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post #9091 of 10472 Old 04-25-2011, 05:42 PM
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Hey y'all! I'm new on here but have been doing the OTA thing for about 6 months now. Def no expert but have a decent understanding.

Recently I moved south & my Wineguard SS-3000 started picking up most of the signals with ease, particularly KOMO. KING is spotty but tolerable most of the time. Oddly enough, I can't seem to get KIRO at all. (My TV Fool w/spaces around tv & com: www. tvfool.com /?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=29&q=id%3d8d171577e950ea ) They're all coming from nearly the same location so I'm not sure what the difference is. Also, according to TVFool, I should be getting Fox on 13.1 without a problem but I actually only get it from whoever is broadcasting on 22.1-22.3. Any idea how I can get KIRO with any reliability? I'm not concerned about FOX since I have other options but am curious about it.

FWIW, I'm in a one-story condo. The living room is set up with the TV near a North facing window with the antenna about 4 feet off the ground facing NNW-ish. I don't have any other windows in the room & I'm really not looking to go the outdoor antenna route.

Thanks!
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post #9092 of 10472 Old 05-01-2011, 05:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim in Seattle View Post

This morning at 8:30 KVOS ran an ad saying MeTV is coming to KVOS April, 25. I hope they are allowed to/choose to continue providing their own local content: it would be a shame to lose productions like The Pickford Classic movies: Julie and I haven't missed one in weeks. Jim

Looking at the new TV schedules for KVOS, it appears they have dropped many of their home-grown programs like The Pickford Classic Movies and the Chuckanut Radio Hour. Also, they appear to be minimizing use of the KVOS logo and brand identity in favor of MeTV.

MeTV tends to repeat many of the same programs in a time slot seven days a week, which is a little disappointing.
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post #9093 of 10472 Old 05-02-2011, 09:08 PM
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I'm out on the east part of Woodinville, and reception here is tricky. I get the VHF stuff pretty well - 9,11,13. UHF I basically get only 22 and 33 with separate antennae. I don't have LOS to anything (maybe 33).

About 815 every evening lately, my reception gets lousy on all stations - you can set your watch by it. It stays crappy for 30 mins or so, then tends to improve a bit.

Any idea whats up? Do stations lower their power at a certain time? Is there something that happens when day turns to night? Is there some other explanation?
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post #9094 of 10472 Old 05-03-2011, 05:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric J View Post

I'm out on the east part of Woodinville, and reception here is tricky. I get the VHF stuff pretty well - 9,11,13. UHF I basically get only 22 and 33 with separate antennae. I don't have LOS to anything (maybe 33).

About 815 every evening lately, my reception gets lousy on all stations - you can set your watch by it. It stays crappy for 30 mins or so, then tends to improve a bit.

Any idea whats up? Do stations lower their power at a certain time? Is there something that happens when day turns to night? Is there some other explanation?

No, stations do not reduce power as you described.

However, since your problem is very specific as to the time of day it starts, you should thread this thread: https://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1327138
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post #9095 of 10472 Old 05-03-2011, 02:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric J View Post

I'm out on the east part of Woodinville, and reception here is tricky. I get the VHF stuff pretty well - 9,11,13. UHF I basically get only 22 and 33 with separate antennae. I don't have LOS to anything (maybe 33).

About 815 every evening lately, my reception gets lousy on all stations - you can set your watch by it. It stays crappy for 30 mins or so, then tends to improve a bit.

Any idea whats up? Do stations lower their power at a certain time? Is there something that happens when day turns to night? Is there some other explanation?

Sometimes when temperatures or weather conditions change, a marginal signal or reflection can change just enough to affect reception. More than likely is some electrical noise source occurs about the same time every evening. Sometimes sodium street lights with a noisy ballast starting up will throw a ton of airborne noise. Neon signs, air conditioners, computer monitors, and those new florescent replacements for incandesent lights can create noise. Especially at start-up. Loud "impulse noise" can be quite destructive to DTV signals if your antenna is close enough to the source.

I've seen antennas trapped in attics pick up electrical noise from house wiring which get better once devices warm up.

32 Year Broadcast Technical Veteran with over ten years in DTV transmission and reception experience.
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post #9096 of 10472 Old 05-03-2011, 09:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kelly From KOMO View Post

Sometimes when temperatures or weather conditions change, a marginal signal or reflection can change just enough to affect reception. More than likely is some electrical noise source occurs about the same time every evening. Sometimes sodium street lights with a noisy ballast starting up will throw a ton of airborne noise. Neon signs, air conditioners, computer monitors, and those new florescent replacements for incandesent lights can create noise. Especially at start-up. Loud "impulse noise" can be quite destructive to DTV signals if your antenna is close enough to the source.

I've seen antennas trapped in attics pick up electrical noise from house wiring which get better once devices warm up.

You guys are brilliant (I think). Tonight it was closer to 8:20 that I had the problem. I have a sodium light on my detatched garagen with a photosensor that hasn't been working so well. I suspect it is firing up when it starts getting dark, throwing a ton of noise as you describe. It is nearly directly in front of the antenna.

