2017 LG OLED Master Information Thread - Page 3 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #61 of 150 Old 11-26-2017, 07:26 AM
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nice...
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post #62 of 150 Old 11-27-2017, 12:56 PM
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LG Screen / Sony AE1 Screen

I’ve read multiple times that there are LG’s with very comparable screen technology and excellence as the Sony AE1. I would like to know the applicable LG models especially given they are supposedly much less expensive. Size - 65”.

Thank you.

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post #63 of 150 Old 11-27-2017, 06:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sonoftumble View Post
Youtube HDR is fixed - among other things.
What other things are fixed?
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post #64 of 150 Old 11-27-2017, 06:48 PM
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Originally Posted by sonoftumble View Post
I got tired of waiting for the update to become available through the TV's update system, so I went to LG's support site, downloaded the file and instructions and loaded into the USB port with a thumb drive. Worked like a champ. Youtube HDR is fixed - among other things.

http://www.lg.com/us/support-product/lg-OLED65B7P
What other improvements did you notice?
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post #65 of 150 Old 11-27-2017, 09:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by noobtv View Post
What other things are fixed?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cam1977 View Post
What other improvements did you notice?
There was a change log about the new FW posted a few days ago. I think it was posted in the owners thread. After reading the change log, I got motivated about installing it directly rather than waiting for the update server to push it out. I remember that there were three audio and two video issues addressed in the update. One of the video things was the fix for YT HDR. Sorry, I don't remember the other items as they were not the elephant-in-the-room fix that YT HDR brought to the table.
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LG OLED65C7P 4-20-19 Calibration SDR/HDR/DV FW 05.80.15: https://www.avsforum.com/forum/40-ol...l#post57928994
VIZIO M70-D3 Calibration SDR/HDR FW 3.4.8.15: https://www.avsforum.com/forum/166-l...l#post55595700
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post #66 of 150 Old 11-27-2017, 09:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 49Merc View Post
I’ve read multiple times that there are LG’s with very comparable screen technology and excellence as the Sony AE1. I would like to know the applicable LG models especially given they are supposedly much less expensive. Size - 65”.

Thank you.
LG actually manufactures the OLED panels that Sony uses in the A1E. All of the LG panels are the same, and all of the LG models have the same PQ. Find your best price and enjoy!
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LG OLED65C7P 4-20-19 Calibration SDR/HDR/DV FW 05.80.15: https://www.avsforum.com/forum/40-ol...l#post57928994
VIZIO M70-D3 Calibration SDR/HDR FW 3.4.8.15: https://www.avsforum.com/forum/166-l...l#post55595700
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post #67 of 150 Old 11-29-2017, 08:06 AM
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hello guys. i just picked up a lg oled65b7a for black friday and have been really impressed. stepped up from a 42" samsung plasma that i had for the past ten years. i have a few things that bother me with my new $2k+ tv, but from reading here it seems like i can fix most of them

right now i have the lg tv hooked up to my yahama rx-v377 receiver powering 5 in ceiling speakers and a 10" polk sub. the only input i have right now is my cable box which is hooked up to the receiver

1. when watching sports, football for instance, the ball seems to ghost out when in the air. reading the forums seems to point me towards the trumotion settings and the dejudder/deblur. for standard "cable box" viewing it seems like i should zero out the tru motion settings, or at least start there... right?

2. similar to above when watching 4k content via netflix or youtube on the integrated tv app i seem to get more of a jitter or jumpiness, not ghosting like with the cable box. a static image looks great and is ultra crisp, but when the camera pans or an actor moves it gets a bit jumpy. im going to guess that this is related to the trumotion settings too, but could it be that my older receiver only outputs 4k @ 30hz? or is that not an issue because it is playing over the integrated tv app?

3. i have the cable box hooked up to the receiver (hdmi) and the output from the receiver hooked up to hdmi2 (ARC) on the tv. i cannot seem to get this right. the tv constantly wants to switch audio outputs on the receiver when changing from cable box to netflix or another internal app. this even happens when i use the guide for my cable box on the tv. from my reading it seems that ARC might simply not work properly and combined with my older receiver just might not work... currently i have also connected an optical fiber audio cable to the receiver as this seems to produce the most consistent results, as in it will pick the correct audio source for the content on the tv, but i still need to switch the audio manually on the receiver every now and then. i would really like to put that remote in the drawer permanently!

thanks for all the great info, you guys are great!

