Tomorrowland in Dolby Vision HDR and Atmos at El Capitan Theatre - Page 3 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #61 of 157 Old 05-22-2015, 11:13 PM
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Originally Posted by Orbitron View Post
To answer your question Scott, is HDR good enough to entice people to go to theaters again? the answer is NO.
While the quality of the image has improved, the quality (behavior) of the people attending is worse than ever.
I don't really understand you guys. What do you do, make plans for a night out, get dressed up and stay at home sitting on the couch watching a movie? Boring.

And the payoff is never certain: Some observers contend that a generation has already been trained to be content with the small screen.

Some servers can do non-encrypted playback to an A/V projector, but it's just a ridiculously expensive media player if you don't have a cinema projector.
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post #62 of 157 Old 05-22-2015, 11:40 PM
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When I dress up and get out I like to interact with people; Not be a boring popcorn machine in a movie theater.

It's like gamers that sit at home and interact on a video game. That's real boredom
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post #63 of 157 Old 05-22-2015, 11:43 PM
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Interacting with people is usually the dinner with friends before or after being the popcorn machine.

And the payoff is never certain: Some observers contend that a generation has already been trained to be content with the small screen.

Some servers can do non-encrypted playback to an A/V projector, but it's just a ridiculously expensive media player if you don't have a cinema projector.
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post #64 of 157 Old 05-22-2015, 11:49 PM
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so not at the cinema. Got it
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post #65 of 157 Old 05-22-2015, 11:50 PM
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Originally Posted by Scott Wilkinson View Post
I don't know; I hope so, because that theater is way better than the El Cap in terms of seating. I heard a rumor that it would be ready by June 1, but I cannot confirm that. The best thing to do is call the theater periodically and ask if it's done.

Every time i hear EL Cap or the Chinese theater mentioned i think of seats like this.....
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And the payoff is never certain: Some observers contend that a generation has already been trained to be content with the small screen.

Some servers can do non-encrypted playback to an A/V projector, but it's just a ridiculously expensive media player if you don't have a cinema projector.
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post #66 of 157 Old 05-23-2015, 12:34 AM
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And for those of us who prefer to watch movies in our home cinemas with projection, is HDR going to make you replace your current projector?
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post #67 of 157 Old 05-23-2015, 12:43 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by CinemaAndy View Post
Every time i hear EL Cap or the Chinese theater mentioned i think of seats like this.....
The El Cap still has seats like those, but the Chinese seats are far better/newer since the main auditorium was converted to Imax.
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post #68 of 157 Old 05-23-2015, 12:48 AM
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Originally Posted by Scott Wilkinson View Post
The El Cap still has seats like those, but the Chinese seats are far better/newer since the main auditorium was converted to Imax.
Let's be fair, the seat at the El Capitan are not bad. They actually replaced all of the cloth and installed all new much thicker foam. The row spacing in most of the theatre is okay too. They also validate for parking at Hollywood and Highland for just $2.00 for 4 hours.
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post #69 of 157 Old 05-23-2015, 08:57 AM
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I posted this in the KC area thread. It is my write up about my experience last night at the grand opening of the AMC Dolby Cinema Prime. Three of the Kansas City area avsforum enthusiast met up to watch Tomorrowland.

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The movie last night was 'ok'.


I thought the speakers were turned up beyond their capability, and beyond my ears preferences for sure on volume, and I have ringing in my ears today to validate that opinion. The swapped out the JBL line array speakers (which I thought were fantastic) for Christie speakers from what I understand in talking to Luke. They are bigger drivers in the array and less of them in the vertical plane. Stitch has some pictures. Overall I thought it was the worst sound I've experienced in a PRIME yet, which was disappointing after seeing a half dozen or so PRIME movies at two different PRIME theaters, and I quite honestly like my audio better at home. I'm hoping they haven't dialed it in quite yet as Luke suggested, and it'll be better next time we go back. But surely they wouldn't have launched the grand premier without doing the best job on EQ they could?
I didn't notice the Atmos aspect much at all outside of the very cool new Atmos/Dolby Cinema demo at the beginning of the movie. In discussion with Tim and Luke after they said they did notice Atmos through the movie, but were listening for it. I can't say I was listening for, so perhaps that's a good thing that the ceiling speakers blended in and didn't call attention to themselves specifically --- but it would have been better if they had turned the main listening volume at least 3-4dB and got some of the harshness, overbearing volume tamed down. I heard the speakers play over their capability pretty badly in the previews, and on several occasions during the movie. They sounded stressed and it was too loud. A complaint I didn't have at dlbeck's house when we watched two movies back to back at reference volume, or at my house when we watched gravity recently at -3dB with the subs about 10dB hot. In neither instance were my ears sore the next day like they are now.


