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post #11461 of 12893 Old 12-15-2016, 10:08 AM
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Originally Posted by Valkster View Post
Does anyone have Sling TV? If so how do you like it? I like what Sling says but have read very poor reviews. Any thoughts?
I've had Sling for several months and I love it. It's got a great channel selection for me at a great price, and since we signed up for the Blue package during the beta testing, it's still $20 for me instead of the normal $25. I personally have very few issues with it.

I've also read a lot of complaints about it and from what I can tell, it's mostly from people using it on gaming consoles. They supposedly did an update to Xbox One last week which is supposed to fix the issues. Chromecast users complain about it too, but I will say from experience it definitely wasn't as good on there as it is on Roku, which is what I use it on now.
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post #11462 of 12893 Old 12-15-2016, 10:30 AM
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I guess it depends on how you watch TV. I personally never watch live TV and DVR everything. In my case, PS Vue is far better than Sling since I can watch any program anytime I want. At $30, it costs more, but is far more useful and has far more channels than Sling.

I'm not a fan of Chromecast either. I much prefer using a traditional remote instead of my phone.
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post #11463 of 12893 Old 12-15-2016, 07:18 PM
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Has anyone heard any recent talk about WLOS-TV possibly adding a translator for Paris Mountain to help reception in Greenville County? I live in a lower elevation area (near the Reedy River) and am skeptical about springing for an outside antenna since it might not help. I can get most of the other stations in the market (WUNF is a pretty tough get) and even get WBTV from Charlotte about 90 percent of the time by using a Leaf amplified indoor antenna.
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post #11464 of 12893 Old 12-16-2016, 05:19 AM
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Originally Posted by OldDevildog View Post
Has anyone heard any recent talk about WLOS-TV possibly adding a translator for Paris Mountain to help reception in Greenville County? I live in a lower elevation area (near the Reedy River) and am skeptical about springing for an outside antenna since it might not help. I can get most of the other stations in the market (WUNF is a pretty tough get) and even get WBTV from Charlotte about 90 percent of the time by using a Leaf amplified indoor antenna.
Don't know it this will help. WUNF and WLOS share a tower. WLOS on top of the tower,WUNF side mounted. So they should similar in terms of getting the signal. Of course WUNF is UHF while WLOS is VHF.
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post #11465 of 12893 Old 12-16-2016, 07:38 AM
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Originally Posted by OldDevildog View Post
Has anyone heard any recent talk about WLOS-TV possibly adding a translator for Paris Mountain to help reception in Greenville County? I live in a lower elevation area (near the Reedy River) and am skeptical about springing for an outside antenna since it might not help. I can get most of the other stations in the market (WUNF is a pretty tough get) and even get WBTV from Charlotte about 90 percent of the time by using a Leaf amplified indoor antenna.
I haven't heard but I sure hope so! Wlos is the only channel I can't get and at one time I was getting Wlos on channel 5.1 but that was quite a while back.
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post #11466 of 12893 Old 12-16-2016, 07:42 AM
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Originally Posted by mcy919 View Post
I've had Sling for several months and I love it. It's got a great channel selection for me at a great price, and since we signed up for the Blue package during the beta testing, it's still $20 for me instead of the normal $25. I personally have very few issues with it.

I've also read a lot of complaints about it and from what I can tell, it's mostly from people using it on gaming consoles. They supposedly did an update to Xbox One last week which is supposed to fix the issues. Chromecast users complain about it too, but I will say from experience it definitely wasn't as good on there as it is on Roku, which is what I use it on now.
Thanks I'm gonna give it a try since it's non contract. The only thing I'm concerned about is not being able to cancel or remove my credit card. That was one of the major complaints.
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post #11467 of 12893 Old 12-16-2016, 11:18 PM
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Don't know it this will help. WUNF and WLOS share a tower. WLOS on top of the tower,WUNF side mounted. So they should similar in terms of getting the signal. Of course WUNF is UHF while WLOS is VHF.
They broadcast from the same location, but that is where the similarity ends. WLOS is VHF and WUNF is UHF. And more problematic, WLOS is more subject to noise and interference on RF13, and their side mounted directional antenna is not optimized for Upstate SC. Not sure about the exact specifications for WUNF, but it is not really similar to WLOS. It was much better when WLOS was omnidirectional UHF before the final digital transition. Moving back to 13 has a bit of a null, possibly because of WBTW which is also RF13 in Forence, SC.
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post #11468 of 12893 Old 12-16-2016, 11:28 PM
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Originally Posted by OldDevildog View Post
Has anyone heard any recent talk about WLOS-TV possibly adding a translator for Paris Mountain to help reception in Greenville County? I live in a lower elevation area (near the Reedy River) and am skeptical about springing for an outside antenna since it might not help. I can get most of the other stations in the market (WUNF is a pretty tough get) and even get WBTV from Charlotte about 90 percent of the time by using a Leaf amplified indoor antenna.
At one time, WLOS had plans for a translator on Paris Mountain to better serve Upstate SC. The FCC permit may have expired or placed on hold because of the FCC repack, but have not heard any recent developments. But to upgrade from the Mohu Leaf, you may want to consider the Clearstream 2V on sale at Walmart for $79. It is a very good indoor/outdoor antenna, and it has been reported to receive 13 in the Upstate, although the single VHF dipole may still be weak in certain areas. And that amp on the Leaf antenna may be overpowering and causing problems for 13. I would try the cheap inline amp at Walmart that sales for around $14.99. It is now branded with the Onn label, but appears to be the same as the old RCA version made by Voxx Intl. with moderate gain and a decent noise figure. And with the CS2, you will probably receive reliable reception for WBTV, which is very strong and consistent at my location near Mauldin.
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post #11469 of 12893 Old 12-17-2016, 09:53 AM
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I've hesitated to say this but...back during the digital transition WLOS asked the FCC for permission to do away with all of it's translators saying they weren't needed. The FCC denied that request. So I think it's unlikely that they will add any new translators without some outside pressure to do so.


