2019 C9–E9 Owner's Thread (No Price Talk) - Page 187 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #5581 of 6660 Old 08-19-2019, 01:51 PM
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Originally Posted by tmc2k1 View Post
From the top of the bottom bezel (on the actual screen and not the bezel of the actual TV) to the base of the stand is just under 2". I got 1 15/16" specifically. Hope this helps.

From the bottom of TV frame bezel to the base of the stand is just a hair under 1 3/8".
Thanks! So now I just need to figure out what the E9 is.

Based on your measurement vs my estimate, there is .3675" more room to play with (1.57" vs 1.9375"). If I am able to add that difference to my E9 estimate, then I would like to think that I would have at least 2.5825" to work with. The soundbars I am looking at range roughly between 2.5"-3.5" in height. It looks like I might be leaning more towards the E9 just for the sake of some added clearance.

Anyone out there know the measurements from the bottom edge of the screen to the bottom of the base on a 65" E9?
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post #5582 of 6660 Old 08-19-2019, 01:51 PM
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Originally Posted by avernar View Post
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Originally Posted by Andreas Moyseos View Post
The C9 is almost bezel-free, so it looks even smaller than it is.. I came from the Panny plasma 65inch to the 77C9, and I was thinking 'ehm... that's it?'.
LOL. I went from a 60" Panasonic Plasma to the 65C9 and was surprised it was a few inches shorter! And I was thinking I was going to have to raise my center speaker shelf up to make room.
This is too funny. I came from a 55" Panasonic Plasma and thought the jump to 65" wasn't that big initially at all because of how minimal the bezels were.
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post #5583 of 6660 Old 08-19-2019, 01:52 PM
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I have some general questions about my 65" C9 and using onboard apps vs outboard "boxes". We use the TV for about 80% Cable (Spectrum Cable) and the other 20% mixed from other streaming services. We have available Roku 4K, Amazon firestick 4K, and Sony 4K Bluray. I currently have the devices hooked up via the TV and then linked via optical connection to my ZVOX soundbar.

First question, For steaming content, we primarily use Netflix, Amazon Prime, and Hulu. It is somewhat easier to use the LG apps using just one control. However, are there any advantage/disadvantages of using the LG native apps for these vs using the Roku vs Firestick vs the Blu-ray from a video standpoint.

I'm using the optical output to my Zvox but I'm planning on moving to a soundbar, so I'm also wondering what may be the better way of making the connections both from audio and video standpoint. I am really confused and would be very frustrated with getting ARC/eARC/CEC issues to get it just work, but would also hope for the best video and audio performance. Ideally would still like to use the TV as teh switcher, but would consider using the soundbar as the switcher if needed. Also any advantages form audio standpint for native LG apps vs the boxes.

Lastly, will also be using an XBOX in the next year, not a big time gamer, but also seeing how this would affect connections.

Trying to see which is the simplest connections, but not trying to lose out on significant video or audio experiences.. Thanks
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post #5584 of 6660 Old 08-19-2019, 01:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VirtualMirage View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by tmc2k1 View Post
From the top of the bottom bezel (on the actual screen and not the bezel of the actual TV) to the base of the stand is just under 2". I got 1 15/16" specifically. Hope this helps.

From the bottom of TV frame bezel to the base of the stand is just a hair under 1 3/8".
Thanks! So now I just need to figure out what the E9 is.

Based on your measurement vs my estimate, there is .3675" more room to play with (1.57" vs 1.9375"). If I am able to add that difference to my E9 estimate, then I would like to think that I would have at least 2.5825" to work with. The soundbars I am looking at range roughly between 2.5"-3.5" in height. It looks like I might be leaning more towards the E9 just for the sake of some added clearance.

Anyone out there know the measurements from the bottom edge of the screen to the bottom of the base on a 65" E9?
Glad to help! Hope someone can do the same with E9 measurements for you.
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post #5585 of 6660 Old 08-19-2019, 02:26 PM
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Originally Posted by Andreas Moyseos View Post
I thought I'd read up a bit and see if any bright ideas came up.. unfortunately i got tangled quickly enough. I'd have to have a pc setup here to test..

Noting down some things i came across, just in case one of them gives you a new idea:

1 - https://www.avsforum.com/forum/145-h...bles-htpc.html
(these guys were trying to do the same thing)

2 - https://www.makeuseof.com/tag/hdmi-s...iple-displays/
(decrescent hdmi splitter)

3 - if you are not playing games on your pc, maybe use a Windows/media player functionality to delay video.

