from reference and the charts (gamma and luminance) are unreadable.

Can you please give some advices?? I am quite a newbie in calibration. In the past I calibrated only my projector in Rec709 and never had those kind of issues.
Thnaks for Your assistance.
Hi Giak.

I can't answer all your questions I'm afraid but can give you some help at least.

1) You can leave these on their default settings. The gamma option just affects how the target gamma is shown in the gamma view function. You already know what your target is, so no need to see a curve to aim for. You can also leave the dE on the default. It comes down to preference, so you might want to read up on how each one calculates the amount of error.

2) You haven't asked any questions here. Seems fine. But I would be wary of adjusting the global colour function unless you are absolutely positive you are getting better results. Running the Colour Checker function is useful if you have the test patterns. HCFR has many variations of Colour Checker targets.

3) I use Xtended Dynamic Range at medium, brightness at 20 and contrast at 90, using a 7.5% window. I'm positive there is no ABL taking place. Sounds like you are also doing the right thing but I can't say for certain if you are avoiding ABL as your settings are brighter than mine.

HDR - It's been mentioned in this thread that the TV does a great job of mapping the SDR settings into HDR. So your adjusted SDR settings will have a direct affect on HDR. It's been mentioned that's it's arguable as to whether there is much merit in doing HDR calibration due to the accuracy of this mapping. However, if you do wish to calibrate HDR you will need to use a different picture mode / white balance mode and select it manually every time you want to view HDR content. As an example, you calibrate SDR is Cinema Pro / Expert 1. And for HDR, you calibrate in Custom / Expert 2.

Sorry I couldn't answer all your questions but I hope this helps.
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post #852 of 1142 Old 08-02-2018, 02:01 PM
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Giak - important! Do not adjust the bias values in the 2pt white balance menu. It can have an abnormal affect on the picture quality. Suggest you use the gain values to perfect 80% IRE and use the 10pt controls for everything else.
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post #853 of 1142 Old 08-03-2018, 08:59 AM
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Whats everyone use to calibrate their display? Spectracal, DisplayCal or i1 Profiler? The cheapest SpectraCal is the RGB at $199USD


As far as i can tell neither i1 profiler or display cal have those cool pre/post calibration reporting

TV: 65" Sony OLED XBR65A1E Speakers: KEF LS50 LCR Front Stage Subs: SVS PB2000 & PB1000 [B] AVR: Denon X3300W DSP: Dirac Live Full Suite
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post #854 of 1142 Old 08-03-2018, 09:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jerrolds View Post
Whats everyone use to calibrate their display? Spectracal, DisplayCal or i1 Profiler? The cheapest SpectraCal is the RGB at $199USD





As far as i can tell neither i1 profiler or display cal have those cool pre/post calibration reporting


Use hcfr it’s free and has a lot of functionality . Not as sophisticated graphics wise but does a nice job. I like Calman but it is expensive .


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post #855 of 1142 Old 08-03-2018, 02:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jerrolds View Post
Whats everyone use to calibrate their display? Spectracal, DisplayCal or i1 Profiler? The cheapest SpectraCal is the RGB at $199USD


As far as i can tell neither i1 profiler or display cal have those cool pre/post calibration reporting
I recommend CALMAN.
It is easy to use, reliable, and produces Nice output.
Since you have expensive display, you might as well enjoy the process, and a little investment is worth it.

E

Theater: Sony A1E OLED 4K Ultra HD, Oppo-205, Anthem AVM60, 7.1.4 B & W CM 7 LR,CDM-cse, CM 1, CM 1 S2, Silverline minuet , SVS SB13 Ultra, Rotel RMB 1555, Parasound A23, Naim NAP 100, EEcolor lut box. Calman, MobileForge, I1D3 & I1pro 2.
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post #856 of 1142 Old 08-03-2018, 02:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eganz1 View Post
I recommend CALMAN.
It is easy to use, reliable, and produces Nice output.
Since you have expensive display, you might as well enjoy the process, and a little investment is worth it.

E

Is RGB the minimum to calibrate this set?

TV: 65" Sony OLED XBR65A1E Speakers: KEF LS50 LCR Front Stage Subs: SVS PB2000 & PB1000 [B] AVR: Denon X3300W DSP: Dirac Live Full Suite
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post #857 of 1142 Old 08-03-2018, 02:35 PM
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Originally Posted by chunon View Post
Use hcfr it’s free and has a lot of functionality . Not as sophisticated graphics wise but does a nice job. I like Calman but it is expensive .


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I recommend this first.
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post #858 of 1142 Old 08-08-2018, 11:35 AM
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Just started watching Ozark on Netflix which is in Dolby Vision & half way through I realized what Dolby Vision has its own picture mode.


I played around with it before my calibration & adjusted some settings, I have cloned all the settings I have in the Cinema Pro picture preset in SDR other than Peak Luminance setting which is set to high.


The only control I am unsure of is brightness. Do I just set this to the same point as what I have it set for SDR?



I know that the A1 uses a matrix from the SDR settings to set up the HDR picture modes so I am unsure if I dont set this correctly it will screw things up.


