2018 LG C8-E8 Owners' Thread (No Price Talk) - Page 26 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #751 of 21633 Old 04-21-2018, 03:21 PM
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I am looking at either a C8 or E8, 55".

As I understand it, the display and electronics are all the same, except:

1. The E8 uses a "sheet of glass" design. It appears that the glass extends 2-3" lower than on the C8, that is, the E8 is taller, while having the same screen size. Don't know what the value of the glass extension is, and it complicates having a center-channel speaker directly below the TV.

2. The E8 has 4.1 60w audio, whereas the C8 has 2.1 40w audio. This only matters if you are using the TV's speakers only.

Are there other differences?
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post #752 of 21633 Old 04-21-2018, 03:24 PM
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I am looking at either a C8 or E8, 55".

Does anyone have photos of the back panel connections (including AC), and the side panel connections? Are they different between C8 and E8? Am I right that side panel connections are on the left, as you are looking at the front of the TV?

Value Electronics offers the 55" C8 and E8 for same price as BB, but each with a two-year warranty (I think this means one free year). For $600 more, I understand they will calibrate it for you. Will the calibration in their lab work for my living room?

These TVs are 120Hz refresh, right?

What is the length of the stand for 55" C8 and E8? Specifically, how wide does a table need to be to support the stand's whole length?

I think I have heard that the Sony TV is better for games than LG TV. Are games playable? What is the problem, and just how bad is it?
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post #753 of 21633 Old 04-21-2018, 03:35 PM
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Autocal still requires expensive equipment and software for best results. Most people will be better off hiring a pro to do it.
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We sure can, but most people do not need this and do not want to pay the slight extra fee.
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Are there other differences?
Speakers and cosmetic as you noted, no picture quality difference.
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post #754 of 21633 Old 04-21-2018, 05:58 PM
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I was at my parents' house tonight dog sitting and I brought a Seinfeld dvd to check on their 75" 900E given the show was mentioned earlier in this thread. I watched some of an episode and then when I came home, I watched the same on my C8.

My findings are that it did not look bad on the C8 and there wasn't excess noise/artifacts that another poster mentioned. It also looked a tad more detailed on the C8 than the 900E though that could be the size difference factoring in given 65" is already reaching for that low res stuff.

I calibrated my parents' tv when I was borrowing it last month and my C8 is in isf dark for the time being so none of the "enhancement" stuff being used on either set. Maybe that is what the other poster had a problem with and some stuff LG has causes artifacts. That or they have too high expectations of low res content on a 4k tv.
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post #755 of 21633 Old 04-21-2018, 10:30 PM
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I understand that, but considering you're paying for these enhancements (for the C8 over the C7), it seemed like a good idea to mention them and that they actually make things worse, which is not what you'd think right off the bat. It's funny that they make for a really great still shot (when you pause whatever you're watching and pull out your camera), but are absolutely terrible when you're actually watching the movie.

I personally like interpolation, having watched all three of the Hobbit movies in HFR and knowing what a huge impact high frame rate makes on image clarity, it definitely helps. Although interpolation isn't the same thing as high frame rate, it tries to accomplish the same thing. Unfortunately this implementation of interpolation seems to have too much overshoot and ruins the picture at the same time it helps it (much like other enhancements). Slow movement scenes it makes everything look better, high motion scenes it turns into a garbly mess, which just tells you that the computer they have powering this thing isn't nearly good enough to keep up with content it needs to process.

When you take all of this into consideration you could buy a C7 for less then half the price and get basically the same experience as long as you turn those things off, which is also what a lot of other people are stating. More time and messing is required though. There are a lot of buried options in which you have to enable/disable something else to get to a option that does something that should be more transparent.
It's more likely that their software/algorithm isn't as good. Maybe try the Sony Oleds/Z9, many here say it has the top interpolation and up scaling out there. As for all the the options and picture setting toggles that are poorly explained, well that about just applies to every tv on Earth. Yes the extra price of the C8 is unlikely to be worth it right now, but many of us are interested in the improvements not for right now, but later in the year when the C8 costs less than the 7. And the new processor does have a few new neat tricks if you play video games as you can use BFI without adding lag (C7 doesn't have BFI) as well toggle between 2 different tone mapping styles.
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post #756 of 21633 Old 04-22-2018, 04:10 AM
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I got my OLED65C8PUA from Cleveland Plasma (Thanks Chris!) on Friday. Unfortunately had to leave on Saturday for a business trip, so I didn't get a lot of time to play with it.

