AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews (https://www.avsforum.com/forum/)
-   OLED Technology and Flat Panels General (https://www.avsforum.com/forum/40-oled-technology-flat-panels-general/)
-   -   Real world differences between B8 & C8? (https://www.avsforum.com/forum/40-oled-technology-flat-panels-general/3056634-real-world-differences-between-b8-c8.html)

srkmish 03-15-2019 09:15 AM

Real world differences between B8 & C8?
 
Hey Guys,

Just wondering if there are any real world differences when viewing certain kinds of content in the mentioned 2 TVs. I would be watching Netflix/Amazon Prime HDR, blu ray HDRs and playing HDR games. Is the price difference worth it for getting the C8?

chunon 03-15-2019 09:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by srkmish (Post 57750300)
Hey Guys,



Just wondering if there are any real world differences when viewing certain kinds of content in the mentioned 2 TVs. I would be watching Netflix/Amazon Prime HDR, blu ray HDRs and playing HDR games. Is the price difference worth it for getting the C8?



I would say they are probably very close , my philosophy is an oled is an oled .


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

TravisPNW 03-15-2019 09:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by srkmish (Post 57750300)
Hey Guys,

Just wondering if there are any real world differences when viewing certain kinds of content in the mentioned 2 TVs. I would be watching Netflix/Amazon Prime HDR, blu ray HDRs and playing HDR games. Is the price difference worth it for getting the C8?


It wasn't last year. The panels were the same. I think the only differences between the B7 and the C7 were Atmos speakers which nobody who takes HT seriously would care about because they have their own sound system... as well as a black vs gray bezel and I think the stand may have differed as well.


I went with the B7... and I don't even notice the gray bezel viewing in the dark.

IMWhizzle 03-15-2019 09:51 AM

I’ve read that the colours on the C8 are somewhat better.

fafrd 03-15-2019 10:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IMWhizzle (Post 57750540)
I’ve read that the colours on the C8 are somewhat better.

That's nonsense (or a lousy calibration). PQ and all features were identical with one exception:

-B8 coukd handle 120Hz SDR as well as 60Hz HDR, but not 120Hz HDR.

-C8 could handle 120Hz HDR (which is only relevant to gaming, possibly).

We don't yet know about differences between the B9 and C9, but there is pretty much no reason to prefer the C8 over the B8 unless you prefer the C9 styling or the Atmos up-firing speakers.

IMWhizzle 03-15-2019 10:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fafrd (Post 57750614)
That's nonsense (or a lousy calibration). PQ and all features were identical with one exception:



-B8 coukd handle 120Hz SDR as well as 60Hz HDR, but not 120Hz HDR.



-C8 could handle 120Hz HDR (which is only relevant to gaming, possibly).



We don't yet know about differences between the B9 and C9, but there is pretty much no reason to prefer the C8 over the B8 unless you prefer the C9 styling or the Atmos up-firing speakers.



Thank you for the clarification. So I’ve refused a great offer on the B8 because of the above. Is it safe to say that the picture quality is exactly the same between the two?

chunon 03-15-2019 10:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IMWhizzle (Post 57750634)
Thank you for the clarification. So I’ve refused a great offer on the B8 because of the above. Is it safe to say that the picture quality is exactly the same between the two?



Do the b8 to c8 comparison on the rtings site I think that will answer your question [emoji4]


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

fafrd 03-15-2019 10:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IMWhizzle (Post 57750634)
Thank you for the clarification. So I’ve refused a great offer on the B8 because of the above. Is it safe to say that the picture quality is exactly the same between the two?

I don't have a B8 (or a C8).

But based on everything I have read, there is no substantive functional difference between the WOLED panel or thecAlpha 7 versus Alpha 9 processor used other than the difference I highlighted.

Checking reviews at rtings, cnet, hdtvtest, etc... is a good way to confirm this (keeping in mind that there is panel-to-panel variation, so specific differences in individual measurements may merely reflect panel variation rather than substantive differences associated with the differing models...).

lsorensen 03-15-2019 01:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TravisPNW (Post 57750470)
It wasn't last year. The panels were the same. I think the only differences between the B7 and the C7 were Atmos speakers which nobody who takes HT seriously would care about because they have their own sound system... as well as a black vs gray bezel and I think the stand may have differed as well.


I went with the B7... and I don't even notice the gray bezel viewing in the dark.

The speaker difference was between the B7A and B7P. The B7P and C7P were the same except for the color of the stand and bezel and which stores you could buy them at.

ganzhimself 03-15-2019 01:33 PM

The C8 has a nicer looking stand... If that really is a big deal to you.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

janos666 03-18-2019 04:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fafrd (Post 57750614)
-B8 coukd handle 120Hz SDR as well as 60Hz HDR, but not 120Hz HDR.
-C8 could handle 120Hz HDR (which is only relevant to gaming, possibly).

That's not true. The format support over HDMI is absolutely identical on all 8-series LG TVs. Both the B8 and the C8 can do 1080p120 HDR over HDMI 2.0. Neither can do 2160p120 HDR over HDMI 2.0. All 9-series will be capable of 2160p120 HDR over HDMI 2.1
The C8 is supposed to support 2160p120 over the internal media player but there is no real content for it (I didn't even see any demo videos yet).


