Channel Master DVR+ Owners Thread - Page 576 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #17251 of 17310 Old 02-12-2020, 05:29 PM
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AUUUGGHHH! (Yes, that was me doing my Charlie Brown-esque scream after Lucy pulls away the football). I went to create a Manual Recording for The Neighborhood on Mondy, Feb 17, at 7:00CST. That time slot is currently listed as an Unknown Event. When I press the Info button on the remote, it says that there is no event description available. BUT, it's marked as a New Episode. How can it be new if it's unknown??? The guide company must have used a new hire for prepping the latest guide data.



Done with my rant...
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post #17252 of 17310 Old 02-12-2020, 06:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arenal04 View Post
AUUUGGHHH! (Yes, that was me doing my Charlie Brown-esque scream after Lucy pulls away the football). I went to create a Manual Recording for The Neighborhood on Mondy, Feb 17, at 7:00CST. That time slot is currently listed as an Unknown Event. When I press the Info button on the remote, it says that there is no event description available. BUT, it's marked as a New Episode. How can it be new if it's unknown??? The guide company must have used a new hire for prepping the latest guide data.
Technically speaking, all unknown events are "new" until they become "known". Just like all objects in the sky are UFO's until they are identified. Once you confirm it is a spaceship full of aliens it ceases to be a UFO.
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post #17253 of 17310 Old 02-12-2020, 06:35 PM
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Originally Posted by Arenal04 View Post
Using your tip, I was able to change the name of a Manual Recording. But I couldn't change the Early or Late time periods. The cursor just wouldn't stop at those fields. Did I do something wrong? If it helps, it was a one-time only recording.
You didn't do anything wrong. On a manual recording, you can't edit the padding (early/late); instead you must edit the start and/or end times directly. You have to click the start or end time then "spin" the hours, then click again and "spin" the minutes to the time you want.

Also, you'll find that you can only edit the "minutes" of either time in 5-minute intervals. (Why they don't just let you type the times in with the number keys is beyond me.)
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post #17254 of 17310 Old 02-12-2020, 07:04 PM
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Originally Posted by JHBrandt View Post
Also, you'll find that you can only edit the "minutes" of either time in 5-minute intervals. (Why they don't just let you type the times in with the number keys is beyond me.)
I've never understood the developers' thought process with that. From a user's perspective, it would be so much easier to just let us type in the numbers.
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post #17255 of 17310 Old 02-12-2020, 10:10 PM
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Question Why so many unknown and blank events (ROVI guide)?

Hope this is not a duplicate question..... I like this CM 7500, but now increasingly, despite refreshing, the ROVI guide has unknown or blank events. Why?

Sometimes if one goes to the desired channel, the event fills in.

End of life?
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post #17256 of 17310 Old 02-13-2020, 12:30 AM
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Angry What skip settings do YOU use...?

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Originally Posted by LensClock View Post
My preferred setting is 45 seconds skip forward, and 10 seconds skip back.
Even though I think it's the best setting available for skipping a block of commericals of variable length, it's still a compromise, and I still often end up skipping too far and having to go back in 10-second intervals to catch the resumption of the program.
In fact, skip forward and skip back are my most-used buttons.

I would have preferred a 50-second skip forward and a 15-second skip back setting, but it's not available.
That's why, on my wish-list that I posted shortly after getting my DVR+ (currently post 10982, posted on 2-13-2016), I listed a variable-length forward/back skip setting (i.e. user-settable to whatever number of seconds you prefer) as one of the improvements I'd like to see.

...and four years later, I'm still waiting!
The skip forward 30 and skip back 10 first appeared on CM-7000 PAL. It was a brilliant idea and implemented well. Several years later when I got the DVR+ and read in the manual that different times could be set, I had to think a while to decide what changes to a perfect system could make it more perfect. I decided that 30 forward with 11 back would be optimal. Imagine my disappointment when the times could only be set to certain other useless values. Then to add insult to injury, I found that the default for forward is a totally useless 10 seconds and has to be re-selected after a factory reset.
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post #17257 of 17310 Old 02-13-2020, 12:39 AM
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Originally Posted by Arenal04 View Post
I've never understood the developers' thought process with that. From a user's perspective, it would be so much easier to just let us type in the numbers.