The TV was delivered by FedEx double boxed, and came in fantastic condition. The FedEx driver was awesome and I asked him to help me bring the TV up my stairs, offered him $20 and he helped me and then refused to take the $20 ...

Removed the TV from the box by myself, it would be a lot easier to do it with a 2nd person - but is totally possible if you're very careful. No issues attaching the stand - was easy and only took a few minutes.

I had some strange issues with HDMI ports at first - I could only get the back facing HDMI port 4 to work initially. The other side facing HDMI ports would not work for me no matter what. As per normal troubleshooting I checked for and performed a firmware update on the TV and then after the TV came back up, turned everything off and turned it back on - and the HDMI ports all started working.

Following that, everything has been great - I am coming from a 60" Pioneer Elite Kuro Pro-151FD and a Panasonic TC-P65VT60. This being my first OLED TV, the brightness and color on it are amazing.

I don't really have enough hours on the TV yet, but I ran through a few different test videos, the 5% grey one in a completely dark room and it did not show any visible banding to my eyes, it looked perfect to me - but maybe my eyes aren't that good

The TV itself looks great out of the box in the Technicolor Expert mode for SDR/HDR and Cinema Home for Dolby Vision. I'm sure it would look better calibrated - but it looks so good already I'm not sure most casual folks really need to do much more than an eyeball calibration themselves.

What settings are folks using for TrueMotion? I played with the settings a bit, and I couldn't find a setting I really like. Having it completely turned off made it seem the closest to Plasma motion to me but when watching sports like hockey - the motion detail is significantly reduced (can't clearly see the numbers on the backs of jerseys in motion like you can with Plasma). With either the smooth or clear option turned on - I hated the soap opera like effect and I tried playing with the user setting, but I couldn't find one I really liked.
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post #757 of 21633 Old 04-22-2018, 04:30 AM
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@LiQiCE

Congrats!

For trumotion, I have dejudder at 2 and deblur at 0. This has worked for the most part in stuff I've so far watched yet there have been a few scenes where it seemed too smooth so I lowered it to dejudder 1 to see how that goes. Dejudder 3 ad the soe so they're out. I will say I am not super sensitive to motion like others so that works in my favour as motion to me seems fine with trumotion off though I have not nor will I be watching any sports on this set.

Did you try BFI? If not, hopefully you won't see flicker whihc is what I unfortunately see on both 24and 60hz content so it's not an option for me.
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post #758 of 21633 Old 04-22-2018, 06:15 AM
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Originally Posted by mindz View Post
Back to the C7. This is a keeper. Had 2 C8's. Both had dead pixels and same yellow tint as on C7. C8 has a worse PC mode aswell. Sharpness needs to be min. 20 for text to look good on 444 chroma tests. All normal text gets aliased. C7 sharpness 0 in PC mode gets all text right, weird. The new program guide on webos 4 is better though! They seem to have cut costs on a few things in C8 including stand and packaging. They moved the wrong direction for me.
In pc mode sharpness at 20 on the c8 is now the correct setting. Rtings review also confirmed this.

How many dead pixels did you have? The tv has over 8.2 million pixels...

I have the c7 and the c8 and it is no contest, the c8 has much better uniformity, it is brighter on full screen colors, has bfi and although the lag numbers with my Leo Bodnar show they are the same the c8 feels much more responsive, especially with bfi active ( maybe that has to do with half the image persistance?). The anti glare on the c8 is much better, when large areas of light colors are panning you do not see the uneveness that the c7 ag filter showed and the orange peel is much less on the c8 filter which helps it look much more expensive. The c8 I have has no vertical banding and has the most pristine uniformity I have seen on a display and no dse, it really is much better than the c7 I have.

I have no yellow tint on either my c7 or c8. What size c8 did you have?

