2019 C9–E9 Owner's Thread (No Price Talk) - Page 27 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #781 of 4452 Old 04-11-2019, 01:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Friendlys View Post
Is 1440p @120 fps available and can you play hdr games at this higher resolution on this tv? Sorry, I've only owned lcd(current PQ65). I know freesync wont be available to me(1080ti). Thanks
I can select 2560*1440 at 120Hz in advanced display settings --> list all modes for the LG C9 from my PC desktop. Whether HDR works at resolution I dunno - I have to go to work now!

Thanks
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post #782 of 4452 Old 04-11-2019, 04:22 PM
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Well went to my local BB yesterday and they have the C8 and the C9 on display. Picture Quality looks identical to me.
Besides the HDMI 2.1 upgrade this feels like a refresh to me.
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post #783 of 4452 Old 04-11-2019, 05:45 PM
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Originally Posted by Iluv4k View Post
Well went to my local BB yesterday and they have the C8 and the C9 on display. Picture Quality looks identical to me.
Besides the HDMI 2.1 upgrade this feels like a refresh to me.
Easy to say running 4k demos. Once you have one at home with sub 4k content you can tell the difference and turn off that ugly vivid mode with motion processing on.
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post #784 of 4452 Old 04-11-2019, 06:09 PM
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Have had my C9 55" for a week+ now. It's my first 4k and first OLED, so I'm obviously enjoying myself. Figured I'd add a couple of my experiences and answers to questions being asked:

1. I have been struggling with lip-sync to my sonos beam. It's one of those things I'm very sensitive to, and I can't quite convince myself I've solved it. Still seems like the audio is slightly behind the picture most of the time. I'm using HDMI ARC, have tried all the settings but settled on DD output with 'pass-through'. Have tried toggling back and forth between av-sync off and on with 'bypass' selected, but can't seem to decide which is better. Any tips I'm missing here?

2. Someone mentioned needing to lower brightness to get true blacks. I noticed this last night while watching netflix (via tv app). Somewhere between 47-48 seemed best to me in a dark room, but I will want to keep playing with it. I haven't done a proper calibration yet (and don't have the equipment to do a true isf version). I am still hoping to see more info about what calibrators are recommending for various modes (I know they can't give universal values for color/brightness).

3. The xbox one x seems to work well with hdr/vrr, though the latter is hard to really observe. I'm hoping someone will identify a specific area of a popular game where the framerate normally varies a lot to see the difference. I hooked up my pc today (GTX 1080) and was immediately able to enable HDR mode in windows and select [email protected] (didn't try 120hz at lower res, but will). Forza Horizon 4 looks great on the xbox, but that only does 30fps @ 4k, whereas my pc can do a solid 60fps, and holy CRAP does that look stunning! I had g-sync enabled on the pc due to my monitor, but I assume it doesn't work with the tv, just not 100% sure how to check.
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post #785 of 4452 Old 04-11-2019, 06:42 PM
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Anyone know when the 77” C9 will be available in store for viewing?
I would guess within 30-60 days.......

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Originally Posted by Iluv4k View Post
Well went to my local BB yesterday and they have the C8 and the C9 on display. Picture Quality looks identical to me.
Besides the HDMI 2.1 upgrade this feels like a refresh to me.
Yep it is true, D-Nice confirmed this.......

Last edited by Cleveland Plasma; 04-11-2019 at 06:48 PM.
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post #786 of 4452 Old 04-11-2019, 07:36 PM
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Originally Posted by RadTech51 View Post
Anyone know when the 77” C9 will be available in store for viewing?
I would guess within 30-60 days.......

Quote:
Originally Posted by Iluv4k View Post
Well went to my local BB yesterday and they have the C8 and the C9 on display. Picture Quality looks identical to me.
Besides the HDMI 2.1 upgrade this feels like a refresh to me.
Yep it is true, D-Nice confirmed this.......
The overall picture quality on the C8 and C9 are not identical. The C9 is an incremental improvement over the C8 which I believe is what D-Nice indicated and how i feel comparing the sets side by side after testing all types of content. I’m not sure why everyone was expecting a revolutionary improvement given the panel hasn’t changed much. We did get confirmation that there was a hardware change in the C9 enabling many of the new features.

