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post #1 of 682 Old 11-22-2017, 08:13 PM - Thread Starter
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Channel Master Stream+ (pre-release & speculation)

Note: This is the pre-release thread which (as it's mostly conjecture), has been replaced by the official owner's thread found here:

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/42-hdt...-s-thread.html


On 3/11/2018, AVS Forum member kent2174 was the first to announce he received the Stream+ via USPS! Congrats Kent!
As stated above,
this thread is now locked.


Is the January 2018 Channel Master STREAM+ (ProductID: CM-7600) going to replace the DVR+? CM is currently teasing us on their facebook page. On December 18, 2017, CM made their STREAM+ web page accessible (Stream+ Media Player Description, Specs & Ordering HERE). Pre-orders are being taken at a $99 introductory offer, for delivery at the end of January 2018. CM hasn't said what the final price will be, but it's speculated to be $150.

.
On February 28, 2018, CM informed early pre-order customers that the Stream+ is in their store waiting for approval by Google on the software before the units ship to customers. See additional information by AVS Forum Members @edit4ever and @wiscojim HERE and HERE.

.
Around February 9, 2018, CM posted the normal price for the Stream+ will be $149 (a pre-order was $99). The Pre-Order note was changed as well as follows. No mention if pre-orders prior to January 4 are being shipped.

Quote:
Pre-orders placed after January 4th, 2018, will ship in the month of April 2018.
$149.00
.
.
On February 1, 2018, CM delayed delivery of pre-orders prior to January 5, 2018 yet again. After January 4th orders are now shipped sometime in April, instead of by end of April. Below is what CM says:

Quote:
Special introductory price. Pre-order now. If you placed a pre-order prior to January 5th, 2018, your Stream+ will
ship late February. Pre-orders placed after January 4th, 2018, will ship in the month of April 2018.
$99.00
.
.
.
Around January 7, 2018, CM updated the pre-order offer on the Stream+ web page, delaying the delivery date. Below is what CM says:

Quote:
Special introductory price. Pre-order now. If you have already placed a pre-order, your Stream+ will
ship by mid-February. If you are pre-ordering today, your Stream+ will ship by the end of April.

$99.00


Please note that this thread was created months before the release of the Channel Master Stream+. It contains a great deal of speculation, and you should expect nothing more at least until the Steam+ is released
(approximately late January 2018), and in the hands of users.


  • Out of the box industrial design
  • Android TV certified
  • OTT and Live TV services with optional Broadcast TV services
  • 4K Ultra HD: HEVC/VP9 Ultra HD 2160p/60 video
  • Wireless Connectivity: Dual band IEEE 802.11n 2.4 GHz (2x2) and IEEE 802.11ac 5 GHz (2x2) interfaces
  • Media sharing functions using a USB 3.0 port for plugging of HDD
  • Enhanced user experience with 3D graphics
  • Future-proof quad core CPU ready for gaming services
  • Bluetooth Low Energy remote with voice control
  • DVR Storage: Currently only to a single SD Card. USB HDD storage NOT YET AVAILABLE, but CM stated it's being worked on, but not promised. Might be "adoptable storage", limiting what can be done with recordings.


Features


  • 4K, HDR and 3D viewing technology
  • Integrated Voice Search
  • Two internal ATSC 1.0 tuners
  • Works with all TV antennas
  • Pause, rewind and record live TV*
  • Watch one live program while recording another
  • Record two live programs at the same time while watching a recorded program or using a streaming service
  • Certified Android™ TV 7.0 Nougat
  • Google™ Play store access for streaming services, games and more
  • Built in Google™ Cast (Chromecast) functionality
  • Subscription-free Live Channels program guide
  • Subscription-free Live Channels DVR
  • Quad-Core processor for high end gaming and running simultaneous apps
  • Built in 802.11ac WiFi (Dual Band) and Ethernet
  • Dolby Digital and Dolby Digital+ audio support
  • MicroSD slot for DVR storage, up to 512GB (U3 MicroSD card required for DVR capability), with USB storage support coming soon)