4 - copied from a forum:
Spoiler!

Hey, thanks for the suggestions. Some comments on each of them:

1. One of the users in that thread (@kirche5) had the exact same issue as me: by duplicating the displays (either by extending or cloning them), they lost access to higher resolutions/refresh rates or HD audio. Unfortunately, they didn't find a proper solution, and that thread has been abandoned since 2016;

2. I don't have a splitter at hand to test it myself, but I don't think that such a device would solve the problem. In theory, the final result would be the same as what I'm currently running: one HDMI cable connected to the TV, and another one connected to the AVR. Because of that, the multiple displays issue would present itself in the same way, I believe;

3. My main use on PC is gaming, so delaying video is not an option, sadly;

4. That's the clone solution that I mentioned. It runs [email protected] just fine (what that person used), but [email protected] isn't available when cloning the displays, only when extending them - which then causes the AVR to lose support for HD audio.

I've asked for help to the creator of CRU (Custom Resolution Utility, a program for editing EDIDs), at the Monitor Tests forums. Hopefully, he'll be able to provide a definitive answer, as I'm running out of options.

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post #5586 of 6660 Old 08-19-2019, 02:36 PM
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Hey, thanks for the suggestions. Some comments on each of them:


2. I don't have a splitter at hand to test it myself, but I don't think that such a device would solve the problem. In theory, the final result would be the same as what I'm currently running: one HDMI cable connected to the TV, and another one connected to the AVR. Because of that, the multiple displays issue would present itself in the same way, I believe;
If I understand well, your current solution with 2 HDMI cables results in Windows recognising two screens - and then rendering both, with the (assumed) result of not being able to go 4k or whatever.
This 1:2 splitter, I think, would allow Windows to output only 1 'screen', and then you'd send that one screen to both devices.

Last edited by Andreas Moyseos; 08-19-2019 at 02:41 PM.
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post #5587 of 6660 Old 08-19-2019, 03:03 PM
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2019 C9–E9 Owner's Thread (No Price Talk)

These are my gray slides how bad does this look compared to your guys tv in terms of vertical banding.
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post #5588 of 6660 Old 08-19-2019, 03:36 PM
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Just picked up a C9 to upgrade my B6. I have to say the increase in brightness and having HDR in YouTube has made it worth it already lol

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post #5589 of 6660 Old 08-19-2019, 04:16 PM
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Originally Posted by tmc2k1 View Post
This is too funny. I came from a 55" Panasonic Plasma and thought the jump to 65" wasn't that big initially at all because of how minimal the bezels were.
You are right, remember the Panasonic 3" silver bezels....lol

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Just picked up a C9 to upgrade my B6. I have to say the increase in brightness and having HDR in YouTube has made it worth it already lol
That excellent you like it Many feel the upgrade is not worth it....... Where did the old one go?
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post #5590 of 6660 Old 08-19-2019, 04:39 PM
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Originally Posted by tmc2k1 View Post
This is too funny. I came from a 55" Panasonic Plasma and thought the jump to 65" wasn't that big initially at all because of how minimal the bezels were.
You are right, remember the Panasonic 3" silver bezels....lol
Haha, luckily mine wasn't THAT old. It was the 2012 ST50 line. Bezels still quite a bit larger than the C9 lol.
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post #5591 of 6660 Old 08-19-2019, 04:42 PM
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The statement that dejudder is only for 30hz content or less doesn’t add up to me. It clearly makes a difference for 60hz content. Deblur and dejudder make a difference for all content.

From just view testing motion using 0,0 ; 0;10 1,10 ; 2,10 ; 1,9 ; 2,8 I found that frame skipping occurred mostly for anything that didn’t add up to 0 or 10. My theory on that is motion is “trumotion 120” if it adds up to 10. So for example when using 2,10 sometimes I would see random slow-mo frames. So far for the past few days I haven’t seen that with 2,8.

I’m still on the quest for the best motion, personally I’m not a fan of the OLED motion. I see the flickering even when trying it for a while and doesn’t help motion to my eyes.
Interesting findings. I'll have to play around with DeBlur and DeJudder some more and try the sum of 10 combinations. Although I did see frame skipping, frame speed changes, etc. at 0,10 on 60Hz content. It sounds like maybe TruMotion analyzes motion and dynamically applies DeJudder and DeBlur, rather than applying DeJudder and DeBlur based on framerate.

OLED motion is definitely poor. No holding any punches there. I will say, though, my eyes and brain have adjusted quite a bit over the past few weeks. So much so I've started using Real Cinema instead of TruMotion for film content.

