2019 C9–E9 Owner's Thread (No Price Talk) - Page 262 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #7831 of 10355 Old 10-21-2019, 03:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LiLAsN View Post
You are losing your peak brightness by conforming yourself to the Hollywood movie standard of videos.



The TVs were built by Korea. The white point is if I remember correctly, D100. That is why when you calibrate your TV with Calman to D65 White point, you will end up losing some of your peak brightness as the white LED in your WOLED subpixel is not being used as much. Some countries in the east like Japan uses a different set of standards like D97 white point. So I can also say, you are not watching Japanese animes to the proper colour that the Japanese producer intended.

I can tell you in all honesty with the windows open, I don't see my daylight and especially the mid noon to look that yellowish as compared to my TV that was colour corrected to D65 White balance. Thus, D65 in itself is not how I see the world as as well.

And don't forget. Films are now filmed digitally. Not on yellowish films that makes all old movies look super old. Digital cameras helps us to achieve proper whites without painting a yellowish tint across the picture.

Not to mention, our houses or my house at least now use LED lights. Not incandescent lighting. So I see my walls in your definition of bluish whites instead of the yellowish like unlike last time which in itself, didn't match the colour of the sky in broad daylight.



This is where I think XRITE says it best.



"While you could recalibrate to a different white point in the evenings, it would likely be more distracting that using the same setting all the time. Attempting to simulate incandescent light on your monitor would result in an extremely yellow-orange display.

What works best also strongly depends on the ambient lighting. If you are doing a lot of image evaluation, try to match the white point of your display to that of your room lighting to help minimize the discrepancy when switching back and forth. In general, your eye should adapt to the white point of the display fairly quickly, and your impression of "blueness" may be a color memory issue that will diminish with time."





What I did was this during my Calman for LG calibration afterwards. I set a different white point balance similar to my country's daylight situation which is closer to Japan broadcast standard of D97 but not exactly D97. But the rest is still set to the colour standard. The end result is all the primary and secondary colours are unaffected but my White point looks more natural to what I see around me. This can be confirmed from local TV programmes or your own videos that you shot that you can rewatch at home. Or even better, looking at your surroundings and seeing if the whites matches the white on your wall from the sun's rays hitting it and not the TV's lights hitting the wall. Even the people's skins started to look normal. You can see even their pinkish hue when they blush instead of everyone looking sickly with unnatural yellowish skins thanks to the D65 yellow tint across the screen. As mentioned, other than the whites, everything else is colour accurate. So it's a win-win.





But if you have some thoughts, please do share. I'd love to learn more about this topic as well.


Could you please post all your settings so I can test it on my C9, would be great!

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post #7832 of 10355 Old 10-21-2019, 04:41 PM
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What's the typical lag time before LG starts pushing these out for auto download and updating? I'm now two updates behind, still on 3.60.19 or whatever

QUOTE=Baff;58708874]
Quote:
Originally Posted by lujan View Post
We need to hear from others with the new firmware. Are others getting Atmos via eARC on the internal Netflix app?
I did the firmware update, then checked Netflix and Atmos was working. Then I updated the Netflix app, and Atmos is still working for me.[/QUOTE]
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post #7833 of 10355 Old 10-21-2019, 04:45 PM
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Originally Posted by GC3 View Post
What's the typical lag time before LG starts pushing these out for auto download and updating? I'm now two updates behind, still on 3.60.19 or whatever

QUOTE=Baff;58708874]

I did the firmware update, then checked Netflix and Atmos was working. Then I updated the Netflix app, and Atmos is still working for me.
I don't know what's going on with my setup? I may replace the HDMI cable between the Denon and the LG?

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post #7834 of 10355 Old 10-21-2019, 05:04 PM
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Originally Posted by GC3 View Post
What's the typical lag time before LG starts pushing these out for auto download and updating? I'm now two updates behind, still on 3.60.19 or whatever
You are only 1 behind. 4.70.05 comes right after 3.60.19. It will probably be on auto download this week. I'm not sure it is that big of a deal. I manually installed it to fix the Atmos issue in the Netflix app. If you are real excited for it, it isn't hard to download and install it as long as you have a usb drive.
https://www.lg.com/us/support/produc...LED77C9PUB.AUS
Just download the zip file and the pdf instructions right below it.

There is another engineering version (4.80.12), but it is very unclear what is in that version. The next official firmware (december?) will likely be very different from that engineering version.