Also the stand on the c8 is soo much better looking and actually directs the audio towards you, the c8 is one of the nicest looking tvs I have seen and the stand is part of it 🙂
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post #759 of 21633 Old 04-22-2018, 06:53 AM
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Curious to know if anyone uses your oleds for gaming. How do you feel with its response time, viewing experience

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post #760 of 21633 Old 04-22-2018, 07:02 AM
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Curious to know if anyone uses your oleds for gaming. How do you feel with its response time, viewing experience

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It is perfect for gaming, I used a c7 up until about two weeks ago when I got the c8. The c8 has bfi and you can use that in pc mode with any picture mode with 21ms of input lag. I highly recommend the c8 for gaming! The motion clarity with bfi is really something special!
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post #761 of 21633 Old 04-22-2018, 07:09 AM
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Curious to know if anyone uses your oleds for gaming. How do you feel with its response time, viewing experience

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I have been using OLED for gaming for years since the EF9500 days, after that series the latency has been on par with most other sets but even on the EF9500 I really never had any issues, only with HDR brightness. If you are looking for the 2018 series the biggest improvement for gaming I guess would be the additional of static logo protection they added and if works as advertised. This would be a WIN for gammers who worry about permeant static images over a prolonged period etc. Of course the 2018 increases brightness, greater motion and whatnot, these are all good things for gaming. I doubt the latency has changed much from the 2017's but I haven't looked into it. Even if it was better it would be such a smaller number that one most likely many would not even notice.

Viewing experience using the Xbox one X with HDR and 4K is insane, such clarity, color and motion. Love it!!

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post #762 of 21633 Old 04-22-2018, 08:20 AM
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I've yet to make the switch from plasma to OLED, hopefully next year. I do gaming and am quite perceptive of latency. I've read the Sony's with the X1 Extreme processor add latency which I believe made the LG's better for gaming last year. Is there any indication that the α9 Intelligent Processor might do the same thing as the X1 Extreme in the 2018 LG's?

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post #763 of 21633 Old 04-22-2018, 11:33 AM
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I see a lot of mentions of PC Mode for gaming. I plan to only use one input on the TV (Arc), and let the AVR do the switching. Do you recommend putting this single input I will use for everything in PC Mode?

Will only using one input be an issue for me with different setting needs (Gaming, TV, Sports, Movies)?

Recommendations appreciated.

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post #764 of 21633 Old 04-22-2018, 11:46 AM
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lol no 2000 nits makes huge difference in HDR content. Luckily Oled with infinite blacks and contrast makes HDR stunning.. If Oled could do 2000 nits hdr on the set would appear like your looking through a window.. It would look real to life.. I agree the Oled gets plenty bright due to the things I mentioned but lets be honest if brighter it would be better.
2000 nit is just an arbitrary number. Why not 3,000, or 1,000, or 100,000? This notion that brighter is always "better" is nonsense.

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It is perfect for gaming, I used a c7 up until about two weeks ago when I got the c8. The c8 has bfi and you can use that in pc mode with any picture mode with 21ms of input lag. I highly recommend the c8 for gaming! The motion clarity with bfi is really something special!
I love my C8 for PC gaming, but I don't know how anyone could use 60 Hz BFI. The flicker is totally unbearable to me.
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post #765 of 21633 Old 04-22-2018, 11:56 AM
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A question for those how had a c7 or b7 before this new set:

Are the differences so noticeable? Mostly for the motion and brightness.

I'm very undecided if buy this new model or the old one with a great cost saving

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post #766 of 21633 Old 04-22-2018, 12:03 PM
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I was at my parents' house tonight dog sitting and I brought a Seinfeld dvd to check on their 75" 900E given the show was mentioned earlier in this thread. I watched some of an episode and then when I came home, I watched the same on my C8.

My findings are that it did not look bad on the C8 and there wasn't excess noise/artifacts that another poster mentioned. It also looked a tad more detailed on the C8 than the 900E though that could be the size difference factoring in given 65" is already reaching for that low res stuff.

I calibrated my parents' tv when I was borrowing it last month and my C8 is in isf dark for the time being so none of the "enhancement" stuff being used on either set. Maybe that is what the other poster had a problem with and some stuff LG has causes artifacts. That or they have too high expectations of low res content on a 4k tv.
Have been keeping up on this topic since returning my C8 in hopes that others would have seen what I saw. My issue was why my 8 year old Samsung LCD could look great on a wide variety of sources, yet the C8 looked OK overall. I understand that it won't shine on low quality sources, but my main viewing is OTA. NHL looked pretty underwhelming with dull whites (bordering on grey) and little to no pop on anything that wasn't HDR. Also, no one picture setting looked good. I had to constantly switch from channel to channel and source to source. On my old tv, I put it on Natural and left it there for everything. Another issue is the TV gave off a weird odor that came from the vents. It smelled like burnt plastic, but very strong.
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2000 nit is just an arbitrary number. Why not 3,000, or 1,000, or 100,000? This notion that brighter is always "better" is nonsense.



