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post #12811 of 12945 Old 06-22-2019, 04:37 PM
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Originally Posted by snowdog 88 View Post
Aren't those networks suppose to help support their stations? I thought that's the whole reason why each station consists of 2-3 of these networks.


The funny thing is that their website lists those stations as being part of Cleveland/Akron area. (Their channel listings seriously need updating).
I suppose they are supporting the channels assuming that people realize they are there and watch them, and if the signal is good enough for the average person to receive. It would interesting to know what their average viewing audience is.
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post #12812 of 12945 Old 06-22-2019, 08:48 PM
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Originally Posted by unclehonkey View Post
low powered stations and translators do not need to cover their city of license. HC2/DTV America has done this across the country. Buy construction permits for stations in outer areas and get a CP to move it to the big city/metro area. Totally legal
I totally understand that. Not saying it isn't legal..Just that it shouldn't be..The only channel I'm really interested in out of what they have is Buzzr, and I get that through two different channel apps on my Roku Box.
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post #12813 of 12945 Old 06-23-2019, 07:31 AM
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I totally understand that. Not saying it isn't legal..Just that it shouldn't be..
it is what it is. Whats odd is when they had the AM revitalization project where stations could buy the CP for a translator and move it up to 250 miles in most cases the city of license changed with the FCC
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post #12814 of 12945 Old 06-23-2019, 09:01 AM
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Originally Posted by snowdog 88 View Post
What may happen is that HC2 might lease 16.1 to Media-Com, meaning that everything on W16DO stays the way it is now (including the iffy picture & audio quality), while the future 6 subs will be handled exclusively by HC2.
That would be nice, but I suspect Media-Com wants out of the business, considering that they tried to sell both stations in the auction (but W16DO's price essentially fell to zero even at the highest clearing target since it was so easy to repack).

Watch HC2 move all the shopping and religious channels to 16.x and leave Buzzr on one of the no-signal stations.
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post #12815 of 12945 Old 06-23-2019, 09:07 AM
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Originally Posted by jkeldo View Post
I suppose they are supporting the channels assuming that people realize they are there and watch them, and if the signal is good enough for the average person to receive. It would interesting to know what their average viewing audience is.
Not very many considering their signals and zero cable carriage. Carrying the shopping channels (who pay for carriage) no doubt pays their bills.
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post #12816 of 12945 Old 06-23-2019, 02:54 PM
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I've seen a couple beat me to it, but WUEK still has the globe with "WUEK Canton" on 26.1, .2, .4 and .7, the other subs seem to be blank. No sound, and on my TV can see the pixels kinda moving around constantly. I assume that's the very fast transitions between 480 and 720 or 1080 as one posted. On my DVR, the globe ID actually cuts in and out real fast so looks like irregular flashes- I assume the DVR can't process the fast transitions more than one a second it seems. That little orange thing on the screen is something reflecting on the screen.

Also slowly working on getting all my channels back among 1001 other things to do, LOL.
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post #12817 of 12945 Old 06-23-2019, 04:06 PM
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Originally Posted by snowdog 88 View Post
I was going to mention this yesterday about WQDI. I was able to get WUEK briefly yesterday morning and they were still running programming.
WQDI had been doing this overnights for the past week, WUEK joind them a couple days later, now it's 24/7

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Maybe they forgot to pay their programming bill?

It ought to be illegal for them to show their city of license as Canton since they aren't even attempting to reach the area..
WVIZ's repeater COL is Eastlake, yet the signal never made it there either. Speaking of which they are shooting a dead carrier still.

I agree, call a spade a spade then, very misleading. I noted once there is/was a Station in either Ely or Elko NV, that is considered in the SLC DMA which is a few hundred miles away.

Edit, Elko NV, 230 miles from it's DMA City KENV


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Originally Posted by nsa1062 View Post
Has the HC2 purchase of the station closed yet?

I guess no more Son of Ghoul
I find 16's signal to be more tempermental out here & WQDI seems a bit more reliable.

Is 16's impending move going to happen on 8/2?

