2020 Panasonic HZ1000 OLED - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
Forum Jump: 
 1Likes
  • 1 Post By wesslan1
 
Thread Tools
post #1 of 30 Old 05-10-2020, 05:55 AM - Thread Starter
AVS Forum Special Member
 
8mile13's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 7,833
Mentioned: 10 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2551 Post(s)
Liked: 1477
2020 Panasonic HZ1000 OLED

Vincent Teoh first look at Panasonic 2020 HZ1000 OLED.

Panasonic stated that it was the only one with BFI Low, Mid, High and Auto in 2020 OLEDs. D Nice stated that the 2020 A8H Sony OLED also has these options. Not shure what Auto does. Does it pick a fixed setting for you or does it choose BFI intensity based upon incoming content?

8mile13 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 30 Old 05-10-2020, 06:08 AM
Member
 
ixlr08's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Mid-Coast Maine
Posts: 25
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 14 Post(s)
Liked: 21
If I remember correctly, the LG CX series also has Low, Med, High and Auto for BFI. The description I saw of the Auto mode was that it did select which BFI mode based on incoming content.
ixlr08 is offline  
post #3 of 30 Old 05-10-2020, 08:11 AM - Thread Starter
AVS Forum Special Member
 
8mile13's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 7,833
Mentioned: 10 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2551 Post(s)
Liked: 1477
Quote:
Originally Posted by ixlr08 View Post
If I remember correctly, the LG CX series also has Low, Med, High and Auto for BFI. The description I saw of the Auto mode was that it did select which BFI mode based on incoming content.
ok. So Auto switches between Low, Mid and High all the time.
8mile13 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #4 of 30 Old 05-10-2020, 08:17 AM
Member
 
ixlr08's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Mid-Coast Maine
Posts: 25
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 14 Post(s)
Liked: 21
Quote:
Originally Posted by 8mile13 View Post
ok. So Auto switches between Low, Mid and High all the time.
Somewhere in the 2020 LG CX-GX thread are the details on how the Auto mode works, and when it works. I don't believe it works in all modes.
ixlr08 is offline  
post #5 of 30 Old 05-10-2020, 12:39 PM - Thread Starter
AVS Forum Special Member
 
8mile13's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 7,833
Mentioned: 10 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2551 Post(s)
Liked: 1477
Quote:
Originally Posted by ixlr08 View Post
Somewhere in the 2020 LG CX-GX thread are the details on how the Auto mode works, and when it works. I don't believe it works in all modes.
Page one

Q:What are the effects of OLED Motion Pro / BFI on the image (without a 120Hz source)?
A: In LG CX there are five levels for OLED Motion Pro (Off, Low, Medium, High and Auto).
'Low' will reduce the brightness by 15%.
'Medium' will reduce the brightness by 40%.
'High' will reduce the brightness by 75%.
'Medium' is more effective at increasing motion resolution than 'Low' but brightness obviously takes a more significant hit.
The 'High' setting produces visible flicker and is not recommended for any type of content.
The 'Auto' option varies between 'Low' and 'Medium' but avoids 'High'.
At its two lower settings (Low and Medium) the BFI system is definitely useful now, as opposed to BFI in 2019 OLED TVs, but improved motion resolution comes at the expense of a reduction in brightness that is a little higher than what was previewed on the 2019 OLED TVs (but later removed from production firmware).
Also, note that by engaging 'OLED Motion Pro' input lag increases slightly to 22 ms.


Want to add that D Nice stated that 2020 Sony AH8 BFI Low and Medium do not impact brightness or the calibration.

Last edited by 8mile13; 05-16-2020 at 11:09 AM.
8mile13 is offline  
post #6 of 30 Old 05-14-2020, 06:48 AM
Senior Member
 
wesslan1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 413
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 127 Post(s)
Liked: 47
wesslan1 is offline  
post #7 of 30 Old 05-14-2020, 08:57 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
Bruce2019's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Vienna
Posts: 1,166
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 614 Post(s)
Liked: 333
Look at the out of the box performance..