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post #7835 of 10355 Old 10-21-2019, 05:06 PM
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Originally Posted by lujan View Post
I don't know what's going on with my setup? I may replace the HDMI cable between the Denon and the LG?
What kind of cable is it?
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post #7836 of 10355 Old 10-21-2019, 05:10 PM
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Originally Posted by avernar View Post
What kind of cable is it?
It's a Monoprice certified with ethernet but I have an 8k cable that I haven't tried yet that specifically says supports eARC.

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post #7837 of 10355 Old 10-21-2019, 05:13 PM
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Originally Posted by lujan View Post
It's a Monoprice certified with ethernet but I have an 8k cable that I haven't tried yet that specifically says supports eARC.
That Monoprice one shouldn’t be giving you trouble.
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post #7838 of 10355 Old 10-21-2019, 05:16 PM
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Originally Posted by Baff View Post
You are only 1 behind. 4.70.05 comes right after 3.60.19.
The info thread has a 3.60.45 listed released only 3 days before 4.79.05 was.
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post #7839 of 10355 Old 10-21-2019, 05:24 PM
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Originally Posted by fookoo_2010 View Post
What does a dvd look like on a 65" LG OLED, as compared to a 65" 2K display? Is it more blurry? The same? All this with black levels not being the same.
You will know you are looking at a DVD vs. a BD, it it is not bad, it just looks soft not blurry. Also depends on the source. If the source is cleanly mastered the upscale will look good.

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post #7840 of 10355 Old 10-21-2019, 05:26 PM
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Originally Posted by avernar View Post
That Monoprice one shouldn’t be giving you trouble.
Switching out the cable didn't make a difference. The last thing I can think of is doing a factory reset of the LG. It's easier to do that than factory reset the Denon which would take much longer to reconfigure afterwards.

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post #7841 of 10355 Old 10-21-2019, 05:31 PM
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Originally Posted by lujan View Post
Switching out the cable didn't make a difference. The last thing I can think of is doing a factory reset of the LG. It's easier to do that than factory reset the Denon which would take much longer to reconfigure afterwards.
Have you tried switching to internal, toggling the ATMOS option left then right and putting it back to ARC?

Another thing to try is to switch to Internal so that Netflix shows ATMOS in the show description, play the show and then switch to ARC while it’s playing.
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post #7842 of 10355 Old 10-21-2019, 06:28 PM
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When you guys are referring to D65 and D97, is that in reference to 6500K and 9700K color temperature?
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post #7843 of 10355 Old 10-21-2019, 06:36 PM
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PC Mode appears to be bugged on this set.

There is noticeable posturization and banding on PC mode in 8bit games in RGB Full. It took me some odd 60 hours to realize the problem but now I can't unsee it. I noticed it in a few darker titles, like Bioshock 1, Amnesia: Machine for Pigs, etc. Every time I slightly move the camera in a very dark scene things get slightly brighter and there is banding/posturization. It looks very unnatural. Disabling PC mode fixes this. This happens in all presets and does not happen on my E6 in PC mode.

If you have Bioshock 1, during the intro when you ride the elevator down and it's dark. Turn your lights off and look around while in PC mode. It'll be very noticeable, disable PC mode and it goes away.

If someone can confirm, I'd like to know somethings not off with my set. PC mode is basically usable now that I know it's causing this... I've seen it in 4 different games so far.

Last edited by Laupe; 10-21-2019 at 06:50 PM.
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post #7844 of 10355 Old 10-21-2019, 06:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by avernar View Post
Have you tried switching to internal, toggling the ATMOS option left then right and putting it back to ARC?

Another thing to try is to switch to Internal so that Netflix shows ATMOS in the show description, play the show and then switch to ARC while it’s playing.
I’ve tried switching to internal but not while playing. I wouldn’t want to do this every time.

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post #7845 of 10355 Old 10-21-2019, 06:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Laupe View Post
PC Mode appears to be bugged on this set.

There is noticeable posturization and banding on PC mode in 8bit games in RGB Full. It took me some odd 60 hours to realize the problem but now I can't unsee it. I noticed it in a few darker titles, like Bioshock 1, Amnesia: Machine for Pigs, etc. Every time I slightly move the camera in a very dark scene things get slightly brighter and there is banding/posturization. It looks very unnatural. Disabling PC mode fixes this. This happens in all presets and does not happen on my E6 in PC mode.

If you have Bioshock 1, during the intro when you ride the elevator down and it's dark. Turn your lights off and look around while in PC mode. It'll be very noticeable, disable PC mode and it goes away.

If someone can confirm, I'd like to know somethings not off with my set. PC mode is basically usable now that I know it's causing this... I've seen it in 4 different games so far.
This was noted soon after the 2019 models released and people suggested not using PC mode but I believe you lose 4:4:4 in doing so.