I can tell you the thought process; lazy and sloppy. It has nothing to do with the user, it's about what's easy to write code for. That's most of the story for the DVR+, in nearly every way inferior to its predecessor, the CM-7000 PAL.
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post #17258 of 17310 Old 02-13-2020, 09:03 AM
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Message from Channelmaster

I asked Channelmaster about the unknown event problem. The following was their response.


Hello Mr. Mattson,

Over the past several months Channel Master has been working with our guide data provider to try and correct issues with an aging data API which the DVR+ get’s its internet guide from. Unfortunately our partner has been unsuccessful with maintaining this API which has caused inconsistent guide data on all DVR+ units over the past few months.
We apologize for the inconvenience but the reliability of the data is outside of our control and unfortunately this is the reality of the current situation. At this point in time we do not see a long term resolution in sight, that being said, for a more consistent experience we highly recommend reverting your DVR+ to receive it’s guide data from the over the air broadcasts. This solution will provide fewer days of guide data and will not be compatible with “New Episodes Only” feature but will still function as a reliable OTA DVR.
Please follow the instructions below to turn off the internet delivered guide and convert your device to receive guide data information from the local broadcaster.
There are a couple of steps that you will need to complete to revert your DVR+ to receive its guide information from the broadcaster. Unfortunately the broadcaster does not offer 14 days of guide information, but it is enough to reschedule your recordings and for them to reliably record. To revert your DVR+ to the broadcaster provided guide information, we highly recommend a default factory reset first. This will flush out any scheduled recordings that had been set up to be recorded using the internet delivered guide information. Once the factory reset is complete, you will want to set your Zip code to 00000, this will force the DVR+ to getting its data from the broadcaster instead of the internet.
If you are wondering why we suggest a factory reset? This is important because the DVR+ works off of name based scheduling and we have seen naming conflicts because of inconsistencies in the naming conventions of the info that is provided over the internet and what is provided by broadcasters. In addition to inconsistent naming conventions causing issues, the lack of series information from the broadcasters could also cause issues. If you do not preform a factory reset, you may be at risk of missed recordings and schedule issues.
Regards,

Ann
Customer Experience Manager


I loved my DVR+ but I guess if they are choosing not to support the product, we have reached the end of an era. For now I will try the broadcaster guide. If that fails I guess I will give TIVO a try. Good luck to all of you. Richie.
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post #17259 of 17310 Old 02-13-2020, 09:43 AM
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@richard - please read a few pages back of the thread, you'll find a lot of info for you !
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post #17260 of 17310 Old 02-13-2020, 12:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arenal04 View Post
AUUUGGHHH! (Yes, that was me doing my Charlie Brown-esque scream after Lucy pulls away the football). I went to create a Manual Recording for The Neighborhood on Mondy, Feb 17, at 7:00CST. That time slot is currently listed as an Unknown Event. When I press the Info button on the remote, it says that there is no event description available. BUT, it's marked as a New Episode. How can it be new if it's unknown??? The guide company must have used a new hire for prepping the latest guide data.
I had something similar happen a week ago. I noticed that Manifest was set to record but was listed as an Unknown Event, which I thought was weird. A couple of days later it was no longer scheduled to record so I had to set a manual recording.
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post #17261 of 17310 Old 02-13-2020, 12:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeff275 View Post
I had something similar happen a week ago. I noticed that Manifest was set to record but was listed as an Unknown Event, which I thought was weird. A couple of days later it was no longer scheduled to record so I had to set a manual recording.

Another weird thing is that the embedded "Unknown Event" has the correct starting time, in the case of Manifest 9:01 pm. This is very different than if you go many days in the future in the guide where Unknown Event is a solid block for hours or days until the end of two weeks. The former is easy to set a manual recording because the initial times are correct. For the latter one must go through the laborious process of setting the the start and end times for the slice of time you want to record.
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post #17262 of 17310 Old 02-13-2020, 02:16 PM
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I had something similar happen a week ago. I noticed that Manifest was set to record but was listed as an Unknown Event, which I thought was weird. A couple of days later it was no longer scheduled to record so I had to set a manual recording.
Sometimes this can happen if the scheduled show for a time slot changes. (This happens often on PBS, for instance.)

Originally scheduled show matches a name-based recording event: DVR+ schedules show to be recorded.
Then the schedule changes to "Unknown Event" or another show that no longer matches: DVR+ does not cancel the recording.