The new laser Christie projectors and HDR didn't knock my socks off either. Just being honest. The detail was amazing, and the focus was simply perfect --- but then so were the 4K projectors at the AMC Prime in Leawood when we watched Fast and Furious 7 last month for the KC home theater crawl. I didn't think that 4K projector at the AMC Prime last month gave up anything to this HDR projector (IMO) --- at least not having seen them immediately side by side. I thought the video quality at that PRIME theater on the Fast and Furious 7 was the best I'd seen, and to me this was on the level. Which is to say simply excellent - but not surpassing my imagination. One thing of note, the quality on these projectors is soooooo good that in the intro scene George Clooney seemed to look more detailed than he would in real life. Almost like you were looking at him with some magnification, like a pair of lightweight binoculars. To make my point, there was a small thin, whispy hair hanging off his green shirt collar while he was talking in the intro. It was obviously there and really (probably unintentionally) showed the resolution and detail these new projectors are capable of.
I was looking for the background sun shot that Scott Wilkinson talked about, but didn't really pick out which scene he was referring to. I didn't see anything startlingly bright, and nothing hurt my eyes or caused me to blink out of brightness which I was kind of expecting since the theater was so blacked out.


Another subjective evaluation -- I'm not sure I liked the pure whites. They had a bit of a grainy sparkly effect to me - sort of like (but not as bad) as my old Elite High Cinema Contrast projector screen with the high gain and glass bead screen structure. I don't think it was the screen fabric which looked to be a matte plastic/vinyl finish when I walked up to it after the movie. It didn't appear to have any visible gain built into the material. So perhaps that little sparkly nature is a byproduct of the laser technology. As another note - they replaced the old AMC Prime screen with a new screen which is more curved. The screen looked great, but to me, the pure white, didn't seem pure white. Like perhaps I'd give that nod to whatever projectors the AMC Prime in Leawood is using for pure white. I did think contrast was about as good as it gets on this new HDR projector. The ambient light in the room from the red floor runway lights and a door that was cracked open on the left side of the front of the theater cast ever so slight ambient light on the screen such that you couldn't tell where the aspect ratio projection lines ended at the top and bottom of the screen, and so even though the theater was very blacked out (the most blacked out commercial theater I've ever visited) - the projector was able to throw blacker. Two things were obvious on black background credits text scrolling at the end of the movie. There was no light bleed over from the white letters to the black background, and 2) they were using 24FPS.

To answer another question, I saw asked -- the exit signs are green glow and ratcheted down so far in light output that they remind me of an indiglow Timex watch glow in brightness. They were so dim that they couldn't really be picked up with Tim's new iPhone camera. They were not obtrusive in the least.


At this point I'm probably more critical than reasonable - but when you go to a show expecting it to be the premier experience in the Country --- the best of the best - only available at 4 theaters in the Country and it fails to rival an experience you had a month ago in another premier theater in town (The Leawood AMC PRIME) or even the same exact theater space before it was converted from a PRIME to the new Dolby Cinema Prime (when we watched the most recent Hobbit) --- then it's hard not to walk away a little disappointed.


To me, HDR isn't any kind of miracle in commercial theater. It wasn't even really that noticeable to me.


Frankly, I'd rather have watched the Tommorowland movie in my own theater with my friends, and I didn't think that when I watched the AMC Prime showing of the Hobbit movie, or the Fast and Furious 7. Compared to last night's experience I have better bass, and IMO better overall sound. I can control the volume and not have my ears be raw from shrill sound the next day. My shortcoming compared to last nights experience is my Panasonic AE8000U projector, while certainly not as good as what we saw last night - is no slouch and I enjoy it quite a bit.


So again. The experience last night was okay. I'm glad the industry is still trying to be innovative and move forward - I'm just not feeling like this was the leap I was anticipating it might be.


