2018 Sony A9F Master Series OLED Owner's Thread - Page 24 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #691 of 3059 Old 10-02-2018, 12:30 PM
 
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This part from the rtings A9F review is concerning:

Quote:
Overall, the A9F's HDR brightness is slightly worse than the A8F, as some small details in some scenes aren't as bright.
https://www.rtings.com/tv/reviews/sony/a9f

and more so, because the a9f price is >1000 usd than the a8f at my place.
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post #692 of 3059 Old 10-02-2018, 01:11 PM
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I don't trust rtings sorry,waiting from some AF9 owners response

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post #693 of 3059 Old 10-02-2018, 02:05 PM - Thread Starter
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One red flag for me on TooSweet's post as well as Rtings review is the brightness setting vs Peak Luminance. If I recall correctly from D-Nice's A8F settings he posted as well as other calibration settings I've run across, the brightness was set to MAX and the Peak Luminance was Low for dark room and maybe Medium for bright room. Running Peak Luminance at High with Brightness at 50 or below is likely the source of some of the disconnect on perceived brightness and ASBL/ABL I suspect the peak luminance setting may be what triggers ABL, not the Brightness setting. I believe I noticed Vincent also ran Brightness at MAX in one of his A8F videos.

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post #694 of 3059 Old 10-02-2018, 02:06 PM
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Some Hard data on color accuracy in hdr mode. This was pointed here before?
https://www.avsforum.com/forum/40-ol...g-vs-sony.html
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post #695 of 3059 Old 10-02-2018, 02:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JLaud25 View Post
This part from the rtings A9F review is concerning:

https://www.rtings.com/tv/reviews/sony/a9f

and more so, because the a9f price is >1000 usd than the a8f at my place.
I thought their review was very accurate and in line with what I've experienced except for this comment about HDR brightness. Again, if this were the case, the A9 and the E8 wouldn't have looked almost identical at the shootout with all the types of content we used and I have both at home sitting side by side and they look incredibly close. Rtings does a great job with their reviews so i'm not sure why they experienced this.

John
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post #696 of 3059 Old 10-02-2018, 02:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by khollister View Post
One red flag for me on TooSweet's post as well as Rtings review is the brightness setting vs Peak Luminance. If I recall correctly from D-Nice's A8F settings he posted as well as other calibration settings I've run across, the brightness was set to MAX and the Peak Luminance was Low for dark room and maybe Medium for bright room. Running Peak Luminance at High with Brightness at 50 or below is likely the source of some of the disconnect on perceived brightness and ASBL/ABL I suspect the peak luminance setting may be what triggers ABL, not the Brightness setting. I believe I noticed Vincent also ran Brightness at MAX in one of his A8F videos.

John ... ?

BTW, just found out my calibrated 65A9F will ship out Monday, so I should have it late next week
I left you a PM

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post #697 of 3059 Old 10-02-2018, 02:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jrref View Post
I thought their review was very accurate and in line with what I've experienced except for this comment about HDR brightness. Again, if this were the case, the A9 and the E8 wouldn't have looked almost identical at the shootout with all the types of content we used and I have both at home sitting side by side and they look incredibly close. Rtings does a great job with their reviews so i'm not sure why they experienced this.
look at my post above...
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post #698 of 3059 Old 10-02-2018, 02:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TooSweet2345 View Post
I’m sorry if people think I’m bsing trust me I’m not I have the latest firmware saccording to flatpanels the problem is very slight and you may not even notice it unless your very sensitive to it whitch sadly I am maybe I just have my settings to high as I have the backlight at47 and peak lumienince to high and nfl and mlb games are where I notice it most I’m sorry if some people are upset and this dimming thing is just weird to me as some people never ever see it but some notice it right away I just don’t get it
There is no need to apologize. Unfortunately too many here are quick to dismiss the words of others. I saw someone on here call an actual Sony employee who works in the corporate office a best buy employee when they tried to give a heads up that the Z9D was going to be discontinued soon.