If you catch it before the recording happens you can cancel it manually, or just let it record and see what you get.
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post #17263 of 17310 Old 02-13-2020, 02:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arenal04 View Post
I've never understood the developers' thought process with that. From a user's perspective, it would be so much easier to just let us type in the numbers.
Quote:
Originally Posted by rahanner View Post
I can tell you the thought process; lazy and sloppy. It has nothing to do with the user, it's about what's easy to write code for. That's most of the story for the DVR+, in nearly every way inferior to its predecessor, the CM-7000 PAL.
The funny thing, though, is that you'd think the easiest way to write the code would be to just let us key in the numbers! That's what the cheap mStar STBs do, and they didn't exactly spend a lot of time or effort on their firmware.
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post #17264 of 17310 Old 02-13-2020, 08:56 PM
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Originally Posted by JHBrandt View Post
The funny thing, though, is that you'd think the easiest way to write the code would be to just let us key in the numbers! That's what the cheap mStar STBs do, and they didn't exactly spend a lot of time or effort on their firmware.
Maybe they wrote it not from the perspective of being easy to write, but from the perspective of what would be the easiest for users. We frequently differentiate from the people on this thread and the "average user", so perhaps they coded it for the lowest common denominator, i.e. just pick something from the menu like it's the small, medium or large fries. But don't give the "average user" too many choices. We could have another fiasco like that of the blinking midnight clock that persisted for decades in the VCR days.
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post #17265 of 17310 Old 02-14-2020, 12:08 AM
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Originally Posted by JHBrandt View Post
The funny thing, though, is that you'd think the easiest way to write the code would be to just let us key in the numbers! That's what the cheap mStar STBs do, and they didn't exactly spend a lot of time or effort on their firmware.
I wrote lots of code in the 40 years I worked so I can tell you that you are wrong.

The way it works is like this: some choices are predefined then presented to the user. The response that comes back can only be one of those choices and the value assigned to each one is fixed. There's essentially nothing to do but move forward.

When the input is anything entered in a free form field of any kind, the code that processes it has to parse it to see what's there, check for valid characters, validate the value and validate any constraints on the value. Then if it's not valid, write a whole other code path to present the error with new messages back to the user to retry.
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post #17266 of 17310 Old 02-14-2020, 11:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Mattson View Post


I loved my DVR+ but I guess if they are choosing not to support the product, we have reached the end of an era. For now I will try the broadcaster guide. If that fails I guess I will give TIVO a try. Good luck to all of you. Richie.
Just FYI if anyone is interested, this sale is on thru 2/21/2020
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2 DTVPal DVR, April 2009
1 DVR+ CM7500GB16, Dec 2014
1 TiVo Roamio OTA, May 2015
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post #17267 of 17310 Old 02-14-2020, 12:31 PM
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Originally Posted by JHBrandt View Post
Sometimes this can happen if the scheduled show for a time slot changes. (This happens often on PBS, for instance.)

Originally scheduled show matches a name-based recording event: DVR+ schedules show to be recorded.
Then the schedule changes to "Unknown Event" or another show that no longer matches: DVR+ does not cancel the recording.

If you catch it before the recording happens you can cancel it manually, or just let it record and see what you get.
The show name has not ever been in my guide this year. For about a month it always showed up as Bluff City Law and then unknown event. February 17th is the only time the correct name ha appeared in the Guide. We'll see what happens.

I have definitely had a lot of incorrect PBS shows record in the way you are talking about though. I always thought it was interesting that it would record the show and give it the correct title and plenty of times I'd see far ahead of time that it was going to record a show that I had never asked to be recorded. Then again there are all sorts of other weird things like that, such as picking up the description of the show that was on the previous hour and I've even seen descriptions change during the course of the show from a shorter description to a longer description of the same show.
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post #17268 of 17310 Old 02-14-2020, 02:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim in Phoenix View Post
Just FYI if anyone is interested, this sale is on thru 2/21/2020
Before I would spend big bucks on a TIVO, I would have to see it having ATSC 3.0 compatibility even if it is on sale.
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post #17269 of 17310 Old 02-14-2020, 02:54 PM
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The show name has not ever been in my guide this year. For about a month it always showed up as Bluff City Law and then unknown event. February 17th is the only time the correct name ha appeared in the Guide. We'll see what happens.
With PSIP I've never had an "Unknown Event" scheduled to record. But I have frequently had the name of the show change in the recording schedule. It's always because the network or station has changed things up. Sometimes it starts with the name of the show I want, then changes to a different named show. Other times there is another show in that time slot, so no program is scheduled to record. But on the day it is supposed to air the name changes to a show in the Series Recording list and gets scheduled when I didn't expect it. In both cases, I end up with a recording.
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post #17270 of 17310 Old 02-14-2020, 03:59 PM
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I wrote lots of code in the 40 years I worked so I can tell you that you are wrong.