Connections

  • RF Port (ATSC 1.0 Dual Tuner)
  • HDMI Port (2.0 with HDCP 2.2)
  • Optical Audio Port (SPDIF)
  • USB Port ( USB3.0)
  • Ethernet Port (10/100BaseT)
  • MicroSD Port (U3 Required for DVR Capability)
  • Wireless 2.4 Ghz /5 GHZ WiFi Dual Band 802.11ac
  • Bluetooth 4.1


FCC:

FCC ID G95-CM-7600 (dated 2018/02/210): https://fccid.io/G95-CM-7600



Various Links:

Channel Master Stream+ web page (12/18/2017)

Channel Master Stream+ web Support page (first noticed 2/23/2018). On 2/23/2018 there were 7 support items. FYI, access to the support pages is hiding on most CM web pages under an icon (the 3 stacked horizontal bars) in the upper left of the web page. Click it to open the side bar, click SUPPORT, then select the Stream+ button. On 3/6/2018, the Stream+ web Support page contained 26 items, including chapters 1 thru 7 from the CM YouTube video (linked below).

Channel Master Stream+ 7600 Spec Sheet (PDF) (2/22/2018). This is a later version of the Spec Sheet from 1/9/2018 (see link below), which appears to only change the Speed Class of the Micro SD card to U3. For some reason the model number dropped "CM-" (perhaps a typo).

Channel Master Stream+ User Guide Complete - Chapters 1-7 video on YouTube (26 minutes 32 seconds) (2/1/2018):

Channel Master Stream+ CM-7600 Spec Sheet (PDF) (1/9/2018) (outdated on 2/22/2018 - see link above)

MacVoices at CES2018 on Stream+ and SMARTenna+ (1/20/2018):

Reviewed (This new streaming box does something you wish your Apple TV did) (1/10/2018)

TechHive (Channel Master's Stream+ is an Android TV box with a built-in TV tuner, but no Netflix) (12/19/2017)

C|net (The new Channel Master Stream+ Android DVR can be yours for $99) suspect $150 after pre-orders) (12/18/2017)

Zats Not Funny (Channel Master Preps OTA Android TV Streamer) (11/22/2017)

Cord Cutters (Channel Master is Building a New Streaming Player With OTA DVR Built In) (11/22/2017)



Images:


The pic on the left is the TIMvision unit (May 2016). CM's Stream+ remote looks different. The 2 pics on the right are from CM Stream+ web page (12/18/2017)
... ...



Rear panel:
...


Some internal pics:
...




Remote Control:
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Last edited by DrDon; 03-12-2018 at 11:43 AM.
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post #2 of 682 Old 11-22-2017, 09:42 PM
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"OTT+OTA ATSC 3.0 DVR" ? from dish ?

.

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post #3 of 682 Old 11-23-2017, 04:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by P Smith View Post
"OTT+OTA ATSC 3.0 DVR" ? from dish ?

.
Based on the Facebook page this has got nothing to do with Dish. Here's the link I found from the FB page. It also has technical specs: https://zatznotfunny.com/2017-11/channel-master-stream/.
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post #4 of 682 Old 11-23-2017, 05:20 AM
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Oh, I see... CM will sell it just as renaming 4k Android box http://www.technicolor.com/en/soluti...-boxes/skipper
Quote:
Features

Out of the box industrial design
Android TV certified
OTT and Live TV services with optional Broadcast TV services
4K Ultra HD: HEVC/VP9 Ultra HD 2160p/60 video
Wireless Connectivity: Dual band IEEE 802.11n 2.4 GHz (2x2) and IEEE 802.11ac 5 GHz (2x2) interfaces
Media sharing functions using a USB 3.0 port for plugging of HDD
Enhanced user experience with 3D graphics
Future-proof quad core CPU ready for gaming services
Bluetooth Low Energy remote with voice control
More tech tidbits from https://compubench.com/device.jsp?be...estgroup=info:
Quote:
CPU
quad core CPU @1.2GHz
Cortex A53 - ARMv8

