2019 C9–E9 Owner's Thread (No Price Talk) - Page 209 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #6241 of 10414 Old 09-10-2019, 04:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1080pee View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by pauls1e View Post
So far I love my c9 but today noticed in a snowy scene a yellow band towards the right side. I'm still in my return window. I have really good gray uniformity but my white shows magenta on the left and a yellow band on the right. The idea of exchanging it sounds rough. What do you all think?
Uniformity


https://imgur.com/gallery/r4u16LZ
My yellow tint is exactly like yours, you saved me from having to upload an image.



Not sure what I'm going to do.
I know. A part of me just wants to live with it because everything else is flawless on my set. I only see it in certain commercials that have white backgrounds or if there is a really snow scene and even then I have to be looking for it. Im just worried that with my luck, I will receive a set with the issue being worse or will have a completely different issue.
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post #6242 of 10414 Old 09-10-2019, 05:09 PM
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Oh, my God! Latest driver issued today from Nvidia (436.30) now supports variable refresh rate (VRR) for Turing! Yes, yes!!! Everybody check it please!!!
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post #6243 of 10414 Old 09-10-2019, 05:26 PM
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Cites to prev. comment: wccftech.com/lg-oled-tvs-to-receive-nvidia-g-sync-compatible-validation-in-upcoming-software-update/
For C9 avsforum.com/lg-announces-nvidia-g-sync-support-for-e9-and-c9-series-oleds/
forums.guru3d.com/threads/436-15-whql-geforce-game-ready-driver.428289/page-10#post-5709538
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post #6244 of 10414 Old 09-10-2019, 06:31 PM
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2019 C9–E9 Owner's Thread (No Price Talk)

I’ve had my 65 inch C9 for about three weeks or so, and no issue with burn in yet. Although I am tending to baby the panel somewhat . Also being very careful with stations that have logos in the corner. Not that I want to, but I am using the zoom feature to get rid of the logos. So I take it LG has done a better job with the C-Series panels as far as burn in goes? After reading some of the posts in the OLED burn in thread, it sounds like the earlier panels where more prone to burn in.


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post #6245 of 10414 Old 09-10-2019, 07:27 PM
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But it's freesync not g-$ync. There's no $250 of magical video hardware in the LG TV is there?

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Originally Posted by ShePearl View Post
G-Sync support is great news.
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post #6246 of 10414 Old 09-10-2019, 07:31 PM
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de-judder > 0 adds artifacts on the edges of things it's pretty much totally unacceptable to me but somehow LG is okay with it.

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Originally Posted by bjaurelio View Post
I have a few motion setting questions as I try to dial in my new C9. I've tried searching this forum as well as around the web for a definitive answer. Under the user trumotion settings, what do de-judder and de-blur do? The basic answer I am most likely to believe is they are separating the interpolation setting according to different framerate content (de-judder for 24 and 30, de-blur for 60).

With reach having a slider from 0-10, what's the difference between 1 and 10? 0 is obviously off, but do we know what the difference is between the other values?

Lastly, I've read that trumotion disables the judder free 5:5 pulldown and reverts to 3:2 pulldown. Is that correct?
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post #6247 of 10414 Old 09-10-2019, 08:45 PM
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EVERYONE take all this new today from NVIDIA with a huge grain of salt it’s not what you u think.

Up until this very announcement GSYNC has never been available via HDMI GSYNC has always been DisplayPort only.

The next Gen consoles are powered by AMD this might be a move by NVIDIA to squash or prevent PS5 from being FreeSync compatible on the LG C9 or future LG OLEDs.

So while this seems like great news, this could be horrible since it’s very possible NVDIA and LG struck a deal to lock out FreeSync and AMD support. Since Samsung has jumped into the FreeSync camp.

Also this leaves out [email protected] and GSYNC Ultimate which I’m sure will be supported by the LG C10
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post #6248 of 10414 Old 09-10-2019, 09:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1080pee View Post
My yellow tint is exactly like yours, you saved me from having to upload an image.