Maybe Tim or Luke will come in and tell me I'm crazy and they loved the experience.
Either way - I enjoyed hanging out with the guys last night and talking with them. Tim and Luke, who I met off avsforum, have become good friends over the last couple years and I enjoy spending time with them --- as well as some of the other avsforum enthusiasts as well!

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post #70 of 157 Old 05-23-2015, 09:01 AM
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So second balcony at El Capitan is higher up than dead center? Have you ever sat there before, with regards to leg room? Are you a tall chap?

I looked at your list of theaters, and the TCL across the street appears to have Laser and Dolby Vision as well.

It's great that some directors still shoot at physical locations...that not everything is conjured up digitally. Physical locations affect actors differently than a green screen and imagined circumstance.
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post #71 of 157 Old 05-23-2015, 09:26 AM
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Originally Posted by Hagenstein View Post
While I sort of get what you're saying, I think a distinction can be made between the utilization of technologies such as HDR (and yes even 3D) to convey a shot or perform visual storytelling vs. making a shot "around new technology", i.e. a shot that exists solely to demonstrate or call attention to that same technology. In this sense ANY film tech can be used as a gimmick. Is that sudden loud sound you hear behind your shoulder in the latest greatest horror flick a "gimmick", or "immersive sound"?

My take on HDR, HFR, variable FR, 3D, surround sound in all forms, color, b&w, etc. is that they are ALL simply tools for the artists (directors, DP's, cinematographers, editors and so forth) to paint the canvas of their films and stories with. We may not always like the colors they paint with, or a particular style, but that does not make any one of these technologies a wholesale gimmick unto itself.

What of the girl in the red dress in Spielberg's Schindler's List? Was the red dress in an otherwise black and white film a gimmick, a way to guide the user's attention, visual storytelling, or perhaps something deeper?

Perhaps this is all cliche and has been said before, but everytime I hear someone refer to a new(ish) technology as a gimmick, it makes me want to re-emphasize that any such tech CAN be used in a gimmicky way, but that doesn't mean the tech can't also be used in artistic and meaningful ways as well. And before condemning any particular tech to gimmick-status, we should think about what we mean when we say gimmick. Many many films are designed to manipulate viewers emotions and elicit responses in various ways, from subtle to 800lb gorilla. Better films imho let viewers choose how to feel about the story/visuals without beating them over the head with it. But it's all subjective and preference. Some may like the jumpscare of a villain leaping out from behind a door that turns out to be nothing but a cat, while others may prefer the creepy mishappen shadow under the crack of the door that is evidently something other than human.

So HDR is not a gimmick. Atmos is not a gimmick. 3D is NOT a gimmick. They are tools that may or may not be used in gimmicky ways in the hands of skilled or not-so-skilled directors and artists. And finally, even gimmicks can be entertaining in their own right in the eye of any one beholder. You know, that whole "What is art/entertainment?" question thingy... Ok my chest feels much lighter now lol.
Beautifully stated!
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post #72 of 157 Old 05-23-2015, 10:02 AM
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Did anyone see this movie In imax?
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post #73 of 157 Old 05-23-2015, 10:12 AM
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With Dolby HDR being attached to the first (and seemingly second) HDR film to theaters, does this mean that they've won the HDR wars for consumer tech? If the first HDR UHD Blu-Ray is Tomorrowland, will we need Dobly Vision HDR equipment to experience it, or will the standard SMPTE HDR implementations suffice?
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post #74 of 157 Old 05-23-2015, 10:29 AM
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Originally Posted by paul.sim View Post
With Dolby HDR being attached to the first (and seemingly second) HDR film to theaters, does this mean that they've won the HDR wars for consumer tech? If the first HDR UHD Blu-Ray is Tomorrowland, will we need Dobly Vision HDR equipment to experience it, or will the standard SMPTE HDR implementations suffice?
Dolby Vision is considered secondary layer metadata in the HDR world. The primary HDR open-source standard (All of the AV industry demanded this) denoted as SMPTE ST 2084/86 is what all devices must adhere to; meaning that if you're equipment doesn't support DV, and you play a film mastered in it, you will still receive HDRI, it just won't have any special secret sauce added in.

When it comes to the secondary layer of HDR, I fully expect Dolby to dominate, simply on their future-proof extreme peak brightness and 12Bpp panel requirements, along with the weight their name carries in both the Home and Cinema environments, I feel like it's a pretty solid start. Think DD Vs. DTS on secondary layer tech.