The way it works is like this: some choices are predefined then presented to the user. The response that comes back can only be one of those choices and the value assigned to each one is fixed. There's essentially nothing to do but move forward.

When the input is anything entered in a free form field of any kind, the code that processes it has to parse it to see what's there, check for valid characters, validate the value and validate any constraints on the value. Then if it's not valid, write a whole other code path to present the error with new messages back to the user to retry.
Well, I too have written lots of code in the 40 years I've been a programmer, and I don't think I'm wrong!

Here's a way you could do direct numeric entry of hours without ever showing an error message: on the first digit, accept only 0 or 1. If any other digit is pressed, ignore it. On the second digit, accept 1-9 if the first digit is 0, or 0-2 if the first digit is 1, and ignore "move right" until the second digit is valid.

Minutes are even easier: accept 0-5 for the first digit and 0-9 for the second. Done. (A spinner, radio button, or similar control does make sense to select AM or PM, though.)

But to program a spinner, you have to show the user the starting value, look for the remote codes that signify "+" and "-", add or subtract 1 (for hours) or 5 (for minutes), check for overflow and underflow, and wrap around if necessary.

In practice, though, both techniques will rely on pre-written code modules that do all the hard work. All the application programmer has to do is decide which module to call and pass it the starting, minimum, maximum, (and increment, for a spinner) values.

On the DVR+, we see the direct entry technique used when someone enters a channel number! That requires a more complex validation against a table, too; but the DVR+ doesn't require the user to "spin" through all possible channels!* So a direct numeric entry module already exists in the DVR+, and it could have been reused for entering times. But instead, someone chose the spinner module.

Why? I think @Greasemonkey is probably close: the programmer thought spinners would be easier for the users, and for minutes, the increment of 5 was chosen so someone didn't have to click the #$%@ remote 30 times to move from 30 down to 0!

The problem with that thinking was, it neglected the need for padding - and on manual recordings, they disabled the "Early" and "Late" padding options, thinking you didn't need them since you'd be setting the time manually anyway! So if you want to pad a manual recording, you're forced to use a full 5 minutes' worth of padding, even if you only need a minute or two.

All of that was forgivable in the 101R firmware release. But I remember complaining about it back in 2014, when I was on 108R, and with CM as the "middleman" between E* and us users, it was never a big enough deal to become a priority for changing.


*Ironically, the iView does use a spinner for editing the channel number on a recording timer, even though it uses direct numeric entry for the start and end times. And as if to prove my point, they fouled it up! The channel spinner often skips channels or even gets caught in a "loop" of a few channels, making it impossible to select some channels with the spinner!
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post #17271 of 17310 Old 02-14-2020, 11:43 PM
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Question

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Originally Posted by Jim in Phoenix View Post
Just FYI if anyone is interested, this sale is on thru 2/21/2020
It's forbidden topic here !!!

Anyway, what the F - "HD-antenna compatible" ?
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post #17272 of 17310 Old 02-15-2020, 12:18 AM
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Anyway, what the F - "HD-antenna compatible" ?
That's the jargon you use when you are trying to sell a product to a generation that may have never received an OTA broadcast signal in their entire life. There is also a TV commercial in the U.S. for a small indoor antenna in which they hype the idea that people can actually receive free TV channels, and hammer home the fact that it is because of a federal law. Funny thing is that the product seems to change names with newer versions of the antenna. I seem to remember the exact same commercial being used to pitch the "Clear TV" antenna, the "Free TV Key" antenna, and I think there is even a newer one now pitching what appears to be a miniature set of rabbit ears that are about the size of a grapefruit. The pitchman really drives it home when he shows himself on a boat in the Gulf of Mexico, off the shores of Galveston and breathlessly tells the viewer that he is receiving free HD on the boat. So you can spend $30 or so and order a couple of these (just a small extra charge for the second antenna), or you can just go to your grandparents house and steal one they used in the 1970's that is probably better.
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post #17273 of 17310 Old 02-15-2020, 12:40 AM
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Well, I'm with you GM... but the TiVo device is "compatible with HD-antenna"
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post #17274 of 17310 Old 02-15-2020, 09:21 AM
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Cool Making room for 5G