Not sure what I'm going to do.
Mine is exactly the same. I was sweating over it for a while but ultimately decided to keep it. From others online, it sounds to be very common and yourself and the others on this page confirm that. It IS frustrating but like you I only see it on some white screens. Regular content looks amazing. Dark screen handling is flawless as well. Zero banding or dirty screen.
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post #6249 of 10414 Old 09-10-2019, 09:20 PM
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Originally Posted by Tanquen View Post
But it's freesync not g-$ync. There's no $250 of magical video hardware in the LG TV is there?
No, there isn't which is why my theory holds water.

Likely they offload the workload that the G-sync module in monitor over to the Tensor cores, which is why they limit it to 20xx series GPUs.

Do you call Microsoft "M$"? That's a great 90s throwback on your part.

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EVERYONE take all this new today from NVIDIA with a huge grain of salt it’s not what you u think.

Up until this very announcement GSYNC has never been available via HDMI GSYNC has always been DisplayPort only.

The next Gen consoles are powered by AMD this might be a move by NVIDIA to squash or prevent PS5 from being FreeSync compatible on the LG C9 or future LG OLEDs.

So while this seems like great news, this could be horrible since it’s very possible NVDIA and LG struck a deal to lock out FreeSync and AMD support. Since Samsung has jumped into the FreeSync camp.

Also this leaves out [email protected] and GSYNC Ultimate which I’m sure will be supported by the LG C10
No, this is Nvidia reacting to AMD allowing VRR via HDMI. It has nothing to do with them trying "squash" FreeSync, only be competitive.

If LG were to rescind VRR support from the Xbox One X from the current displays, that would be a PR nightmare, particularly since next gen consoles are going to be AMD APUs.

As far as "[email protected]" the bottleneck are current Nvidia GPUs which are limited to HDMI 2.0 and it is a bandwidth issue but the C9 already is ready for HDMI 2.1 from next gen GPUs.
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post #6250 of 10414 Old 09-10-2019, 10:15 PM
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Originally Posted by DRC72 View Post
I’ve had my 65 inch C9 for about three weeks or so, and no issue with burn in yet. Although I am tending to baby the panel somewhat . Also being very careful with stations that have logos in the corner. Not that I want to, but I am using the zoom feature to get rid of the logos. So I take it LG has done a better job with the C-Series panels as far as burn in goes? After reading some of the posts in the OLED burn in thread, it sounds like the earlier panels where more prone to burn in.
From what I have seen, burn in seems to set in after more panel life, like 2-3 years......Seems to be random and rare.......
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post #6251 of 10414 Old 09-10-2019, 10:21 PM
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Originally Posted by Tanquen View Post
But it's freesync not g-$ync. There's no $250 of magical video hardware in the LG TV is there?
It's "G-SYNC Compatible" which doesn't need a chip.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Ice Cold View Post
Also this leaves out [email protected] and GSYNC Ultimate which I’m sure will be supported by the LG C10
Everything that G-Sync Ultimate adds to a monitor the C9 can already do. [email protected] will be available when HDMI 2.1 devices come out.


Quote:
Originally Posted by mutelight View Post
Likely they offload the workload that the G-sync module in monitor over to the Tensor cores, which is why they limit it to 20xx series GPUs.
There's nothing to offload. The Nvidia card is just going to be using HDMI VRR. That's what G-SYNC Compatible really is but usually done with FreeSync.
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post #6252 of 10414 Old 09-10-2019, 10:28 PM
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What are you all talking about? C9 does not support either Freesync or Adaptive Sync or G-SYNC. It only supports HDMI 2.1 VRR technology. There is NO NEED in HDMI 2.1 interface though on Nvidia's and LG end, obvioulsly, because it is very low bandwidth. eARC is the same, BTW. All of them are compatible with 2.0b (in ideal world). The only thing which requires HDMI 2.1 cable and 48 GBit/s is 8K60. Also Nvidia is just calling it g-sync compatible, because it is what it is: compatible with G-SYNC API (or how does Microsoft calls it).
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post #6253 of 10414 Old 09-10-2019, 10:33 PM
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There's nothing to offload. The Nvidia card is just going to be using HDMI VRR. That's what G-SYNC Compatible really is but usually done with FreeSync.
Ah, I see what you're saying as far as "G-sync compatible" meets their spec/performance. Still seems suspect they'd limit it to 20xx/Turing architecture when 10xx/Pascal supports "G-sync compatible" displays over DP when the pin layout is similar and it is only a discrepancy in throughput. Refresh rate isn't that costly as far as throughput.