White balance and gamma is completely out of whack.. Delta errors almost in the 10 range..

Colors on the other hand are almost spot on..

2013 Panasonic TX-P42X60E PDP
2013 Panasonic TX-P42STW60 PDP
ST60 Settings: Custom Mode, Contrast 60 = 100nits peak brightness aka Filmmaker Mode, Panel Brightness Medium
Gamma 2.4, Gamma settings: 10% -30, 20% -15, 30% -5, 80% +3
Bruce2019 is offline  
post #8 of 30 Old 05-15-2020, 02:21 AM
Senior Member
 
wesslan1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 413
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 127 Post(s)
Liked: 47
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruce2019 View Post
Look at the out of the box performance..

White balance and gamma is completely out of whack.. Delta errors almost in the 10 range..

Colors on the other hand are almost spot on..
Yeah it's very strange, doesn't look like panasonics usually great out-of-the-box performance. Can hope it's the review sample only. Waiting for hdtvtest review and then we know more.
wesslan1 is offline  
post #9 of 30 Old 05-15-2020, 08:24 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
Bruce2019's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Vienna
Posts: 1,166
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 614 Post(s)
Liked: 333
That is the stock calibration result of a budget Huawei Y5 phone..

Not much worse then this Oled..

https://www.notebookcheck.com/filead...Graustufen.jpg

2013 Panasonic TX-P42X60E PDP
2013 Panasonic TX-P42STW60 PDP
ST60 Settings: Custom Mode, Contrast 60 = 100nits peak brightness aka Filmmaker Mode, Panel Brightness Medium
Gamma 2.4, Gamma settings: 10% -30, 20% -15, 30% -5, 80% +3
Bruce2019 is offline  
post #10 of 30 Old 05-15-2020, 08:29 AM
Senior Member
 
wesslan1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 413
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 127 Post(s)
Liked: 47
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruce2019 View Post
That is the stock calibration result of a budget Huawei Y5 phone..

Not much worse then this Oled..

https://www.notebookcheck.com/filead...Graustufen.jpg
Not sure what you expect though, go watch CX or GZ2000 reviews. Out of the box deltas seems above 8 and sometimes close to 15 on most. This isn't worse than all other "oled tvs" from what I see.
wesslan1 is offline  
post #11 of 30 Old 05-15-2020, 08:38 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
Bruce2019's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Vienna
Posts: 1,166
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 614 Post(s)
Liked: 333
The point is that even budget 100$ phones have pretty good calibrated screens, almost on level of a 2000$ Oled..

I mean these are no budget tvs, and they dont even have the gamma and white balance correct.. I am just a bit shocked..

2013 Panasonic TX-P42X60E PDP
2013 Panasonic TX-P42STW60 PDP
ST60 Settings: Custom Mode, Contrast 60 = 100nits peak brightness aka Filmmaker Mode, Panel Brightness Medium
Gamma 2.4, Gamma settings: 10% -30, 20% -15, 30% -5, 80% +3

Last edited by Bruce2019; 05-15-2020 at 08:59 AM.
Bruce2019 is offline  
post #12 of 30 Old 05-16-2020, 12:05 AM
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2019
Posts: 43
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 20 Post(s)
Liked: 7
FlatpanelsHD often measures out of the box white scale measurements that are not in line with other reviewers. Maybe they measure differently?

LG’s CX seems to be doing even worse, while Sony’s AG9 seems to be doing similarly, according to their measurements.
JayPee2610 is offline  
post #13 of 30 Old 05-16-2020, 12:07 PM
Advanced Member
 
Rysa_105's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2019
Posts: 867
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 650 Post(s)
Liked: 312
Still no hdtvtest review? He unboxed it a week ago, how long would it take? And no avforums and hdtv polska review. These are the sources i want.