I love my C8 for PC gaming, but I don't know how anyone could use 60 Hz BFI. The flicker is totally unbearable to me.
In real life the human eye can see 10,000 nits in daylight . So ya the closer to that number the more real it will appear to us.. This is science undisputed numbers. So when I say the brighter the HDR the more real it will look now you understand why.
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post #768 of 21633 Old 04-22-2018, 12:23 PM
 
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Originally Posted by kibit86 View Post
A question for those how had a c7 or b7 before this new set:

Are the differences so noticeable? Mostly for the motion and brightness.

I'm very undecided if buy this new model or the old one with a great cost saving

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From what I read it's motion,BFI and brightness. Also much better 5% uniformity and game mode has drastically improved for HDR as Dynamic tone mapping can be applied. If you are not a gamer or want to save some cash just grab a B7 on the cheap. The improvements are there but not that big for non gamers apart from screen uniformity(mostly 65 inch was effected anyways)
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post #769 of 21633 Old 04-22-2018, 12:24 PM
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IMO, once you get near 1000, people are focusing too much on nits because numbers look to be incremental every year.

I also get, that starting with zero black, every 100 nits you get away from 0 you do improve PQ. 0-700 looks great, so 0-900, 0-1300, etc... will just continue to make things better. Some seem to focus a little too much for me on it now, because they already look great.

Nits, like Qled, color volume, are just ways a certain manufacturer and their shills can pump LCD.
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IMO, once you get near 1000, people are focusing too much on nits because numbers look to be incremental every year.

I also get, that starting with zero black, every 100 nits you get away from 0 you do improve PQ. 0-700 looks great, so 0-900, 0-1300, etc... will just continue to make things better. Some seem to focus a little too much for me on it now, because they already look great.

Nits, like Qled, color volume, are just ways a certain manufacturer and their shills can pump LCD.
I agree with you to a point. HDR looks fantastic on Oled.. 1000 nits is also fine for most however if we want the true looking through the window experience the closer to 10,000 nits the better the HDR experience.
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post #771 of 21633 Old 04-22-2018, 12:35 PM
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^^^
Last night i calibrated a Q9F and it was right next to an A1E. The Q9F measured 2050 nits HDR with a 10% window and the A1 i know at best is around 700 nits. Playing the same HDR content, the Q9 is brighter but not 3X brighter overall BUT the highlights on the Q9 are noticeably brighter and that's where you see the difference. That said, depending on your "taste", there's no right or wrong in what kind of a picture you like, the blacks on the OLED are still superior.
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post #772 of 21633 Old 04-22-2018, 12:48 PM
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Curious to know if anyone uses your oleds for gaming. How do you feel with its response time, viewing experience

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Playing God of Warnon a PS4 Pro on my LG C6, constantly have to pick my jaw off the floor. Can’t imagine how great this is going to look on a C8 when I upgrade soon.

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post #773 of 21633 Old 04-22-2018, 12:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by player002 View Post
lol no 2000 nits makes huge difference in HDR content. Luckily Oled with infinite blacks and contrast makes HDR stunning.. If Oled could do 2000 nits hdr on the set would appear like your looking through a window.. It would look real to life.. I agree the Oled gets plenty bright due to the things I mentioned but lets be honest if brighter it would be better.
2000 nit is just an arbitrary number. Why not 3,000, or 1,000, or 100,000? This notion that brighter is always "better" is nonsense.