Really dumb oversite on LG's part.
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post #7846 of 10355 Old 10-21-2019, 07:00 PM
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Originally Posted by lujan View Post
I’ve tried switching to internal but not while playing. I wouldn’t want to do this every time.
But you do get ATMOS when you switch back? If you don’t there is something else wrong.

You need to follow these steps exactly:
  1. Switch to internal while on the show’s info screen so it switches from VISION 5.1 to VISION ATMOS
  2. Play the show
  3. Switch to eARC while playing. Your AVR should say ATMOS at this point.
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post #7847 of 10355 Old 10-21-2019, 07:04 PM
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Originally Posted by FantasticGrand View Post
This was noted soon after the 2019 models released and people suggested not using PC mode but I believe you lose 4:4:4 in doing so.

Really dumb oversite on LG's part.
How is this a thing when my E6 didn't have this problem? This is sadly a deal breaker for me... How can they push GSYNC with this massive bug in PC mode?

Having to choose between extreme banding and posturization or 4:4:4 on a set of this price... I thought it only effected HDR gaming, but sadly it's all games, some just make it more noticeable than others. It's really really bad in very dark games. Bioshock 1 will make you want to tear your eyes when in PC mode.

Last edited by Laupe; 10-21-2019 at 07:09 PM.
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post #7848 of 10355 Old 10-21-2019, 07:24 PM
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Originally Posted by FantasticGrand View Post
This was noted soon after the 2019 models released and people suggested not using PC mode but I believe you lose 4:4:4 in doing so.
Got 4:4:4 without PC mode. Someone with a better graphics card should play with that screen some more.
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Last edited by avernar; 10-21-2019 at 07:28 PM.
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post #7849 of 10355 Old 10-21-2019, 07:28 PM
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I would considering the banding and posturization PC mode causes to be unplayable in some game. LG needs to fix this. The first image especially is especially bad. I beat the whole game (Amnesia: A Machine for Pigs) thinking it was the game. The second is from Bioshock 1, which bands like crazy in PC mode. The smoke has very aggressive lines, every dark area has really bad posturization. It's hard to capture such dark scenes on my phone, but it's a night/day difference when PC mode is disabled. I use the same settings on both inputs.

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Got 4:4:4 without PC mode. Someone with a better graphics card should play with that screen some more.
I am not showing 4:4:4 with PC mode, my green text in steam is noticeably wrong. Deep Color is ON, and set to RGB Full in drivers. Did you have to tweak anything?
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Last edited by Laupe; 10-21-2019 at 07:32 PM.
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post #7850 of 10355 Old 10-21-2019, 07:32 PM
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Originally Posted by Laupe View Post
How is this a thing when my E6 didn't have this problem? This is sadly a deal breaker for me... How can they push GSYNC with this massive bug in PC mode?

Having to choose between extreme banding and posturization or 4:4:4 on a set of this price... I thought it only effected HDR gaming, but sadly it's all games, some just make it more noticeable than others. It's really really bad in very dark games. Bioshock 1 will make you want to tear your eyes when in PC mode.

Are you on a C9 or a different model? I've been doing PC gaming on my 55 C9 for months now and have never seen this problem. I've played several FPS games with very dark scenes in both SDR and HDR. The C9 is in PC mode with RGB full 8 bit in NVCP.
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post #7851 of 10355 Old 10-21-2019, 07:32 PM
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I am not showing 4:4:4 with PC mode, my green text in steam is noticeably wrong. Deep Color is ON, and set to drivers. Did you have to tweak anything?
Can you post a screenshot the HDMI Diagnostic screen in both normal and PC mode?
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post #7852 of 10355 Old 10-21-2019, 07:34 PM
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Originally Posted by jacoro1 View Post
Are you on a C9 or a different model? I've been doing PC gaming on my 55 C9 for months now and have never seen this problem. I've played several FPS games with very dark scenes in both SDR and HDR. The C9 is in PC mode with RGB full 8 bit in NVCP.
C9. I played 56 hours this week, and I did notice more banding than normal but I thought it was because I was gaming on a 77" and it was bringing out the flaws. After starting playing Bioshock, I knew something was wrong because it was a game I'd played before.

Not all games get dark enough to really make it noticeable. Witcher 3, Tomb Raider, etc don't seem to do it even in darker areas. Extremely dark games like Bioshock, Amnesia, Outlast, etc do though.