GPU
Vivante Corporation Vivante GC7000XS
Interesting ... in Italy Google device (!) TimVision with support DVB-T2 looks as same as Skipper aka Streamer+
http://www.telecomitalia.com/tit/en/...n-Android.html
Good info in TC leaflet [PDF] https://platform.fan.tv/_files/pdf/T...Tech_Sheet.pdf
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post #5 of 682 Old 11-23-2017, 06:26 AM
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Since it's Android Tv, I hope it won't suffer the hard drive issue that I'm experiencing with the nvidia Shield. On the Shield, when recording ota on an USB hard drive, the Shield sometimes loose connection with the hard drive.
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post #6 of 682 Old 11-23-2017, 07:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pachinko View Post
Is the January 2018 Channel Master Stream+ going to replace the DVR+? CM is currently teasing us on their facebook page.

Here’s a few screenshots from the teaser video:



More Info & Features
  • Out of the box industrial design
  • Android TV certified
  • OTT and Live TV services with optional Broadcast TV services
  • 4K Ultra HD: HEVC/VP9 Ultra HD 2160p/60 video
  • Wireless Connectivity: Dual band IEEE 802.11n 2.4 GHz (2x2) and IEEE 802.11ac 5 GHz (2x2) interfaces
  • Media sharing functions using a USB 3.0 port for plugging of HDD
  • Enhanced user experience with 3D graphics
  • Future-proof quad core CPU ready for gaming services
  • Bluetooth Low Energy remote with voice control

Various Links:

Zats Not Funny

Cord Cutters








Rear panel:


Remote Control:
Thanks for posting this. I have been attempting to buy a second DVR+. Channel Masters' (CM) website says they are out of product. The imminent release of this device might explain why they are not selling the DVR+ right before Christmas. At any rate, I can wait until February to buy the second DVR.

I am curious to know what this device might provide that I am not now getting from a Roku, Smart TV, Apple TV, etc.
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post #7 of 682 Old 11-23-2017, 09:23 AM
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There's a DVR button on that remote, and a USB port. I'm wondering if this will be the device that can replace both my DVR+ and Roku ... load apps for the streaming services I want AND have a DVR for OTA with a 14 day guide. Please, oh please Channel Master ....
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post #8 of 682 Old 11-23-2017, 12:37 PM
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Based on something that has been out for more than a year, yet I find nothing about pricing even where the skipper comes up. Bet it's going to be way too much $$$ for us.
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post #9 of 682 Old 11-23-2017, 07:38 PM
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Looks like it fits CM's M.O.: Take an existing product, license it, and put their own logos on it. The logo gives its splash screen an appearance similar to the DVR+, even though it's a totally different product made by a different company, and will undoubtedly have a different UI.

The delay until after Christmas is disappointing, but may be necessary to allow time to get an ATSC 3.0 tuner into the thing. The existing product it's based on undoubtedly has an ATSC 1.0 tuner; no 3.0 tuners are available outside of S. Korea yet.

From the ZatsNotFunny article:
Quote:
And given that DVR button on the Stream+ remote, perhaps we’ll be fortunate enough to see some interplay between the devices or even local recording capabilities via USB drive
I too am hopeful that it will have true local DVR capabilities, with a decent Internet-based guide like the DVR+. It's possible, though, that the "DVR" button will only be for use with "cloud" DVR services provided by suppliers like Sling, PS Vue, etc.