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Originally Posted by Blackvette94 View Post
It is perfect for gaming, I used a c7 up until about two weeks ago when I got the c8. The c8 has bfi and you can use that in pc mode with any picture mode with 21ms of input lag. I highly recommend the c8 for gaming! The motion clarity with bfi is really something special!
I love my C8 for PC gaming, but I don't know how anyone could use 60 Hz BFI. The flicker is totally unbearable to me.
Yea, the bfi after 20-30 mins of using it makes my eyes fee like someone is stabbing then and I get a wicked headache, so other than that and the half brightness its great!! Lol
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post #774 of 21633 Old 04-22-2018, 01:01 PM
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Have been keeping up on this topic since returning my C8 in hopes that others would have seen what I saw. My issue was why my 8 year old Samsung LCD could look great on a wide variety of sources, yet the C8 looked OK overall. I understand that it won't shine on low quality sources, but my main viewing is OTA. NHL looked pretty underwhelming with dull whites (bordering on grey) and little to no pop on anything that wasn't HDR. Also, no one picture setting looked good. I had to constantly switch from channel to channel and source to source. On my old tv, I put it on Natural and left it there for everything. Another issue is the TV gave off a weird odor that came from the vents. It smelled like burnt plastic, but very strong.
I have the G6, but I can tell you Oled doesn’t seem to be the best for OTA material.
Did you have the set calibrated? I had mine calibrated twice. Once from dealer prior to delivery after in house burn in. Then at my apartment after a few months. It looks fantastic.

One thing about the plastic smell- on my G6 there was some sort plastic protection layer on the back. I had to peel it off. There was also some packing in the rear vents I had to remove. I assume you removed all this, but just in case you missed some of it.....?
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post #775 of 21633 Old 04-22-2018, 01:09 PM
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^^^
Last night i calibrated a Q9F and it was right next to an A1E. The Q9F measured 2050 nits HDR with a 10% window and the A1 i know at best is around 700 nits. Playing the same HDR content, the Q9 is brighter but not 3X brighter overall BUT the highlights on the Q9 are noticeably brighter and that's where you see the difference. That said, depending on your "taste", there's no right or wrong in what kind of a picture you like, the blacks on the OLED are still superior.
Thats the key for me, I found I liked 0-700 over raised-1300. Both were great, just my preference. Plus OLED has a better depth of image on bright scenes.

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post #776 of 21633 Old 04-22-2018, 01:22 PM
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I agree with you to a point. HDR looks fantastic on Oled.. 1000 nits is also fine for most however if we want the true looking through the window experience the closer to 10,000 nits the better the HDR experience.
I've never understood this desire for a "looking through the window experience". It never made sense to me when I had normal windows, "What I dream of is having this cut off view of what I'm seeing, like looking through a window." Yuck.

Then I moved to places with floor to ceiling windows -- maybe that's what all y'all meant! -- but I still hate it. I have great views here and yet I find that when the sun is out, even with low-E windows, it's far too bright and unpleasant to keep staring out the window from the modestly dim indoor space. I would never, ever want to feel this when watching a movie or some TV. It would be excruciating.

There's a saying about "everything in moderation". If only it was applied to well, you know...
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post #777 of 21633 Old 04-22-2018, 01:24 PM
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@LiQiCE

Congrats!

For trumotion, I have dejudder at 2 and deblur at 0. This has worked for the most part in stuff I've so far watched yet there have been a few scenes where it seemed too smooth so I lowered it to dejudder 1 to see how that goes. Dejudder 3 ad the soe so they're out. I will say I am not super sensitive to motion like others so that works in my favour as motion to me seems fine with trumotion off though I have not nor will I be watching any sports on this set.

Did you try BFI? If not, hopefully you won't see flicker whihc is what I unfortunately see on both 24and 60hz content so it's not an option for me.
I tried BFI briefly, and I didn't notice any flicker just the darker picture - but I didn't keep it on for very long. I might try it again while watching a hockey game and see.

Also - I did notice the same burning plastic smell that @HDKing noticed with his set - it is not extremely noticeable though unless I am sitting close to the TV or standing right behind it -- I still only have maybe 5 or 6 hours on the set so I am hoping when I get back home and can play with it more that the smell dissipates. I'll check to make sure there isn't any packing plastic on the back of the set too but I didn't notice any when I set it up.

BTW- With regard to upscaling SD content - one big difference when watching SD content, is the source of the material - if you're watching off of a DVD, you're probably working with one of the best SD sources available in terms of bitrate (and if it were encoded in 480p versus 480i) versus if you've recorded it onto a DVR and maybe it was off cable TV - sometimes cable TV re-compresses the video from the OTA broadcast, which depending on the station may have compressed it some too - so the source may not be as good and when upscaling to 4K, the picture may suffer more. Realize you're upscaling a 640x480 picture to 3840x2160 or 27 times more pixels. 1080p is 1920x1080 or 6.75 more pixels than 480p.