Last edited by Bismarck440; 06-25-2019 at 07:53 AM.
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post #12818 of 12945 Old 06-23-2019, 04:10 PM
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Originally Posted by dannykewl View Post
I've seen a couple beat me to it, but WUEK still has the globe with "WUEK Canton" on 26.1, .2, .4 and .7, the other subs seem to be blank. No sound, and on my TV can see the pixels kinda moving around constantly. I assume that's the very fast transitions between 480 and 720 or 1080 as one posted. On my DVR, the globe ID actually cuts in and out real fast so looks like irregular flashes- I assume the DVR can't process the fast transitions more than one a second it seems. That little orange thing on the screen is something reflecting on the screen.

Also slowly working on getting all my channels back among 1001 other things to do, LOL.
The 'moving pixels' are compression artifacts, which really shouldn't be noticeable if all the sub are transmitting a static/blank image. I've noticed this weirdness ever since these stations signed on and presumably when they were in 480i.

Your Vizio looks similar to the one that I have. My Vizio has problems decoding all the DTV America/HC2 channels, as well as some other TV's & devices that I use. Perhaps it's because they don't fully understand the 480p format, which technically isn't one of the ATSC standards. I wonder if this was the problem all along and we just realized that they are using the wrong video format.

Newer is not always better.
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post #12819 of 12945 Old 06-23-2019, 04:17 PM
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Originally Posted by Bismarck440 View Post
I find 16's signal to be moire tempermental out here & WQDI seems a bit more reliable.
W16DO should improve slightly when they move to RF 27. They will be at 15 kW instead of 10.

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Is 16's impending move going to happen on 8/2?
I believe that's next year, phase 10.

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post #12820 of 12945 Old 06-23-2019, 05:30 PM
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Originally Posted by snowdog 88 View Post
The 'moving pixels' are compression artifacts, which really shouldn't be noticeable if all the sub are transmitting a static/blank image. I've noticed this weirdness ever since these stations signed on and presumably when they were in 480i.

Your Vizio looks similar to the one that I have. My Vizio has problems decoding all the DTV America/HC2 channels, as well as some other TV's & devices that I use. Perhaps it's because they don't fully understand the 480p format, which technically isn't one of the ATSC standards. I wonder if this was the problem all along and we just realized that they are using the wrong video format.

I can scan and my Vizio as well as my DVR will save the 20's, but either a black screen or a blue screen depending on what subchannel. Right before WEKA left 41, all the subs audio were breaking up bad but pic was OK on both TV and DVR.
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post #12821 of 12945 Old 06-23-2019, 06:04 PM
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Just tried the RS amp again that I found both pieces. Lost almost all channels ex. 3, 5, 55 and 61 when I tried it by the attic antenna. Similar when I tried it behind the TV. So took that out, and moved extra slack coax that was back there around a bit, and now getting 8, 19 and 43 again, but lost 16, 17 and 23. Still get 47 and 49, and the scan says 20 is still there, even though nothing on them. 26 still has the globe. Think I'll let it be as is, no sense putting more time in it if I'm moving soon.

What's strange, that RS amp kit has the 2 parts that are supposed to be connected, but they both have male ends on those sides, the AC power part to the amp part! I had to use a small piece of coax to connect them. Maybe came with a piece that I lost.

Will be another can or worms when I get re-settled as I see the areas I'm looking at are generally about 50 miles from any full power stations.

Thank you all for all your help on this!
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post #12822 of 12945 Old 06-24-2019, 02:38 AM
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Originally Posted by snowdog 88 View Post
W16DO should improve slightly when they move to RF 27. They will be at 15 kW instead of 10.


I believe that's next year, phase 10.
I thought the 5 kW was going to offset the higher frequency change. so it would likely be a wash, same tower, same height.

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Originally Posted by dannykewl View Post

What's strange, that RS amp kit has the 2 parts that are supposed to be connected, but they both have male ends on those sides, the AC power part to the amp part! I had to use a small piece of coax to connect them. Maybe came with a piece that I lost.

Will be another can or worms when I get re-settled as I see the areas I'm looking at are generally about 50 miles from any full power stations.

Thank you all for all your help on this!
The Round Barrel goes right at the antenna I would believe, & the power supply block is indoors.

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post #12823 of 12945 Old 06-24-2019, 07:00 AM
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I thought the 5 kW was going to offset the higher frequency change. so it would likely be a wash, same tower, same height.
That's one of the reasons with many stations moving to new frequencies. Most of the repacked stations show a slight increase in coverage, which I presume will help overcome interference from other nearby stations. The only local station that I see that's decreasing it's coverage is WBNX. (Looks like they now have a construction permit for a temporally aux antenna for RF 17 while the main antenna is getting replaced).

