Rtings OLED Burn-In Tests...Updated - Page 30 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #871 of 987 Old 12-03-2018, 06:38 PM
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Originally Posted by TravisPNW View Post
I gotta ask though... how did you burn in your panel in a few weeks? DVR CNN and pause it on screen for days on end?
For investment purposes really, CNBC and Bloomberg mostly. It needs to be left on while I do my work. Channel flipping frequently and at any time it's used to simply watch tv. I don't game.
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post #872 of 987 Old 12-03-2018, 06:46 PM
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For investment purposes really, CNBC and Bloomberg mostly. It needs to be left on while I do my work. Channel flipping frequently and at any time it's used to simply watch tv. I don't game.
Man that sucks.

Not to pour salt in the wound but I'd never recommend OLED for any type of long term news channel viewing. It'd be like buying a Ferrari as a grocery getter... you get a Prius (LCD) for that.

OLED is a gorgeous home theater display. 100% fact. It's still emissive and still risky to watch news channels. I don't do it other than a few hours in November every 2/4 years.
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post #873 of 987 Old 12-03-2018, 06:52 PM
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Man that sucks.

Not to pour salt in the wound but I'd never recommend OLED for any type of long term news channel viewing. It'd be like buying a Ferrari as a grocery getter... you get a Prius (LCD) for that.

OLED is a gorgeous home theater display. 100% fact. It's still emissive and still risky to watch news channels. I don't do it other than a few hours in November every 2/4 years.
Yeah but LG doesn't tell people that. They claim it's impossible to burn it under normal use, and for me it's normal use.
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post #874 of 987 Old 12-03-2018, 06:57 PM
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Yeah but LG doesn't tell people that. They claim it's impossible to burn it under normal use, and for me it's normal use.
"For me it's normal use" is kind of an oxymoron.
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post #875 of 987 Old 12-03-2018, 07:03 PM
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"For me it's normal use" is kind of an oxymoron.
You're right. 'I use it normally!'
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post #876 of 987 Old 12-03-2018, 07:30 PM
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Yeah but LG doesn't tell people that. They claim it's impossible to burn it under normal use, and for me it's normal use.

Yeah I hear ya. Still sucks. That's why I did my research prior to purchase. Of course LG is gonna tell me that their panel is a risk free purchase. If they told me about all the risks QLEDs would probably get a lot more sales. I did my research on those too... and glorified LCD wasn't what I was interested in even if it was BI risk free. I wanted the best PQ available.


I may not be the only one... saw something today about OLED outselling QLED 2 to 1. Keep taking risks people. It's worth it.

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post #877 of 987 Old 12-03-2018, 07:35 PM
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I'm not really pissed, I'm just stating my experience and it's really easy to burn in these displays.
Not really. But YMMV.
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post #878 of 987 Old 12-03-2018, 07:42 PM
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Not really. But YMMV.
You make me vomit? I had to look that up - mileage varies. Dang. Oh well. I'm reading up on microled. Sounds like OLED will be gone like plasma.
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post #879 of 987 Old 12-03-2018, 07:48 PM
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You make me vomit? I had to look that up - mileage varies. Dang. Oh well. I'm reading up on microled. Sounds like OLED will be gone like plasma.
I had never thought that about "YMMV." At least you found the correct interpretation. It will be awhile before microled hits the mainstream. There's always something better on the horizon. Myself, I'm waiting for hologram displays or an affordable Holodeck In the mean time I'm enjoying the hell out of my OLED, worry free.
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post #880 of 987 Old 12-03-2018, 07:50 PM
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I had never thought that about "YMMV." At least you found the correct interpretation. It will be awhile before microled hits the mainstream. There's always something better on the horizon. Myself, I'm waiting for hologram displays or an affordable Holodeck In the mean time I'm enjoying the hell out of my OLED, worry free.
I'm sure it's available somewhere. I know CSI Miami has it. I guess taxpayers in Miami are getting hit hard.
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post #881 of 987 Old 12-03-2018, 09:01 PM
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You make me vomit? I had to look that up - mileage varies.
LOL! I had never thought that there could be another interpretation of that acronym. This might make me more careful about using it with someone who might not be familiar with internet lingo.