-I will probably end up getting a Sony A9F in the next few months to test it for myself. However I am leaning towards believing you in regards to the dimming for a few reasons. I don't fully trust rtings but I do consider their hdr sustained numbers to be pretty reliable. Their numbers for the sustained HDR 2%, 10%, and 25% for the Sony A8F and A9F are lower than what was on the Sony A1E before the dimming/DV firmware was implemented.

-Even without rtings mentioning it just by comparing the HDR sustained numbers I can see that dimming or something is still taking place. The Sony A1E sustained 10% HDR is 649 compared to 372 for the A9F, and 381 for the A8F. That difference is too great to be considered panel variation in my book.

-Also another pretty reliable site called digitalfernsehende has mentioned/shown that the Sony A9F still dims. It seems to be one of those issues where some appear to be sensitive to the dimming and others don't notice it.

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post #699 of 3059 Old 10-02-2018, 02:29 PM
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Yes that’s prob what I see because I’ve never been able to duplicate that a1e the first when I had it in the first few months I tried the a8f and now the a9f and both are sadly gunna have the same fate of being returned I just like the way peak lumenince on high looks in day viewing but not with it shifting darker every 2 minutes i had a feeling the lime once was the culprit but I wish Sony would give the option for me if I want it to dim or not because I really like the a9f but this dimming thing they implemented is not the way to go IMO
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post #700 of 3059 Old 10-02-2018, 02:30 PM
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Two things I want to say:
1) The article on the LG is very interesting and I know Tedd and other's have discovered this a while back. Thanks for posting it.
2) I raise an eyebrow when someone posts a behavior relating to a set that seems odd meaning that people with the set and some pro calibrators have not experienced it. Usually when someone posts something out of the ordinary it could be the PM and or settings and or the calibration that is causing the problem or maybe the set is out of tolerance or defective. I know D-Nice and I have seen sets out of tolerance more than once. I guess when someone posts something out of the ordinary, instead of taking it as fact, we should just accept it as a report and move on until the problem can be verified.


I have calibrated several A9s so far and i can tell you they are finnickey when it comes to the calibration but an experienced calibrator will know how to set them up correctly.

Update: At the end of the day if there is a problem, you will see experienced people who work with these sets every day, like D-Nice, Vincent, Chadb, myself, etc.,, reporting them.

John
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post #701 of 3059 Old 10-02-2018, 02:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TooSweet2345 View Post
I’m sorry if people think I’m bsing trust me I’m not I have the latest firmware saccording to flatpanels the problem is very slight and you may not even notice it unless your very sensitive to it whitch sadly I am maybe I just have my settings to high as I have the backlight at47 and peak lumienince to high and nfl and mlb games are where I notice it most I’m sorry if some people are upset and this dimming thing is just weird to me as some people never ever see it but some notice it right away I just don’t get it
Don't be sorry, we are just posting our different experience!

I would like to find out if it's just a very slight issue the I can't catch or if it's depend on the setting or what else
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post #702 of 3059 Old 10-02-2018, 02:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TooSweet2345 View Post
I’m sorry if people think I’m bsing trust me I’m not I have the latest firmware saccording to flatpanels the problem is very slight and you may not even notice it unless your very sensitive to it whitch sadly I am maybe I just have my settings to high as I have the backlight at47 and peak lumienince to high and nfl and mlb games are where I notice it most I’m sorry if some people are upset and this dimming thing is just weird to me as some people never ever see it but some notice it right away I just don’t get it
I have my brightness at 47, Contrast @ 90, Gamma @ -2 and Peak Luminance @ Low. I watch in a mostly dark room with some ambient light.

Mike

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post #703 of 3059 Old 10-02-2018, 02:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jrref View Post
Two things I want to say:
1) The article on the LG is very interesting and I know Tedd and other's have discovered this a while back. Thanks for posting it.
2) I raise an eyebrow when someone posts a behavior relating to a set that seems odd meaning that people with the set and some pro calibrators have not experienced it. Usually when someone posts something out of the ordinary it could be the PM and or settings and or the calibration that is causing the problem or maybe the set is out of tolerance or defective. I know D-Nice and I have seen sets out of tolerance more than once. I guess when someone posts something out of the ordinary, instead of taking it as fact, we should just accept it as a report and move on until the problem can be verified.