W16DO - RF 16 Coverage
W16DO - RF 27 Coverage
WBNX - RF 30 Coverage
WBNX - RF 17 Coverage
WBNX - RF 17 AUX Coverage


EDIT: Speaking of WBNX, they have filed for a waiver to repack to RF 17 on August 8th due to delays in the antenna manufacturing process.
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post #12824 of 12945 Old 06-24-2019, 04:58 PM
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Originally Posted by dannykewl View Post
Just tried the RS amp again that I found both pieces. Lost almost all channels ex. 3, 5, 55 and 61 when I tried it by the attic antenna. Similar when I tried it behind the TV. So took that out, and moved extra slack coax that was back there around a bit, and now getting 8, 19 and 43 again, but lost 16, 17 and 23. Still get 47 and 49, and the scan says 20 is still there, even though nothing on them. 26 still has the globe. Think I'll let it be as is, no sense putting more time in it if I'm moving soon.

What's strange, that RS amp kit has the 2 parts that are supposed to be connected, but they both have male ends on those sides, the AC power part to the amp part! I had to use a small piece of coax to connect them. Maybe came with a piece that I lost.

Will be another can or worms when I get re-settled as I see the areas I'm looking at are generally about 50 miles from any full power stations.

Thank you all for all your help on this!
Here is a copy of the manual for the one I previously mentioned that is on eBay in case you need it or for the specs.
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post #12825 of 12945 Old 06-25-2019, 07:34 AM
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Originally Posted by snowdog 88 View Post
That's one of the reasons with many stations moving to new frequencies. Most of the repacked stations show a slight increase in coverage, which I presume will help overcome interference from other nearby stations. The only local station that I see that's decreasing it's coverage is WBNX. (Looks like they now have a construction permit for a temporally aux antenna for RF 17 while the main antenna is getting replaced).

W16DO - RF 16 Coverage
W16DO - RF 27 Coverage
WBNX - RF 30 Coverage
WBNX - RF 17 Coverage
WBNX - RF 17 AUX Coverage


EDIT: Speaking of WBNX, they have filed for a waiver to repack to RF 17 on August 8th due to delays in the antenna manufacturing process.
Thank you, these map links would be nice to have on page 1 here. Is is 23 & 49 also moving in part of phase 4 (along with KONV turned back on)? I'm imagining I may be losing 23 up here due to the decreased tower height not making it over the ridge, but possibly gaining the 49 PBS in the Summer.

I'm not sure why WVIZ is still shooting a blank carrier on Physical 19 & reporting no signal, I should delete it & then rescan & see how the tuner reacts. Would think they should shut down the transmitter at this point.
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post #12826 of 12945 Old 06-25-2019, 07:35 AM
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post #12827 of 12945 Old 06-25-2019, 08:59 AM
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I'm imagining I may be losing 23 up here due to the decreased tower height not making it over the ridge, but possibly gaining the 49 PBS in the Summer.
Looking at the maps for the current RF 23 and the future RF 22, I see some slight coverage improvement west of the transmitter, but some slight degradation towards the northeast, mainly in areas located directly behind a hill. For the most part, coverage for RF 22 will roughly be the same in most areas.

Yes, I wish that WVPX would have stayed on the current tower. Would have also been nice if WEAO moved there as well so that all the Akron TV stations were on one tower. I wonder if the move was so that ION could use the former WDLI studios/Church as their offices. Perhaps the building adds more value should ION Media sell off WVPX (or the WDLI license) to someone who wants to produce local news for the Akron/Canton area.

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post #12828 of 12945 Old 06-25-2019, 09:19 AM
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Originally Posted by dannykewl View Post
Just tried the RS amp again that I found both pieces. Lost almost all channels ex. 3, 5, 55 and 61 when I tried it by the attic antenna. Similar when I tried it behind the TV. So took that out, and moved extra slack coax that was back there around a bit, and now getting 8, 19 and 43 again, but lost 16, 17 and 23. Still get 47 and 49, and the scan says 20 is still there, even though nothing on them. 26 still has the globe. Think I'll let it be as is, no sense putting more time in it if I'm moving soon.