Thanks for a good chuckle.
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post #882 of 987 Old 12-04-2018, 03:07 AM
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You make me vomit? I had to look that up - mileage varies. Dang. Oh well. I'm reading up on microled. Sounds like OLED will be gone like plasma.
Man, you made me laugh! Thank you.

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post #883 of 987 Old 12-04-2018, 03:34 AM
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Originally Posted by fafrd View Post
Let's please just stop that game of wack-a-mole before it even gets started. There is not the smallest shred of evidence that burn-in is the result of (or at all related to) WOLED panel variance or defectiveness.

You (and I, and most of us) escaped the 'inevitable' because we don't watch thousands
of hours of CNN in our OLED TVs.

Those that do are doomed to burn the CNN logo into their WOLEDs - for those poor souls, it is inevitable (good thing there are vanishingly few of them).

My brother admiring my 65C6P over Thanksgiving and asking my advice for a new TV. His wife leaves the TV on CNN pretty much all day long. I told him to stick to LED/LCD unless he plans to buy his wife a second TV .

(I trust it's understood that my above statements refer to CNN or any similar static/logo content).
Maybe not but Im going by some of the reports from people that claimed to have suffered BI from very normal use cases as in use cases that should never cause BI. Now, I suspect some of them are just lying to suport their position. But if a few did get BI out of "nowhere" then couldnt that point to that specific panel itself being more prone to it? Just a thought.
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post #884 of 987 Old 12-04-2018, 03:39 AM
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Originally Posted by TravisPNW View Post
Same here.

I do want to thank those who have written the full page analysis on BI/IR. I don't watch CNN or any other news station other than maybe a few hours of election coverage every 2/4 years so I feel safe in going back to what I've been doing the last 10 months and that is enjoying the hell out of my OLED... just as much on day 300 as I did on day 1. (Probably more in fact because it's calibrated)

I just don't have the time to sit back stressing over how degraded my pixels might be in 5 years and I refuse to do so.

Happy OLEDing everyone!
Amen - best PQ ever.

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About the first statement, it's really really easy, not 'hard' as they claim. Regarding the second statement, I see you mention OLED is not for me, but I don't see anywhere in LG's claims that I should buy a Samsung LCD. They're claiming it's the best technology for all. I know the first two years like you, I thought image retention and burn-in is impossible, but after a few weeks of watching the news it burned in.

I'm not really pissed, I'm just stating my experience and it's really easy to burn in these displays.
I dont think this is true. If it were then would we ALL have BI? The fact remains that the vast majority of OLED owners do NOT have BI. So, your statement doesnt work, IMO.
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post #885 of 987 Old 12-04-2018, 04:13 AM
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I've read a lot about OLED burn-in issues. It's clear that they exist and that for some use cases that exacerbate the issue it can be a big deal. The same was true with plasma, though I don't know whether plasma or OLED is more susceptible.

Back around 2004 or so, I helped my mom pick out a high-end, well-regarded Pioneer plasma panel. She liked to leave it on CNN for background noise while she puttered around the house during the day. She passed away ~5 years later, and I inherited the TV. When I first set it up in my house, I could see some moderate burn-in on the lower portion of the screen where the crawl and the logo were always on. Over time, the burn-in faded away and was unnoticeable. (Not implying that OLED burn-in is reversible, btw; just illustrating that my usage habits are such that burn-in is not a big risk for me.)

That plasma TV was my first (and only, until just now) flat-panel TV, and it remained my primary screen until just yesterday, when my Black Friday OLED purchase arrived. That's ~15 years of "primary use", which is longer than any other TV I've ever owned.

When LCD/LED took over from plasma as the dominant (and for several years, only) TV technology, I felt like it was akin to the VHS/Betamax or other tech wars where the "better" technology lost out. OLED is still "young" enough that I may grow to regret my decision (either because we learn that this technology has flaws that emerge over time or that it is rapidly eclipsed by something better), but for now, I'm excited to have the choice of an emissive display technology again, and based on my past experience with a "burn-in risky" technology, I'm pretty confident that my viewing habits will mitigate that risk.