I realize my math is a little wonky because technically 4K and 1080p are 16:9 aspect ratios and 480p/480i are 4:3 aspect ratios - and when upscaling 480p/480i to 4K you're only upscaling to a 4:3 ratio - but it still is a lot more pixels to interpolate when you're upscaling.

I hardly ever watch SD content anymore, but still do watch a lot of 720p/1080i/1080p content, which actually still looks good on this TV imho.
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post #778 of 21633 Old 04-22-2018, 01:29 PM
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Question LiQice, could you elaborate on differences between Panny VT60 (I also own) & the C8 ?

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I got my OLED65C8PUA from Cleveland Plasma (Thanks Chris!) on Friday. Unfortunately had to leave on Saturday for a business trip, so I didn't get a lot of time to play with it.

The TV was delivered by FedEx double boxed, and came in fantastic condition. The FedEx driver was awesome and I asked him to help me bring the TV up my stairs, offered him $20 and he helped me and then refused to take the $20 ...

Removed the TV from the box by myself, it would be a lot easier to do it with a 2nd person - but is totally possible if you're very careful. No issues attaching the stand - was easy and only took a few minutes.

I had some strange issues with HDMI ports at first - I could only get the back facing HDMI port 4 to work initially. The other side facing HDMI ports would not work for me no matter what. As per normal troubleshooting I checked for and performed a firmware update on the TV and then after the TV came back up, turned everything off and turned it back on - and the HDMI ports all started working.

Following that, everything has been great - I am coming from a 60" Pioneer Elite Kuro Pro-151FD and a Panasonic TC-P65VT60. This being my first OLED TV, the brightness and color on it are amazing.

I don't really have enough hours on the TV yet, but I ran through a few different test videos, the 5% grey one in a completely dark room and it did not show any visible banding to my eyes, it looked perfect to me - but maybe my eyes aren't that good

The TV itself looks great out of the box in the Technicolor Expert mode for SDR/HDR and Cinema Home for Dolby Vision. I'm sure it would look better calibrated - but it looks so good already I'm not sure most casual folks really need to do much more than an eyeball calibration themselves.

What settings are folks using for TrueMotion? I played with the settings a bit, and I couldn't find a setting I really like. Having it completely turned off made it seem the closest to Plasma motion to me but when watching sports like hockey - the motion detail is significantly reduced (can't clearly see the numbers on the backs of jerseys in motion like you can with Plasma). With either the smooth or clear option turned on - I hated the soap opera like effect and I tried playing with the user setting, but I couldn't find one I really liked.
Could you elaborate on the differences between your plasmas, spec the Panny VT-60 (I also own) and the C8, please?...especially the brightness- is the C8 definitely brighter? I do love my VT-60, except it is only 50" I still love the VT-60 motion and the skin tones. Please convince me to move to the 65" C8. Thanks again !
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post #779 of 21633 Old 04-22-2018, 01:35 PM
 
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Originally Posted by rogo View Post
I've never understood this desire for a "looking through the window experience". It never made sense to me when I had normal windows, "What I dream of is having this cut off view of what I'm seeing, like looking through a window." Yuck.

Then I moved to places with floor to ceiling windows -- maybe that's what all y'all meant! -- but I still hate it. I have great views here and yet I find that when the sun is out, even with low-E windows, it's far too bright and unpleasant to keep staring out the window from the modestly dim indoor space. I would never, ever want to feel this when watching a movie or some TV. It would be excruciating.
You understand the term looking thorough the window means that it appears life like right?
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post #780 of 21633 Old 04-22-2018, 01:51 PM
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Originally Posted by WOLVERNOLE View Post
Could you elaborate on the differences between your plasmas, spec the Panny VT-60 (I also own) and the C8, please?...especially the brightness- is the C8 definitely brighter? I do love my VT-60, except it is only 50" I still love the VT-60 motion and the skin tones. Please convince me to move to the 65" C8. Thanks again !
Whoa, you're still worried about brightness of the OLED versus plasma? Let's nip that in the bud already:

VT60: 114 cd/m2 (according to flatpanelshd)
See rtings for extensive brightness testing of the C8 but to summarize, SDR 100% white is 212 cd/m2. HDR 100% white is 161 cd/m2. Highlights will absolutely bombard your retina with much higher values.
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