What's strange, that RS amp kit has the 2 parts that are supposed to be connected, but they both have male ends on those sides, the AC power part to the amp part! I had to use a small piece of coax to connect them. Maybe came with a piece that I lost.

Will be another can or worms when I get re-settled as I see the areas I'm looking at are generally about 50 miles from any full power stations.

Thank you all for all your help on this!

Keep in mind that the ONLY purpose of using a preamp or an amplifier is to preserve the signal coming from the antenna due to losses in coax, splitters, etc. If you're using a cheap amplifier, I'd bet it has a high noise figure too. And if you're using an amplifier in Cleveland, then you may be worsening the signal due to overloading your tuner. The whole point of using a PREAMP is to place it at the antenna, and to choose one from a reputable manufacturer which actually publishes the noise figure... hopefully much lower than the tuner's noise figure so you'll gain a couple extra dB of signal. I really cringe at some of these indoor antenna manufacturers. They clearly are duping the consumer. I was driving around Toledo last Saturday, and there's a heck of a lot more real outdoor antennas on towers out there. I'm amazed that people in this area just don't use real outdoor antennas anymore... you know, ones that actually work.
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post #12829 of 12945 Old 06-25-2019, 12:23 PM
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Originally Posted by snowdog 88 View Post

EDIT: Speaking of WBNX, they have filed for a waiver to repack to RF 17 on August 8th due to delays in the antenna manufacturing process.
Would WBNX be allowed to stay on 30 for even a week past the deadline with WYTV moving to RF31 on August 2?
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post #12830 of 12945 Old 06-25-2019, 12:39 PM
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Keep in mind that the ONLY purpose of using a preamp or an amplifier is to preserve the signal coming from the antenna due to losses in coax, splitters, etc. If you're using a cheap amplifier, I'd bet it has a high noise figure too. And if you're using an amplifier in Cleveland, then you may be worsening the signal due to overloading your tuner. The whole point of using a PREAMP is to place it at the antenna, and to choose one from a reputable manufacturer which actually publishes the noise figure... hopefully much lower than the tuner's noise figure so you'll gain a couple extra dB of signal. I really cringe at some of these indoor antenna manufacturers. They clearly are duping the consumer. I was driving around Toledo last Saturday, and there's a heck of a lot more real outdoor antennas on towers out there. I'm amazed that people in this area just don't use real outdoor antennas anymore... you know, ones that actually work.

My luck with pre-amps----worse operation with them in the circuit then out of it so I gave all three of them away.
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post #12831 of 12945 Old 06-26-2019, 05:41 AM
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Has anyone tried the ASTC 3.0 USB tuner stick from Geniatech yet?
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post #12832 of 12945 Old 06-26-2019, 06:20 AM
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I really cringe at some of these indoor antenna manufacturers. They clearly are duping the consumer. I was driving around Toledo last Saturday, and there's a heck of a lot more real outdoor antennas on towers out there. I'm amazed that people in this area just don't use real outdoor antennas anymore... you know, ones that actually work.
Probably the dumbing down with widespread Cable introduction in this area in the very late 70's, early 80's, most if not all of the millennials have been "weened" on it.

Remember, not all of us have the luxury of having an antenna, I could give my development a workshop on OTA antenna TV, but I have to approach cerytain people on an individual basis & tell them how wonderful the outdoor antennas that were hauled off worked, they thought it was a sick joke that I brought it up at a HOA annual meeting.

The 25 repeater would not scan in, but held the virtual channel info until I deleted it, 49 will not be @ full power & height untill 1/29/20.
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post #12833 of 12945 Old 06-26-2019, 07:14 AM
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The 25 repeater would not scan in, but held the virtual channel info until I deleted it, 49 will not be @ full power & height untill 1/29/20.
Isn't the WVIZ repeater suppose to move to RF 34 soon? RF 19 was just temporary as they had to vacate RF 38, so perhaps they're in the process of switching out antennas.

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post #12834 of 12945 Old 06-26-2019, 09:23 AM
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Looking at the maps for the current RF 23 and the future RF 22, I see some slight coverage improvement west of the transmitter, but some slight degradation towards the northeast, mainly in areas located directly behind a hill. For the most part, coverage for RF 22 will roughly be the same in most areas.