As others have said...YMMV.

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post #886 of 987 Old 12-04-2018, 04:52 AM
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When LCD/LED took over from plasma as the dominant (and for several years, only) TV technology, I felt like it was akin to the VHS/Betamax or other tech wars where the "better" technology lost out.
While I agree with you on which tech was better, as far as I know plasma has never been the dominant TV technology on the market. LCD took over from CRT and has remained dominant to this day. If we start segmenting market we might have a different picture, maybe plasma was dominant in hi-end? I don't know. OLEDs are, if I'm not mistaken.

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post #887 of 987 Old 12-04-2018, 07:00 AM
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While I agree with you on which tech was better, as far as I know plasma has never been the dominant TV technology on the market. LCD took over from CRT and has remained dominant to this day. If we start segmenting market we might have a different picture, maybe plasma was dominant in hi-end? I don't know. OLEDs are, if I'm not mistaken.
Hah--okay, good point. It made sense in my mind (plasma was the best picture you could buy, and then when it went the way of the dodo, LCD/LED was the only game in town and thus the best TVs were LCD/LED). "Dominant" was a poor word choice.
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post #888 of 987 Old 12-05-2018, 04:03 AM
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Hah--okay, good point. It made sense in my mind (plasma was the best picture you could buy, and then when it went the way of the dodo, LCD/LED was the only game in town and thus the best TVs were LCD/LED). "Dominant" was a poor word choice.
Yeah, "dominant" has to be taken into context. It was the ONLY tech available for quite some time. Its like feeling good about winning a drag race against another car that didnt show up or never existed. Its like...."great, you win". Meh.

Now that we have OLED there is firm competition at least in the 55" and up segment and thats good for the consumer. Im not married to OLED tech either. If they create something else or can make LCDs viable through new tech then Ill be the first in line to upgrade. Until then? OLED is king.
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post #889 of 987 Old 12-08-2018, 02:14 AM
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^I would never have a one-night stand with LCD.
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post #890 of 987 Old 12-08-2018, 10:27 AM
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^I would never have a one-night stand with LCD.
Lol...good response. I disagree of course...but...love the response.

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post #891 of 987 Old 12-08-2018, 02:47 PM
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I may be forced to develop a deeper relationship on the next go around (if there is one), or just get a projector.
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post #892 of 987 Old 12-09-2018, 05:42 AM
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I may be forced to develop a deeper relationship on the next go around (if there is one), or just get a projector.
Right? Or, I’ll forego some PQ and slap an 85” Sony 900F on the living room wall. I know, blasphemy....an LCD as my main viewing TV? Huh?


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post #893 of 987 Old 12-09-2018, 05:57 AM
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Right? Or, I’ll Gregory some PQ and slap an 85” Sony 900F on the living room wall. I know, blasphemy....an LCD as my main viewing TV? Huh?

Well size does matter. But if it's not 3D, who cares
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post #894 of 987 Old 12-10-2018, 03:50 PM
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Question on defeating burn-in

Long time listener, first time poster....at least since I got my Pioneer Plasma 10 years ago - looking to get an OLED finally.

At this point these things aren't just monitors or smart TV's, they are basically computers.

Has anyone tried writing a program to remove the TV logos from the picture and replacing them with whatever color is surrounding them? I know this may not work for other static images - sports or HUD in FPS gaming, but I would think in 2018 something could at least be done for the network logo bugs that darken our sets at every channel.

Just think there must be a better technical solution this day and age than 1. turning the brightness down, and 2. avoiding certain content.


We had these same discussions, right here, about plasma burn-in, and how there was some great conspiracy, or it was over-blown, or LCD's were the s*** and anyone who got plasma was an idiot, or LCD's were s*** and anyone who got one was an idiot.


Fact was, burn-in was real, but could be managed - my 14 year old panasonic shows some, the pioneer does not because I turned the brightness down right when I bought it.

I'm not so concerned with the issue that I would avoid OLED, or even change what I watch - just would adjust settings accordingly and then live with the consequences.