peralatan saya
marten, rogue audio (hifi) bowers and wilkins, belles, onkyo, jl audio, sony, auralex, furutech (ht)
Rysa_105 is offline  
post #14 of 30 Old 05-16-2020, 02:12 PM
Senior Member
 
wesslan1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 413
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 127 Post(s)
Liked: 47
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rysa_105 View Post
Still no hdtvtest review? He unboxed it a week ago, how long would it take? And no avforums and hdtv polska review. These are the sources i want.
Yeah it's wierd. But since he also unpacked the CX maybe we will get a HZ1000 vs CX. I would like that and he did something similar in 2019.
wesslan1 is offline  
post #15 of 30 Old 05-23-2020, 06:02 AM - Thread Starter
AVS Forum Special Member
 
8mile13's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 7,833
Mentioned: 10 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2551 Post(s)
Liked: 1477
Vincent Teoh posted a 18 minutes long 2020 HZ1000 review.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCcCYOO2uYPnG-21WDOWdwew
8mile13 is offline  
post #16 of 30 Old 05-23-2020, 06:58 AM
Senior Member
 
wesslan1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 413
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 127 Post(s)
Liked: 47
Very nice! Better BFI than A8 (A8H) he thinks and that alone is mighty impressive for me. Pretty much all things got a little better where it counts, shadowdetail especially. Too bad they can't fix that minor 24p skipping and those DV IQ settings that can't be turned off is a let down. But the fixed posterization/banding in highlights is great.
wesslan1 is offline  
post #17 of 30 Old 05-23-2020, 07:15 AM - Thread Starter
AVS Forum Special Member
 
8mile13's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 7,833
Mentioned: 10 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2551 Post(s)
Liked: 1477
Quote:
Originally Posted by wesslan1 View Post
Very nice! Better BFI than A8 (A8H) he thinks and that alone is mighty impressive for me.
He does not compare the HZ1000 to TVs like the A8H he did not review yet.
8mile13 is offline  
post #18 of 30 Old 05-23-2020, 07:28 AM
Senior Member
 
wesslan1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 413
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 127 Post(s)
Liked: 47
He compare it to "2020" LG and sony oleds at 16:50 and I think the A8 is the only new so far right? And he has them all unpacked so I "think" he's testing cx, A8 and HZ1000 and doing separate reviews but I could be wrong.
wesslan1 is offline  
post #19 of 30 Old 05-23-2020, 08:44 AM
Advanced Member
 
Rysa_105's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2019
Posts: 867
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 650 Post(s)
Liked: 312
I might be interested to buy this over lg if the price is right, we havent had pricing announced here yet. The 120hz BFI implementation sounds great, and to a person like me who doesnt calibrate and watches the most accurate preset, it could give better near black shadow detail and less noise in dark scenes than lg and sony.

peralatan saya
marten, rogue audio (hifi) bowers and wilkins, belles, onkyo, jl audio, sony, auralex, furutech (ht)
Rysa_105 is offline  
post #20 of 30 Old 05-23-2020, 08:46 AM
Advanced Member
 
Rysa_105's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2019
Posts: 867
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 650 Post(s)
Liked: 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by 8mile13 View Post
He does not compare the HZ1000 to TVs like the A8H he did not review yet.
thx for posting this, over the last week i was checking his yt channel daily if the review had been posted, today was the only day i didn't check and he posted it lol.

peralatan saya
marten, rogue audio (hifi) bowers and wilkins, belles, onkyo, jl audio, sony, auralex, furutech (ht)
Rysa_105 is offline  
post #21 of 30 Old 05-23-2020, 09:00 AM
Advanced Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2018
Posts: 530
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 398 Post(s)
Liked: 236
Quote:
Originally Posted by wesslan1 View Post
Very nice! Better BFI than A8 (A8H) he thinks and that alone is mighty impressive for me. Pretty much all things got a little better where it counts, shadowdetail especially. Too bad they can't fix that minor 24p skipping and those DV IQ settings that can't be turned off is a let down. But the fixed posterization/banding in highlights is great.
It's not better than the A8H. If anything Panasonic seems to have the worst BFI implementation among the three based on Vincent's testing. Min doesn't improve motion resolution at all. Mid seems to be the same as prior BFI and Max gives 1080 lines but has significant brightness loss and flicker.