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post #787 of 4452 Old 04-12-2019, 03:35 AM
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Originally Posted by Seraph321 View Post
Have had my C9 55" for a week+ now. It's my first 4k and first OLED, so I'm obviously enjoying myself. Figured I'd add a couple of my experiences and answers to questions being asked:

1. I have been struggling with lip-sync to my sonos beam. It's one of those things I'm very sensitive to, and I can't quite convince myself I've solved it. Still seems like the audio is slightly behind the picture most of the time. I'm using HDMI ARC, have tried all the settings but settled on DD output with 'pass-through'. Have tried toggling back and forth between av-sync off and on with 'bypass' selected, but can't seem to decide which is better. Any tips I'm missing here?

2. Someone mentioned needing to lower brightness to get true blacks. I noticed this last night while watching netflix (via tv app). Somewhere between 47-48 seemed best to me in a dark room, but I will want to keep playing with it. I haven't done a proper calibration yet (and don't have the equipment to do a true isf version). I am still hoping to see more info about what calibrators are recommending for various modes (I know they can't give universal values for color/brightness).

3. The xbox one x seems to work well with hdr/vrr, though the latter is hard to really observe. I'm hoping someone will identify a specific area of a popular game where the framerate normally varies a lot to see the difference. I hooked up my pc today (GTX 1080) and was immediately able to enable HDR mode in windows and select [email protected] (didn't try 120hz at lower res, but will). Forza Horizon 4 looks great on the xbox, but that only does 30fps @ 4k, whereas my pc can do a solid 60fps, and holy CRAP does that look stunning! I had g-sync enabled on the pc due to my monitor, but I assume it doesn't work with the tv, just not 100% sure how to check.
For #2 , every tv has a different black level so you can’t copy this. I suggest you get a black level video or test picture and set it to the right level in a dark room. Start high and back off until blacks look black around the 17/18 bars on the pattern.
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post #788 of 4452 Old 04-12-2019, 04:49 AM
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No BFI at 120hz is a dealbreaker.

Looking to downgrade to the nanocell or straight up wait for next year's samsung QD-OLED stuff instead in lieu of this.
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post #789 of 4452 Old 04-12-2019, 05:08 AM
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Originally Posted by kellerr1 View Post
No BFI at 120hz is a dealbreaker.

Looking to downgrade to the nanocell or straight up wait for next year's samsung QD-OLED stuff instead in lieu of this.
Yeah. Knowing this is an owner's thread I'll keep it brief.


Such a downgrade, in the videogames world, would have created a mess of a situation for LG.


Presenting stuff in the best possible light and then heavily downgrading it at release is not taken with a smile for videogames. But there's probably a wider nucleus of passionate users in videogaming than for TVs, so LG will get away with this, with no explanation.
An acceptable (not perfect) BFI implementation had me convinced that this was the year to switch to OLED but the current situation has seriously dampened my enthusiasm. I cannot change TV every couple of years, unfortunately. Far from it.

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post #790 of 4452 Old 04-12-2019, 06:21 AM
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Originally Posted by guitarguy316 View Post
For #2 , every tv has a different black level so you can’t copy this. I suggest you get a black level video or test picture and set it to the right level in a dark room. Start high and back off until blacks look black around the 17/18 bars on the pattern.
I keep saying this over and over, crushed blacks can be caused by many things but one clear screen may help according to LG, and a lot of the time calibration will fix or improve this problem because often the gamma is not optimal in the lower ire's. Playing with the black level one click is ok to try and may improve PQ but what you will find is you will start elevating the black floor.

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post #791 of 4452 Old 04-12-2019, 06:29 AM
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Yeah. Knowing this is an owner's thread I'll keep it brief.


Such a downgrade, in the videogames world, would have created a mess of a situation for LG.


Presenting stuff in the best possible light and then heavily downgrading it at release is not taken with a smile for videogames. But there's probably a wider nucleus of passionate users in videogaming than for TVs, so LG will get away with this, with no explanation.
An acceptable (not perfect) BFI implementation had me convinced that this was the year to switch to OLED but the current situation has seriously dampened my enthusiasm. I cannot change TV every couple of years, unfortunately. Far from it.
You can also look at it another way. Would you rather have had LG released BFI and then there was a problem that couldn't be fixed? There would have been a whole thread on AVS just on that topic. I feel LG did the responsible thing by not releasing the feature and then have to deal with all the user complaints and negative press.