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post #5592 of 6660 Old 08-19-2019, 05:55 PM
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You are right, remember the Panasonic 3" silver bezels....lol



That excellent you like it Many feel the upgrade is not worth it....... Where did the old one go?
In my case it was definitely worth it. My B6 was a 55" and I knew 65" was the way to go. Aside from the brightness, the biggest change is just the processor. Much more responsive. Menus, apps, all much snappier. HDR has much more punch.

The B6 has temporarily (or permanently) become a gaming monitor. Its sitting on my desk now which looks ridiculous, but gaming on it is something else!

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post #5593 of 6660 Old 08-19-2019, 06:51 PM
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Thanks! So now I just need to figure out what the E9 is.

Based on your measurement vs my estimate, there is .3675" more room to play with (1.57" vs 1.9375"). If I am able to add that difference to my E9 estimate, then I would like to think that I would have at least 2.5825" to work with. The soundbars I am looking at range roughly between 2.5"-3.5" in height. It looks like I might be leaning more towards the E9 just for the sake of some added clearance.

Anyone out there know the measurements from the bottom edge of the screen to the bottom of the base on a 65" E9?
From top of table to bottom of inbuilt sound bar is 30 mm. From top of table to bottom of screen is 55 mm. i.e there is 30 mm of glass and 25 mm of sound bar below the screen. I will let you convert these to inches yourself as the US is the only country in the world not metric.
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post #5594 of 6660 Old 08-19-2019, 06:56 PM
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From top of table to bottom of inbuilt sound bar is 30 mm. From top of table to bottom of screen is 55 cm. i.e there is 30 cm of glass and 25 mm of sound bar below the screen. I will let you convert these to inches yourself as the US is the only country in the world not metric.
Edit - I meant cm.
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post #5595 of 6660 Old 08-19-2019, 07:17 PM
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Edit - I meant cm.
Duh!! - mm
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post #5596 of 6660 Old 08-19-2019, 07:18 PM - Thread Starter
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If you own a PS4 and want to use ISF or Cinema (most accurate PQ) and want the lowest input lag possible you must switch the HDMI label to "PC". Otherwise all the processing features will be available and most likely more lag. This is my conclusion after some investigation. The Xbox One X doesn't have this issue due to ALLM support.
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post #5597 of 6660 Old 08-19-2019, 07:53 PM
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If you own a PS4 and want to use ISF or Cinema (most accurate PQ) and want the lowest input lag possible you must switch the HDMI label to "PC". Otherwise all the processing features will be available and most likely more lag. This is my conclusion after some investigation. The Xbox One X doesn't have this issue due to ALLM support.
Wouldn’t that break HDR though?
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post #5598 of 6660 Old 08-19-2019, 08:14 PM - Thread Starter
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Wouldn’t that break HDR though?


I tested infamous first light and it looked beautiful w/ HDR.
Why would PC mode break HDR?


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post #5599 of 6660 Old 08-19-2019, 08:43 PM
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From top of table to bottom of inbuilt sound bar is 30 mm. From top of table to bottom of screen is 55 mm. i.e there is 30 mm of glass and 25 mm of sound bar below the screen. I will let you convert these to inches yourself as the US is the only country in the world not metric.
Are we talking about the 65” E9 here?

55mm to inches is 2.165”. The 65” C9 measured in at 1.9375” (~49.5mm) from the bottom edge of the screen to the bottom of the base, yet the E9 is .625” taller (~16mm)with a slightly thinner top bezel too (.5 mm). So for a TV that is 16mm taller than the C9 with a thinner top bezel, how does the space between the bottom edge of the screen to the bottom of the base only differ by 5mm? Where did the other 11mm go?
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Are we talking about the 65” E9 here?

55mm to inches is 2.165”. The 65” C9 measured in at 1.9375” (~49.5mm) from the bottom edge of the screen to the bottom of the base, yet the E9 is .625” taller (~16mm)with a slightly thinner top bezel too (.5 mm). So for a TV that is 16mm taller than the C9 with a thinner top bezel, how does the space between the bottom edge of the screen to the bottom of the base only differ by 5mm? Where did the other 11mm go?
Yes - The 65 inch E9. The entire TV is 875 mm in height. Note that when I say bottom of screen I mean the glass screen. There is a 10 mm black rim at bottom top and side of the actual viewing picture area. So you can add another 10 mm before the actual picture will be hidden by the sound bar. (30 mm glass at base + 25 mm sound bar + 10 mm black rim to viewing screen) It would look better if the 10 mm black rim was visible imho.

