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post #361 of 385 Old 11-03-2016, 11:31 AM
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I just had a brain flash for the title of the adult parody version of this one: Enter Stella.

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post #362 of 385 Old 11-03-2016, 11:33 AM
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I just had a brain flash for the title of the adult parody version of this one: Enter Stella.
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post #363 of 385 Old 11-03-2016, 12:01 PM
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Genius is often difficult to recognize when you are first exposed to it.

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post #364 of 385 Old 11-03-2016, 12:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Dean Roddey View Post
I just had a brain flash for the title of the adult parody version of this one: Enter Stella.
Spoiler!



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post #365 of 385 Old 11-03-2016, 01:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Optimus_Fine View Post
I already made my mind.
You are entitled to hold whatever opinion you want, regardless of how factually inaccurate it may be.

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post #366 of 385 Old 11-03-2016, 01:04 PM
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Originally Posted by Dean Roddey View Post
I just had a brain flash for the title of the adult parody version of this one: Enter Stella.
Sadly, the days of porn movies having clever-ish pun titles are over. Today, for legal reasons it would be called "Interstellar: A XXX Parody - You Can't Sue Us Because We're Protected by the First Amendment or Something."

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post #367 of 385 Old 11-04-2016, 10:23 AM
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You are entitled to hold whatever opinion you want, regardless of how factually inaccurate it may be.
Don't be so overconfident in calling my opinion "factually inaccurate" because I had your same view but now I realized I was wrong.
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post #368 of 385 Old 11-04-2016, 11:13 AM
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Don't be so overconfident in calling my opinion "factually inaccurate" because I had your same view but now I realized I was wrong.
I have no problem with you preferring the 16:9 version because that's what you like. That's all well and good. Nonetheless, the fact remains (and it is a hard, objective fact) that Christopher Nolan composed the movie to be safe for projection at a constant 2.40:1. He had no other choice. It was required. He knew that the overwhelming majority of his audience would see it that way in theaters.

Christopher Nolan may have many faults as a screenwriter, but he's not incompetent as a director. Everything important to the storytelling of that movie is contained within the 2.40:1 area, where his entire audience would be able to see it. Most viewers watched the movie that way in theaters. Everything above or below the 2.40:1 safe zone is just atmosphere.

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post #369 of 385 Old 11-04-2016, 11:43 AM
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[...] Everything above or below the 2.40:1 safe zone is just atmosphere.
I already explained to you that the 2.39 extraction is a compromise, not the intended vision.
Nolan made the movie first and foremost for IMAX film. All IMAX scenes are full frame, not hard matted. All the CGI were rendered full frame. All the Paramount Studios premiere screenings have been in IMAX film.
The anamorphic 35 mm print was just done for mass distribution, but that doesn't make it THE intended version.

Shooting in IMAX but compose for 35 mm??? How could I be such a fool into believing that???
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post #370 of 385 Old 11-04-2016, 11:50 AM
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I don't see Josh disagreeing with you on that. He is simply stating that (in fact) he had to shoot the movie (and any director doing full IMAX) with a "safe zone" of 2.40:1 like any director should do.

I agree with you that the intended "vision" of the movie is open matte full IMAX, yes. But you still have to shoot the whole movie in a way that doesn't lose important information outside the scope aspect ratio. That would just be poor cinematography.
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post #371 of 385 Old 11-04-2016, 12:40 PM
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No, it wasn't shot with a simple safe zone. Medium shots have headroom because that's inherent to the IMAX photography guidelines. And like I already said, there's a scene that required tilt/scan for the 2.39 extraction that if we simply center-crop from the BD, it looks cramped.
Also, the scenes outside the Ranger's cockpit look too cramped.