I have calibrated several A9s so far and i can tell you they are finnickey when it comes to the calibration but an experienced calibrator will know how to set them up correctly.

Update: At the end of the day if there is a problem, you will see experienced people who work with these sets every day, like D-Nice, Vincent, Chadb, myself, etc.,, reporting them.
Did you noticed this HDR subpar colour brightness i pointed on the latest LG oleds?
Here in Brazil oleds are kinda rare so i am limited to a few samples and have not calibrated any 2018 LG oled.

Thanks for the info.
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post #704 of 3059 Old 10-02-2018, 05:12 PM
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Originally Posted by henrique33 View Post
Did you noticed this HDR subpar colour brightness i pointed on the latest LG oleds?
Here in Brazil oleds are kinda rare so i am limited to a few samples and have not calibrated any 2018 LG oled.

Thanks for the info.
I haven't seen this but I know there are luminance problems due to the WRGB technology. What they say in the article makes sense to me and as mentioned, Tedd and other's have been talking about this for a while with these OLEDs.

John
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post #705 of 3059 Old 10-02-2018, 05:17 PM
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Originally Posted by jrref View Post
I didn't but I know there are luminance problems due to the RGBW technology. What they say in the article makes sense to me and as mentioned, Tedd and other's have been talking about this for a while with these OLEDs.
But on the Sonys it was alright, the problem was only observed on LG oleds...
Did you read the topic i created about it?

And what is this judd white target?
there is already an consensus about it?
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post #706 of 3059 Old 10-02-2018, 05:41 PM
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Yes I read what you posted, it's interesting and worth discussing.

As far as the Judd white point, I don't think enough people have the set to have a consensus yet. I haven't made up my mind yet. As Dewayne mentioned, this is a hot topic of discussion and there are many points of view. I'll be happy to join the discussion but I think we need a separate thread where we can look at all the points of view.

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post #707 of 3059 Old 10-02-2018, 05:42 PM
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BTW, my A9F got another automatic firmware update tonight. I have to go look to see what version it's at now.
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post #708 of 3059 Old 10-02-2018, 07:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Lord Axl View Post
I don't trust rtings sorry,waiting from some AF9 owners response
I like user reviews or reviews by Chad B or D Nice myself.......
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post #709 of 3059 Old 10-02-2018, 07:25 PM
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I would like to read even D-Nice's comments about the AF9 but he disappeared
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post #710 of 3059 Old 10-02-2018, 07:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jrref View Post
BTW, my A9F got another automatic firmware update tonight. I have to go look to see what version it's at now.
For me:

Original Firmware out of Box:
8.0.0, security patch level is June 1, 2018. Kernel 4.9.51. Firday Jul 27th 2018.
BRAVIA_UR1_4K_UC-user 8.0.0 OPR2.170623.027.S1

New Firmware from last week:
8.0.0, security patch level is July 1, 2018. Kernel 4.9.51. Firday Aug 31st 2018.
BRAVIA_UR1_4K_UC-user 8.0.0 OPR2.170623.027.S13

New Firmware Oct 2nd
8.0.0, security patch level is July 1, 2018. Kernel 4.9.51. Firday Sep 14th 2018.
BRAVIA_UR1_4K_UC-user 8.0.0 OPR2.170623.027.S14

Note the tiny point release i.e. S14 vs S13, meaning whatever was done, it was pretty minor.


