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post #8821 of 8909 Old 05-11-2018, 08:27 PM
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After noting the presence of ch. 25 before, when I checked back this afternoon at 5:30 and this evening at 8:15 the signal is no longer present. Apparently a test run.
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post #8822 of 8909 Old 05-21-2018, 10:10 AM
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KOIN's channel 25 transmitter has been off and one since May 11 when I last posted, always transmitting color bars.


This morning, it is on transmitting the same program material it features on its channel 40 transmitter.
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post #8823 of 8909 Old 05-31-2018, 05:21 PM
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RF-41 is off the air; apparently moved to RF-15. Only one virtual channel, 15.1,is present; picture is 480i. YouToo network programming. Ironically, there is a crawler saying that KOXO will be moving to a new channel on June 1st and you will need to re-scan your TV set.

The RF-15 signal is very unusual in that it has an extremely large adjacent channel emissions. A DTV signal that just meets the FCC's mask will have an IM emissions shoulder 36 dB below the signal's head, falling rapidly as one tunes away from the channel edge. RF-15 exhibits shoulders at about 20 dB below the signal's head with the emissions falling away slowly as one moves away from the channel edge.
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post #8824 of 8909 Old 06-01-2018, 04:58 PM
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KOIN turned off its RF-40 transmitter this morning, leaving the signal on RF-25 as its official outlet.

As I checked the spectrum at about 4:30 this afternoon, KEVE on RF-36 was experiencing carrier trips. The signal would suddenly go away, be away for 3 to 5 seconds then return to full power over about a 4 second period. Some days are not fun for broadcast engineers.

KOXO on RF-15 is still transmitting a signal with clearly excessive adjacent channel emissions this afternoon.
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post #8825 of 8909 Old 06-01-2018, 10:56 PM
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Since the move I cannot pick up KOIN. I have rescanned multiple times, I get 37 channels showing up, none of which are KOIN. Any possible insight?
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post #8826 of 8909 Old 06-01-2018, 10:57 PM
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I am in Beaverton btw.
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post #8827 of 8909 Old 06-02-2018, 10:33 AM
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KOIN is operating with lower power (57kW vs 1000kW) from an antenna 500' lower in altitude (1240' vs 1754' above average ter.) that is located 0.6 miles NW of its normal Sylvan site. Its antenna is somewhat directional, favoring the east with a slight reduction in signal in other directions. At my house in Aloha to the SW of the station, its signal strength is down about 13 dB from its former value. I don't know how that is affected by variations in my antenna's gain. The coverage map for KOIN available on RabbitEars.info shows that there are many pockets in the Beaverton area that have reduced signal strength. You may be in one of those areas.

Depending on what antenna you are using and where you live, KOIN's new signal has apparently fallen below threshold at your house. One of the features of DTV is that you will have a perfect picture (and sound) right up to the point where, without warning, a small change causes the receiver to fall below threshold and you suddenly have NO picture (or sound). This threshold effect makes it difficult to trouble shoot the situation.

Without seeing your situation, all I can suggest are the typical palliatives. Move you antenna higher; move it away from the set (to avoid EMI from the set); make sure the antenna is oriented toward KOIN's tower. Try randomly moving the antenna about hoping to find a hot spot. Try a different antenna, an attic antenna or an outside antenna. etc.

Some TV sets make it a bit easier to trouble shoot coverage. First, some sets have a signal strength read out of some sort. Review menu options to see. Another feature of some sets is that they will allow themselves to be directed directly to a channel to see if there is a signal there. Try just entering 25.1 on the remote and see what the set does. If it simply goes to a nearby channel that it has found in the latest scan, your set does not do this. If it goes to channel 25, does some flipping and then reports no signal it does. The point is that if it does, it speeds up the trouble shooting by eliminating the wait as all the channels are scanned while you look for channel 25. Unfortunately, the only set in my house that will do this is an old set top converter box. This is one of the features one essentially has to buy the set to find out if it works that way. I only mention this to let you know the feature might exist and to try it on your set.
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post #8828 of 8909 Old 06-02-2018, 12:15 PM
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An additional note.

I am only about 6 miles from the TV stations. To get a loud signal for testing purposes I use an outside antenna so I think I am receiving almost everything that is available in the metro area.