To me, it would be like having an IMAX reel of Interstellar and cropping it just because the 35 mm theaters had the cropped version. It's stupid. I'd rather change my screen.
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post #372 of 385 Old 11-04-2016, 01:01 PM
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post #373 of 385 Old 11-06-2016, 04:45 AM
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Originally Posted by Morpheo View Post
I don't think he does it to "enhance the 35mm presentation", imo he does it to enhance the presentation period.
I still can't grasp what you mean with that statement. What is to you THE presentation? The Blu-ray? You think Nolan shot in IMAX three of his last four movies just to enhance the Blu-ray?
I'm sure it's not the 35 mm print because I saw The Dark Knight in 35 mm and there was no difference in definition between the different footage, due to the resolution loss between the process from original negative to interpositive to internegative to theatrical print (and that's in the best scenario).
It can't be the 5/70 mm print because for the two Dark Knight movies there wasn't any, and anyway for Interstellar that was actually a blowup of the 35 mm IP or IN.
The DCP? Does Nolan care about digital projection? He considers it inferior even to 35 mm.

So, I can't find anything else but the IMAX film presentation as the reason why he shoots in IMAX.
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post #374 of 385 Old 11-06-2016, 07:12 AM
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Originally Posted by Optimus_Fine View Post
I still can't grasp what you mean with that statement. What is to you THE presentation? The Blu-ray? You think Nolan shot in IMAX three of his last four movies just to enhance the Blu-ray?
No it has nothing to do with the Blu-ray version, I only meant he adds IMAX footage to enhance the cinematic experience ("the presentation"), regardless if it's originally 35mm, digital, regardless of the usual ratio (2.35/40, 1.85, etc)... Sorry I wasn't clear.

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post #375 of 385 Old 11-06-2016, 07:23 AM
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I already explained to you that the 2.39 extraction is a compromise, not the intended vision.
And yet he had to make sure the largest audience would appreciate and enjoy his film at this ratio, in these conditions. I think we all agree that the IMAX version is the intented vision, but it inherently involves compromises. The biggest compromise being that he has to stay within the safe zone, IMAX is a visual enhancement, not something that is required to understand and follow the movie (even the shifting AR blu-ray is a compromise, but at least it's closer to the intented vision).
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post #376 of 385 Old 11-06-2016, 12:44 PM
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Originally Posted by Josh Z View Post
It's not necessarily cropped from the DCP. It may have been scaled down without losing any picture information.
I just compared the DVD and BD and there's no side cropping, so it's a downscale. And they're not from the same source because the DVD has some slight different framing in some IMAX shots.
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post #377 of 385 Old 11-07-2016, 03:44 AM
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After looking exclusively at medium shots, I realized that, for a character-driven experience, the scope framing is enough, so I'm keeping my scope setup.
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post #378 of 385 Old 11-07-2016, 11:21 AM
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Originally Posted by Optimus_Fine View Post
I still can't grasp what you mean with that statement. What is to you THE presentation? The Blu-ray? You think Nolan shot in IMAX three of his last four movies just to enhance the Blu-ray?
I'm sure it's not the 35 mm print because I saw The Dark Knight in 35 mm and there was no difference in definition between the different footage, due to the resolution loss between the process from original negative to interpositive to internegative to theatrical print (and that's in the best scenario).
It can't be the 5/70 mm print because for the two Dark Knight movies there wasn't any, and anyway for Interstellar that was actually a blowup of the 35 mm IP or IN.
The DCP? Does Nolan care about digital projection? He considers it inferior even to 35 mm.

So, I can't find anything else but the IMAX film presentation as the reason why he shoots in IMAX.
Did you really watch any of these movies in 35mm? Regardless of what Christopher Nolan likes, very few theaters still project 35mm anymore. If you didn't go to IMAX, you are most likely to have seen them projected digitally. Even IMAX theaters are almost exclusively digital now. And at the time Interstellar was released, all IMAX digital theaters used 2k projectors, not even 4k.

Shooting with IMAX cameras has other benefits beyond just the aspect ratio difference. IMAX film stock is inherent finer-grained than 35mm. Combined with the huge and razor sharp camera lenses, IMAX captures more detail than traditional 35mm (or digital) cameras.

Consider this: Brad Bird shot Mission: Impossible - Ghost Protocol with some scenes in IMAX. When it came time to transfer the movie to Blu-ray, Bird specifically instructed the studio to present it at a constant 2.40:1, because that is his preferred ratio. He said that he finds an alternating aspect ratio annoying. As far as the director of the film is concerned, that gimmick only works on the large IMAX theater screens, but everyone else is better off watching his movie at 2.40:1.