(About my earlier post on WLOS / WUNF. I was simply referring to their shared geographic location and how that was helpful in aiming an antenna.)

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post #11470 of 12893 Old 12-17-2016, 06:24 PM
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Originally Posted by rtripboy View Post
I've hesitated to say this but...back during the digital transition WLOS asked the FCC for permission to do away with all of it's translators saying they weren't needed. The FCC denied that request. So I think it's unlikely that they will add any new translators without some outside pressure to do so.
I don't think I remember ever seeing that, and the FCC can't make a station transmit if it doesn't want to, so I'm not sure how that would have worked anyway. Do you have a citation? I'd love to read it.

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post #11471 of 12893 Old 12-17-2016, 07:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Trip in VA View Post
I don't think I remember ever seeing that, and the FCC can't make a station transmit if it doesn't want to, so I'm not sure how that would have worked anyway. Do you have a citation? I'd love to read it.

- Trip
I saw it in one of the trade publications sometime in Jan/Feb 2009. I don't remember which one.

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post #11472 of 12893 Old 12-18-2016, 05:25 PM
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My understanding is that WLOS previously had a permit for a translator on Paris Mountain to serve Upstate SC. I believe it may have been RF31 or RF32. Those plans appear to have been postponed, or perhaps the permit has expired due to the FCC repack now in progress. So the future plans remain unclear. Perhaps Trip or some other authority can clarify. Or contact WLOS engineering and request a response. Sometimes such plans may be confidential until they decide to publicly announce.

But despite some issues, WLOS can be received in Greenville County. It just requires the proper VHF antenna and very strategic use of a low power amplifier, which can cause more problems due to overload from other strong signals. And in my case, an FM trap is also necessary. But just putting up an amplified Mohu Leaf antenna like some folks like to do will most likely not receive WLOS in this area. More strategic work is required. And the Clearstream 4V has worked well according to many local reports, although in some cases a better VHF antenna may be required.
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post #11473 of 12893 Old 12-24-2016, 10:10 AM
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WHNS on Charter has somehow gotten even worse than even a few weeks ago. Watching the Panthers game now, and even the text on the screen is hard to read. I can't believe WHNS let's Charter ruin Fox's picture like this.
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post #11474 of 12893 Old 12-25-2016, 01:55 AM
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WHNS on Charter has somehow gotten even worse than even a few weeks ago. Watching the Panthers game now, and even the text on the screen is hard to read. I can't believe WHNS let's Charter ruin Fox's picture like this.
Is this strictly a Charter issue rather than WHNS or DirecTV or another provider? And is WHNS the only local channel that Charter has downgraded the video quality? If I understand correctly, much of master control for WHNS is done at their Meredith station in Atlanta, so they may not be that aware of the situation with a lack of local control.

But I thought Meredith and Media General were going to merge, which could mean that either WHNS, WYCW, or WSPA would have to be sold. I don't think they could own all 3 stations. But I could be mistaken or confused here.

I often watch the Panthers on WJZY (FOX-46) because they often have an expanded pregame or post game show from Charlotte. Looks ok to me there. But when I watch the news on WHNS it still does not seem like they have upgraded to full HD resolution, as the picture is not as clear as other stations.
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post #11475 of 12893 Old 12-25-2016, 07:22 PM
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The Meredith/Media General merger didn't go through, so I wouldn't expect any changes with WSPA and WHNS. Media General has hey have since entered into an agreement with Nexstar, but the license transfers haven't cleared the FCC yet.