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post #68 of 150 Old 11-29-2017, 03:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tocirahl View Post
Recommended Picture Settings

I cannot remember who originally posted this spreadsheet
That was from jbebel, who originally posted it in the link below. Besides giving him credit (perhaps he was too modest to point it out), I think it would be a good idea to include the link below in your write-up because it gives some context to the settings in the spreadsheet and explains how they were determined.

w ww.avsforum.com/forum/139-display-calibration/2853954-lg-2017-oled-calibration-thread-settings-13.html#post54751596
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post #69 of 150 Old 11-30-2017, 06:58 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by forreal View Post
That was from jbebel, who originally posted it in the link below. Besides giving him credit (perhaps he was too modest to point it out), I think it would be a good idea to include the link below in your write-up because it gives some context to the settings in the spreadsheet and explains how they were determined.

w ww.avsforum.com/forum/139-display-calibration/2853954-lg-2017-oled-calibration-thread-settings-13.html#post54751596
Thank you! much appreciated!
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post #70 of 150 Old 11-30-2017, 07:59 AM
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Calibration for Gaming updated:

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/139-di...l#post54906032

Changes: SDR Profile slightly adjusted after latest TV official 4.70.xx firmware changes in black levels.


Enjoy
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post #71 of 150 Old 11-30-2017, 09:12 AM
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Hello everyone!

I'm happy to announce after over a year of being on and off the fence to purchase an LG OLED, I finally pulled the trigger and unboxed my B7A last night! What a thing of beauty. It's such an amazing jump from my prior TV and I'm very excited about it.

I appreciate all the effort put into this thread as trying to read 16,000 posts on the owners thread was starting to hurt. So thank you tocirahl, and all the other contributors across the entire AVS community. I've found this forum extremely helpful.

I feel overwhelmed with the various picture setting menu options as I am a novice. I've updated the firmware to the latest version and was able to get HDR/DV content on the screen via provided Netflix app. I had trouble this morning with YouTube producing HDR content, I don't think it was working as I found the "HDR Effect" option available in one of the settings during various video playback. Are there any good reputable videos available that talk about some of the TV settings and how they affect image quality/motion? I find videos help me gain a better understanding of things more so than forum explanations exclusively. Even a post with a summary of setting functions would be helpful.

I plan to try your SDR/HDR settings @sonoftumble , and your game settings @P40L0 this evening. (thanks for providing)

When I have time to game, I play Destiny 2 mostly and I just picked up the PS4 Pro a couple of days ago. Bungie announced 12/5 they will rolling out an update to support HDR and I would like to maximize the TV's potential with this game specifically. Any recommendations on setting adjustments would be appreciated.

Thank you!
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post #72 of 150 Old 12-03-2017, 07:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by beantownsfinest View Post
I had trouble this morning with YouTube producing HDR content, I don't think it was working as I found the "HDR Effect" option available in one of the settings during various video playback.
Lots of videos on youtube with "HDR" in the title are not actually HDR.

Check out this channel for some good ones (Jacob + Katie Schwarz).
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post #73 of 150 Old 12-04-2017, 05:07 PM
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So I am planning to buy a OLED 4k TV, still undecided between 55 and 75 inches. I measured the distance , and I will sit around 7.5 to 8 feet away from the wall( will hang the TV on the wall).

Is 55 inches more comfortable for gaming and movies ? Or should I go big ? I know there is a chart in the op, but wondering if somebody has the same set up. It is a small room, no windows and dark . 10x 1w feet, viewing distance around 7 to 8 feet

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk
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post #74 of 150 Old 12-04-2017, 08:30 PM
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Originally Posted by davivascaino View Post
So I am planning to buy a OLED 4k TV, still undecided between 55 and 75 inches. I measured the distance , and I will sit around 7.5 to 8 feet away from the wall( will hang the TV on the wall).

Is 55 inches more comfortable for gaming and movies ? Or should I go big ? I know there is a chart in the op, but wondering if somebody has the same set up. It is a small room, no windows and dark . 10x 1w feet, viewing distance around 7 to 8 feet

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk
I presume you meant 55 or 65". I would go the 65" for sure if you can. It will be much more impressive.