Yes, I wish that WVPX would have stayed on the current tower. Would have also been nice if WEAO moved there as well so that all the Akron TV stations were on one tower. I wonder if the move was so that ION could use the former WDLI studios/Church as their offices.
West is Best, & all signals lead to Akron , I believe the diminished height will kill WVPX up my way, as I'm shadowed by the Ridge to the SW, Kirtland to the South, & Thompson to the SE for the Youngstown signals.

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Isn't the WVIZ repeater suppose to move to RF 34 soon? RF 19 was just temporary as they had to vacate RF 38, so perhaps they're in the process of switching out antennas.
That is correct rf 19 was temporary, they should just shut the repeater down at this point, they have to vacate 19 on 8/2. I currently would have to manually add it, but no point if nothing is broadcasting, but I'm getting about 80-85% on the tuner bar. With 26 currently being on diminished power/height too, it's a bit flaky, it may had been of some benefit to me.

I never was able to get the repeater on 38 though. Even pointing the 751 at it.
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post #12835 of 12945 Old 06-26-2019, 09:29 AM
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That would be nice, but I suspect Media-Com wants out of the business, considering that they tried to sell both stations in the auction (but W16DO's price essentially fell to zero even at the highest clearing target since it was so easy to repack).
I think that Media-Com wanted to keep the television station. However, when the station was removed from the Spectrum Cable lineup in Akron, that was the death of their interest in owning the television station.

Now that the company is being asked to temporarily operate the station (essentially doing the same thing they have been doing for years) and being paid by the new owners, it is the best of both worlds.
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post #12836 of 12945 Old 06-26-2019, 12:57 PM
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WUEK-26 channels are now on when I checked around 3:45 PM but it wasn't on this morning around 8:30 AM or so. The seven channels appear to be the same ones broadcasting in 480i format.

WQDI-20 is not back on yet.
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This ad is in today's Plain Dealer which talks about disappearing channels due to the repack although it doesn't use that word at all:
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post #12838 of 12945 Old 06-26-2019, 01:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bismarck440 View Post
That is correct rf 19 was temporary, they should just shut the repeater down at this point, they have to vacate 19 on 8/2. I currently would have to manually add it, but no point if nothing is broadcasting, but I'm getting about 80-85% on the tuner bar.
WVIZ had a webpage explaining the Thompson repeater transition, but it appears to have been completely updated for their main signal. Yes, they have to leave RF 19 by 8/2, so I'm assuming that they will switch to RF 34 on or shortly after that date.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dmking12370 View Post
I think that Media-Com wanted to keep the television station. However, when the station was removed from the Spectrum Cable lineup in Akron, that was the death of their interest in owning the television station.

Now that the company is being asked to temporarily operate the station (essentially doing the same thing they have been doing for years) and being paid by the new owners, it is the best of both worlds.
I think the problem was that there was no direct feed from Media-Com's studios to Spectrum, and they essentially wanted Spectrum to pick up W16DO via over the air. This may have been done with WAOH/29 where the signal was receivable, but since W16DO is farther away, Spectrum (Akron) probably didn't want to upgrade their antenna or equipment in order to receive a distant station. If they did have a direct feed, it would have likely came from the WAOH transmitter site, which should still be operational after the station signed off.

Newer is not always better.
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post #12839 of 12945 Old 06-26-2019, 01:13 PM
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Originally Posted by jkeldo View Post
WUEK-26 channels are now on when I checked around 3:45 PM but it wasn't on this morning around 8:30 AM or so. The seven channels appear to be the same ones broadcasting in 480i format.

WQDI-20 is not back on yet.
That's strange. WQDI was definitely back on around 11:00 AM when I last checked. When their ID came up, I brought up my info screen and it said 480p. When the ID disappeared, it reverted back to 480i. I wasn't able to receive WUEK though as they are still not up to full power.

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post #12840 of 12945 Old 06-26-2019, 01:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by snowdog 88 View Post
That's strange. WQDI was definitely back on around 11:00 AM when I last checked. When their ID came up, I brought up my info screen and it said 480p. When the ID disappeared, it reverted back to 480i. I wasn't able to receive WUEK though as they are still not up to full power.
There is no trace of a signal for WQDI when I checked around 3:45 PM but will check again later. I have been receiving them better compared to last summer.
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