If you watch various content on the 2019 LG you will see a noticeable improvement in motion over the C8 and previous years. It's not perfect and not as good as the Sony, in my opinion, but it's pretty good and i'm sure will get better with firmware updates.
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post #792 of 4452 Old 04-12-2019, 06:31 AM
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There is new firmware for the 2019 LGs 03.50.31 on the web site this morning.
Release notes say PQ improvements but they never tell you everything that's in the release.
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Can any owners confirm that eARC is operational and tested to work on the C9? I have not seen a single confirmation that this feature is working on this TV.
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post #794 of 4452 Old 04-12-2019, 07:09 AM
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Originally Posted by jrref View Post
The overall picture quality on the C8 and C9 are not identical. The C9 is an incremental improvement over the C8 which I believe is what D-Nice indicated and how i feel comparing the sets side by side after testing all types of content. I’m not sure why everyone was expecting a revolutionary improvement given the panel hasn’t changed much. We did get confirmation that there was a hardware change in the C9 enabling many of the new features.
From the reactions to your and D-Nice's posts, I suspect that a lot of people have been interpreting "incremental" to mean "infinitesimal".

This is the way I have interpreted your comments: "The C9 is a step up from the C8, but it is not worth spending thousands of dollars to upgrade from a C8 to a C9, unless money means nothing to you."
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People are already having firmware updates for C9, Q90 already on went on discount and I'm yet to see C9 / E9 at my location.
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post #796 of 4452 Old 04-12-2019, 07:15 AM
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From the reactions to your and D-Nice's posts, I suspect that a lot of people have been interpreting "incremental" to mean "infinitesimal".

This is the way I have interpreted your comments: "The C9 is a step up from the C8, but it is not worth spending thousands of dollars to upgrade from a C8 to a C9, unless money means nothing to you."
Or unless you want to upgrade your screen size.

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post #797 of 4452 Old 04-12-2019, 07:34 AM - Thread Starter
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2019 C9–E9 Owner's Thread (No Price Talk)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Seraph321 View Post
Have had my C9 55" for a week+ now. It's my first 4k and first OLED, so I'm obviously enjoying myself. Figured I'd add a couple of my experiences and answers to questions being asked:



1. I have been struggling with lip-sync to my sonos beam. It's one of those things I'm very sensitive to, and I can't quite convince myself I've solved it. Still seems like the audio is slightly behind the picture most of the time. I'm using HDMI ARC, have tried all the settings but settled on DD output with 'pass-through'. Have tried toggling back and forth between av-sync off and on with 'bypass' selected, but can't seem to decide which is better. Any tips I'm missing here?



2. Someone mentioned needing to lower brightness to get true blacks. I noticed this last night while watching netflix (via tv app). Somewhere between 47-48 seemed best to me in a dark room, but I will want to keep playing with it. I haven't done a proper calibration yet (and don't have the equipment to do a true isf version). I am still hoping to see more info about what calibrators are recommending for various modes (I know they can't give universal values for color/brightness).



3. The xbox one x seems to work well with hdr/vrr, though the latter is hard to really observe. I'm hoping someone will identify a specific area of a popular game where the framerate normally varies a lot to see the difference. I hooked up my pc today (GTX 1080) and was immediately able to enable HDR mode in windows and select [email protected] (didn't try 120hz at lower res, but will). Forza Horizon 4 looks great on the xbox, but that only does 30fps @ 4k, whereas my pc can do a solid 60fps, and holy CRAP does that look stunning! I had g-sync enabled on the pc due to my monitor, but I assume it doesn't work with the tv, just not 100% sure how to check.


On the Xbox One X games must support VRR. Look up specific games on Xbox.com for support and you will notice Gears 4, Division 2 support VRR but Forza Horizon 4 does not.
Test Gears 4, it looks stunning (great HDR tone map) and runs smoothly without a hitch.