Sony's Clearness 2 seems to be a set it and forget mode for SDR. 900 lines, no flicker, no real brightness loss, and 96hz playback of 24p content.


What I got from the video regarding BFI:

Off = no BFI
Min = 120Hz BFI, no flicker, some brightness loss, and 350 lines motion resolution
Mid = 120Hz BFI, no flicker, more brightness loss than Min, and 600 lines motion resolution
Max = 60? Hz BFI, visible flicker, more brightness loss than Mid, and 1080 lines motion resolution

Sony 55A9F
LG 55B6

Last edited by Micolash; 05-23-2020 at 09:34 AM.
Micolash is offline  
post #22 of 30 Old 05-23-2020, 09:07 AM
Advanced Member
 
Rysa_105's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2019
Posts: 867
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 650 Post(s)
Liked: 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by Micolash View Post
It's not better than the A8H. If anything Panasonic seems to have the worst BFI implementation among the three based on Vincent's testing. Min doesn't improve motion resolution at all. Mid seems to be the same as prior BFI and Max gives 1080 lines but has significant brightness loss and flicker.

Sony's Clearness 2 seems to be a set it and forget mode for SDR. 900 lines, no flicker, no real brightness loss, and 96hz playback of 24p content.
he said it's the closest he's seen to plasma like motion resolution on an oled tv. not known whether he includes the a8h when he says oled tv, he did not clarify.

but, unlike the a8h, where only bfi seems improved over the older model, on the hz1000 they have more improvements over the gz1000 other than just bfi, hard clip and tone mapping target option for hdr10 content, lesser posterization, better near black tracking, dolby IQ and filmmaker mode.

peralatan saya
marten, rogue audio (hifi) bowers and wilkins, belles, onkyo, jl audio, sony, auralex, furutech (ht)
Rysa_105 is offline  
post #23 of 30 Old 05-23-2020, 09:21 AM - Thread Starter
AVS Forum Special Member
 
8mile13's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 7,833
Mentioned: 10 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2551 Post(s)
Liked: 1477
Quote:
Originally Posted by wesslan1 View Post
He compare it to "2020" LG and sony oleds at 16:50 and I think the A8 is the only new so far right? And he has them all unpacked so I "think" he's testing cx, A8 and HZ1000 and doing separate reviews but I could be wrong.
He states : ''the clearest motion i have seen from a consumer OLED yet''..after that he states ''compared with LG's and Sony's 2020 OLEDs the HZ1000 has the cleanest near black handling etc..''(not meantioning motion).

We will see his comment on Sony motion when he reviews the A8H. I can tell you upfront that Teoh believes that Sony motion interpolation is the best out there.
8mile13 is offline  
post #24 of 30 Old 05-23-2020, 09:25 AM
Advanced Member
 
Rysa_105's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2019
Posts: 867
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 650 Post(s)
Liked: 312
He could probably do a hz1000 vs a8h comparison video, in terms of interpolation sony has been better in the past, but we're talking of the new bfi implementation here, so a comparison between 120hz bfi on the two tv's would be nice to see. i dont doubt that near black, ootb color accuracy will be be better on panasonic, as in these areas panasonic has been better in the past.

peralatan saya
marten, rogue audio (hifi) bowers and wilkins, belles, onkyo, jl audio, sony, auralex, furutech (ht)
Rysa_105 is offline  
post #25 of 30 Old 05-23-2020, 09:43 AM
Senior Member
 
wesslan1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 413
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 127 Post(s)
Liked: 47
Yeah he really should do a CX vs A8 vs HZ comparison video also since he got em all in his house at the same time which isn't usual. A mini shootout!
wesslan1 is offline  
post #26 of 30 Old 05-23-2020, 09:45 AM
Advanced Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2018
Posts: 530
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 398 Post(s)
Liked: 236
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rysa_105 View Post
He could probably do a hz1000 vs a8h comparison video, in terms of interpolation sony has been better in the past, but we're talking of the new bfi implementation here, so a comparison between 120hz bfi on the two tv's would be nice to see. i dont doubt that near black, ootb color accuracy will be be better on panasonic, as in these areas panasonic has been better in the past.
There definitely needs to be a comparison between the Panasonic, LG, and Sony. All three seem to be doing something different with their BFI options.