Also in a dark room having Peak Luminance set to high is a little too bright on some highlights. Can I drop this down to medium or will this effect the matrix again?
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post #859 of 1142 Old 08-09-2018, 06:19 AM - Thread Starter
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^^^
If you have a calibrated SDR PM like Cinema pro all you need to do is select either Expert 1 or 2, which ever was calibrated and use that setting for DV. Once done, it should work perfectly.

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Last edited by jrref; 08-09-2018 at 07:04 AM.
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post #860 of 1142 Old 08-09-2018, 06:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jrref View Post
^^^
If you have a calibrated SDR PM like Cinema pro all you need to do is select either Expert 1 or 2, which ever was calibrated and use that setting for DV. You also want to change the color gamut to Warm2, the same that was calibrated for SDR. Once done, it should work perfectly.
I'm confused, use Expert 1/2 or Warm2 for DV? I never calibrated Warm2, use 1 for Cinema Pro and 2 for Custom (bright).

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post #861 of 1142 Old 08-09-2018, 07:03 AM - Thread Starter
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OK so use Expert2, the bright mode for DV. Calibrated expert 1 or 2 will work but I find the Bright calibration mode looks slightly better. Sorry for the confusion.
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post #862 of 1142 Old 08-09-2018, 11:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AdamAttewell View Post
Just started watching Ozark on Netflix which is in Dolby Vision & half way through I realized what Dolby Vision has its own picture mode.


I played around with it before my calibration & adjusted some settings, I have cloned all the settings I have in the Cinema Pro picture preset in SDR other than Peak Luminance setting which is set to high.


The only control I am unsure of is brightness. Do I just set this to the same point as what I have it set for SDR?



I know that the A1 uses a matrix from the SDR settings to set up the HDR picture modes so I am unsure if I dont set this correctly it will screw things up.


Also in a dark room having Peak Luminance set to high is a little too bright on some highlights. Can I drop this down to medium or will this effect the matrix again?
I don't think the conversion process incorporates brightness. With HDR, I suggest maxing out contrast and brightness.
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post #863 of 1142 Old 08-10-2018, 03:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jrref View Post
^^^
If you have a calibrated SDR PM like Cinema pro all you need to do is select either Expert 1 or 2, which ever was calibrated and use that setting for DV. Once done, it should work perfectly.



I have selected Expert 1 which is what I used for my SDR night calibration but what about brightness & contrast? Do I copy the settings I used for the SDR night calibration?
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post #864 of 1142 Old 08-10-2018, 03:04 PM
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Originally Posted by Toadus View Post
I don't think the conversion process incorporates brightness. With HDR, I suggest maxing out contrast and brightness.

What do you set Peak Luminance at for night viewing?
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post #865 of 1142 Old 08-10-2018, 03:22 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AdamAttewell View Post
I have selected Expert 1 which is what I used for my SDR night calibration but what about brightness & contrast? Do I copy the settings I used for the SDR night calibration?
For DV leave everything at default and just select Expert 1 or 2, which ever was calibrated. Same for HDR.

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post #866 of 1142 Old 08-10-2018, 04:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AdamAttewell View Post
What do you set Peak Luminance at for night viewing?
For HDR? High! Max contrast and max brightness.

For SDR I used Peak Luminance Medium, contrast 90 and brightness 20 for calibration.
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post #867 of 1142 Old 08-12-2018, 07:08 AM
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I was looking at the service menu today as I was curious how many hours were on the panel, it hadn't done a long refresh yet, and in the audio/video section I noticed it has a WB submenu with gain/offset, all values were set at 512. Anyone know anything about this section?

Sony 65A1E
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post #868 of 1142 Old 08-12-2018, 03:31 PM
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Originally Posted by jrref View Post
For DV leave everything at default and just select Expert 1 or 2, which ever was calibrated. Same for HDR.



I see, problem is I have adjusted the values from default.



If I use the "Return all picture settings to factory default" option does this just reset the currently selected picture mode or return every picture mode associated to every input to factory default?


If the latter is the case does anyone know what the factory default settings are for the HDR/DV picture modes?
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post #869 of 1142 Old 08-15-2018, 01:50 PM
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Originally Posted by AdamAttewell View Post
I see, problem is I have adjusted the values from default.



If I use the "Return all picture settings to factory default" option does this just reset the currently selected picture mode or return every picture mode associated to every input to factory default?


If the latter is the case does anyone know what the factory default settings are for the HDR/DV picture modes?
It doesn't matter Adam. All that's important is that you use your adjusted 2pt WB cuts and gains and also select the colour temp mode (expert 1 or 2) which you adjusted for calibration. If you're not too sure about stuff drop me a PM.
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post #870 of 1142 Old 08-15-2018, 04:46 PM
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Originally Posted by Toadus View Post
It doesn't matter Adam. All that's important is that you use your adjusted 2pt WB cuts and gains and also select the colour temp mode (expert 1 or 2) which you adjusted for calibration. If you're not too sure about stuff drop me a PM.
Never touch the RGB Bias control on these Sonys. Doing so will impact black levels and color 1-5% stimuli on the grayscale.
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