If you watch a lot of movies, they will have letterbox bars on the top and bottom that will make the screen smaller as well.

I had to go 55" because of stupid room layout issues... Still loving the TV though!
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post #75 of 150 Old 12-05-2017, 08:24 PM
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...mounting an OLED65B7A. Am surprised to find the power cable hardwired to TV.


Do all flavors of 2017 LG OLEDs have the hardwired power cable?


Also surprised it's a two prong (no ground) plug.
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post #76 of 150 Old 12-05-2017, 11:21 PM
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Originally Posted by HiDefbg View Post
...mounting an OLED65B7A. Am surprised to find the power cable hardwired to TV.


Do all flavors of 2017 LG OLEDs have the hardwired power cable?


Also surprised it's a two prong (no ground) plug.
I believe you can unscrew the plastic cover and it is a normal plug under that.

Edit: Someone posted a picture of it in the B7/C7 thread, it's not a normal plug under the cover.

Last edited by noobtv; 12-11-2017 at 03:46 PM.
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post #77 of 150 Old 12-11-2017, 11:49 AM
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Question OLED77G7P vs OLED77W7P

Hello Everyone,

Can someone please tell me the major differences between OLED77G7P and OLED77W7P? Would you pay extra 5K for OLED77W7P?

Thank you!
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post #78 of 150 Old 12-12-2017, 06:52 AM - Thread Starter
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Hello Everyone,

Can someone please tell me the major differences between OLED77G7P and OLED77W7P? Would you pay extra 5K for OLED77W7P?

Thank you!
The difference is the "Wallpaper" design on the W7P.

The W7P has a separate soundbar and control unit attached to a very thin OLED display unit through a thin cable. This allows the OLED display unit itself to be magnetically wall mounted very close to the wall. It looks like a 77-inch painting essentially. The W7P can only be wall-mounted. It cannot sit on a TV stand/table.

The G7P has the soundbar attached to the display unit and looks bulkier if wall-mounted.
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post #79 of 150 Old 12-13-2017, 11:42 AM
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There is a newer firmware 04.70.36 posted Dec 12, 2017
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post #80 of 150 Old 12-19-2017, 04:30 PM
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Lots of people in the B7/C7 thread are reporting that they lost the Dolby Access app when they updated to either 4.70.30 and 4.70.36.

LG support has said to switch region from US to Canada but apparently that doesn't work.

Might be worth adding this info to the first post.

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post #81 of 150 Old 12-26-2017, 03:40 PM
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Originally Posted by noobtv View Post
Lots of people in the B7/C7 thread are reporting that they lost the Dolby Access app when they updated....

LG support has said to switch region from US to Canada but apparently that doesn't work.

Might be worth adding this info to the first post.

I upgraded the firmware on my 65B7P today to 4.70.36 and the Dolby Access app is present and I'm in the US with that as my region.
Maybe they fixed it. Or, I just got lucky.
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post #82 of 150 Old 12-26-2017, 06:24 PM
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I upgraded the firmware on my 65B7P today to 4.70.36 and the Dolby Access app is present and I'm in the US with that as my region.
It works for me after an update to the app.

I might type 2K for 1080p.
UDP-203/ATV4K(6,2)/X3500/LG C8
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post #83 of 150 Old 01-16-2018, 02:49 PM
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So some advise is GREATLY appreciated here guys.

I run a Denon receiver right now that I LOVE. It has everything pipped into it and outputs it as a single HDMI. Everything from xbox one X to ps4 pro all the way back to ps1's and NES era consoles. EVERYTHING goes to this receiver with a single HDMI going to the TV.

I also have a windows 10 media center PC hooked up to it in what I think is running RGB to a DLP TV/

I want to upgrade to the best TV you can get so of course my eyes are on the LG OLED's

- I guess I should just set the input to "game mode" and make sure the PC is set at 4:2:2 10 bit for HDR to work?
- I have been gaming on the DLP for years but for the life of me can't figure out what the input lag on DLP's are so not sure if I would notice a difference?
- Really whats the best setting to have the TV on to support all the game consoles as well as a media center PC with now what is over 1TB of HDR MKV files ready to blow my mind?

