OLED Light. What is it? - Page 2 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #31 of 46 Old 01-10-2019, 09:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Exist_To_Resist View Post
No it's not a gimmick. Let me see if I can explain this.

OLED light, increases the current flow to each pixel. Meaning that let's say you have a pixel emitting 0 light increasing the light from 50 to 100 will still have the pixel emit 0 light. However if you have a pixel at 100 brightness and it's emitting 50% of the light because OLED light is at 50 (let's interpret the oled light at 50 as 50% of it's output/current value), increasing the OLED light to 100 will take the pixel that is emitting 100% brightness at 50% OLED to emitting 100% brightness at 100% of the OLED light.

Brightness refers to the overall lightness or darkness of the image. Increasing the brightness every pixel in the frame gets lighter. You are in turn limiting the brightness spectrum of the pixels. It will even wash out blacks if raised high enough and lower the brightness of the brightest pixels if lowered enough.

Contrast is the difference in brightness between objects in the image. Increasing the contrast makes light areas lighter and dark area in the frame becomes much darker.

Does that make sense?

No, it doesn't. Contrast and brightness are the same thing in the context of my comments. I'm well aware that most TVs designate the 'Brightness' setting in the menu for black level. That's not how I was using the term brightness in my comments.


I understand what you're saying in the first paragraph, but it's still a gimmick in that all it's giving you is perhaps a finer level of contrast adjustment; however, this could be achieved the same way by simply having a finer level of steps in a standard, single Contrast setting (i.e. no additional adjustment for 'OLED light').
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post #32 of 46 Old 01-10-2019, 09:40 AM
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I guess I always just figured that the brightness and contrast settings were the EQ sliders, and the OLED light was the master volume. *shrug*

I'm not sure I'd call something a gimmick if the product is designed to work the way it does, but I'm no TVologist.
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post #33 of 46 Old 01-10-2019, 10:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gorman42 View Post
Having gone from CRT to a couple of plasma screens (industrial Panasonic and later my current Kuro) I still don't understand what is the OLED Light setting supposed to regulate.


While I understood that for LCDs you could have a setting that regulates the intensity of the backlighting, I don't get what OLED light is supposed to do, with the technology being self emissive.


I guess my question could be: since both plasma and OLED are emissive techs, why is picture controlled by just contrast and brightness on plasma and it needs a third setting (OLED Light) for OLED?

Here is a fun fact I learned at CES, OLED Burn In, is actually “Burn Out” so that Burned in image is actually the colors that Burned Out and left behind a retained latent image.
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post #34 of 46 Old 01-17-2019, 10:31 PM
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Contrast adjusts the white level (without affecting the black level).



Brightness adjusts the black level (without affecting the white level).


OLED Light adjusts the overall luminance of the screen (how much light it puts out) without (significantly) affecting either the white level or black level.


The OLED Light setting is not a gimmick. It allows you to raise/lower the overall luminance of the picture without clipping whites or crushing blacks.



When I optimize (I don't calibrate) picture settings with something like AVS HD 709 patterns, first I set the black level (brightness) so that line 16 is not visible, and line 17 is barely visible. Next I set the contrast so that at least line 234 flashes, but with our B6 OLED I can go up to line 253 flashing with a setting of 84. Now, I can adjust OLED Light so that the screen appears very bright or very dim, or anywhere in between, and it won't significantly affect my black level or white level settings.

@gorman42 You say that you can just use the Contrast setting to raise the light output. That's true, but it's limited. Raise Contrast too much and you're clipping whites. OLED Light allow you to significantly increase the overall light output of the panel without clipping whites (and without crushing blacks when significantly decreasing the overall light output).
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post #35 of 46 Old 01-20-2019, 04:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wxman View Post
Setting OLED light during the day to 100 makes a big difference. 5000 hours now with OLED light at 100 on my EF9500.
How are you able to change it? It's greyed out and not adjustable on mine. It shows "Energy Savings".
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post #36 of 46 Old 01-20-2019, 05:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by a_ok2me View Post
How are you able to change it? It's greyed out and not adjustable on mine. It shows "Energy Savings".
Set energy saving to off.