Last edited by Hakea; 08-19-2019 at 08:59 PM.
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post #5601 of 6660 Old 08-20-2019, 06:55 AM
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But upon further reading it sounds like LG's Technicolor mode was tuned using a projector setup for the mastering of movies for final projection in a cinema. In other words, the Technicolor mode isn't designed for final viewing in-home on an OLED display.
I've been wanting to learn and read more about the Technicolor Expert mode. May I ask where you found this info? The quotes below have led me to believe the mode was specifically designed for LG consumer OLED displays. Each is linked to its source article. The third article tells a bit about how Technicolor is using OLED displays in their mastering bays.

Quote:
LG OLED TVs, recognized for their superior performance, are used by Technicolor as consumer reference displays in the production of home delivery versions of major Hollywood movies and television content, including Logan and Sense 8,” said Technicolor.


Quote:
LG's OLEDs, and soon their UHD LCDs, also have a "Technicolor Expert Mode" as one of the picture presets, which LG claims will make the image look as close as possible to how it did in the Technicolor mastering suites. In CNET's review of the C8 OLED TV, that mode did provide an extremely accurate picture with both SDR and HDR content, so that's cool.


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Technicolor Expert Mode
Another element of the LG/Technicolor partnership is the inclusion of a new picture mode in the 2018 OLED TVs called Technicolor Expert Mode. Basically, LG's selling point is this: if you want to see the content exactly the way the Technicolor mastering team saw it, use the Technicolor Expert mode--which is set to Technicolor specs for white point and peak luminance.

The white point is an interesting topic for videophiles, reviewers, and professional calibrators. We've always been taught that the D65 white point (which has specific x and y coordinates) is accurate for both HD and UHD standards, but the Technicolor white point uses different x and y coordinates because the resulting "white" actually looks more accurate when comparing the OLED to the types of mastering devices in use at Technicolor.
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post #5602 of 6660 Old 08-20-2019, 08:12 AM
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Yes - The 65 inch E9. The entire TV is 875 mm in height. Note that when I say bottom of screen I mean the glass screen. There is a 10 mm black rim at bottom top and side of the actual viewing picture area. So you can add another 10 mm before the actual picture will be hidden by the sound bar. (30 mm glass at base + 25 mm sound bar + 10 mm black rim to viewing screen) It would look better if the 10 mm black rim was visible imho.
Well that answers where the missing 11mm went, or at least 10mm (which is close enough). Thanks for the clarification!

I don't plan to butt the soundbar directly up against the TV, so I am not as concerned that it will impact the aesthetics. I just want to minimize (if not eliminate) the potential of the soundbar impacting the view. The entertainment center that it will be sitting is only around 24" (610mm) high off the ground.
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post #5603 of 6660 Old 08-20-2019, 10:28 AM
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I've been wanting to learn and read more about the Technicolor Expert mode. May I ask where you found this info? The quotes below have led me to believe the mode was specifically designed for LG consumer OLED displays. Each is linked to its source article. The third article tells a bit about how Technicolor is using OLED displays in their mastering bays.
From Ted at LightSpace:

Quote:
Originally Posted by ConnecTEDDD View Post
Also LG has worked closely with Technicolor to incorporate Technicolor's in-house D65 perceptual match White Point target, by adding a custom target white point with co-ordinates of x: 0.300 y: 0.327.

But these coordinates are not really working, because Technicolor tried to match a Xenon DCI Cinema Projector as reference (with DCI primaries and D65 White Point), so these coordinates are only helpful for those which are working in post-production and use LG OLED's as client view monitors, for the commercial cinema release of the movie.

For home video release of a movie, a projector as reference is never being used, only with monitors its been performed the mastering of SDR home release of the movies, so there no point for anyone to use a Technicolor custom White Point (for home viewing).

As usual with that recommendation, LG has confused once again the consumer world, it has done it at past many times, with various PDF's with calibration notes for HDR calibration which never worked (even the digital values where incorrect to these PDF, digital bits of PQ % levels).

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post #5604 of 6660 Old 08-20-2019, 10:45 AM
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post #5605 of 6660 Old 08-20-2019, 02:38 PM
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We recently upgraded from a Panasonic plasma to the LG 55" C9. The video experience is jaw dropping. Audio wise, however, I'm experiencing the audio delay "feature" that I've come to see is fairly common. I'm currently running it all on an Onkyo TX-NR809. This is practically an antique these days, but it served my plasma greatly. With the change to the C9, I've gone from having all the HDMI being input into the AVR, with an HDMI out to the plasma, to now having all the HDMI inputs going to the C9, with an HDMI ARC to the AVR for sound.