I have had "G-sync" laptops and I know they don't have dedicated hardware modules and they do the equivalent of what is happening now with "compatible" displays.
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post #6254 of 10414 Old 09-10-2019, 10:49 PM
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Ah, I see what you're saying as far as "G-sync compatible" meets their spec/performance. Still seems suspect they'd limit it to 20xx/Turing architecture when 10xx/Pascal supports "G-sync compatible" displays over DP when the pin layout is similar and it is only a discrepancy in throughput. Refresh rate isn't that costly as far as throughput.

I have had "G-sync" laptops and I know they don't have dedicated hardware modules and they do the equivalent of what is happening now with "compatible" displays.
Listen just read these highlights of HDMI 2.1 (2018 year) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HDMI#Version_2.1
https://www.hdmi.org/press/press_release.aspx?prid=152
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post #6255 of 10414 Old 09-10-2019, 10:53 PM
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What are you all talking about? C9 does not support either Freesync or Adaptive Sync or G-SYNC. It only supports HDMI 2.1 VRR technology.
Were you replying to me? If so you completely misread what I wrote. I said that Nvidia will be using HDMI 2.1 VRR with the C9.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Бальтазар Лин View Post
The only thing which requires HDMI 2.1 cable and 48 GBit/s is 8K60.
No, 4K120 HDR needs HDMI 2.1 48Gbps. And the C9 doesn't currently accept a 4K120 4:2:0 8-bit SDR signal.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Бальтазар Лин View Post
Also Nvidia is just calling it g-sync compatible, because it is what it is: compatible with G-SYNC API (or how does Microsoft calls it).
G-Sync compatible means that the monitor or TV was certified to meet a minimum spec. The video card will turn on G-Sync functionality internally but output either FreeSync (DisplayPort) or VRR (HDMI). Nothing to do with APIs.
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post #6256 of 10414 Old 09-10-2019, 10:59 PM
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Originally Posted by Бальтазар Лин View Post
Dude. Seriously. We know what the C9 can do with respect to HDMI 2.1 .


I just explained that it's probably going to be using HDMI 2.1 VRR for this G-Sync Compatibility thing. The only thing that doesn't fit is that they need to turn it on via a firmware update. I'm speculating that maybe the C9 can do FreeSync and that's what will be used and needs to be enabled.


Either way it's just going to use the existing variable refresh rate feature of the C9.
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post #6257 of 10414 Old 09-11-2019, 12:08 AM
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From what I understand, yes. That's roughly the setup I'll also be using.

Thankfully this tv seems to be resistant to burn-in (I'm saying this based on Teoh's tests, and my own experience the last couple of months).

You did change your input to pc, yes?
Yes it’s set to PC and Game picture mode which is calibrated using Calman Auto Cal.
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post #6258 of 10414 Old 09-11-2019, 04:10 AM
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Hi all,

my new pc has arrived, which will have HTPC and gaming duties.
GPU is an RTX 2080.

I'm trying to set things up, but I'm getting a little frustrated. Main issue at the moment is the colour banding present in any videos I play through the pc (which is not there when the tv's own apps are used - so not a content issue).

Any kind soul out there to share your settings and/or any tips on how to set this up?