Thanks for any help!!!
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post #84 of 150 Old 01-18-2018, 01:14 PM
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I found a way to use the PC HDR mode in a meaningful way. There are two things to consider for this:

1: The v390.65 nVidia driver not only brought back the NVAPI HDR support for Win10 1703+ but also uses dithering for 8-bit output (rather than simply truncating the higher precision input like some older drivers did --- at least on my GTX1070 and with Win10).

2: The PC mode HDR can't properly handle >8 bit input (I guess it's just arbitrary low precision, not exact truncation to 8-bit but looks about as good as that: clearly visible banding) and can't do gamut mapping from device to Rec2020 space (you just get the roughly DCI-P3 native gamut with the fixed Wide option in Standard or Game, sRGB in the rest at Auto).

So... when the VGA driver dithers the display output to 8-bit (from the 10+ bit software image) the TV in PC/HDR mode can properly handle that 8-bit, so it looks decent overall (not as good as real 10+ bit but it's closer to real 10-bit than it is to plain 8-bit, so it's acceptable for WCG and HDR too).
And... if you use a color sensor to profile the Wide gamut mode (which is actually easier to than it is for Auto, since this Wide mode is closer to the native gamut and that's usually the easiest to profile reliably...) and create a 3DLUT for ReShade, you can have your proper Rec2020 colors in games. I used the PC/HDR/Game mode for this (Standard could also work but that's further from the desired tone curve, the rest is garbage).

After that, the only outstanding issue is the handling of the the anisotropic WRGB color space of these panels. I solved this by creating the 3DLUT with hard-clip at 650 nit (the actual peak white of the display with W+R+G+B) but setting the videogame to 400 nit peak output. This latter number comes from two sources: one is the fact that the R+G+B cluster (without the help of the W sub-pixel) can produce ~380 nit white on my panel and I also spent some time in the game staring at shiny lights and tweaking this number (and found that it's fine to overshoot the R+G+B number a little bit without seeing obvious problems but numbers like 500 are obviously problematic).
(If you wander, in Frostbite games, you can set the peak white with the Render.DisplayMappingHDR10PeakLuma command in the developer console.)

So, after all that, I have decently smooth-ish gradients and 4:4:4 in NVAPI HDR games with the LG C7 running in PC/HDR/Game. The only thing I changed in this picture mode was tuning the sharpness down from 10 to 0 and the Color from 65 to 50 (because that's the "neutral" point for Color in every single picture mode, both TV and PC, I have no idea why it's set to 55 for all "accurate" modes in TV mode, R,G,B colors reach their peak saturation and luminance exactly at 50, not at 49, not at 55, but 50). Ah, and I also tweaked the white point settings in the service menu, so this stupid W30-C30 slider always produces D65 white (I set all factory white balance settings to the same, so the slider does nothing).

"DIY certified hobby-calibrator" (based on ChadB's "warning signs" list

Last edited by janos666; 01-18-2018 at 01:26 PM.
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post #85 of 150 Old 01-19-2018, 08:17 AM
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Originally Posted by janos666 View Post
I found a way to use the PC HDR mode in a meaningful way. There are two things to consider for this:

1: The v390.65 nVidia driver not only brought back the NVAPI HDR support for Win10 1703+ but also uses dithering for 8-bit output (rather than simply truncating the higher precision input like some older drivers did --- at least on my GTX1070 and with Win10).

2: The PC mode HDR can't properly handle >8 bit input (I guess it's just arbitrary low precision, not exact truncation to 8-bit but looks about as good as that: clearly visible banding) and can't do gamut mapping from device to Rec2020 space (you just get the roughly DCI-P3 native gamut with the fixed Wide option in Standard or Game, sRGB in the rest at Auto).

So... when the VGA driver dithers the display output to 8-bit (from the 10+ bit software image) the TV in PC/HDR mode can properly handle that 8-bit, so it looks decent overall (not as good as real 10+ bit but it's closer to real 10-bit than it is to plain 8-bit, so it's acceptable for WCG and HDR too).
And... if you use a color sensor to profile the Wide gamut mode (which is actually easier to than it is for Auto, since this Wide mode is closer to the native gamut and that's usually the easiest to profile reliably...) and create a 3DLUT for ReShade, you can have your proper Rec2020 colors in games. I used the PC/HDR/Game mode for this (Standard could also work but that's further from the desired tone curve, the rest is garbage).

