2018 LG C8-E8 Owners' Thread (No Price Talk) - Page 673 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #20161 of 22210 Old 08-12-2019, 03:39 AM
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Originally Posted by zeonstar View Post
I'm sorry to bring up Tone Mapping again but I made some choices in the last few days based on some assumptions I made and I figured I should ask and see if I am even correct.

Does the LG C8's Dynamic Tone Mapping affect a (Pro) calibrated TV and "ruin" it in any way?

What I mean is this. The LG's DTM affects the overall picture of a scene it's correcting. It makes the whole image brighter or darker, depending on the situation, not just the area that "needs" tone mapping. So my thinking is, when it raises the brightness of the entire image, is it causing the picture to not be as accurate... like say for example elevating the blacks? Is that at all the case?

***

I'd also like to ask. Who here uses a UB820/9000 with their LG C8 and do you use the TV's DTM or the Players HDR Optimizer? Still trying to decide which one I want to go with.

Basically, the LG does tone mapping twice if you switch on DTM. DTM changes HDR's fixed tone curve and thus the creator's intent - the picture will be less accurate. If you use a UB820/9000, then activate HDR Optimizer and leave DTM deactivated for the most accurate picture.
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post #20162 of 22210 Old 08-12-2019, 04:51 AM
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Just received the new firmware. Not really noticing a difference picture wise. Still looks beautiful to me.
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post #20163 of 22210 Old 08-12-2019, 06:07 AM
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Originally Posted by RiverSide View Post
Hmmm.. perhaps I should at least download it.. in case LG "forgets" to roll this one out to the USA and makes us wait for the next..
Should have made this "threat" earlier.. TV found 5.10.03 this morning.. updating now!

Insert pithy comment here
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post #20164 of 22210 Old 08-12-2019, 07:32 AM
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Originally Posted by RiverSide View Post
Should have made this "threat" earlier.. TV found 5.10.03 this morning.. updating now!
Figures, now I am stuck with a "more polite USA model that smells faintly of maple syrup."
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post #20165 of 22210 Old 08-12-2019, 08:12 AM
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I'm in upstate NY and just received the OTA updade.
Any notes on what's been fixed?
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post #20166 of 22210 Old 08-12-2019, 08:14 AM
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Originally Posted by Tool Belt View Post
Figures, now I am stuck with a "more polite USA model that smells faintly of maple syrup."
The US and Canada FWs are probably exactly the same, relax.
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post #20167 of 22210 Old 08-12-2019, 08:17 AM
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Just got 5.20.03. I already calibrated .02, so I'll be pissed if I have to do it again. I'll take a few measures with the meter later to make sure. I'm worried that all these firmware updates are going to cause burn because I have to change the settings. EVERY TIME.
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post #20168 of 22210 Old 08-12-2019, 08:46 AM
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Originally Posted by chronitis View Post
Just got 5.20.03. I already calibrated .02, so I'll be pissed if I have to do it again. I'll take a few measures with the meter later to make sure. I'm worried that all these firmware updates are going to cause burn because I have to change the settings. EVERY TIME.
I had applied the luminance adjustments that you had posted for 4.10.55 and was quite happy with the picture. Just got 5.10.03, do I change the luminance adjustments back to 0?

Thanks.
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post #20169 of 22210 Old 08-12-2019, 08:52 AM
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Originally Posted by milin_im View Post
The US and Canada FWs are probably exactly the same, relax.

Thanks, I know that otherwise I would not have done it....I was making fun......
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post #20170 of 22210 Old 08-12-2019, 08:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RiverSide View Post
Hmmm.. perhaps I should at least download it.. in case LG "forgets" to roll this one out to the USA and makes us wait for the next..
Only takes a few seconds to download, so why not?
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post #20171 of 22210 Old 08-12-2019, 09:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chronitis View Post
Just got 5.20.03. I already calibrated .02, so I'll be pissed if I have to do it again. I'll take a few measures with the meter later to make sure. I'm worried that all these firmware updates are going to cause burn because I have to change the settings. EVERY TIME.
Why would modifying the settings if necessary cause burn it?
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post #20172 of 22210 Old 08-12-2019, 09:31 AM
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Originally Posted by Otto Pylot View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by chronitis View Post
Just got 5.20.03. I already calibrated .02, so I'll be pissed if I have to do it again. I'll take a few measures with the meter later to make sure. I'm worried that all these firmware updates are going to cause burn because I have to change the settings. EVERY TIME.
Why would modifying the settings if necessary cause burn it?
Because you have to use 10% windows to calibrate. It takes time. Particularly for HDR.
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post #20173 of 22210 Old 08-12-2019, 09:37 AM
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Originally Posted by chronitis View Post
Because you have to use 10% windows to calibrate. It takes time. Particularly for HDR.
Me thinks you'll be fine. Let us know. I have't checked yet if its available here.