On a side note I don’t know what people expected of the C9 this year. LG is driving the panel harder than ever so HDR really pops.
With the right content I’m constantly surprised how good it looks. I understand the disappointment regarding the promised motion features . The C9 just came out and historically LG is better than Sony on updates so things should only improve (fingers crossed).


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post #798 of 4452 Old 04-12-2019, 07:53 AM
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What’s with all this talk about no BFI? It’s
The feature is not Available at all or is it only not available at 120HZ?
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post #799 of 4452 Old 04-12-2019, 08:50 AM
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Apologies if this is not the appropriate thread for this (someone point me where it would be).

I am interested in getting a C9, but do not want to play panel lottery for the obvious reasons plus I live way out in the middle of nowhere so its a major hassle from a transport perspective and getting ISF calibrators out here is kind of a non option without paying for over and beyond travel fees.

All that said, I was leaning towards a service such as Value Electronics (panel check, ISF calibration) but I am on the other side of the country from them. Does anyone know of any similar west coast services that will panel check and ship?
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post #800 of 4452 Old 04-12-2019, 09:18 AM
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What’s with all this talk about no BFI? It’s
The feature is not Available at all or is it only not available at 120HZ?
It's just the same BFI that is on existing OLEDs. Not the improved BFI that LGD and LGE talked about and demoed.

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post #801 of 4452 Old 04-12-2019, 09:18 AM
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Originally Posted by jrref View Post
You can also look at it another way. Would you rather have had LG released BFI and then there was a problem that couldn't be fixed? There would have been a whole thread on AVS just on that topic. I feel LG did the responsible thing by not releasing the feature and then have to deal with all the user complaints and negative press.

If you watch various content on the 2019 LG you will see a noticeable improvement in motion over the C8 and previous years. It's not perfect and not as good as the Sony, in my opinion, but it's pretty good and i'm sure will get better with firmware updates.
Noticeable improvement in motion over the C8 sounds in itself a worthy upgrade to me since LG has a poor reputation in this department to begin with. I’m sensitive to motion handling myself and always wondered why some reviewers hide or omit this information in their LG OLED reviews. I love the motion handling on Sony displays however so the closer they get to them the better.

As for BFI being removed I’m not to surprised here as it’s notorious for causing issues on displays and is almost always recommended to be turned off. The potential gains though if they ever get it right sounds intriguing so this is a disappointment in that regard.

 

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post #802 of 4452 Old 04-12-2019, 09:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kellerr1 View Post
No BFI at 120hz is a dealbreaker.

Looking to downgrade to the nanocell or straight up wait for next year's samsung QD-OLED stuff instead in lieu of this.
Quote:
Originally Posted by gorman42 View Post
Yeah. Knowing this is an owner's thread I'll keep it brief.


Such a downgrade, in the videogames world, would have created a mess of a situation for LG.


Presenting stuff in the best possible light and then heavily downgrading it at release is not taken with a smile for videogames. But there's probably a wider nucleus of passionate users in videogaming than for TVs, so LG will get away with this, with no explanation.
An acceptable (not perfect) BFI implementation had me convinced that this was the year to switch to OLED but the current situation has seriously dampened my enthusiasm. I cannot change TV every couple of years, unfortunately. Far from it.
what's the obsession with BFI? with it on the screen still flickers. i've never seen any lcd or oled with BFI that i couldn't pick up the flicker on.



Quote:
Originally Posted by New_to_4K View Post
People are already having firmware updates for C9, Q90 already on went on discount and I'm yet to see C9 / E9 at my location.
i see it in stock online at all the best buy's near me now...

Quote:
Originally Posted by TechNerd666 View Post
What’s with all this talk about no BFI? It’s
The feature is not Available at all or is it only not available at 120HZ?
there is BFI just like on the 2018 C8 series. LG had showed BFI with low/med/high settings in terms of level of BFI, but looks like there will only be an "on" setting again this year.

Overall as the John and DeWayne have said, I had a C8 right next to the C9 i got and the improved motion is noticeable WITHOUT any BFI, trumotion, etc. turned on.
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post #803 of 4452 Old 04-12-2019, 09:22 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by jrref View Post
There is new firmware for the 2019 LGs 03.50.31 on the web site this morning.

Release notes say PQ improvements but they never tell you everything that's in the release.