After that, the only outstanding issue is the handling of the the anisotropic WRGB color space of these panels. I solved this by creating the 3DLUT with hard-clip at 650 nit (the actual peak white of the display with W+R+G+B) but setting the videogame to 400 nit peak output. This latter number comes from two sources: one is the fact that the R+G+B cluster (without the help of the W sub-pixel) can produce ~380 nit white on my panel and I also spent some time in the game staring at shiny lights and tweaking this number (and found that it's fine to overshoot the R+G+B number a little bit without seeing obvious problems but numbers like 500 are obviously problematic).
(If you wander, in Frostbite games, you can set the peak white with the Render.DisplayMappingHDR10PeakLuma command in the developer console.)

So, after all that, I have decently smooth-ish gradients and 4:4:4 in NVAPI HDR games with the LG C7 running in PC/HDR/Game. The only thing I changed in this picture mode was tuning the sharpness down from 10 to 0 and the Color from 65 to 50 (because that's the "neutral" point for Color in every single picture mode, both TV and PC, I have no idea why it's set to 55 for all "accurate" modes in TV mode, R,G,B colors reach their peak saturation and luminance exactly at 50, not at 49, not at 55, but 50). Ah, and I also tweaked the white point settings in the service menu, so this stupid W30-C30 slider always produces D65 white (I set all factory white balance settings to the same, so the slider does nothing).
So if we want to have a hybrid this is where I am confused....

Using the latest creators update and the latest nvidia driver, what is the best way to watch HDR MKV's to the TV?
Best thing to do is to keep the TV on RGB for normal operation and videos and switch it to 4:2:2 when trying to watch HDR? TV and movies app the best player for this as well? (heard rumors that it will pass HDR10 now)

Just leave the windows HDR setting disabled for now?

Thanks!
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post #86 of 150 Old 01-19-2018, 01:14 PM
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So if we want to have a hybrid this is where I am confused....

Using the latest creators update and the latest nvidia driver, what is the best way to watch HDR MKV's to the TV?
Best thing to do is to keep the TV on RGB for normal operation and videos and switch it to 4:2:2 when trying to watch HDR? TV and movies app the best player for this as well? (heard rumors that it will pass HDR10 now)

Just leave the windows HDR setting disabled for now?

Thanks!
I prefer NVAPI (on Win10 1703+) for various reasons, especially with these 390-series drivers (which fixed and improved some things), but we don't get to decide what future games will support (Windows<10 compatibility is a good reason for them to use the private APIs but only as long as those OSs are still relevant --- remember: DX12 limits things to Win10 anyway...).

For an "all rood" solution I would definitely go with TV/HDR/Game. Actually, that's probably what I will continue to do myself (despite my growing annoyance of having to switch the input label depending if I want PC/SDR/ISF or TV/HDR/Game). Even though I was happy to share my findings about how the PC/HDR/Game mode could be utilized in some meaningful way (with dithered 8-bit RGB input and color mapping with a 3DLUT), my limited testing suggests the difference in precision (aka color/gradient smoothness/banding) is more noticeable for me in videgames than chroma subsampling (aka YCC 4:2:2 instead of YCC 4:4:4 or RGB) is. And movies care even less about chroma subsampling (on a PC we have to go through RGB but still, they are YCC 4:2:0 to start with), although the same could be said about precision as well (since most movies usually have all kinds of noise on them, dithering included) so banding was always a bigger issue in videogame, even in 8-bit SDR days.
It also seems like the better precision in TV/HDR/Game mode allows me to push the content peak luma a little bit further (from 400 to 500? needs a little more testing...) before the color crush in the shrinking chroma zone (where the W pixel kicks in) starts bothering me (the saturation loss is obviously still there but the finer gradation makes the shifts from saturated colors to white more smooth, thus less disturbing -- I still like to cut it well below 650 nit though, but may be a finer detailed 3DLUT could help to mitigate this issue even further).