Thanks a lot
Andreas
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post #6259 of 10414 Old 09-11-2019, 06:14 AM
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Were you replying to me? If so you completely misread what I wrote. I said that Nvidia will be using HDMI 2.1 VRR with the C9.



No, 4K120 HDR needs HDMI 2.1 48Gbps. And the C9 doesn't currently accept a 4K120 4:2:0 8-bit SDR signal.




G-Sync compatible means that the monitor or TV was certified to meet a minimum spec. The video card will turn on G-Sync functionality internally but output either FreeSync (DisplayPort) or VRR (HDMI). Nothing to do with APIs.
No, it has everything to do with VRR API by Microsoft in Directx 12 and the same in vulkan 1.1 and universal applications (UWP only since windows 10 1903) (if you did not know in this APIs one can manipulate all the parameters of VRR (in this case VRR is API name, not HDMI tech.)). It is also supported in windowed apps like adobe audition.
And I know about 4k120Hz 4:4:4 HDR though again it is possible (with a little overclocking, while 8K60 is impossible, that is for sure).
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post #6260 of 10414 Old 09-11-2019, 06:15 AM
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Hmm the LG press release has me a bit worried about [email protected]


http://www.lgnewsroom.com/2019/09/lg...ng-experience/

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which can make the difference between victory and defeat – is barely perceptible at a 6 milliseconds range for 1440p content at 120 Hz and 13 milliseconds range for 4K content at 60 Hz
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post #6261 of 10414 Old 09-11-2019, 06:31 AM
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Unfortunately LG c9 does not support VRR YET (will come with software update)
https://www.nvidia.com/en-us/geforce...ead-r/2266035/
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post #6262 of 10414 Old 09-11-2019, 06:46 AM
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Originally Posted by PittyH View Post
Hmm the LG press release has me a bit worried about [email protected]


http://www.lgnewsroom.com/2019/09/lg...ng-experience/

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which can make the difference between victory and defeat – is barely perceptible at a 6 milliseconds range for 1440p content at 120 Hz and 13 milliseconds range for 4K content at 60 Hz
what worries you about the comment?
I understand that, since no hdmi 2.1 gpu's exist at the moment, it would be misleading for them to note anything about 4k/120.
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post #6263 of 10414 Old 09-11-2019, 07:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Andreas Moyseos View Post
Hi all,



my new pc has arrived, which will have HTPC and gaming duties.

GPU is an RTX 2080.



I'm trying to set things up, but I'm getting a little frustrated. Main issue at the moment is the colour banding present in any videos I play through the pc (which is not there when the tv's own apps are used - so not a content issue).



Any kind soul out there to share your settings and/or any tips on how to set this up?



Thanks a lot

Andreas

4K60 RGB is limited to 8bits. I would suggest trying 4K60 12bit 422 YCbCr
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post #6264 of 10414 Old 09-11-2019, 07:11 AM
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Originally Posted by WiFi-Spy View Post
4K60 RGB is limited to 8bits. I would suggest trying 4K60 12bit 422 YCbCr
Thank you Tyler!
It's about time I sat down and learnt the difference between rgb and ycbcr, as well.. i've been ignoring it for years..
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post #6265 of 10414 Old 09-11-2019, 07:43 AM
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Originally Posted by Бальтазар Лин View Post
No, it has everything to do with VRR API by Microsoft in Directx 12 and the same in vulkan 1.1 and universal applications (UWP only since windows 10 1903) (if you did not know in this APIs one can manipulate all the parameters of VRR (in this case VRR is API name, not HDMI tech.)). It is also supported in windowed apps like adobe audition.
And I know about 4k120Hz 4:4:4 HDR though again it is possible (with a little overclocking, while 8K60 is impossible, that is for sure).
We don't care how the the software on the PC talks to the card in this thread. The discussion here is about the card talking to the TV. So the API used on the PC is irrelevant. For our purposes, "run software on the PC that uses Nvidia's G-Sync" is all that's required to discuss the hardware.