I also believe that the basic standard HDR will be fully enjoyable as well, and wouldn't look down on someone not wanting to wait for the DV/Philips/Technicolor/BBC specialty panels and just get basic HDR displays, like the SUHD line, for instance.
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post #75 of 157 Old 05-23-2015, 10:34 AM
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Originally Posted by taichi4 View Post
So second balcony at El Capitan is higher up than dead center? Have you ever sat there before, with regards to leg room? Are you a tall chap?

I looked at your list of theaters, and the TCL across the street appears to have Laser and Dolby Vision as well.

It's great that some directors still shoot at physical locations...that not everything is conjured up digitally. Physical locations affect actors differently than a green screen and imagined circumstance.
The TCL does not have Dolby Vision, it does have a couple of Laser projectors. The TCL is not showing Tomorrowland which I thought was weird.

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post #76 of 157 Old 05-23-2015, 01:19 PM - Thread Starter
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Let's be fair, the seat at the El Capitan are not bad. They actually replaced all of the cloth and installed all new much thicker foam. The row spacing in most of the theatre is okay too. They also validate for parking at Hollywood and Highland for just $2.00 for 4 hours.
You're right, the parking validation is great, better than Imax, which is 2 hours, I think. And in most locations, the row spacing is okay. But as far as I could tell, the seat padding was pretty thin, and both times I've been there recently (once in the orchestra, once in the balcony), one arm rest was loose and wobbly. The seats simply didn't feel like they had much quality, at least to me.
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post #77 of 157 Old 05-23-2015, 01:21 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by taichi4 View Post
So second balcony at El Capitan is higher up than dead center? Have you ever sat there before, with regards to leg room? Are you a tall chap?

I looked at your list of theaters, and the TCL across the street appears to have Laser and Dolby Vision as well.

It's great that some directors still shoot at physical locations...that not everything is conjured up digitally. Physical locations affect actors differently than a green screen and imagined circumstance.
I have not sat in the second balcony, so I don't really know about the leg room. It does put the viewer higher than the center of the screen, which is not ideal, but it's better than looking up at the screen. I'm not a particularly tall chap; I'm right around 6 feet.

The TCL Chinese Imax has laser-illuminated projection, but not Dolby Vision.
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post #78 of 157 Old 05-23-2015, 01:26 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by paul.sim View Post
With Dolby HDR being attached to the first (and seemingly second) HDR film to theaters, does this mean that they've won the HDR wars for consumer tech? If the first HDR UHD Blu-Ray is Tomorrowland, will we need Dobly Vision HDR equipment to experience it, or will the standard SMPTE HDR implementations suffice?
Good questions! Fox recently announced that it would make all of its home releases in HDR, but not Dolby Vision. On the other hand, I wouldn't be surprised if Disney makes Tomorrowland and other movies in Dolby Vision for release on Ultra HD Blu-ray. I'm concerned about how multiple HDR formats will play out in the marketplace.
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post #79 of 157 Old 05-23-2015, 01:35 PM
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When I was at the El Cap last month, we sat in the back row of the first balcony and there was plenty of leg room there (two rows behind the railing, I think). Great review Scott.

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post #80 of 157 Old 05-23-2015, 02:33 PM
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And for those of us who prefer to watch movies in our home cinemas with projection, is HDR going to make you replace your current projector?
Replacing your current projector with an HDR version won't be an option anywhere in the near future. There are no consumer HDR projectors in the works, only HDR TVs. If you want to see HDR projected you have to go a theater.
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post #81 of 157 Old 05-23-2015, 02:54 PM - Thread Starter
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When I was at the El Cap last month, we sat in the back row of the first balcony and there was plenty of leg room there (two rows behind the railing, I think). Great review Scott.
Thanks David! How were the sightlines from that row? I thought that the heads of people in the rows ahead of that might get in the way along the bottom of the image, even though the balcony seats are steeply raked.
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post #82 of 157 Old 05-23-2015, 03:16 PM
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Replacing your current projector with an HDR version won't be an option anywhere in the near future. There are no consumer HDR projectors in the works, only HDR TVs. If you want to see HDR projected you have to go a theater.
Fortunately, today's home cinema projectors deliver an awesome picture; comfortable staying with what I have.
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post #83 of 157 Old 05-23-2015, 05:38 PM
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Replacing your current projector with an HDR version won't be an option anywhere in the near future. There are no consumer HDR projectors in the works, only HDR TVs. If you want to see HDR projected you have to go a theater.
I am sure the time frame will narrow down a bit for home HDR projection. As it was invented for first run theatrical releases in a joint partnership with many companies, and many of those companies do not offer home products, it will take a little longer than most offerings from cinema to home. The two main companies, Dolby Labs and Christie Digital will eventually offer home offerings. The big question, with Christie products, is I do not see third parties releasing Dolby Cinema HDR home projection, if you want to play you will probably be owning a Christie home projector.