Of course, Christopher Nolan is not Brad Bird. Two directors can have different opinions about things. I'm sure Nolan would tell you that the alternating ratio version is his preference. Nonetheless, he still had to shoot the movie to protect for 2.40:1 composition, because that's how most theater viewers would see it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Optimus_Fine View Post
After looking exclusively at medium shots, I realized that, for a character-driven experience, the scope framing is enough, so I'm keeping my scope setup.
So, after all your arguing, you're now ready to acknowledge that I was right all along?

You're welcome.

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post #379 of 385 Old 11-08-2016, 08:51 AM
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Actually, never mind my last post.
I've found a picture of an IMAX cell of the first docking scene and noticed that the door is all the way to the bottom. Then I searched the matching frame in the BD and it's the same (of course), so a center crop for scope doesn't frame accordingly.
But that's just of one many scenes, which I already discussed before.

Out of curiosity (and kind of off-topic), I also looked for bad framing in the first encounter of Batman and Bane and found a couple of scenes which look cramped in DVD (2.39) and also in the 16:9 BD: one is when Batman is on top of Bane and Bane is going to push him aside, a little before Batman turns the lights off; the other is when Bane lifts Batman up and breaks his back.
But there are also other instances where the scope crop feels too cramped throughout the movie, but I'm not going to list them now.
So, I decided to buy the trilogy collection with the bonus disc containing all the IMAX scenes in 1.43 and see if they're better composed, filling the IMAX height.

In the end, even if the BDs are already cropped in 16:9, they're still less compromised than the DVDs, let alone an amateurish center crop in scope of the BD themselves.
As soon as I can, I will drop my scope screen and buy one more fitting for IMAX.
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post #380 of 385 Old 11-08-2016, 12:35 PM
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I look forward to you changing your mind again in a couple days.

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post #381 of 385 Old 11-26-2016, 12:10 PM
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Originally Posted by Josh Z View Post
Did you really watch any of these movies in 35mm? Regardless of what Christopher Nolan likes, very few theaters still project 35mm anymore. If you didn't go to IMAX, you are most likely to have seen them projected digitally. Even IMAX theaters are almost exclusively digital now. And at the time Interstellar was released, all IMAX digital theaters used 2k projectors, not even 4k.

Shooting with IMAX cameras has other benefits beyond just the aspect ratio difference. IMAX film stock is inherent finer-grained than 35mm. Combined with the huge and razor sharp camera lenses, IMAX captures more detail than traditional 35mm (or digital) cameras.
Just to clarify, yes, I did watch The Dark Knight in 35 mm and, besides the bokeh, there was no difference in detail between the 35 mm and the IMAX footage. So, I'm very positive that Nolan shoots in IMAX with no improvements for 35 mm projection.
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post #382 of 385 Old 11-26-2016, 12:15 PM
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This was the only IMAX 70mm I've ever seen... it was so epic. I wish I could have seen it that way a second time.
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post #383 of 385 Old 12-05-2016, 05:45 AM
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According to IMDb, Dunkirk will feature an opening sequence in 1:1 aspect ratio, but it's still unknown in which film format that will be, which would make more clear Nolan's actual intended aspect ratio.
If the 1:1 will be inside the 35 mm prints, then he composed 5/65 mm in 2.39:1.
If it'll be inside 5/70 mm prints, it'll be 1.08:1 on 35 mm prints, which would make the 35 mm a cropped version.
If it'll be inside the IMAX prints at the full camera aperture, it'll be around 1.66:1 on 5/70 mm prints, which would correspond to the European screen format, and 16:9 on 35 mm prints. In this case, the IMAX print would be an open matte version.

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post #384 of 385 Old 12-06-2016, 04:12 PM
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This was the only IMAX 70mm I've ever seen... it was so epic. I wish I could have seen it that way a second time.
I missed this at my local IMAX but did catch Force Awakens in 15/70; awesome, it was.
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post #385 of 385 Old 07-28-2017, 08:22 PM
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awesome, it was.
Stop that. :P
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