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post #20174 of 22210 Old 08-12-2019, 10:03 AM
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As others have reported I also received the 5.10.03 update overnight. Greater Los Angeles area here.
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post #20175 of 22210 Old 08-12-2019, 12:18 PM
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Originally Posted by gp56 View Post
I had applied the luminance adjustments that you had posted for 4.10.55 and was quite happy with the picture. Just got 5.10.03, do I change the luminance adjustments back to 0?

Thanks.

0 won't be perfect (my set still required slight near-black corrections), but it should be more accurate than the 4.10.55 settings.
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post #20176 of 22210 Old 08-12-2019, 12:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chronitis View Post
Just got 5.20.03. I already calibrated .02, so I'll be pissed if I have to do it again. I'll take a few measures with the meter later to make sure. I'm worried that all these firmware updates are going to cause burn because I have to change the settings. EVERY TIME.
I’m curious to see what you find in reference to PQ using .55 with your settings, and a picture mode reset with .03?

Regards,
Bert
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post #20177 of 22210 Old 08-12-2019, 12:32 PM
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Originally Posted by oledmod View Post
0 won't be perfect (my set still required slight near-black corrections), but it should be more accurate than the 4.10.55 settings.
I found that the 0-5% luminance adjustments I made back on 4.10.55 were no longer necessary with 5.10.03. And when I tried to adjust luminance anyways as a test, it seemed to have a much less pronounced effect on shadow details.

This was after a factory reset and the determination that I still needed to have my panel at brightness of 53.

--H
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post #20178 of 22210 Old 08-12-2019, 12:44 PM
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Let's hope LG corrects gamma balance even further, until then I stay at 4.15 which is by far the best Firmware

Gesendet von meinem GM1913 mit Tapatalk
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post #20179 of 22210 Old 08-12-2019, 12:48 PM
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Originally Posted by Hurin View Post
I found that the 0-5% luminance adjustments I made back on 4.10.55 were no longer necessary with 5.10.03. And when I tried to adjust luminance anyways as a test, it seemed to have a much less pronounced effect on shadow details.

This was after a factory reset and the determination that I still needed to have my panel at brightness of 53.

--H

Have you thoroughly checked in a pitch-black room with test patterns that black level isn't elevated at 53?
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post #20180 of 22210 Old 08-12-2019, 12:50 PM
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Originally Posted by hamad138 View Post
Let's hope LG corrects gamma balance even further, until then I stay at 4.15 which is by far the best Firmware

Gesendet von meinem GM1913 mit Tapatalk

Disagree, that firmware had some issues such as chrominance overshoot that have now been fixed (as much as is possible), and gamma is not worse with 5.10.03 in my opinion. In fact, I don't think that LG can globally improve gamma significantly after the newest firmware if they account for panel variances.



Panels always have variances, which is why every panel (regardless of firmware) will see some improvement with proper calibration.
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Last edited by oledmod; 08-12-2019 at 12:56 PM.
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post #20181 of 22210 Old 08-12-2019, 01:05 PM
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Originally Posted by oledmod View Post
Have you thoroughly checked in a pitch-black room with test patterns that black level isn't elevated at 53?
Yes. Very thoroughly. Via 0% black slide (vs 1% black slide). The AVS black clipping pattern. And Wizziwig's gamma correction slide. All in a pitch black room (I even turn off my outdoor porch lights lest the glow from the window affect things).

It's not strange for a panel to need a notch or three of brightness. Due to panel variance.

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post #20182 of 22210 Old 08-12-2019, 01:07 PM
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I’️m currently on firmware 05.10.03 and noticed that web os tv version is different after this update. During the usb install I was trying to take a quick photo of the current TV information but it quickly finished and my TV rebooted.