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Can you post a screenshot the HDMI Diagnostic screen in both normal and PC mode?
How?
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post #7853 of 10355 Old 10-21-2019, 07:37 PM
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Does anybody know if the C9 does lossless sound when using WiSA speakers? I have written to LG and received no response. I am using the Klipsch Reference speakers and the Axiim Link. Can somebody please answer?
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post #7854 of 10355 Old 10-21-2019, 07:39 PM
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How?
Follow the instructions here: https://www.avsforum.com/forum/40-ol...l#post58698658
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post #7855 of 10355 Old 10-21-2019, 07:47 PM
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Originally Posted by avernar View Post
PC mode and non-PC mode look the same to me, but non-PC mode is definitely not 4:4:4

EDIT: Yours says you are at 30hz.
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post #7856 of 10355 Old 10-21-2019, 07:49 PM
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Originally Posted by Laupe View Post
C9. I played 56 hours this week, and I did notice more banding than normal but I thought it was because I was gaming on a 77" and it was bringing out the flaws. After starting playing Bioshock, I knew something was wrong because it was a game I'd played before.

Not all games get dark enough to really make it noticeable. Witcher 3, Tomb Raider, etc don't seem to do it even in darker areas. Extremely dark games like Bioshock, Amnesia, Outlast, etc do though.

I don't have the original Bioshock but I'm reinstalling Outlast to try it. I did just recently play through Metro Exodus on this set though, and it has lots of very dark areas. It looked perfect to me. I watch tv shows and movies while in PC mode as well and haven't seen it there either.
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post #7857 of 10355 Old 10-21-2019, 07:53 PM
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Originally Posted by Laupe View Post
PC mode and non-PC mode look the same to me, but non-PC mode is definitely not 4:4:4

EDIT: Yours says you are at 30hz.
Both modes the PC is sending RGB (which isn’t 4:4:4 technically but doesn’t matter in this case). What happens if you change picture mode to Game in non-PC mode?

On-board laptop graphics. I game on PS4 and Xbox. That’s why I can’t test this myself.
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post #7858 of 10355 Old 10-21-2019, 07:54 PM
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Originally Posted by jacoro1 View Post
I don't have the original Bioshock but I'm reinstalling Outlast to try it. I did just recently play through Metro Exodus on this set though, and it has lots of very dark areas. It looked perfect to me. I watch tv shows and movies while in PC mode as well and haven't seen it there either.
I didn't notice too much in outlast TBH. I think you'll have a hard time noticing the problems with that game.
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post #7859 of 10355 Old 10-21-2019, 07:56 PM
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Originally Posted by avernar View Post
Both modes the PC is sending RGB (which isn’t 4:4:4 technically but doesn’t matter in this case). What happens if you change picture mode to Game in non-PC mode?

On-board laptop graphics. I game on PS4 and Xbox. That’s why I can’t test this myself.
It's not gonna change anything because the NVIDIA drivers control the RGB level. As far as I know, you cannot get 4:4:4 on LG OLED without PC mode.
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post #7860 of 10355 Old 10-21-2019, 08:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Laupe View Post
PC Mode appears to be bugged on this set.

There is noticeable posturization and banding on PC mode in 8bit games in RGB Full. It took me some odd 60 hours to realize the problem but now I can't unsee it. I noticed it in a few darker titles, like Bioshock 1, Amnesia: Machine for Pigs, etc. Every time I slightly move the camera in a very dark scene things get slightly brighter and there is banding/posturization. It looks very unnatural. Disabling PC mode fixes this. This happens in all presets and does not happen on my E6 in PC mode.

If you have Bioshock 1, during the intro when you ride the elevator down and it's dark. Turn your lights off and look around while in PC mode. It'll be very noticeable, disable PC mode and it goes away.

If someone can confirm, I'd like to know somethings not off with my set. PC mode is basically usable now that I know it's causing this... I've seen it in 4 different games so far.
This is an issue going back several generations of LG OLED's. It affects the C9, C8, C7 and C6 (I also own a C6). The banding is even worse in HDR content in PC mode. I don't have much hope that LG will fix it
Here is a forum that discusses the issue a little.

https://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1869558
No way to fix it until LG does something but I don't have high hopes as it hasn't been fixed in 4 generations of OLED's. You can reduce the banding by switching to YCbCr 4:4:4 in the Nvidia control panel but you'll be stuck on Limited Range and reduced quality, especially with text.

LG OLED65C9PUA; Denon AVR-X4500H, 7.2.4 ATMOS
LG OLED55C6P, Denon AVR-X6300H also rocking 7.2.4 ATMOS goodness!
Samsung UN65HU9000FXZA (TS01) with SEK-3500U/ZA Evolution Kit, Onkyo TX-RZ1100
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Reply OLED Technology and Flat Panels General

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