Out of interest I scanned two sets and two set top boxes in my house this morning. Sets vary somewhat in what they find when they are scanned. So, the number of channels received varied a bit from set to set but all of them got over 50 virtual channels.

Getting only 35 virtual channels when over 50 are easily available indicates that your present antenna is good enough for only the most powerful stations.

DTV strikes again; the signals you receive give a perfect picture and don't give a clue that there are signals being missed. Further, you don't know how close to the threshold of failure your present system is. DTV is a huge improvement over analog TV. But it, like everything else, has its downside.
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post #8829 of 8909 Old 06-04-2018, 08:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LinleyG View Post
KOIN turned off its RF-40 transmitter this morning, leaving the signal on RF-25 as its official outlet.
I guess this explains why my TiVo no longer gets KOIN.

I did a scan and found KOIN-HD (the previous name was KOINDT) and although that works, I get no guide info. I even reran the guided setup to no avail. I guess I just have to wait for TiVo to update something.

Currently, the TiVo shows 3 channels for 6-1: frequency 40 (no signal), frequency 47 (strong signal but no picture, K47LM-D), and frequency 25 (KOIN-HD).
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post #8830 of 8909 Old 06-04-2018, 08:54 AM
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In the Portland area, RF47 will get you KUNP-LD. K47LM-D is a translator that primarily covers the Prineville, OR area.


See https://rabbitears.info/market.php for the best listing of station information. Portland is market 24.

Last edited by LinleyG; 06-04-2018 at 06:56 PM. Reason: Clarity
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post #8831 of 8909 Old 06-07-2018, 02:39 PM
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Checking the TV spectrum this afternoon, we find that KUNP-LD RF47 has moved to RF34. On my sets, they are transmitting a single virtual 1080i channel still labeled as 47-1.

Last edited by LinleyG; 06-07-2018 at 02:59 PM. Reason: Correct the call letters.
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post #8832 of 8909 Old 06-08-2018, 07:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LinleyG View Post
Checking the TV spectrum this afternoon, we find that KUNP-LD RF47 has moved to RF34. On my sets, they are transmitting a single virtual 1080i channel still labeled as 47-1.
I'm seeing that RF34 has:

47.1 KUNP-LD (1080i)
47.2 TBD (480i)
47.3 Charge (480i)
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post #8833 of 8909 Old 06-08-2018, 08:23 AM
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I'm seeing the same thing this morning.


At this point I don't know if the 47.2 and 47.3 were there yesterday and I missed them or if they actually weren't there.
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post #8834 of 8909 Old 06-08-2018, 11:02 AM
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RF-15, KOXO's, adjacent channel emissions are now under control.


Channel edge shoulder amplitudes are about all one can see in off-air measurements. KOXO's transmitter is either just meeting or just not meeting the FCC's emission mask specification there. To tell more requires measurements at the transmitter site.
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post #8835 of 8909 Old 06-12-2018, 11:06 AM
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KOXO, 41-1 (RF 15) is off the air this morning.


KEVE, 36-1 (RF 36) continues to exhibit carrier trips I have noted (but not reported here) over the last couple of weeks.


T-Mobile sent KUNP-LD notice some time ago that it would commence cell phone operations in Portland on June 15th. Thus KUNP's change to channel RF34. T-Mobile holds the title to cell phone bands C and D in the Portland area which occupies TV RF 40 and RF 41 for the base stations and TV RF 47, RF 48 and RF 49 for the handsets. (The cell bands are 5 MHz wide while the TV channels are 6 MHz. It means that the mapping of one to the other is irregular.)


KOIN, RF40 and KOXO, RF41 were somehow convinced to move off frequency before they were required to so the base station band is clear. KUNP-LD, RF 47 as a LD station had no rights to the frequency and has moved to RF 34. That leaves KOPB's RF48 translator on Healy Heights and KWVT's RF 49 transmitter left in the T-Mobile handset band. Neither has the rights to the frequency. It will be interesting to see what happens over the next few days. Both KOPB and KWVT have applied for alternate channels but the FCC (as far as I can tell) has yet to act.
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post #8836 of 8909 Old 06-14-2018, 08:10 PM
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KOXO, 41-1 (RF 15) is back on the air this evening. It was not on the air this morning nor any other time I looked since I noted that it was off on June 12th.


