OLED TVs Hit By Severe Blocking And Flashing Problems Poll - Page 6 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
View Poll Results: Do you see macroblock flashing on your 2018 OLED?
No macroblock flashing on my 2018 LG OLED. 65 36.11%
Macroblock Flashing visible on my 2018 LG OLED. 82 45.56%
No macroblock flashing on my 2018 Sony OLED. 18 10.00%
Macroblock Flashing visible on my 2018 Sony OLED. 6 3.33%
No macroblock flashing on my 2018 Panasonic OLED. 4 2.22%
Macroblock Flashing visible on my 2018 Panasonic OLED. 2 1.11%
No macroblock flashing on my 2018 Philips OLED. 2 1.11%
Macroblock Flashing visible on my 2018 Philips OLED. 3 1.67%
No macroblock flashing on my 2018 Other OLED. 0 0%
Macroblock Flashing visible on my 2018 Other OLED. 4 2.22%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 180. You may not vote on this poll

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post #151 of 493 Old 01-09-2019, 09:23 AM
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Originally Posted by mattg3 View Post
Good for LG owners but what about Sony owners who have also identified the issue on 2018 Sony models?
I'm hoping that John Archer contacted Sony on this as well and we'll hear back from them soon; however I find Sony slow to respond compared to LG - just look at how late the Oreo firmware update for A8F is.

Once again kudos to jk82, iSeries and Wizziwig and others who pushed for this!
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post #152 of 493 Old 01-09-2019, 10:40 AM
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Originally Posted by ion.jorj View Post
I'm hoping that John Archer contacted Sony on this as well and we'll hear back from them soon; however I find Sony slow to respond compared to LG - just look at how late the Oreo firmware update for A8F is.

Once again kudos to jk82, iSeries and Wizziwig and others who pushed for this!
Yep. I hope it's something that LG can make available easily to Sony and Panasonic. If it's left up to Sony, well... look how late their "early 2017" dolby vision update was.

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post #153 of 493 Old 01-09-2019, 10:43 AM
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I wouldn't hold my breath for Sony fixing this.

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post #154 of 493 Old 01-09-2019, 01:11 PM
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Hopefully there will be enough 2018 Sony A8F / A9F users (and possibly some 2019 A9G / A8G, who knows) users affected to make them care.
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post #155 of 493 Old 01-09-2019, 01:32 PM
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Hmm...back on the c8 65" shopping.
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post #156 of 493 Old 01-11-2019, 06:28 AM
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We now have another legit source confirming that LG has confirmed the issue and is working on a fix. Received this yesterday from rtings via email:

"Hi Ricky,

We tested this on our LG OLEDs and Sony A9F, and were able to reproduce the issue with a test pattern. It appears that it occurs when the white sub-pixel is turned on or off in dark scenes, for example, if there is a pixel switch from (3,5,7) to (0,5,7). LG has confirmed the issue, and is working on a fix. Because the fix can impact the TV's picture quality, they are making sure there are no adverse effects from the fix, so they are currently saying it should be ready in the next couple of months.

We've posted a video of this over on AVS, you can see it here: https://www.avsforum.com/forum/40-ol...l#post57376996

Adam Babcock
RTINGS.com"
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post #157 of 493 Old 01-11-2019, 07:54 AM
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Fixing flashing is good. But what about macroblocking/graduation artifacts in shadows and near blacks?
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post #158 of 493 Old 01-11-2019, 12:30 PM
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Originally Posted by Dimon.Zorg View Post
Fixing flashing is good. But what about macroblocking/graduation artifacts in shadows and near blacks?
That is completely separate, and has been a design choice of LG for every OLED going back many years. See Vincent's video. Here's an example from his review of the 55EG920V way back in 2015:
https://www.hdtvtest.co.uk/news/55eg...1511164212.htm
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According to LG, the above-black handling on its 2015 OLEDs is done at lower than 8-bit gradation, which explains various dark-scene phenomenons (especially with less-than-pristine video signal) such as false contouring, increased noisiness, misfiring pixels, and intermittently floating blacks (video black would light up ever so slightly even after we’ve set [Brightness] correctly against a PLUGE pattern). While careful calibration at the lower end could attenuate some of these issues, the only surefire method to make all these above-black artefacts disappear was – ironically – to lower [Brightness] and crush some shadow detail.
Of course we'd all like this to be improve so that it wasn't done at 4, 5, 6 or 7-bit gradation - but it's absolutely nothing to do with this thread whatsoever.

It's a pity that reviewers other than Vincent haven't criticised LG for this - if they had been more vocally critical in 2015, 2016 and 2017, then perhaps the 2018 10-bit panels would have had 8, 9, or even 10-bit gradation near black, who knows!