BTW, CM's timing for this may not be very good. They're getting ready to release a streaming box, just as the FCC plans to kill Net Neutrality. If that goes through, it will probably make streaming more expensive, as companies like Netflix, Hulu, and even YouTube (i.e. Google) are forced to pay big ISPs like Comcast and Spectrum to ensure their content will be delivered. That of course will make streaming less competitive than now. CM may be tilting toward streaming just as the market tilts back toward OTA and traditional MVPDs like cable and satellite.
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post #10 of 682 Old 11-24-2017, 10:31 AM
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My guess is that they will still have OTA available, especially if the DVR+ is being discontinued. OTA is CM's core business. The Fan TV document (PDF) mentions both dual tuner configuration and "all sources of content - VOD, OTT, broadcast and PPV" using the Fan TV interface. CM tried to get there with the E* built DVR+ but couldn't quite get it done. I suspect Tecnicolor (formerly Thompson) and the Android platform will be "extensible" for CM.

My hope is that it has OTA DVR capabilities with dual tuners with a 14 day guide like the DVR+, using an external HDD. And that it adds the ability to add all the Android TV Apps like Netflix, Hulu, YouTube, and other free channels I currently watch on my Roku.

Technicolor touts cross-service search, so looking for "Amy Adams" would bring up appearances on OTA, OTT, Android apps, etc. I hope that's included in CM's version. Roku has a search for all apps, but combining that will all the other services you use, like OTA, would be sweet.

This is an argument for another venue, but I don't think net neutrality will have any impact on the move from cable to OTT services. What may stop the bleeding is the new OTT services from traditional cable companies like Spectrum - for $20 a month, month to month, without any other equipment fees, you can get an OTT package of local broadcast plus 10 - 12 of the most popular cable channels (minus ESPN and FSN). That's the real competition for the "skinny bundle" people like SlingTV and PS Vue.
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post #11 of 682 Old 11-24-2017, 12:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fshagan View Post
... the new OTT services from traditional cable companies like Spectrum - for $20 a month, month to month, without any other equipment fees, you can get an OTT package of local broadcast plus 10 - 12 of the most popular cable channels (minus ESPN and FSN). That's the real competition for the "skinny bundle" people like SlingTV and PS Vue.
OK, just for comparison, Sling Orange also costs $20/month, also requires no equipment, and has more "cable" channels, including ESPN. The only advantage the Spectrum package has is all the local channels, but:

  • OTA gives you those for $0.00/month
  • OTA includes many additional subchannels
  • OTA has the best PQ
  • OTA uses no Internet bandwidth
  • OTA programs can be freely recorded with a DVR

I think Spectrum is missing the point of a "skinny bundle" - it's supposed to add "cable" channels for those who already get their local channels OTA, not just be a stripped-down, streamed version of cable TV.
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post #12 of 682 Old 11-24-2017, 01:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JHBrandt View Post
I think Spectrum is missing the point of a "skinny bundle" - it's supposed to add "cable" channels for those who already get their local channels OTA, not just be a stripped-down, streamed version of cable TV.
Not sure I follow your logic. Sling, PS Vue, and Youtube TV are surely providers of "skinny bundles" and they all offer network broadcasts of ABC, CBS, FOX, NBC and PBS in their smallest, most economical "skinny bundles". Then they add cable channels. Spectrum's product looks the same to me. For someone who wants to get away from the $80 a month cable package a Roku and "skinny bundle" from Sling gives them most of what they want. They can also go with a Roku and Spectrum's package for $20 a month. Those are direct competitors.

None of those services are a good fit for me; I get my locals from an antenna and a OTA DVR is what I want for those channels. If the Stream+ solves the problem of having to change inputs on the TV to go from OTA to streaming services, it's a welcome addition. If not, I'll stick with my DVR+ and Roku on a different port. I don't care about the cable channels at all.
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post #13 of 682 Old 11-24-2017, 02:51 PM
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Getting back to the Stream+:
Quote:
Originally Posted by eherberg View Post
What might be possible is simply using the TV and DVR capabilities of existing products that could be downloaded through the Play Store like Plex, Tablo, Emby, etc using HDHomeRun or Tablo as the tuner. Hence, the 'optional' part.
I had totally forgotten about Plex being available on Android. Yes, something like that is probably the DVR function, and even if there's only one internal tuner, you can configure it to use HDHRs on your network. That's good: true local recordings.