I have not observed KEVE, 36.1 (RF 36) having any more problems with carrier trips since June 12th.
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post #8837 of 8909 Old 06-15-2018, 09:39 AM
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Here it is, the 15th of June. Nothing has changed from yesterday. RF 48 and RF 49 are still on the air and T-Mobile's base stations are not transmitting (at least near me) on Cell bands C and D (627 MHz to 637 MHz). We will just have to await events.
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post #8838 of 8909 Old 07-01-2018, 07:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LinleyG View Post
WatchTV's KOXI-CD is on today (apparently at full power) transmitting what appears to be an ATSC 3.0 signal. The signal's spectrum appears "squarer" than the standard DTV signal (i.e., ATSC 1.0), has no pilot and has short intervals of a narrower spectrum that would correspond to ATSC 3.0's boot up interval. This is the first day of the TV industry's giant NAB show in Las Vegas so the time is ripe for an ATSC 3.0 demonstration. The WatchTV stations are slated for an ATSC 3.0 demonstration this summer. First time I have seen one of WatchTV's transmitters on the air since last July.
Do you think ATSC 3.0 will help with OTA TV reception in fringe areas (60-75 miles away from transmitters) or will it just be another false hope for those who don't live right inside a large metropolitan area? Broadcast TV was originally designed to reach about 75 miles from a transmitter (not always with the best picture quality but analog VHF was more forgiving of terrain issues in fringe areas than ATSC 1.0 digital is). It seems like the whole idea of broadcasting needs to be changed to actually reach homes throughout an entire market, especially markets with difficult terrain.
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post #8839 of 8909 Old 07-01-2018, 11:36 AM
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ATSC 3.0 is likely do better than ATSC 1.0 to provide service in the fringe. It uses an OFDM modulation scheme that involves sending many tightly spaces carriers that is easier for receivers to demodulate in difficult situations. Beyond that, I am uncertain. The ATSC 3.0 standard allows a wide range of transmission characteristics allowing the broadcaster to choose to send a low data content signal that is very easy to decode, to a very high data content signal that requires a larger signal to noise to decode than ATSC 1.0. In fact the low data mode of ATSC 3.0 was specifically designed to be received by hand held receivers in moving vehicles.


I have read some accounts that say it is possible for the broadcaster to do both at the same time. I don't know myself as I have found the ATSC 3.0 physical layer document to be opaque. It never plainly gives the over the air characteristics of the signal. I am sure it does exactly specify the signal but it uses a mental model that I do not understand. I am old, so perhaps a new specification format/concept is likely to be difficult for me; but I have heard similar complaints from other, younger, broadcast engineers also. Having ended my career with learning and designing for ATSC 1.0, I understand its physical signal fairly well. It was a wonder in it's day, but it does have limitations when it comes to being decoding when multipath is bad and/or signal strength is low.


No one has asked, so I will just volunteer that the avatar that is associated with my AVS account is the ATSC 1.0 system impulse response (i.e., transmitter and receiver combined) expressed in a polar format. It is very different from normal QAM because it is a vestigial sideband system like analog TV. As far as I know, I am the only person that has displayed that signal's characteristics in this polar format. For my own amusement, several years ago I wrote an (unpublished) "learned" paper about the physical ATSC 1.0 signal writing down what I knew. This was well after ATSC 1.0 was well adopted so no one seemed to be interested in it. Write me if you would like so see it.

Last edited by LinleyG; 07-01-2018 at 02:31 PM. Reason: Removed a line feed before word "Having". Changed wording slighty to make it clear there are many transmission modes,
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post #8840 of 8909 Old 07-18-2018, 08:24 PM
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At least this late afternoon and evening, KOXO-CD (RF15, virtual Ch 41) and KPXG-TV (RF and virtual Ch 22) are off the air. I have no idea why. They both transmit from KGW's tower but so do KGW and KOPB which are still on the air.
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post #8841 of 8909 Old 07-19-2018, 08:06 PM
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KPXG-TV (RF and virtual Ch 22) came back on the air this afternoon. Their web site said they had a transmitter failure and were off the air until a repair part arrived.