And the payoff is never certain: Some observers contend that a generation has already been trained to be content with the small screen.

Some servers can do non-encrypted playback to an A/V projector, but it's just a ridiculously expensive media player if you don't have a cinema projector.
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post #84 of 157 Old 05-23-2015, 05:43 PM
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The El Cap still has seats like those, but the Chinese seats are far better/newer since the main auditorium was converted to Imax.
I purchased 4 of the old Chinese theater seats as a gift for my mom, she loved going to that theater when we lived in Burbank, she had them put in the waiting room at her office. What is funny is the people who will sit in them just to say they sit in a seat from a popular place.

And the payoff is never certain: Some observers contend that a generation has already been trained to be content with the small screen.

Some servers can do non-encrypted playback to an A/V projector, but it's just a ridiculously expensive media player if you don't have a cinema projector.
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post #85 of 157 Old 05-23-2015, 06:19 PM
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Thanks David! How were the sightlines from that row? I thought that the heads of people in the rows ahead of that might get in the way along the bottom of the image, even though the balcony seats are steeply raked.
Sight lines were good because of the stair stepping of the seats. There were people sitting in front of us and nobody complained about not being able to see.

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post #86 of 157 Old 05-23-2015, 08:23 PM
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I am sure the time frame will narrow down a bit for home HDR projection. As it was invented for first run theatrical releases in a joint partnership with many companies, and many of those companies do not offer home products, it will take a little longer than most offerings from cinema to home. The two main companies, Dolby Labs and Christie Digital will eventually offer home offerings. The big question, with Christie products, is I do not see third parties releasing Dolby Cinema HDR home projection, if you want to play you will probably be owning a Christie home projector.
It's not just licensing issues. I'll be very surprised if anybody can do HDR projection at a cost that is affordable by even 0.01% of the consumer market without cutting some serious corners. It would probably require a completely different solution than what is used in the theatrical projectors.

Besides that, the content that is released for home won't have the same color grade as theatrical. The home HDR masters are targeting televisions with 1000+ cd/m2 peak luminance. The HDR cinema grade is nowhere near that. A home projector won't be able to get anywhere close to the targeted home mastering luminance, so it's going to wind up either seriously clipping or having to darken the content. It will be a mess.
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post #87 of 157 Old 05-23-2015, 10:03 PM
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You're right, the parking validation is great, better than Imax, which is 2 hours, I think.
Same parking structure, same validation ($2 for the first 4 hours) for both theatres (El Cap and TCL IMAX).

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post #88 of 157 Old 05-23-2015, 11:27 PM
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It's not just licensing issues. I'll be very surprised if anybody can do HDR projection at a cost that is affordable by even 0.01% of the consumer market without cutting some serious corners. It would probably require a completely different solution than what is used in the theatrical projectors.

Besides that, the content that is released for home won't have the same color grade as theatrical. The home HDR masters are targeting televisions with 1000+ cd/m2 peak luminance. The HDR cinema grade is nowhere near that. A home projector won't be able to get anywhere close to the targeted home mastering luminance, so it's going to wind up either seriously clipping or having to darken the content. It will be a mess.
I am sure work is already underway to bring this into a home, IMAX is in the "high end" HT and so is Dolby and Christie. I am sure they are looking for better market shares and lower cost. I don't see it happening right now or this year or the next, but it will happen.

And the payoff is never certain: Some observers contend that a generation has already been trained to be content with the small screen.