The HDMI port on the card is only 18Gbps. 4K120 4:4:4 HDR10 requires 40.1Gbps. Can't be done on current video cards. What the card can do using DisplayPort does not apply to the C9/E9.
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post #6266 of 10414 Old 09-11-2019, 08:01 AM
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Will be interesting to see if this is HDMI Forum VRR
or if NVIDIA and LG are using an own implementation.
"We are excited to bring G-Sync Compatible support to LG’s 2019 OLED TVs and HDMI Variable Refresh Rate support to our GeForce RTX 20-Series GPUs," said Matt Wuebbling, GeForce head of marketing, Nvidia.

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Originally Posted by Tanquen View Post
But it's freesync not g-$ync. There's no $250 of magical video hardware in the LG TV is there?
No need for magical anything...

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Originally Posted by Ice Cold View Post
EVERYONE take all this new today from NVIDIA with a huge grain of salt it’s not what you u think.

Up until this very announcement GSYNC has never been available via HDMI GSYNC has always been DisplayPort only.
Now it will be, see the quote from Nvidia above.
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post #6267 of 10414 Old 09-11-2019, 08:14 AM
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What I do not understand:
Why do LG OLEDs need a firmware update for that?
HDMI VRR is available since Day 1 on these TVs.
They fixed one bug with XBox One X a few month ago.
Since then it is working fine.

If NVIDIA GPUs really use HDMI Forums VRR Implementation there should be no
need for a Firmwareupdate on our OLEDs. But as we know a firmware update is required.
This makes me wondering what implementation NVIDIA is using. Obviously not the implementation
the XBox One X is using (HDMI Forum VRR). Maybe NVIDIA is using the same implementation AMD is
using with FreeSync via HDMI (which, as we know is not supported by LG OLEDs just yet).

Quote:
Originally Posted by dfa973 View Post
"We are excited to bring G-Sync Compatible support to LG’s 2019 OLED TVs and HDMI Variable Refresh Rate support to our GeForce RTX 20-Series GPUs," said Matt Wuebbling, GeForce head of marketing, Nvidia.
Why is there need for firmware update then? HDMI Forums VRR should useable right away since
it is implemented in the TV since day 1. I highly doubt that LG needs to add HDMI-VRR support for every VRR device via an update.

All NVIDIA is saying is that they added "HDMI VRR". But as I already said. AMD GPUs also support "HDMI VRR". But they do not
use the implementation suggested by the HDMI Forum. Which is why AMD GPUs are not able to use FreeSync (via HDMI) with 2019 LG OLEDs.

Last edited by fenster3000; 09-11-2019 at 08:22 AM.
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post #6268 of 10414 Old 09-11-2019, 08:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fenster3000 View Post
What I do not understand:
Why do LG OLEDs need a firmware update for that?
I have three theories:

1) Existing cards may not be capable of HDMI VRR and LG is adding/enabling FreeSync which is what G-Sync Compatible monitors use.
2) The card needs to see something in the display's EDID.
3) They had to tweak the timings or something to meet the G-Sync Compatible certification.
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Last edited by avernar; 09-11-2019 at 08:53 AM.
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post #6269 of 10414 Old 09-11-2019, 08:46 AM
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So i have an Amd Radeon vii and have been waiting for a free-sync update to try it out on the oled. Now im learning that a new update is coming for only nvidia? I know the xbox has the vrr support and thats cool, but what about amd gpu’s? What about Amd navi or the Radeon vii? No Freesync support? Really? Just nvidia and consoles.

Is there hope for amd gpu users? Or should I have gone nvidia? DAMN...
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post #6270 of 10414 Old 09-11-2019, 08:50 AM
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Is there hope for amd gpu users? Or should I have gone nvidia? DAMN...
See number 1 in my previous post. If that's not the case then AMD will have to add/enable HDMI VRR support in their cards.
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