OTOH, don't you need to subscribe to Schedules Direct for a guide? Not that I'd complain about a better guide than the DVR+ for only $25/year, but some may see that as an impediment.
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post #14 of 682 Old 11-24-2017, 03:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JHBrandt View Post
Getting back to the Stream+:I had totally forgotten about Plex being available on Android. Yes, something like that is probably the DVR function, and even if there's only one internal tuner, you can configure it to use HDHRs on your network. That's good: true local recordings.
There is no guaranty that this box will be able to run plex server. To my knowledge, right now only nvidia shield can run this server. Arm processors are not powerful enough to support transcoding, unless this box has a big GPU that can be used for transcoding like the Shield.


For plex to have access to livetv /DVR, you need to have a plex pass subscription. You can have a monthly subscription (I think it's 5$/month), pay for a year or buy a lifetime subscription. That gives you a 14 days guide from Gracenote with season/episodes numbers.

For hdhr dvr service, I think it's 35$/year.
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Last edited by Alainl12; 11-24-2017 at 03:16 PM.
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post #15 of 682 Old 11-24-2017, 04:40 PM
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Ok; Plex's guide isn't Schedules Direct, so it costs a bit more than I thought, but it's still a Gracenote guide. That's good.

Unfortunately it's not the "subscription-free" guide we've grown accustomed to with the DVR+. I don't know if there's a PSIP-only guide option for any of these DVR apps either.
Quote:
Originally Posted by fshagan View Post
Sling, PS Vue, and Youtube TV all offer network broadcasts of ABC, CBS, FOX, NBC and PBS in their smallest, most economical "skinny bundles".
Wish I knew where you got that, because it's not correct; at least not for Sling. (It may be correct for some/all of the others; if so, it may help explain why PS Vue is more expensive.) I subscribe to Sling Blue ($25/mo) and can attest that out of 45 total channels, only four (NBC, Fox, Univision, and Unimas) are local stations; no ABC, CBS, PBS, CW, Ion, My Network, etc.

Out of the 30 Sling Orange ($20/mo) channels, it doesn't appear that any are locals. You can see the lineups for yourself at https://www.sling.com/service. If you're still not convinced that the locals aren't there, sign up for the 7-day free trial, check it out for yourself (all you need is a Chrome browser), then cancel the free trial.

All of which is fine with me. Like you I get my locals via antenna; I don't need Sling to waste my subscription money paying retransmission fees for inferior OTT versions of channels I already get free and unencumbered by DRM. Spectrum should do the same as Sling and offer a package with fewer local channels and more cable channels.
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post #16 of 682 Old 11-24-2017, 06:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JHBrandt View Post
Wish I knew where you got that, because it's not correct; at least not for Sling. (It may be correct for some/all of the others; if so, it may help explain why PS Vue is more expensive.) I subscribe to Sling Blue ($25/mo) and can attest that out of 45 total channels, only four (NBC, Fox, Univision, and Unimas) are local stations; no ABC, CBS, PBS, CW, Ion, My Network, etc.
I think it depends on your market. I can't find an actual channel listing for Blue or Orange on their site any longer [edit - just tried your link and see it now], but in looking at their site they carry Fox, ABC, and NBC in local markets (https://www.screencast.com/t/KvFRxHbcw). Perhaps that's only on Blue but they have an indicator at the bottom that the locals are on both Orange and Blue on their home page. We know some markets get ABC, at least, where your market doesn't. [Edit: I trust the channel lineup you linked to rather than the lies on their home page that indicates the locals are available on both Orange and Blue].

But the others have it. YouTube.tv: "Watch the full lineups from ABC, CBS, FOX, NBC, ESPN, and more." That section is listed above the cable channels on their site.

PS Vue lowest plan at $40 a month has: CBS, NBC, ABC, Fox, MyTV, Decades. PS Vue lists those stations FIRST on their pages.