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Originally Posted by Greasemonkey View Post
<....>, and I think there is even a newer one now pitching what appears to be a miniature set of rabbit ears that are about the size of a grapefruit. The pitchman really drives it home when he shows himself on a boat in the Gulf of Mexico, off the shores of Galveston and breathlessly tells the viewer that he is receiving free HD on the boat. <....>.
The pitch for this one is "... 4K for Free ..." which I guess implies that it will still work after you get yourself an ATSC 3.0 Tuner.

I'm just happy for any method to put more viewers dependent on broadcast TV.
They make no mention of it, but obviously their new antenna will also broadcast ATSC 3.0 when it becomes available.

One Ohio Corporation owns both our NBC & ABC Channel's, so we're down to CBS and FOX Channel's as news sources for the past week.
Art

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post #17275 of 17310 Old 02-15-2020, 09:34 AM
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So you can spend $30 or so and order a couple of these (just a small extra charge for the second antenna), or you can just go to your grandparents house and steal one they used in the 1970's that is probably better.
My dad used to be in TV sales and repair. I snagged a rabbit ear antenna from my dad's house, still in the box, from the '70s! Had to connect a 330-ohm to 75 ohm converter. It's THAT old. Works great on those fancy, new-fangled "HD" signals.
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post #17276 of 17310 Old 02-15-2020, 09:39 AM
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Last night, I noticed that a new program guide was downloaded. IIRC, It goes out to Feb 28, a full 2 weeks! And a LOT of the Unknown Event black holes for next week have been filled in.
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post #17277 of 17310 Old 02-15-2020, 02:58 PM
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Woo hoo! Data out to the 28th too, with very few gaps in the prime time data! Happy camper! And most of all I saw The Blacklist was firing up again...
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post #17278 of 17310 Old 02-15-2020, 08:18 PM
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Originally Posted by SillyConVal View Post
Before I would spend big bucks on a TIVO, I would have to see it having ATSC 3.0 compatibility even if it is on sale.
When ATSC 3.0 'arrives', it will enter the home via a 'router' similar to the Tablo TV DVR which will stream to whatever device is attached to your television.
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post #17279 of 17310 Old 02-16-2020, 01:04 AM
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Originally Posted by wizwor View Post
When ATSC 3.0 'arrives', it will enter the home via a 'router' similar to the Tablo TV DVR which will stream to whatever device is attached to your television.
Hopefully only the data collecting aspects (the part that "enhances the viewer's experience") will require a router. Since it's broadcast television, the main programming should certainly enter the home through the antenna. But I wouldn't be surprised if the full EPG comes through the router, leaving only PSIP data for the currently airing program delivered via broadcast. There is only so much bandwidth to work with, and the EPG might be the first to go so other nonsense features fit in what's left in the carrier signal after the visual programming gets crammed in there. If that happened it would kill one of the big draws of an OTA DVR, further driving viewers toward streaming.
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post #17280 of 17310 Old 02-16-2020, 02:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Greasemonkey View Post
Hopefully only the data collecting aspects (the part that "enhances the viewer's experience") will require a router. Since it's broadcast television, the main programming should certainly enter the home through the antenna. But I wouldn't be surprised if the full EPG comes through the router, leaving only PSIP data for the currently airing program delivered via broadcast. There is only so much bandwidth to work with, and the EPG might be the first to go so other nonsense features fit in what's left in the carrier signal after the visual programming gets crammed in there. If that happened it would kill one of the big draws of an OTA DVR, further driving viewers toward streaming.
ATSC 3.0 won't require a router and will enter the home via an antenna. The router approach makes the transition easier and less expensive. Connect one device with tuner[s] and storage and watch everywhere. Think of it as a whole house DVR like the Tablo TV DVR or Recast -- except that the tuners are ATSC 3.0. The router could contain smarts for pay-per-view and be subsidized by OTA subscription services like Netflix or HBO.
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