Sony 55A9F
LG 55B6
Micolash is offline  
post #27 of 30 Old 05-23-2020, 10:02 AM
Advanced Member
 
Rysa_105's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2019
Posts: 867
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 650 Post(s)
Liked: 312
my guess is since he's done unboxing of the CX and A8/A8H, he'll first do their reviews and a comparison review in the end, so i dont expect the comparison before mid june or so. And a comparison video review is certainly more hardwork.

im excited for the hz1000 based on his review, i think the hz2000 will have a small edge (~5%) with hdr content over the hz1000 , but hz1000 strikes better price to performance balance, the hz2000 will be too expensive like last year's model. i own a sony a9g (and prior to it a sony a9f), so sony is out for me, i want to try something different for my second oled.

i also have lg cx on my radar, but one of the calibrators on this board doesnt seem to think there is any improvement on the cx over last year's model. And the 120hz bfi on cx so far doesnt seem to be getting any appreciation. The rtings' review of the CX along with the measurements posted didn't make it seem like an improvement over last year's model. Still want to see more reviews on the cx.

peralatan saya
marten, rogue audio (hifi) bowers and wilkins, belles, onkyo, jl audio, sony, auralex, furutech (ht)

Last edited by Rysa_105; 05-23-2020 at 10:14 AM.
Rysa_105 is offline  
post #28 of 30 Old 05-23-2020, 10:19 AM
Senior Member
 
wesslan1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 413
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 127 Post(s)
Liked: 47
Yeah and I'm on the much older A8F and been thinking about A8H vs HZ1000 mainly to get much better dolby vision performance. Here in sweden we just got prices up for most HZ models. The HZ1000 is exactly the same price as LG CX right now and that is around €1500!!! less than HZ2000 so I think I might skip the 2000. It's not "that" much better. Most don't even seem to see a clear difference besides some bright highlights.

I really would like to upgrade for panasonics shadowdetails, cleaner handling, better APL, above black levels and DV IQ. BFI is cool if it works good then I'll use it but I don't have a problem with motion on my old sony.
wesslan1 is offline  
post #29 of 30 Old 05-23-2020, 10:32 AM
Advanced Member
 
Rysa_105's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2019
Posts: 867
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 650 Post(s)
Liked: 312
^.Vincent did say the the lg cx is better if you're a gamer (i'm not). However for non gaming use and mostly movie watching, if the price of the cx and hz1000 were equal, i'd choose hz1000. especially if you're not looking to get a calibration any time soon. in my country, only the pricing on lg is available, panasonic and sony have not announced pricing or a launch date so far. though im in no hurry, was not going to buy before july in any case.

peralatan saya
marten, rogue audio (hifi) bowers and wilkins, belles, onkyo, jl audio, sony, auralex, furutech (ht)
Rysa_105 is offline  
post #30 of 30 Old 05-23-2020, 10:34 AM
Senior Member
 
wesslan1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 413
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 127 Post(s)
Liked: 47
Seems like CX don't have the locked DV IQ settings like the HZ (noise reduction, mpeg remaster, resolution remaster and sharpness). I hope Vincent can get panasonic to unlock those in future fw or something. Seems like a mistake right?

Well yeah I like to play but still 80% movies/series and 20% games. Will buy the PS5 but since target is [email protected] I won't miss sleep over the 120hz and VRR. Have a fat PC for that...

PQ for movies is the priority and really want to have that HDR optimizer tonemapping tech that everybody loves from their players UB820/2000. I think Panasonic does it much better than LG that often seem to brighten the whole picture.

Last edited by wesslan1; 05-23-2020 at 10:38 AM.
wesslan1 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply OLED Technology and Flat Panels General

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off