Locals are always a consideration for most consumers, and skinny bundles are not just for people who put up an antenna. A lot of the discussion in the cord cutters subreddit is about using a Fire or Roku and still being able to get locals without using an antenna.

Last edited by fshagan; 11-24-2017 at 06:08 PM.
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post #17 of 682 Old 11-24-2017, 07:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JHBrandt View Post
Ok; Plex's guide isn't Schedules Direct, so it costs a bit more than I thought, but it's still a Gracenote guide. That's good.

Unfortunately it's not the "subscription-free" guide we've grown accustomed to with the DVR+. I don't know if there's a PSIP-only guide option for any of these DVR apps either.
Plex, doesn't support PSIP only. It relies heavely on metadata. if Gracenote doesn't have a station that you receive in their database, you're screwed. You can't even create manual recordings.

I would be very surprised if CM releases this device and rely on a third party app like plex to provide DVR. First this box, from what I see doesn't have the necessary hardware to run plex server app. You will be able to run plex client, but the server, I don't think so. Plex server runs as a system app. The database and metadata are stored in the android protected data region. You can't move the database and metadata to an adopted storage (that limitation doesn't apply to recordings, recordings can be save on an usb drive or directly to a NAS). To get Plex server running reliably on the Shield, you need the Pro version with 500GB of internal storage. So if this box has 8GB or 16GB, that answers the question.

Personally, if they don't provide a solid DVR system on this box with ATSC 3.0 tuners, I don't see it to succeed. it will be only a "me too" product. There is already a lot of streaming boxes on the market doing a great job. From Apple TV to Mi Box, Roku and the very powerful (and pricey) Nvidia Shield, we already have a great choice of products. They need to be different from the other ones.

I already use plex DVR on the Nvidia Shield. But my DVR+ is still my main DVR. plex is far away from being prime time. It's great system though, but need a lot of work. The great thing though is that plex pass subscription is linked to an account, not a device. You can run multiple servers on the same account.

Edit: mistake in the last sentence.

Last edited by Alainl12; 11-26-2017 at 05:48 AM.
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post #18 of 682 Old 11-24-2017, 08:20 PM - Thread Starter
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CM is stubbornly NOT providing any info about the Stream+ on their facebook page, even though several have asked, and excitement is NOT very great. IMHO, that is a bad position for CM to take, especially with that other DVR (whose name shall not be mentioned) is having really good Black Friday prices, and will have a sale on other DVRs on Cyber Monday.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pachinko View Post
CM is stubbornly NOT providing any info about the Stream+ on their facebook page, even though several have asked, and excitement is NOT very great. IMHO, that is a bad position for CM to take, especially with that other DVR (whose name shall not be mentioned) is having really good Black Friday prices, and will have a sale on other DVRs on Cyber Monday.
CM is not a originator of the new model - we can pull all info from the mfg - Techicolor
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post #20 of 682 Old 11-25-2017, 04:43 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by P Smith View Post
CM is not a originator of the new model - we can pull all info from the mfg - Techicolor
I know that!

But, you cannot know for certain from any data currently available to us. For example, do you know if the guide will be included in the price of the device? Do you know if there will be one, two, or more tuners, or no tuners at all, relying upon external tuners of either ATSC 1.0 or 3.0? Etc, etc, etc!
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post #21 of 682 Old 11-25-2017, 07:07 AM
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I could deduce from published info ... a guide should be same as for DVR+; a tuner should be one internal 8VSB ATSC 1.0 for US market, perhaps next [more expensive!] version of the device will have ATSC 3.0 support as it will require new FW and tuner's HW.
Don't forget - CM is the seller: what TC will make, they will sell !