For those who still have the previous firmware is your Dolby Vision the same as 1.5.0_17.00
The Dolby Vision version with firmware 4.10.55 was also 1.5.0_17.00 on my 65C8.

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post #20183 of 22210 Old 08-12-2019, 01:40 PM
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Originally Posted by BlazednSleepy View Post
OTA software just dropped in Los Angeles!
Why does everyone keep saying OTA which is short for Over The Air referring to using an antenna. With these updates it should be OTI for Over The Internet 😬

Last edited by rdgcss; 08-12-2019 at 01:59 PM.
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post #20184 of 22210 Old 08-12-2019, 01:57 PM
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Originally Posted by Ken Masters View Post
A large part of the calibration procedure is in ensuring the TV tracks the luminance targets, engaging the LG's dynamic tone mapping deviates from those targets (even taking ABL into consideration, their relative relationship is altered).
Good afternoon. Thanks for your input and help on this topic, it is appreciated. What you are saying here is basically what my concern was...that the DTM was (Negatively) impacting my calibration and altering the original content intent. Having just had my TV calibrated, I of course want the picture as accurate as possible, while of course not losing and visual information whenever possible.



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Originally Posted by Ken Masters View Post
I do and I do not engage DTM. DTM and the player's HDR Optimiser are doing two different things. What the player's optimiser is doing is the same thing that the LG's regular tone-mapping does. All that's happening now is that the player is ensuring that all content is tone-mapped down to 1000 nits before passing it on to the TV, so the TV's job of tone-mapping the image down to 700 nits is that much easier.
I actually thought till I read this that the Optimizer was just literally another form of Dynamic Tone Mapping. Is what the Optimizer does dynamic at all? (It sure seems like it.)


Quote:
Originally Posted by oledmod View Post
Basically, the LG does tone mapping twice if you switch on DTM. DTM changes HDR's fixed tone curve and thus the creator's intent - the picture will be less accurate. If you use a UB820/9000, then activate HDR Optimizer and leave DTM deactivated for the most accurate picture.
Just for my own curiosity... why is the HDR Optimizer better at doing what it does, but also maintaining the most of the creator's intent?

I had thought that Panasonic's actual OLEDs also have the HDR Optimizer build in. Do they? Do they just have their own version of DTM in there?

Thanks all.
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post #20185 of 22210 Old 08-12-2019, 01:58 PM
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Two choices: use ARC between the receiver and C8 or optical out from the tv to the receiver. Both will deliver 5.1 audio, when presented, from the internal apps.
TV supports Bluetooth output
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post #20186 of 22210 Old 08-12-2019, 02:03 PM
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Why does everyone keep saying OTA which is short for Over The Air referring to using an antenna. With these updates it should be OTI for Over The Internet 😬

All of that is construed as not using an USB stick.
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post #20187 of 22210 Old 08-12-2019, 02:07 PM
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TV supports Bluetooth output
Three choices then

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post #20188 of 22210 Old 08-12-2019, 02:21 PM
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Originally Posted by Roberto Pedro Martinez View Post
I'm in upstate NY and just received the OTA updade.
Any notes on what's been fixed?
Nah, no-one knows.

Seriously, the issue that has been fixed has been discussed on this thread for over a year, and specifically the 5.10.* firmwares since May, very easy to find via a basic search.
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post #20189 of 22210 Old 08-12-2019, 02:23 PM
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Originally Posted by chronitis View Post
Because you have to use 10% windows to calibrate. It takes time. Particularly for HDR.
You might have temporary image retention, sure. I notice it too when calibrating HDR. But that goes on its own after a few minutes. Certainly after the next comp cycle.

"Burn-in" means something permanent, and is different to temporary image retention.

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post #20190 of 22210 Old 08-12-2019, 02:26 PM
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Originally Posted by hamad138 View Post
Let's hope LG corrects gamma balance even further
What are you talking about, there is nothing left to correct. It's been proven with calibration scans posted here by jk82 that the gamma curve in 5.10.* is identical to the curve in 4.15

Quote:
until then I stay at 4.15 which is by far the best Firmware
Um, nope.

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