Given the current issues with the audio delay and hoping for a firmware solution, can I expect to eliminate the issues by upgrading to a current AVR, with 4K support equal to or exceeding the C9 and moving back to just using the C9 as a monitor? I've played around with everything connected to audio (on both ends) and the issue almost seems to come and go.


My other HW: Panasonic DP-UB820 blu ray, ROKU Ultra, and the Comcrap DVR. With all this, I really don't need any of the LG Apps.


Thanks!
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post #5606 of 6660 Old 08-20-2019, 03:57 PM
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I've noticed the audio sync problem too. In fact, I bumped the adjustment for ARC to about 3 or 4 and it seemed to do the trick. Very weird though.

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post #5607 of 6660 Old 08-20-2019, 04:04 PM
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I have a C9 and a modern Denon AVR-X4400H that can support HDR etc. is there anyway to NOT use ARC / eARC if the output of my AVR is using the ARC HDMI input on the C9 and just have the AVR handle audio duties before it gets to the TV?

the only sound options I see on the C9 are basically: use TV speakers, use optical cable, use ARC, use wireless speakers, or use a combination of optical and TV speakers. nothing about just using the AVR for audio without the signal having to do a loop: media device -> AVR -> TV -> AVR.

I understand technically eARC should be basically the same as just having the audio signal processed by the AVR first, but I've noticed some lip sync issues and other complications when trying to run a PC into the AVR and then to the TV that have to do with ARC / eARC.
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post #5608 of 6660 Old 08-20-2019, 04:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Soaringswine View Post
I have a C9 and a modern Denon AVR-X4400H that can support HDR etc. is there anyway to NOT use ARC / eARC if the output of my AVR is using the ARC HDMI input on the C9 and just have the AVR handle audio duties before it gets to the TV?



the only sound options I see on the C9 are basically: use TV speakers, use optical cable, use ARC, use wireless speakers, or use a combination of optical and TV speakers. nothing about just using the AVR for audio without the signal having to do a loop: media device -> AVR -> TV -> AVR.



I understand technically eARC should be basically the same as just having the audio signal processed by the AVR first, but I've noticed some lip sync issues and other complications when trying to run a PC into the AVR and then to the TV that have to do with ARC / eARC.
Yes. In that case, take a look at the outputs on your DVD player. In the past, I've used one output directly to my AVR (HDMI) and another to the tv. If you only have one HDMI out, run it to the tv if you wish, then see if you have an optical output that you can run to the AVR.

If the audio sync continues to bother me, I might do the same thing

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post #5609 of 6660 Old 08-20-2019, 06:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Soaringswine View Post
I have a C9 and a modern Denon AVR-X4400H that can support HDR etc. is there anyway to NOT use ARC / eARC if the output of my AVR is using the ARC HDMI input on the C9 and just have the AVR handle audio duties before it gets to the TV?

the only sound options I see on the C9 are basically: use TV speakers, use optical cable, use ARC, use wireless speakers, or use a combination of optical and TV speakers. nothing about just using the AVR for audio without the signal having to do a loop: media device -> AVR -> TV -> AVR.

I understand technically eARC should be basically the same as just having the audio signal processed by the AVR first, but I've noticed some lip sync issues and other complications when trying to run a PC into the AVR and then to the TV that have to do with ARC / eARC.
ARC and eARC are only used for audio originating on the TV or from one of the other HDMI inputs on the TV. Audio never goes from AVR to TV and back to AVR again. You can't even do this with the Denon as in order to have it play ARC/eARC audio you have to switch the input away from your source device.

There's a setting in the Denon where it sends the audio, either out the speakers connected to it or to pass it on to the TV. But as I've said, you can't loop it back.
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post #5610 of 6660 Old 08-20-2019, 07:48 PM
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Does anyone else find that the Netflix app through webOS doesn't kick into 4K despite the fact that overall TV speed seems to be okay?

It seems to be consistently sitting at 4.10mbps/1080 when I use the info button. My Xbox One X does not have this problem.

When testing the TV connection speed through browser on fast.com and speedtest.net both show around 25-30mbps, wifi signal is 2-3 bars out of 5 though.

LG customer support is advising to reset the TV but I can't see it helping.
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