Last edited by P Smith; 11-25-2017 at 09:37 PM. Reason: grammar
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post #22 of 682 Old 11-25-2017, 10:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by P Smith View Post
I could deduct from published info ... a guide should be same as for DVR+; a tuner should be one internal 8VSB ATSC 1.0 for US market, perhaps next [more expensive!] version of the device will have ATSC 3.0 support as it will require new FW and tuner's HW.
Don't forget - CM is the seller: what TC will make, they will sell !
I keep looking at the DVR button on that remote and thinking that CM is having TC put DVR functions in the thing, along with two tuners.

It would be nice to have a streaming device as easy to set up as the Roku, Fire, Apple TV devices that also has OTA broadcast TV included. We would only switch OTA from the DVR+ to a streaming device if there was also a DVR component to it.
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post #23 of 682 Old 11-25-2017, 06:28 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by P Smith View Post
I could deduct from published info ... a guide should be same as for DVR+; a tuner should be one internal 8VSB ATSC 1.0 for US market, perhaps next [more expensive!] version of the device will have ATSC 3.0 support as it will require new FW and tuner's HW...
I think you mean "deduce", not "deduct", and yes, much of that may be true, but that's not knowing for a fact (unless, of course, you have insider knowledge). I read somewhere that suggested the guide data may be a paid subscription, and that won't make me happy unless it's dirt cheap, like $12 per year.

CM's facebook page says "Something cool is coming in January". Well, is the Stream+, as outlined in the TC specs, really something "cool". Not to me, but of course that's in the eye of the beholder.

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Originally Posted by P Smith View Post
Don't forget - CM is the seller: ...
Again, I know that! What we don't know is what CM may have ordered from TC's options, or what CM may have requested that is not one of those options.
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post #24 of 682 Old 11-25-2017, 07:46 PM
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This is very worrisome news:
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Originally Posted by DrDon View Post
Looking through the FCC’s notice of proposed rulemaking, I can’t find any mention of encryption or DRM applying exclusively to add-on content. Commissioner Jessica Rosenworcel even specifically pointed to encryption concerns in her dissent against the proposal. (The proposal passed in a 3-2 vote.)
(The "notice of proposed rulemaking" refers to the FCC's recently-adopted rules regarding ATSC 3.0.)

What that means is, there's nothing in the rule to prevent broadcasters from encrypting ATSC 3.0 transmissions with the purpose of preventing shows from being recorded by DVRs - or at least, to require DVRs that can record ATSC 3.0 to be "crippled" so you can't skip commercials and can't copy your recordings.

Edit: Based on this info from Dr. Don, I now believe it's more likely the latter than the former:
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[T]he thing to remember is that the networks retain streaming rights to their programs. Any after-airing streaming belongs to the networks, not the local stations. So, it's in the local broadcaster's best interest to allow recording. Even better for them if ATSC 3.0 recording devices can be crippled to force viewing of local and/or targeted ads. It's a LONG time before we see how this plays out.
If he's right, the Stream+ will probably be able to (eventually) record ATSC 3.0. It's just that there may not be much point in doing so. (Will they disable the mute button while they're at it?)

Either way, though, there is some good news: Unencrypted ATSC 1.0 broadcasts will continue through at least 2023. Perhaps the next FCC Commissioner will revisit this issue before then.
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post #25 of 682 Old 11-26-2017, 02:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JHBrandt View Post
What that means is, there's nothing in the rule to prevent broadcasters from encrypting ATSC 3.0 transmissions with the purpose of preventing shows from being recorded by DVRs - or at least, to require DVRs that can record ATSC 3.0 to be "crippled" so you can't skip commercials and can't copy your recordings.
I doubt that preventing the recording of programming on DVR's will ever be commonplace. Time shifting is such a part of the viewing culture I can't imagine anyone being able to undo 4 decades of it without facing a serious backlash from viewers. Skipping commercials or copying recordings is a different story though. Copying recordings is probably higher on the priority list for content creators. It would also be tough to stop the skipping of commercials without also killing off being able to jump forwards and backwards within the programming itself.
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post #26 of 682 Old 11-26-2017, 06:57 PM
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I basically agree: if they lock ATSC 3.0 broadcasts down too much, consumers will rebel, nobody will buy ATSC 3.0 equipment, and the whole venture will turn into a huge waste of money. No one wants that.