Some servers can do non-encrypted playback to an A/V projector, but it's just a ridiculously expensive media player if you don't have a cinema projector.
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post #89 of 157 Old 05-24-2015, 11:53 AM
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Just saw Tomorrowland at El Capitan Saturday. We sat in the front row of the second balcony. Eyes even with top of screen. Was very eager to see HDR, and technologically, it did not disappoint. Plenty of brightness, vivid color, and more importantly to me, blackness on the screen. But that happened only selectively. There were plenty of night-time scenes where the whole screen was still lit with the usual gray raster that normally passes for darkness in cinemas. Perhaps it is not easy to expand images into the ink without "black crush" so they were better left alone? I'm looking forward to an HDR movie where all dark scenes (where appropriate) go black.

The Atmos mix was good -- heard occasions where the side walls carried individual pools of sound displaced front to rear, all at the same time. The heights effectively added to the presentation without distraction.

The El Cap is a wonderful piece of history. But, being large and largely untreated acoustically, it has significant reverb. Happily, no slap echo, but dialog intelligibility is not state of the art by a wide margin. I accept that under these circumstances. What I cannot accept is the poor tuning of the screen channels. From the first words out of Clooney's mouth it was obvious there is significant midbass lumpiness and untamed excess. Totally unnatural, and this afflicted female voices just as much. Does anyone actually listen to their work after tuning these rooms? So sad, especially because, unlike the reverb, it is so easy to fix.

To end on a positive note, I felt the subs were nicely integrated, with deep extension and smooth response, and none of that "1-note" bass honk still found in too many cinemas.
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post #90 of 157 Old 05-24-2015, 12:35 PM
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Saw Tomorrowland at the El Capitan theatre Saturday morning with fellow AVS members Ivan Pino, Scott Simonian and Roger Dressler. The movie itself was enjoyable enough, though for me probably the weakest of Brad Bird's career. The best thing about this movie was Raffey Cassidy as Athena.

The Atmos mix was nice, with occasional height imaging and off-screen dialogue. The main problem with the sound was the reverberant auditorium; not like slap-echo reverberant, but enough extended decay to muddy the dialogue at times. Having experience the same problem watching Avengers and Mad Max across the street at the TCL IMAX, I chalked it up to both theatres being historical landmarks that can't have acoustic treatments covering their expensively-restored ornate interiors.

Speaking of the TCL IMAX, having just seen the aforementioned couple of movies at that theatre with dual laser projectors, I didn't know how much to attribute the picture quality at the El Cap to the laser projection and how much to attribute to HDR. It's not like there was a laser-projected non-HDR version of the movie playing alongside for comparison, like the dual monitor displays at trade shows, where the difference is down to a single variable (HDR). I didn't like the movie enough to see it again in a regular theatre, but even if I did, how would I know how much the dimmer image was due to a lack of laser projection or due to a lack of HDR?

Despite not knowing how much to attribute to which technology, I will say that the projected image was absolutely stunning. Bright, punchy, detailed; like looking at a 4K LCD display blown up to the size of a motion picture screen. A couple of shots appeared to have been shot with HDR in mind, like when Clooney is looking down at the girl and we can see the sun directly over his shoulder. There also seemed to be missed opportunities; scenes where the blacks appeared dark grey and not like the kind of blacks I've seen on plasma TVs.

The only downside, which is not the fault of the technology, is how quickly I got used to it. Early in the movie I leaned over to Ivan and whispered that the image didn't look spectacular, just normal (like how I see the world in real life). Don't know if that's good or bad, but it didn't take long to stop being impressed by the image and just taking it for granted. Maybe I've been spoiled because the last two movies I saw used dual laser-projectors.

On the drive home, we talked about movie technologies that were immediately noticeable. Scott mentioned seeing high frame rate for the first time with the most recent Hobbit movie. From the moment the Warner Bros. logo came on screen, he knew something was different. And the first time you see someone moving, within a second you know you're not watching 24fps. Ivan went all the way back to Toy Story 2, which was the first movie he saw projected digitally. Upon seeing the green band of the first trailer, he knew within seconds that this was something different: no grain, no gate weave, none of the tell-tale signs of film. For me it was the first few seconds of Transformers 3, during the Paramount logo, where the transformers signature sound effect goes around the room. There was absolutely no doubt in my mind that I was listening to a 7.1 mix, and the movie itself hadn't even started yet.

By comparison, the benefits of HDR were less clear. We kinda had to go looking for shots in Tomorrowland that we thought might have benefited from HDR (again, lack of comparison kept us from knowing for sure). Like I said, having just seen two movies in laser made this presentation look like an incremental improvement at best, but not the immediately noticeable differences we talked about on the drive home.

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