On the other hand, the C8 handles HDR colors better than the B8.

fafrd 03-18-2019 09:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by janos666 (Post 57763626)
That's not true. The format support over HDMI is absolutely identical on all 8-series LG TVs. Both the B8 and the C8 can do 1080p120 HDR over HDMI 2.0. Neither can do 2160p120 HDR over HDMI 2.0. All 9-series will be capable of 2160p120 HDR over HDMI 2.1
The C8 is supposed to support 2160p120 over the internal media player but there is no real content for it (I didn't even see any demo videos yet).


On the other hand, the C8 handles HDR colors better than the B8.

Yes, the only way to get 120Hz 2160p into a 2018 WOLED is through USB (or possibly internet). So you are correct, there is no practical difference in performance between the B8 and the C8 (though the Alpha 7 and the Alpha 9 processors are different and have different capability, however 'theoretical/immaterial' that difference may be...).

On the C8 'handling' HDR colors better than the B8, I'd appreciate any references you have for that statement.

chunon 03-18-2019 11:37 AM

Real world differences between B8 & C8?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by fafrd (Post 57764748)
Yes, the only way to get 120Hz 2160p into a 2018 WOLED is through USB (or possibly internet). So you are correct, there is no practical difference in performance between the B8 and the C8 (though the Alpha 7 and the Alpha 9 processors are different and have different capability, however 'theoretical/immaterial' that difference may be...).



On the C8 'handling' HDR colors better than the B8, I'd appreciate any references you have for that statement.



Looks like the C8 has better color volume but I doubt you would be able to see it unless you did a side by side with alot of hdr material.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

janos666 03-18-2019 02:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fafrd (Post 57764748)
On the C8 'handling' HDR colors better than the B8, I'd appreciate any references you have for that statement.

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/139-d...l#post57308890
Quote:

Originally Posted by chunon (Post 57765614)
Looks like the C8 has better color volume but I doubt you would be able to see it unless you did a side by side with alot of hdr material.

I always noticed it on the C7 (it was my first HDR display). Everything looks a little under-saturated in a format which you expect to be equally or more but not less "colorful". It really shows on skin tones. People look pale, everything is a little "colder". It's like you tuned the Color slider down in the settings (below the default/neutral) by a few notches in SDR. I was really disappointed when I realized the B8 is the same.

fafrd 03-18-2019 02:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chunon (Post 57765614)
Looks like the C8 has better color volume but I doubt you would be able to see it unless you did a side by side with alot of hdr material.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Is that just based on messurements from a rtings.com review or what?

Is the C8 using a different panel than the B8?

Has this difference in color volume been confirmed by enough independant sources that we're certain it's not just TV-specific variation?

Color volume really depends only on the WOLED panel itself and has nothing to do with processing, so I'm doubtful of a difference in color volume unless the B8 was using a different panel...

chunon 03-18-2019 02:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fafrd (Post 57766778)
Is that just based on messurements from a rtings.com review or what?



Is the C8 using a different panel than the B8?



Has this difference in color volume been confirmed by enough independant sources that we're certain it's not just TV-specific variation?



Color volume really depends only on the WOLED panel itself and has nothing to do with processing, so I'm doubtful of a difference in color volume unless the B8 was using a different panel...



Yes rtings site but I agree could be panel variance .


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

fafrd 03-18-2019 02:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by janos666 (Post 57766774)
https://www.avsforum.com/forum/139-d...l#post57308890

I always noticed it on the C7 (it my first OLED display). Everything looks a little under-saturated in a format which you expect to be equally or more but not less "colorful". It really shows on skin tones. People look pale, everything is a little "colder". I was really disappointed when I realized the B8 is the same.

I had not realized this, that the Alpha 7 processor cannot support the new 2018 tone-mapping algorithms.

That is a significant-enough difference to stay away from the Alpha-7 processor if you have any ibtention to view HDR material...

It's probably safe to assume that the same applies to the Alpha7-Gen2 used in the B9, but someone should check...

fafrd 03-18-2019 02:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chunon (Post 57766790)
Yes rtings site but I agree could be panel variance .


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Well, or based on what janos666 just pointed out to me, perhaps it is actually related to the different tone-mapping algorithms used on the B8 and C8...

If color volume is determined by presenting a full 'cube' of color, the color volume should be independant of tone mapping, but if color volume is measured only using the few points at the extremes, different tone-mapping of out-of-range colors will result in a different color volume (needlessly) being calculated.

janos666 03-18-2019 02:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fafrd (Post 57766778)
Color volume really depends only on the WOLED panel itself and has nothing to do with processing, so I'm doubtful of a difference in color volume unless the B8 was using a different panel...

The standard container is a cube. The panel gamut is not. There has to be some sacrifice at some places. The two processors do this differently. The Alpha7 spreads the errors out more evenly across the dynamic range to provide a more internally coherent appearance while the Alpha 9 pushes these errors to the upper range. The dark colors are now accurate but there is a bigger relative difference between bright and dark colors and the transition is abrupt rather than spread out. But I prefer the Alpha 9 behavior. I never noticed this internal incoherence yet. Sick people on the screen (pale skin) did bother me.

chunon 03-18-2019 02:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fafrd (Post 57766866)
Well, or based on what janos666 just pointed out to me, perhaps it is actually related to the different tone-mapping algorithms used on the B8 and C8...



If color volume is determined by presenting a full 'cube' of color, the color volume should be independant of tone mapping, but if color volume is measured only using the few points at the extremes, different tone-mapping of out-of-range colors will result in a different color volume (needlessly) being calculated.



Makes sense


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 11:32 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
vBulletin Security provided by vBSecurity (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.