But expect ATSC 3.0 recorders to do less than existing ones. Sure, you'll be able to record shows for time-shifting purposes; but you may not be able to copy the recordings and play them on a different device, because they'll all be encrypted and only the device that recorded them will have the decryption key. And don't be surprised if that recorder won't let you skip the commercials - heck, I wouldn't be surprised if they even disable the mute button!
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It would also be tough to stop the skipping of commercials without also killing off being able to jump forwards and backwards within the programming itself.
Not as tough as you might think: remember, the commercials will already be flagged in the data to allow broadcast ads to be replaced with "targeted" ads for Internet-connected viewers.

So you can FF and skip forward all you want - until you hit one of those flags. Then the DVR drops to "play" and the sound comes on. (Hopefully, once you've seen the commercial, it'll get flagged so you don't have to re-watch it if you replay the recording - but I wouldn't count on it!)
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post #27 of 682 Old 11-26-2017, 09:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JHBrandt View Post
I basically agree: if they lock ATSC 3.0 broadcasts down too much, consumers will rebel, nobody will buy ATSC 3.0 equipment, and the whole venture will turn into a huge waste of money. No one wants that.
At this point I tend to doubt that ATSC 3.0 will be around for a very long time. Based on the Lifewire article posted to the DVR+ thread it looks like they are already preparing for 8K television, and that might require another consumer equipment upgrade down the line. I think electronics manufacturers would welcome this because they benefit when we have to buy new equipment. And technology is evolving so rapidly at this point I don't think anyone can accurately predict what it will look like as few as 10 years from now. Several years ago I read an article about science fiction that made the point it is very difficult to write science fiction set more than 100 years in the future for that very reason, so virtually all science fiction entails some natural or man-caused disaster that sets humanity and technology back. I also look at the Star Trek franchise as a way to gauge how technology will progress. The original Star Trek was way ahead of it's time in how it visualized the future. But as a TV show, ST: TNG looks primitive based on the technology average people are using every day now.
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post #28 of 682 Old 11-28-2017, 02:43 PM
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I found this on google sites: https://sites.google.com/view/droid-...master-cm-7600

Based on this specs, this is the CM-7600. Under broadcast, ATSC/IPTV. So at least, there is an atsc tuner. But no mention about the number of tuner, atsc version and if there is a DVR feature or not.
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Last edited by Alainl12; 11-28-2017 at 02:46 PM.
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post #29 of 682 Old 11-28-2017, 04:41 PM
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Question mfg - Techicolor or Technicolor

If anyone thinks they can force me to watch their commercials, they've got another think coming.

Most of CATV was as plagued with commercials as OTA and they did 'hook me with their DVR. I went nearly a year after cutting cable before getting relief from DVR+.

My DVD Recorder helped a lot. Between Amazon Prime streaming and Blue-rays, I didn't watch much broadcast TV. Never even subscribed to Netflix but expect it would be commercial free.

All those Law & Drug Ads really make me sick and I can certainly always find other ways to occupy my time.

Quote:
Originally Posted by P Smith View Post
CM is not a originator of the new model - we can pull all info from the mfg - Techicolor
Interesting here in that my ISP (CenturyLink) has provided me with the Technicolor C2000A Router/Modem (link in sig) for past four years (since I canceled their 'Prism CATV service) and I've been very happy with it.

First I've heard of Technicolor other than on movie credits, any connection I wonder.
Art

Last edited by pilotart; 11-28-2017 at 04:57 PM.
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post #30 of 682 Old 11-28-2017, 05:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pilotart View Post

First I've heard of Technicolor other than on movie credits, any connection I wonder.
Art
They seem to have a "colorful" history of acquisitions, mergers, sales of division and spin-offs:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Technicolor_SA

And the one we all know and love from the movies before becoming the above Technicolor SA:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Technicolor

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