So, TV/HDR/Game it is for me... I don't see much sense in profiling TV/HDR/Cinema as well because the CMS in that mode should be left alone anyways (it causes all kinds of weird issues if you try, it's just broken) and it doesn't offer significantly better precision than TV/HDR/Game (and it's a lot of work to get a really good profile and 3DLUT for any picture modes + a real annoyance to go through the menus based on your content, having to switch the PC/HDMI1 labels is too much already, I won't switch picture modes as well just for negligible-to-none gains).

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I have a question that goes back to something stated in the original post:

Quote:
LG employs two different types of ABL; the first one (ABL) kicks in when the entire screen is lit up above 150 nits
Can anyone verify that if the light output is kept below 150 nits, that the ABL will not kick in? Having had a career in broadcasting and post-production, I set my displays so that white is about 100 nits (~30 footlamberts), so I am hoping that at that "low" level, I would be below the threshold of the ABL. Call me crazy, but it drive me nuts to see a screen go "dim" when presented with a full white field. My old Panasonic plasma had that "problem" and I hated it. I realize that it doesn't bother most, but it's high on my list of deal-breakers.

Thanks for any info!
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Quote:
Originally Posted by videojanitor View Post
I have a question that goes back to something stated in the original post:



Can anyone verify that if the light output is kept below 150 nits, that the ABL will not kick in? Having had a career in broadcasting and post-production, I set my displays so that white is about 100 nits (~30 footlamberts), so I am hoping that at that "low" level, I would be below the threshold of the ABL. Call me crazy, but it drive me nuts to see a screen go "dim" when presented with a full white field. My old Panasonic plasma had that "problem" and I hated it. I realize that it doesn't bother most, but it's high on my list of deal-breakers.

Thanks for any info!
I didn't care to record the exact number (and I guess it will float around a bit with the "panel-lottery" + aging/compensation + occasional manual white balance readjustments) but I remember it was 140-something on my panel on it's first days when I started fiddling around in the service menu and turned SABL off. This applies to all SDR picture modes (PC and TV / ISF, Cinema and Game included).

I have it set to ~100nit for SDR as well (PC/ISF, OLEDLight 16, Contrast 100, white balance adjusted in the SM by Red set to 192 [neutral] and then Green and Blue lowered as required to get D65 at panel peak white around 650nit, so it's suitable for the TV/HDR/Game mode and a good base for the PC/SDR/ISF mode, Cuts all left at 64, all copied over to all white balance presets, so the stupid Game mode slider is a no-op).

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Quote:
Originally Posted by janos666 View Post
I didn't care to record the exact number (and I guess it will float around a bit with the "panel-lottery" + aging/compensation + occasional manual white balance readjustments) but I remember it was 140-something on my panel on it's first days when I started fiddling around in the service menu and turned SABL off. This applies to all SDR picture modes (PC and TV / ISF, Cinema and Game included).

I have it set to ~100nit for SDR as well (PC/ISF, OLEDLight 16, Contrast 100, white balance adjusted in the SM by Red set to 192 [neutral] and then Green and Blue lowered as required to get D65 at panel peak white around 650nit, so it's suitable for the TV/HDR/Game mode and a good base for the PC/SDR/ISF mode, Cuts all left at 64, all copied over to all white balance presets, so the stupid Game mode slider is a no-op).
Thanks for the detailed info. If I read you correctly, it sounds like it should be fine running at 100 nits, if the ABL is disabled in the service menu. "Fine" meaning that 100% white always results in the same light output, regardless if it's a small window, or full-screen.
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Originally Posted by videojanitor View Post
Thanks for the detailed info. If I read you correctly, it sounds like it should be fine running at 100 nits, if the ABL is disabled in the service menu. "Fine" meaning that 100% white always results in the same light output, regardless if it's a small window, or full-screen.
Yes, with the settings I listed, I see ~0 ABL related fluctuations in brightness.
Although, may be I should note that the brightness often fluctuates a little bit over longer periods. This is more meaningful in HDR mode, like 3 consecutive measurement runs might yield something between 650 and 670 nit peak white (but I saw as high as 700 at some point). But this percentage difference translates to smaller numbers in a darker tuned SDR mode and I think the percentage change is also smaller (less wear = less fluctuation and 100 nit causes a lot less wear than 650...).

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