I'll throw the breaker tomorrow and see if I have the problem.
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post #9097 of 10472 Old 05-07-2011, 07:30 PM
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Has anyone else noticed KING comming in on only 2.1 channels lately? It must be the station because all the others are still 5.1
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post #9098 of 10472 Old 05-08-2011, 09:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric J View Post

You guys are brilliant (I think). Tonight it was closer to 8:20 that I had the problem. I have a sodium light on my detatched garagen with a photosensor that hasn't been working so well. I suspect it is firing up when it starts getting dark, throwing a ton of noise as you describe. It is nearly directly in front of the antenna.

I'll throw the breaker tomorrow and see if I have the problem.

Kelly and ProjectSHO89, thanks again. I had the problem again (a few minutes later than usual) and ran out to the garage, and sure enough, the sodium light there was struggling to fire up. Its about 45 feet in front of the antenna. I need to disable or replace that light entirely.
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post #9099 of 10472 Old 05-09-2011, 08:18 AM
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You're welcome Eric! Glad you discovered the problem and are able to fix it.

32 Year Broadcast Technical Veteran with over ten years in DTV transmission and reception experience.
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post #9100 of 10472 Old 05-17-2011, 09:11 AM
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Is anyone else having a problem with King 5 5-1 and 5-2 reception? I cannot seem to recieve an image on those channels. I have 3 TVs each with a seperate HTPC and watch TV via WMC7. Two of the HTPCs use a dual tuner HDhomerun and the third uses a Hauppage pvr-1600 tuner. All three TVs exhibit the same behavior, ie states there is no signal. I have done a channel scan and signal strength test with all TVs, and the channels are detected with maximum signal strength, but alas no signal is detected when trying to actually watch the channels. I don't think signal strength is the issue since I live on Capitol Hill.
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post #9101 of 10472 Old 05-17-2011, 10:54 AM
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I'm also having troubles with King 5-1 and 5-2, I can watch live but if I try to record it goes blank and I get the no signal warning. Last night was the first I noticed, also using WMC7 and HDhomerun.
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post #9102 of 10472 Old 05-17-2011, 12:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by freakjim View Post

I'm also having troubles with King 5-1 and 5-2, I can watch live but if I try to record it goes blank and I get the no signal warning. Last night was the first I noticed, also using WMC7 and HDhomerun.

See if the suggested solution in this thread fixes it. It did for me and I had exactly the same problerm as you all today.

http://www.silicondust.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=9971
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post #9103 of 10472 Old 05-17-2011, 02:20 PM
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Thanks glorpsd! Eliminating duplicate channel sources fixed it.
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post #9104 of 10472 Old 05-17-2011, 03:55 PM
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yes that seemed to do the trick
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post #9105 of 10472 Old 05-18-2011, 08:32 AM
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Starting yesterday I started having problems with Ch 5.1 and 5.2 OTA in Lake City. I get max signal strength (TiVo HD), but it's like a "video black" signal is being transmitted!
I can reboot my TiVo and get it back... strange
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post #9106 of 10472 Old 05-18-2011, 08:40 AM
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Apparently KING was having PSIP probllems yesterday. Several people with HDHRs on WMC reported that the missing channel problem resolved itself automatically when KING fixed things yesterday. You can read more at the link in my post above. I am back to normal too after reversing the 'fix' posted in that thread at SD and reenabling all the sources for the channels in WMC.
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post #9107 of 10472 Old 05-25-2011, 03:06 PM
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I live in Edmonds (near 196th/76th st.) and just bought a Clearstream2 that I have mounted on my roof and pointed south. My cable runs are probably around 100ft and I have it connected through a 3way splitter. No amp is installed. There is also a thin line of trees directly to the south.

I get all the local UHF channels with excellent signal strengh. VHF signal is very weak. I'd like to improve that so I can get a better signal for PBS and FOX(HD). Anyone have any advice on how to improve my VHF signal?

I purchased my CS2 at Fry's and can still return it. If there is a better antenna recommended for both UHF/VHF signals I would like to know. Reviews of the 4228hd and CS4 seem to be mixed.

Thanks!
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post #9108 of 10472 Old 05-25-2011, 09:20 PM
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Neither the 4228 nor the Clearstream 2 are meant for VHF channels. I was using a Winegard PR4400 for digital until channels 9 and 11 changed frequency (I cannot receive 13 here). After the change I reverted to my old Radio Shack U/V antenna (I forget which model, but it resembles the Channelmaster 3016) which has worked fine.

Bob
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post #9109 of 10472 Old 06-07-2011, 10:16 PM
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Bit of a mystery here. Wondering if anyone can shed some light on this. I'm in NE Seattle and have pretty good reception on all the stations. I've got a decent indoor RCA VHF/UHF antenna w/preamp and put a parabolic reflector behind it ( I'd post the url for it, but am not allowed to yet, doh ). With this setup, I can even pull in a strong KBTC which is Violet from my location according to AntennaWeb (the parabolic reflector is truly amazing - as soon as I put it behind my antenna, KBTC came in great).