But I do understand why others are concerned. If I buy a nice TV once every ten years, I'd prefer it not go to crap in two as well.
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post #895 of 987 Old 12-10-2018, 04:23 PM
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For investment purposes really, CNBC and Bloomberg mostly. It needs to be left on while I do my work. Channel flipping frequently and at any time it's used to simply watch tv. I don't game.
Can you turn the screen off and listen only for your work? I do that when listening to CNN.

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post #896 of 987 Old 12-10-2018, 04:27 PM
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Can you turn the screen off and listen only for your work? I do that when listening to CNN.
Yes. We have one cable box so it's not ideal. There's also the option of streaming the phone. All a little too late though.
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post #897 of 987 Old 12-10-2018, 08:47 PM
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Is there some danger of burn-in when watching letterbox movies? I just don't understand till the end after test.
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post #898 of 987 Old 12-11-2018, 05:00 AM
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Is there some danger of burn-in when watching letterbox movies? I just don't understand till the end after test.
OLED uses minimum power to make blacks and maximum power to make whites, LED is the opposite. Thus, the dark area is essentially unused, and the movie portion of the screen is under normal use if you use normal brightness. So, it's the same with a bright logo, if you watch letterbox 24/7 maybe a rectangle would form. If you watch 2 letter box movies a week with normal settings then it is highly unlikely; using my C7 with 4500 hours as an example.
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post #899 of 987 Old 12-11-2018, 09:23 AM
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OLED uses minimum power to make blacks and maximum power to make whites,
This is correct.

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LED is the opposite.
But this is not (LED, meaning LED/LCD, uses the same power regardless of how 'on' on LCD pixel is - power consumption is domnated by the backlight. Without any backlight dimming, power consumption is essentially independant of image brightness. Once dimming comes into play, darkened dimming zones consume less power than bright dimming zones (similar to OLED and independant of how 'ON' or 'OFF' the LCD pixels are...

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Thus, the dark area is essentially unused, and the movie portion of the screen is under normal use if you use normal brightness. So, it's the same with a bright logo, if you watch letterbox 24/7 maybe a rectangle would form. If you watch 2 letter box movies a week with normal settings then it is highly unlikely; using my C7 with 4500 hours as an example.
This is all essentially correct - you only need to be concerned about burn-in of letterbox bars if displaying a bright fukly-saturated yellow/orange/red rectangle in the center of the screen for hundreds of cumulative hours.

There is no aging at all in the blackened letterbox areas and as this post here (https://www.avsforum.com/forum/40-ol...l#post57250866) shows, the movie/display area will also have basically no aging over 8000 hours with peak brightness set at 170cd/m2 (rtings.com 2016 burn-in test results) as long as it is displaying truly random movie content.

The long and short of it is that you can watch thousands of hours of letterbox movies on these WOLEDs without needing to worry about the letterbox bars becoming noticably brighter than the central viewing area of the screen (as you have confirmed with your C7 experience).
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post #900 of 987 Old 12-13-2018, 06:12 PM
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This is all essentially correct - you only need to be concerned about burn-in of letterbox bars if displaying a bright fukly-saturated yellow/orange/red rectangle in the center of the screen for hundreds of cumulative hours.

There is no aging at all in the blackened letterbox areas and as this post here (https://www.avsforum.com/forum/40-ol...l#post57250866) shows, the movie/display area will also have basically no aging over 8000 hours with peak brightness set at 170cd/m2 (rtings.com 2016 burn-in test results) as long as it is displaying truly random movie content.

The long and short of it is that you can watch thousands of hours of letterbox movies on these WOLEDs without needing to worry about the letterbox bars becoming noticably brighter than the central viewing area of the screen (as you have confirmed with your C7 experience).
Thanks buddy, that's really nice to know, was worried a little about this.
have a Sony A8F OLED. How to set peak brightness at 170cd/m2 on this TV?

Sony 55A8F OLED TV, Sony X900E LCD TV, Yamaha RX-A3050 reciever, Epson 5300 1080p projector, SVS Ultra Tower Surround Sound 7.1.2 system, SVS PB2000 Subwoofer, SVS SB1000 Subwoofer, Marantz UD7007 Universal Disc Player, LG UP970 UHD Player, Braun 16:9 projector screen.
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