Change in update over my 930c/d when using the update menu: "Completed the software update. You can use the latest software after powering the TV off and on. Once it is powered off, the TV will not respond for around 10 seconds"

The updates on the A9F have been nothing but instant vs my 930c/d. On the other sets, the updates took the 10-15 mins+, the two updates I've done so far have been rather instant.
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post #711 of 3059 Old 10-02-2018, 08:52 PM
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Originally Posted by jrref View Post
I have calibrated several A9s so far and i can tell you they are finnickey when it comes to the calibration but an experienced calibrator will know how to set them up correctly.
Finnickey and touchy. However, excellent results if you know what you are doing.
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Hi all,

I just bought my AF9 55" (this is how the A9F is called here in Germany where I´m currently assigned) and I really need your help fellas. As in Germany I only have 5 days to return/exchange it in case necessary, I would greatly appreciate your input regarding my panel banding and uniformity (I´m not an expert and this is my first OLED). The attached picture was taken after approx. 8h of use with Cinema mode on and no changes whatsoever (Max brightness, Peak luminance= medium).

Watching Marco Polo (S1E3 - 14-16min.) the banding is hardly noticed, but it is visible at some scenes for sure.

Thanks in advance for your support!


Kind regards,


HDMII.
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post #713 of 3059 Old 10-03-2018, 04:12 AM
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Finnickey and touchy. However, excellent results if you know what you are doing.
D-nice please could you post your opinion about the AF9 please?!
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post #714 of 3059 Old 10-03-2018, 04:14 AM
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Hi all,

I just bought my AF9 55" (this is how the A9F is called here in Germany where I´m currently assigned) and I really need your help fellas. As in Germany I only have 5 days to return/exchange it in case necessary, I would greatly appreciate your input regarding my panel banding and uniformity (I´m not an expert and this is my first OLED). The attached picture was taken after approx. 8h of use with Cinema mode on and no changes whatsoever (Max brightness, Peak luminance= medium).

Watching Marco Polo (S1E3 - 14-16min.) the banding is hardly noticed, but it is visible at some scenes for sure.

Thanks in advance for your support!


Kind regards,


HDMII.
People will say the dark spot on the left side will get better after a few comp cycles and then you will have an acceptable panel. i waited a few weeks for mine to get better, i have no patience so I returned it. i just couldnt justify having 2 OLED's with banding. i know they all have it to some extent. don't get me wrong, the picture is beautiful. the perfect contrast and black uniformity really make an OLED stand out compared to an LCD. case in point, I just bought the Sony Z9D which was their flagship LCD for 2016 and while it has no banding and it gets much brighter than OLED i still feel the OLED produces a better picture. having said that I will probably keep this LCD as my main living room tv and use my OLED in my bedroom.
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Originally Posted by HDMII View Post
Hi all,

I just bought my AF9 55" (this is how the A9F is called here in Germany where I´m currently assigned) and I really need your help fellas. As in Germany I only have 5 days to return/exchange it in case necessary, I would greatly appreciate your input regarding my panel banding and uniformity (I´m not an expert and this is my first OLED). The attached picture was taken after approx. 8h of use with Cinema mode on and no changes whatsoever (Max brightness, Peak luminance= medium).

Watching Marco Polo (S1E3 - 14-16min.) the banding is hardly noticed, but it is visible at some scenes for sure.

Thanks in advance for your support!


Kind regards,


HDMII.
The darker band just left off center could become problematic if it gets even either darker or brighter because you will see it as it's almost at the center of the screen. Try to use the panel as much as possible for four consecutive hours then turn off the TV and let do its compensation circle. Rince and repeat.
If it seems to get worse get the TV exchanged because it's very hard to live with a flawed panel once you've seen where the problem is at; you will look for it each time for sure..

Envoyé de mon SM-N960F en utilisant Tapatalk
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post #716 of 3059 Old 10-03-2018, 04:35 AM
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Originally Posted by akadennis View Post
People will say the dark spot on the left side will get better after a few comp cycles and then you will have an acceptable panel. i waited a few weeks for mine to get better, i have no patience so I returned it. i just couldnt justify having 2 OLED's with banding. i know they all have it to some extent. don't get me wrong, the picture is beautiful. the perfect contrast and black uniformity really make an OLED stand out compared to an LCD. case in point, I just bought the Sony Z9D which was their flagship LCD for 2016 and while it has no banding and it gets much brighter than OLED i still feel the OLED produces a better picture. having said that I will probably keep this LCD as my main living room tv and use my OLED in my bedroom.
Thanks for your input akadennis, the dark spot is indeed getting better since yesterday.