Anyway, now my problem is that with this setup I was able to get KFFV 44.1-44.4 easily the first night it was setup. But for the past couple of days I can't get them. All the other stations are still fine. What makes this even more mysterious is that KUNS 51.1 comes in great and as far as I can tell KFFV and KUNS are located at the same place with the same power output (according to the FCC). KFFV is like 5 feet lower, 714 vs 719 feet above terrain.

So what's the deal with KFFV? Any ideas? I've moved the antenna all around and just cannot pull in the signal. Anyone else having trouble with it? Thanks!

Edit: Hmm, well after looking at TV Fool, it seems KFFV is only broadcasting at 25 kW, compared to 1000 kW for KUNS. And they're not at the same place, even though the FCC website says otherwise. But then TV Fool also says channel 13 is at 30 kW and located past Bremerton. Don't know what to believe anymore.
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post #9110 of 10472 Old 06-08-2011, 06:16 AM
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Channel 13's transmitter is on Gold Mountain, west of Bremerton.

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post #9111 of 10472 Old 06-08-2011, 02:22 PM
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Not sure about KFFV, but KUNS only radiates 27-kW ERP from West Tiger Mtn. There is a construction permit for 1000-kW along with a relocation of the transmitter but for right now that's the power level.
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post #9112 of 10472 Old 06-09-2011, 03:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Old Negus View Post

So what's the deal with KFFV? Any ideas? I've moved the antenna all around and just cannot pull in the signal. Anyone else having trouble with it? Thanks!

KFFV is operating under STA from Capitol Hill; they also have applied to stay there. They haven't been operating from their licensed site on West Tiger in quite some time.

http://transition.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/tv...=0&facid=49264 - see, in particular, the third and fourth records on the page.

I checked, both at home and in my office, and am still able to pick up KFFV, so I don't think (at least in the last couple of hours) that they're having any transmission problems.
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post #9113 of 10472 Old 06-15-2011, 12:59 PM
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Of note: TVNewsCheck.com reports KFFV is going up for bid in a couple of weeks. Obviously, this was on the horizon. Got a few million handy?

Personally, because I'm in the Anacortes DTV shadow I can't get that station OTA.
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post #9114 of 10472 Old 06-15-2011, 08:02 PM
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Of note: TVNewsCheck.com reports KFFV is going up for bid in a couple of weeks. Obviously, this was on the horizon. Got a few million handy?

It'll be interesting to see what the final price is, and who walks away with it. An opening bid of $3.45m isn't much; it's a fraction of what Fisher paid for KWOG/KUNS five years ago ($16m).
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post #9115 of 10472 Old 06-22-2011, 12:32 PM
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ERI Antenna Makes Big Difference in KOMO Signal

http://www.tvtechnology.com/article/121924

I seem to recall wondering why they didn't utilize an elliptical antenna considering all the work and it turns out that they did after all. The application and the FCC still say horizontal, but I expect they simply checked the wrong box and no one at the FCC bothered to verify the actual polarization.

Quote:


MIXED POLARIZATION PAYS OFF

We felt that by adding a 20 percent vertical component to our signal we could improve our ATSC signal coverage and we were right. Our station can now deliver a Mobile DTV signal to handheld receivers farther out than any of our competitors. Mobile DTV reception inside the buildings here has also improved dramatically.

I would like to see the FCC list all vertical ERP's in additional to horizontal, considering how important this is for Mobile DTV.
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post #9116 of 10472 Old 06-22-2011, 07:02 PM
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Originally Posted by Falcon_77 View Post

I would like to see the FCC list all vertical ERP's in additional to horizontal, considering how important this is for Mobile DTV.

I'd think that listing horizontal only power would be effectively the same as listing zero vertical power. Although no antenna is perfect, KCTS, for example, at 21.7kw ERP H would have effectively zero ERP in the vertical plane.

Guess I'll need to crank up the MDTV receiver and see if it has made any real difference in KOMO's coverage.
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post #9117 of 10472 Old 06-22-2011, 07:02 PM
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I was going to do TS_Reader grabs for somebody and dropped the ball. Is there still interest?
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post #9118 of 10472 Old 06-22-2011, 07:22 PM
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I was going to do TS_Reader grabs for somebody and dropped the ball. Is there still interest?

Yes, very much so.

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post #9119 of 10472 Old 06-22-2011, 07:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tschall View Post

I'd think that listing horizontal only power would be effectively the same as listing zero vertical power. Although no antenna is perfect, KCTS, for example, at 21.7kw ERP H would have effectively zero ERP in the vertical plane.

The FCC uses horizontal power for ERP, regardless of what vertical power is. So, for example, KATV in Little Rock AR is 1000 kW H and 250 kW V. (Not sure why that one popped into my head, but it's on page 6 of this document: https://licensing.fcc.gov/cdbs/CDBS_...um=1&exhcnum=1 )

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post #9120 of 10472 Old 06-23-2011, 12:43 PM
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Interesting article from this mornings (6/23/2011) Seattle Times:

http://o.seattletimes.nwsource.com/h...tle_tv_st.html
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