John are you going to update any TVs today with the new firmware? I might tempt fate and update mine later tonight. Didn’t the gentlemen from Australia notice improved response time?


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post #804 of 4452 Old 04-12-2019, 09:23 AM
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John are you going to update any TVs today with the new firmware? I might tempt fate and update mine later tonight. Didn’t the gentlemen from Australia notice improved response time?


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he should be updating mine before calibrating this weekend i think?
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post #805 of 4452 Old 04-12-2019, 09:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by guitarguy316 View Post
what's the obsession with BFI? with it on the screen still flickers. i've never seen any lcd or oled with BFI that i couldn't pick up the flicker on.





i see it in stock online at all the best buy's near me now...



there is BFI just like on the 2018 C8 series. LG had showed BFI with low/med/high settings in terms of level of BFI, but looks like there will only be an "on" setting again this year.

Overall as the John and DeWayne have said, I had a C8 right next to the C9 i got and the improved motion is noticeable WITHOUT any BFI, trumotion, etc. turned on.
The flicker is barely noticeable at 60Hz. It's one of my favorite features on my A9F vs my B6. Brings the motion handling pretty much on par with plasma. It's a shame we have to wait for 75% BFI since that may have resulted in superior than plasma motion and possibly on par with CRT.

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post #806 of 4452 Old 04-12-2019, 09:27 AM
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The overall picture quality on the C8 and C9 are not identical. The C9 is an incremental improvement over the C8 which I believe is what D-Nice indicated and how i feel comparing the sets side by side after testing all types of content. I’m not sure why everyone was expecting a revolutionary improvement given the panel hasn’t changed much. We did get confirmation that there was a hardware change in the C9 enabling many of the new features.
If the screen uniformity regarding the vertical banding in dark scenes is improved over the C8 in addition to better motion handling this would be more than incremental improvement in my opinion.

Do you know which display D-Nice recommends or owns personally? I’d be curious because he was a big Pioneer Kuro ELITE fan from what I remember and he treasured deep inky black levels on displays as being probably the most important picture quality element back then. OLED’s obviously have the best black level now so I wouldn’t be surprised if he owns one now and has a recommendation.

 

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post #807 of 4452 Old 04-12-2019, 09:38 AM
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Have any 2019 C9-E9 owners hooked up a PC with an AMD GPU and checked what FreeSync range their TV reports? I'm really curious, especially at 4K.



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Originally Posted by Seraph321 View Post
3. The xbox one x seems to work well with hdr/vrr, though the latter is hard to really observe. I'm hoping someone will identify a specific area of a popular game where the framerate normally varies a lot to see the difference. I hooked up my pc today (GTX 1080) and was immediately able to enable HDR mode in windows and select [email protected] (didn't try 120hz at lower res, but will). Forza Horizon 4 looks great on the xbox, but that only does 30fps @ 4k, whereas my pc can do a solid 60fps, and holy CRAP does that look stunning! I had g-sync enabled on the pc due to my monitor, but I assume it doesn't work with the tv, just not 100% sure how to check.

No, NVIDIA doesn't support VRR over HDMI. And unfortunately they probably won't until their next major GPU refresh.


The Xbox isn't a great test for VRR either because, from what I've seen on my own FreeSync monitor, and what I read on Digital Foundry, it isn't implemented the same as it would be on PC.

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post #808 of 4452 Old 04-12-2019, 09:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jrref View Post
Or unless you want to upgrade your screen size.
Even then though for many it might be worth getting a 77C8 over a 77C9 with the price difference and little upgrade in performance. That's what I personally did as I didn't see the C9 worth the £2500 premium that it is here in the UK.
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post #809 of 4452 Old 04-12-2019, 10:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ozymandis View Post
Have any 2019 C9-E9 owners hooked up a PC with an AMD GPU and checked what FreeSync range their TV reports? I'm really curious, especially at 4K..
Nope, literally no one has tested out Freesync from an AMD GPU yet despite them being in the wild for 2 weeks now. Freesync might even flat out not work since it is using HDMI spec VRR instead of AMD's implementation

Last edited by olqxqipz; 04-12-2019 at 10:21 AM.
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post #810 of 4452 Old 04-12-2019, 10:18 AM
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