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post #159 of 493 Old 01-11-2019, 02:59 PM
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Originally Posted by mrtickleuk View Post
That is completely separate, and has been a design choice of LG for every OLED going back many years. See Vincent's video. Here's an example from his review of the 55EG920V way back in 2015:
https://www.hdtvtest.co.uk/news/55eg...1511164212.htm


Of course we'd all like this to be improve so that it wasn't done at 4, 5, 6 or 7-bit gradation - but it's absolutely nothing to do with this thread whatsoever.

It's a pity that reviewers other than Vincent haven't criticised LG for this - if they had been more vocally critical in 2015, 2016 and 2017, then perhaps the 2018 10-bit panels would have had 8, 9, or even 10-bit gradation near black, who knows!
How is it that Sony and Panasonic are seemingly avoiding this issue?
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post #160 of 493 Old 01-18-2019, 10:43 AM
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Hi, does anybody have news about this on Sony TVs? Will Sony fix the issue as well?
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post #161 of 493 Old 01-18-2019, 01:43 PM
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Only manufacturer who has announced a fix publicly is LG.

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post #162 of 493 Old 01-18-2019, 01:49 PM
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Only manufacturer who has announced a fix publicly is LG.
Which is somewhat concerning as supposedly the problem is inherent to all 2018 panels from LGD which would include Sony products and not just LG TVs.
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post #163 of 493 Old 01-18-2019, 02:29 PM
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This thread is just so depressing. It's amazing that this TV does so many things so well, yet stumbles on the very reason most of us bought it for - dark scenes.

Last edited by hhaller; 01-18-2019 at 02:59 PM.
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post #164 of 493 Old 01-18-2019, 03:34 PM
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That‘s exactely what it is. Do you have the issue wirh SDR and HDR? So far, all the scenes I saw it were SDR. I have to do some HDR testing though.
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post #165 of 493 Old 01-18-2019, 03:44 PM
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Originally Posted by sonicblue83 View Post
That‘s exactely what it is. Do you have the issue wirh SDR and HDR? So far, all the scenes I saw it were SDR. I have to do some HDR testing though.
Before this week I saw both issues frequently with SDR. This week I saw it with Dolby Vision for the first time. It's gutting.


Pics of the gradation/crush/blocking whatever-you-want-to-call-it issue attached. Not great pic quality I know, but this was from DV content.
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post #166 of 493 Old 01-18-2019, 06:21 PM
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Originally Posted by hhaller View Post
Before this week I saw both issues frequently with SDR. This week I saw it with Dolby Vision for the first time. It's gutting.


Pics of the gradation/crush/blocking whatever-you-want-to-call-it issue attached. Not great pic quality I know, but this was from DV content.
Was the video paused when you took those pics?
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post #167 of 493 Old 01-18-2019, 07:21 PM
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Was the video paused when you took those pics?
No.
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post #168 of 493 Old 01-18-2019, 08:20 PM
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It would be great to make an petition to LG about these problems. LG should know that unsolved troubles with all that macroblocking/gradation crap scare away customers from buying LG OLED TV.
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post #169 of 493 Old 01-18-2019, 08:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hhaller View Post
Before this week I saw both issues frequently with SDR. This week I saw it with Dolby Vision for the first time. It's gutting.


Pics of the gradation/crush/blocking whatever-you-want-to-call-it issue attached. Not great pic quality I know, but this was from DV content.
Wanted to repost my pictures from the Skyfall Blu-ray. I added a 3rd picture to show how my replacement panel handles the scene. First picture is my initial C8 which had the problem to the extreme. Second picture is my Panasonic ST60 Plasma. Third picture is my replacement and current C8. The Plasma handles the scene well as expected. My replacement is definitely better than my first C8. There is definitely a variation in the degree of macroblocking/flashing in the C8’s. Some are better than others. But even though my current C8 handles this reference disc better it still looks like crap on many SDR cable dark scenes. Waiting to see how much the firmware update affects all content.
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post #170 of 493 Old 01-18-2019, 10:30 PM
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Originally Posted by pwiss View Post
Wanted to repost my pictures from the Skyfall Blu-ray. I added a 3rd picture to show how my replacement panel handles the scene. First picture is my initial C8 which had the problem to the extreme. Second picture is my Panasonic ST60 Plasma. Third picture is my replacement and current C8. The Plasma handles the scene well as expected. My replacement is definitely better than my first C8. There is definitely a variation in the degree of macroblocking/flashing in the C8’s. Some are better than others. But even though my current C8 handles this reference disc better it still looks like crap on many SDR cable dark scenes. Waiting to see how much the firmware update affects all content.

...and yet your disc looked fine on my C8 I'm beginning to think that my C8 is truly an anomaly. However, I'm not complaining !