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post #37 of 46 Old 01-20-2019, 05:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Reflex-Arc View Post
I guess I always just figured that the brightness and contrast settings were the EQ sliders, and the OLED light was the master volume. *shrug*

I'm not sure I'd call something a gimmick if the product is designed to work the way it does, but I'm no TVologist.

The problem that's causing confusion is that with the introduction of two knobs which both tweak the amount of light that the TV emits, contrast and OLED light, there are now multiple combinations of those two settings which produce the same number of nits from the display. So what's the "right" combination to achieve the perceived brightness you want?


In order to interpret the OLED light value as a master volume knob you have to assume that changing it doesn't impact the calibration of the display. I'm certainly not an expert, but every calibration workflow I've seen assumes that everything affects everything else. So I'd not expect to be able to change the OLED light level without knocking the calibration out of whack. Has anyone tested that?


If the contrast setting can accomplish the same effect as OLED light, and changing OLED light has the same potential negative impact on calibration as changing contrast, then adding an OLED light setting is a marketing gimmick. It makes you think you've got an extra fancy knob that makes your display better when in fact it adds nothing of real value.
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post #38 of 46 Old 01-21-2019, 06:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wxman View Post
Set energy saving to off.
There's no option to adjust every savings on my 65EF9500.
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post #39 of 46 Old 01-21-2019, 08:28 PM
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PDP and CRT didn't get too bright for a normal room, so they didn't need this setting.

OLED light is just a simple linear overall output control.
You don't combine it with brightness. Just set brightness to set up the image, e.g. 85 for SDR, later use Light to adjust for ambient lighting.



Quote:
Originally Posted by janos666 View Post
Yes, although the highest possible peak brightness of SDR is somewhere between 50 and 75% of the HDR mode because the SDR mode is pretty close to real additive RGB color space but HDR is allowed to cut the saturation in favor of white brightness (the W subpixel is allowed to make the image brighter even if it de-saturates the RGB colors).
The reports are that the four pixels are never on at the same time, though. This would indicate the W subpixel doesn't come on unless it's a less-saturated image.
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post #40 of 46 Old 01-21-2019, 09:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by a_ok2me View Post
There's no option to adjust every savings on my 65EF9500.
What picture mode are you using? Click on picture in the menu, at very top there is Smart Picture Mode. Make sure that is off. Next scroll down. There is Picture Mode Settings, below that Aspect ratio, below that 3D setting, below that Dual Play, and below that is Energy Saving. Turn it off.

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post #41 of 46 Old 01-22-2019, 03:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AnalogHD View Post
PDP and CRT didn't get too bright for a normal room, so they didn't need this setting.

Samsung PDPs (at least the D, E, F series, I am not sure about earlier models) had a Cell Light control in the user menu. It had practically the same function as OLED Light has on these LG TVs.
Pioneer PDPs (at least the Kuros ~) used a similar method for controlling the peak output with the Room Sensor (when a sensor was present and this auto adjustment was enabled).
Even the late Panasonic PDPs had a Panel Brightness control (although this was limited to 3 steps instead of 10 or so and seemed to alter other driving settings as well, not just the peak output).



Quote:
Originally Posted by AnalogHD View Post
OLED light is just a simple linear overall output control.
You don't combine it with brightness. Just set brightness to set up the image, e.g. 85 for SDR, later use Light to adjust for ambient lighting.

I know how to use these controls. That's not what I meant.
I just wondered if it could theoretically be a redundant user control which ultimately adjust the same digital contrast range in the background. But I doubt that. It was just an idea (a possibility).


My best guess is that OLED Light was added to make better use of the LVDS bit depth (the theoretical max shading precision of the display panel). The LVDS is 10bit but that covers a fairly big luminance range. Hence, a lot of the 0-1023 values would go to waste in SDR mode (the upper end would never be utilized). So, another control was added to remap that 10bit input range into a different analog voltage output range (to better suit SDR mode dark room applications, let them use the whole 10bit precision).