KOXO-CD (RF 15 virtual Ch 41) is still off the air.
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post #8842 of 8909 Old 07-24-2018, 09:52 AM
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KOXO-CD (RF 15 virtual ch 41) is back on the air this morning. It's been off the air since I noted its absence on July 18th.
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post #8843 of 8909 Old 07-26-2018, 11:14 AM
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KGWZ-LD (RF and virtual ch 46) has filed for and received a STA from the FCC to go silent tomorrow the 27th of July. This is KGW's station that features a live picture of down town Portland taken from the east side of the river. T-Mobile gave it notice to be off RF 46 by July 29th. KGWZ-LD has applied for but has not received permission from the FCC to move to RF23, reducing its ERP from 15kw to 8.6kw as it does so. Since it did not have that permission, it applied for and was granted the permission to go silent.
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post #8844 of 8909 Old 07-27-2018, 02:03 PM
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KGWZ-LD (RF and virtual ch 48) is off the air this afternoon. It was on this morning.
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post #8845 of 8909 Old 08-03-2018, 04:05 PM
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KMNT (RF45, virtual ch24) is sharply down in power this afternoon. At my location in Aloha, they are 35 dB below the amplitude I logged them at in February. That works out to be an ERP of roughly 300 Watts. They were at or near full power yesterday when I checked.


KMNT has a STA from the FCC to operate at 1/2 power (i.e., 500 kW ERP) as necessary to facilitate installing the new channel 32 antenna for their post repack channel assignment. But, that's only a 3 dB reduction. Something else seems to be happening.
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post #8846 of 8909 Old 08-03-2018, 06:58 PM
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At 7 PM (probably well before) KMNT is back up to full power.
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post #8847 of 8909 Old 08-15-2018, 12:01 PM
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Yesterday evening and today, KPXG-LD (RF 42, virtual 42-1) is off the air. It holds a construction permit for a repack move to RF 21. If being off air on RF 42 is part of that change, it hasn't appeared on RF 21 yet.


Yesterday afternoon, KNMT-CD (RF 45, virtual 45-x) was operating with low power (same as noted above) but was back to full power in the evening hours. It's again operating at low power at midday today.
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post #8848 of 8909 Old 08-18-2018, 04:41 PM
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KJYY-LD (RF 26, virtual 26.1) was off the air yesterday but is back on today.


Yesterday was the end of the Silent STA the FCC granted to four of WatchTV's Portland stations (pdf attached). These stations are; KORS-CD (RF 16), KOXI-CD (RF 20), KORK-CD (RF 35) and KKEI-CD (RF-38). In a letter to WatchTV dated April 18, 2018, the FCC granted the stations a Silent STA that was to end six months from the date each station went silent. The letter also noted that that WatchTV, in its application for the Silent STA, said the stations went silent on February 18, 2018 even though in my observations only KORS-CD was the only station ever to air an ATSC 3.0 signal and it went off the air about February 7th. The FCC's letter states that "The stations ... upon expiration of their silent authority must resume operation consistent with their underlying license." That is transmit signals in ATSC 1.0 format.


As of this afternoon none of these stations are transmitting a signal while WatchTV's KOXO-CD (RF 15 virtual ch 41) does remain on. It will be interesting to see what happens next.
Attached Files
File Type: pdf FCC Letter.pdf (222.1 KB, 15 views)
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post #8849 of 8909 Old 08-30-2018, 11:29 AM
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I completely missed the fact that WatchTV applied for a STA extension on the 14th of August. They say that the duplexer required for the new channel line-up was ordered on time but has not been delivered. The STA extension is in a"pending" status and has not been granted.
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File Type: pdf Silent_STA_extension_exhibit_KORK_KOXI_KORS.pdf (78.2 KB, 10 views)
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post #8850 of 8909 Old 09-03-2018, 08:16 PM
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Long-time FiOS subscriber here. Originally with Verizon in Tigard but held on to Frontier since they took over the franchise. Now in Sherwood with Frontier. I am having problems with getting a solid transmission of channel 731, AMC. It is the only channel that consistently has severe macroblocking and pixelation on all programs. Last fall Walking Dead was unwatchable, as was Preacher. This season Better Call Saul and Preacher are having the same problems. I have to watch these AMC programs via their app on my AppleTv. Before I call Frontier to complain I was wondering if anyone here has a similar issue with Frontier and AMC?
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