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post #171 of 493 Old 01-18-2019, 11:01 PM
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The problem does really exists. I encounter with such awful pixelation and gradation periodically on my B8
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post #172 of 493 Old 01-19-2019, 04:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hhaller View Post
Before this week I saw both issues frequently with SDR. This week I saw it with Dolby Vision for the first time. It's gutting.


Pics of the gradation/crush/blocking whatever-you-want-to-call-it issue attached. Not great pic quality I know, but this was from DV content.


Do these scene flicker too? Do you own a Sony AF9/A9F or another brand?

I have scenes similar like that on my AF9, but when I played the same scene on my iPhone‘s OLED screen the scenes looked equally. A lot of this blocking is really within the content itself. So far the only issue I saw on my AF9 is the flickering.

I talked to Vincent Teoh and John Archer. Vincent told me that he talked to Sony and they are investigating the flicker issue. John told me he hasen‘t talked to Sony yet because LG told him they are in communication with the other OLED brands over the flickering issue.
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post #173 of 493 Old 01-19-2019, 05:29 AM
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Originally Posted by sonicblue83 View Post
I talked to Vincent Teoh and John Archer. Vincent told me that he talked to Sony and they are investigating the flicker issue. John told me he hasen‘t talked to Sony yet because LG told him they are in communication with the other OLED brands over the flickering issue.
Very interesting! Does this mean you met them at CES, when you say you talked to them?

LG is certainly doing all the right things here - they've committed to a firmware fix for this near-black chrominance overshoot issue and they are pro-actively talking to their other customers so that they too can fix their products. Couldn't really ask for more in the circumstances.

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post #174 of 493 Old 01-19-2019, 05:38 AM
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No, I wrote them and they answered me what I wrote above.
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post #175 of 493 Old 01-19-2019, 08:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sonicblue83 View Post
Do these scene flicker too? Do you own a Sony AF9/A9F or another brand?

I have scenes similar like that on my AF9, but when I played the same scene on my iPhone‘s OLED screen the scenes looked equally. A lot of this blocking is really within the content itself. So far the only issue I saw on my AF9 is the flickering.

I talked to Vincent Teoh and John Archer. Vincent told me that he talked to Sony and they are investigating the flicker issue. John told me he hasen‘t talked to Sony yet because LG told him they are in communication with the other OLED brands over the flickering issue.
I own a C8. I don't recall these scenes flickering (these were from Daredevil on Netflix) but I do recall seeing both issues simultaneously on SDR content with Netflix (Hold the Dark, Haunting of Hill House).


Hopefully they can fix both issues, and soon.
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post #176 of 493 Old 01-19-2019, 08:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pwiss View Post
Wanted to repost my pictures from the Skyfall Blu-ray. I added a 3rd picture to show how my replacement panel handles the scene. First picture is my initial C8 which had the problem to the extreme. Second picture is my Panasonic ST60 Plasma. Third picture is my replacement and current C8. The Plasma handles the scene well as expected. My replacement is definitely better than my first C8. There is definitely a variation in the degree of macroblocking/flashing in the C8’s. Some are better than others. But even though my current C8 handles this reference disc better it still looks like crap on many SDR cable dark scenes. Waiting to see how much the firmware update affects all content.
I'd say your replacement C8 looks marginally better. That's interesting.


And man oh man there are some days when I miss plasma!
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post #177 of 493 Old 01-19-2019, 10:08 AM
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Originally Posted by Dimon.Zorg View Post
The problem does really exists. I encounter with such awful pixelation and gradation periodically on my B8

I never said the problem didn't exist because obviously it does. It just doesn't exist, or is easily noticeable, with all C8 owners.

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post #178 of 493 Old 01-19-2019, 10:48 AM
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Originally Posted by Otto Pylot View Post
It just doesn't exist, or is easily noticeable, with all C8 owners.
You can see what C8 owners say about issuies in late posts . Alas issuies with macroblocking/gradation in shadows and near black has long history. It is sad that LG didn't resolve it yet.
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post #179 of 493 Old 01-19-2019, 10:53 AM
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Originally Posted by Dimon.Zorg View Post
You can see what C8 owners say about issuies in late posts . Alas issuies with macroblocking/gradation in shadows and near black has long history. It is sad that LG didn't resolve it yet.

If you're going to quote me, at least quote my entire post. Otherwise, other readers may get the impression that I'm saying issues don't exist, because they do. Just not for everyone.
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post #180 of 493 Old 01-19-2019, 12:28 PM
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Alas issuies with macroblocking/gradation in shadows and near black has long history. It is sad that LG didn't resolve it yet.
Sure but just please remember this thread is NOT about those issues, to be clear. It's about the near-black chrominance overshoot, which is visible as "flashing"; that is the issue reported on and that is the only issue LG is committed to fixing.
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