This was pretty much the same role of Cell Light (and alike) on the PDPs mentioned above (with the exception that those had far less native steps and slower overall processing precision because PDPs used heavy dithering and processors in general were much more expensive and/or slower some 5-8 years ago than today).


If these LGD OLED panels used, say, 12+ bit LVDS connection then OLED Light would probably be redundant (the digital Contrast could fully replace it without visible loss of precision). Except it seems the internal LUT layer is below the Contrast adjustment layer, so that would need to be redesigned (or, you know, this is yet another reason to have the OLED Light...).

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Last edited by janos666; 01-22-2019 at 03:26 AM.
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post #42 of 46 Old 01-22-2019, 08:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wxman View Post
What picture mode are you using? Click on picture in the menu, at very top there is Smart Picture Mode. Make sure that is off. Next scroll down. There is Picture Mode Settings, below that Aspect ratio, below that 3D setting, below that Dual Play, and below that is Energy Saving. Turn it off.
Thanks
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post #43 of 46 Old 01-22-2019, 02:10 PM
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Two settings (ISF Day, and ISF Night) cannot cover every possible lighting condition in a room with windows and lamps.

And while this is not the default on the LG (for reasons I've never seen explained), I've set my ISF Day setting identical to my ISF Night setting (with a higher OLED Lamp value). One calibration setting and a light output knob is a lot easier to maintain.
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post #44 of 46 Old 02-26-2019, 03:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by a_ok2me View Post
There's no option to adjust every savings on my 65EF9500.
Quote:
Originally Posted by wxman View Post
What picture mode are you using? Click on picture in the menu, at very top there is Smart Picture Mode. Make sure that is off. Next scroll down. There is Picture Mode Settings, below that Aspect ratio, below that 3D setting, below that Dual Play, and below that is Energy Saving. Turn it off.
Hmm... I guess the OLED Light and Contrast settings are greyed-out when HDR is on.

Last edited by a_ok2me; 02-26-2019 at 03:36 PM.
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post #45 of 46 Old 02-26-2019, 06:02 PM
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Cell light on my Samsung plasma does effect brightness and contrast. It raises the overall phosphor luminance of the display which effects black and white levels.



Essentially brightness would set black level while not effecting white level. Contrast would set white level while not effecting black level. Although contrast can clip your whites at the upper limit, cell light could increase white level luminance without clipping but would raise your black level at the same time.
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post #46 of 46 Old 06-10-2019, 07:48 AM
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So something interesting happened to me the other day, that "visually explained" the difference, at least for me, with my LG E8, and "OLED LIGHT" vs "BRIGHTNESS".

I had to reboot my Hopper 3, and that caused several minutes of "black blank screen" (I have the screen saver turned off on my E8), and instead of the "inky, super dark, black" that I expected, I saw what I might call a "CRT Glow".

Sorry for such a vague description, so let me explain further. Say that, "back in the day", you were watching a DVD on your CRT TV, and you turned off the DVD, but kept the CRT TV on, the screen would be "blank", but it would have a slight "glow", so that the screen would still be black and blank, but it was very obvious that the CRT TV was on.


Well, that is what I saw on my LG E8. I went into settings, still while the Hopper3 is rebooting, and I still have a total blank screen, I turned the "BRIGHTNESS" down, until the "blank screen" appeared totally black, as if it were turned off.

I then played with the OLED LIGHT setting, and I could turn the OLED light up to 100, and still the blank screen appeared to be "turned off black".

After I had a picture again, I could turn up the OLED LIGHT and make my picture brighter, so that was good, should i need to make it brighter.

Also, when I had my "black blank screen glow", on, when I turned down the BRIGHTNESS, at one setting, the screen became "turned off black", and turning the brightness down any further did not make my screen any "blacker".

For me, the BRIGHTNESS setting for getting "turned off black" screen was 58.

I know that one of the awesome benefits of an OLED screen, is that "inky black, darker than dark" blacks, and I would hate to loose that by turning up the brightness too high!

NOW I understand the difference between "OLED LIGHT" and "BRIGHTNESS"!

So, I hope my very non technical description benefits someone!

Last edited by BuddTX; 06-10-2019 at 08:06 AM.
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