Please keep your opinion coming fellas =)
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post #717 of 3059 Old 10-03-2018, 04:37 AM - Thread Starter
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Just added links to the Rtings and TrustedReviews A9F reviews in post #2

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post #718 of 3059 Old 10-03-2018, 05:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HDMII View Post
Hi all,

I just bought my AF9 55" (this is how the A9F is called here in Germany where I´m currently assigned) and I really need your help fellas. As in Germany I only have 5 days to return/exchange it in case necessary, I would greatly appreciate your input regarding my panel banding and uniformity (I´m not an expert and this is my first OLED). The attached picture was taken after approx. 8h of use with Cinema mode on and no changes whatsoever (Max brightness, Peak luminance= medium).

Watching Marco Polo (S1E3 - 14-16min.) the banding is hardly noticed, but it is visible at some scenes for sure.

Thanks in advance for your support!


Kind regards,


HDMII.
I would do one manual screen refresh and see how it looks.

John
Sony 55A1E, A9F / LG 55OLEDC8
Marantz 7012, Ohm Walsh Speakers
Klein K10-A, Jeti 1501, Murideo Six-G Gen2
Calman Ultimate, ISF Level III Certified
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post #719 of 3059 Old 10-03-2018, 05:36 AM
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Originally Posted by jrref View Post
I would do one manual screen refresh and see how it looks.
He did say it’s getting better so no disrespect to jrref but I would refrain from doing the manual if you already noticing that it’s getting better. I have seen some people say doing the manual actually made it worse. Just my 2 cents.
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post #720 of 3059 Old 10-03-2018, 05:41 AM
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Originally Posted by jrref View Post
BTW, my A9F got another automatic firmware update tonight. I have to go look to see what version it's at now.
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Originally Posted by jsessler View Post
For me:

Original Firmware out of Box:
8.0.0, security patch level is June 1, 2018. Kernel 4.9.51. Firday Jul 27th 2018.
BRAVIA_UR1_4K_UC-user 8.0.0 OPR2.170623.027.S1

New Firmware from last week:
8.0.0, security patch level is July 1, 2018. Kernel 4.9.51. Firday Aug 31st 2018.
BRAVIA_UR1_4K_UC-user 8.0.0 OPR2.170623.027.S13

New Firmware Oct 2nd
8.0.0, security patch level is July 1, 2018. Kernel 4.9.51. Firday Sep 14th 2018.
BRAVIA_UR1_4K_UC-user 8.0.0 OPR2.170623.027.S14

Note the tiny point release i.e. S14 vs S13, meaning whatever was done, it was pretty minor.


Change in update over my 930c/d when using the update menu: "Completed the software update. You can use the latest software after powering the TV off and on. Once it is powered off, the TV will not respond for around 10 seconds"

The updates on the A9F have been nothing but instant vs my 930c/d. On the other sets, the updates took the 10-15 mins+, the two updates I've done so far have been rather instant.
Mine is still:
Version
8.0.0

Android security patch level
June 1, 2018

Kernel version
4.9.51
[email protected] #1
Fri Jul 27th 2018 11:17:37 JST 2018

Build
BRAVIA_UR1_4K_UC-user 8.0.0 OPR2.170623.027.S1
600581 release-keys

I have auto-updates turned on and I tried a manual update last night and it said it was up-to-date.

Am I going to the right place? I see the software version in About and to update the software: About > System software update > Software update.

Something weird did happen last night though:
When my son and I left the house around 6pm, we powered off the TV normally. When we got back at around 9pm, it wouldn't respond to either my Harmony remote or its own remote. I checked all the power connections and everything seemed good. It turned on when I pressed the power button on the side of the unit.

Sony XBR65A9F | Denon AVRX4300H | Klipsch R110SW | Apple TV 4k | TiVo Bolt+ | Tivo Roamio Pro | Panasonic DP-UB820 | Harmony Elite | AC Infinity T9 | Samsung UN40MU6290

Last edited by barbja; 10-03-2018 at 05:49 AM.
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