Regarding the WLOS translators, I suspect they are waiting on the outcome of the spectrum auction before making any translator changes. Translators are secondary services, and changes to full power stations might require them to change channel, antenna pattern, or go off if there is no available frequency at that location.
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post #11476 of 12893 Old 12-27-2016, 08:33 AM
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The Meredith/Media General merger didn't go through, so I wouldn't expect any changes with WSPA and WHNS. Media General has hey have since entered into an agreement with Nexstar, but the license transfers haven't cleared the FCC yet.

Regarding the WLOS translators, I suspect they are waiting on the outcome of the spectrum auction before making any translator changes. Translators are secondary services, and changes to full power stations might require them to change channel, antenna pattern, or go off if there is no available frequency at that location.
If the Meredith/Media General merger had gone through they were going to have divest themselves of either WHNS or WSPA. I keep wondering which one they were planning on keeping.(Not that it matters now) Either way they were going to be allowed to keep WYCW because it's audience levels were too low for it matter.

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post #11477 of 12893 Old 12-30-2016, 12:58 PM
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From Charter Facebook Page
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post #11478 of 12893 Old 12-30-2016, 05:20 PM
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Not too surprising. Now that Charter has bought Time Warner and Bright House, they are large enough to make NBC Universal's owner Comcast worry about them.
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post #11479 of 12893 Old 12-31-2016, 07:41 PM
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Not too surprising. Now that Charter has bought Time Warner and Bright House, they are large enough to make NBC Universal's owner Comcast worry about them.
That's only for the NBC O&O stations like KNBC in Los Angeles, CA for example. WYFF 4 is an NBC affiliate owned by Hearst TV and I hope I don't lose WYFF 4 on DIRECTV on New Years 2017 because of a impasse. I know Retransmission Consent and Blackouts are controversial. I almost lost WSPA 7 (CBS) and WYCW 62 (The CW) last year, same for WLOS 13 (ABC) and WMYA 40 (MNT) a few weeks ago.

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post #11480 of 12893 Old 01-01-2017, 04:44 AM
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I've never experienced a local channel blackout on DIRECTV because of greed before. I just lost WYFF 4, what am I going to do without NBC and my local news?

We do live in a moderate to bad over the air TV reception area. Despite getting three out-of-market adjacent stations over the air from Augusta, Charlotte, and Columbia. The TV Transmitters in the Greenville, SC/Asheville, NC market is unusually 70-98 miles from where I live. Unfortunately we can't get a single Big 4 network OTA with indoor rabbit ears in my area unless getting long range antennas. WYFF-TV's transmitters in Caesars Head is about 73 miles from where I live. I'm very disappointed at Hearst TV blacking out my favorite station I grew watching over the years since I was a toddler when they had the Arrow 4 logo from 1974-1991 (It was WFBC-TV prior to March 1983), when Carl Clark, Kenn Sparks, and the late Charlie Gertz were on Your Friend Four. The Viewers Comes First, Not Greed! SMH!

Watching WYFF News 4 online is NOT THE SAME as watching it on TV. I was upset and angry that I loss my NBC station on DIRECTV because of outdated silly rules from 25 years ago that caused blackouts today. I do have issues with Retransmission Consent blackouts and the National Association of Broadcasters (NAB). I'm a very concerned viewer, and I do follow news of Retransmission Impasses and Blackouts since 2010. What am I going to do without WYFF 4? What am I going to do without my favorite network NBC? What am I going to do without Geoff Hart, Allyson Powell, Dale Gilbert, and Brennan McDavid in the mornings? What am I going to do without Nigel and Gabby at 5pm? What am I going to do without Michael Cogdill and Carol Goldsmith at 6 and 11pm? What am I going to do without Myra and Pamela on Weekend Mornings? What am I going to do without Patrick on Saturdays and Mike on Sundays? The NAB's We Are Broadcasters is a Joke! Retransmission Consent is not Common Sense. I've already sent my letters to my elected officials in Washington, DC and posted on the FCC's Facebook Page about this situation.

I bet Norvin Duncan, Monty DuPuy, Stowe Hoyle aka Mr. Doohickey, Jim Phillips, Charlie Gertz, Marv Starks, and Keisha Kirkland are rolling from their graves if they heard what Hearst TV did to DIRECTV....They wouldn't like it either.

One of my best friends (also a ex-YouTuber) has issues with Laura Thomas of rival WSPA-TV 7 (CBS), also unfortunately WLOS 13 (ABC) doesn't do much South Carolina news. Have no choice I 'll might watch 7, 13, or WHNS 21 aka FOX Carolina for local news until Hearst TV and DIRECTV resolved their beef and restore my local NBC station. I don't like blackouts and consumers treated as pawns.

I do have a YouTube page. Please search my name as well. I hope if they willing, I hope Hearst TV and DIRECTV come to an agreement ASAP. I don't like dire warnings and bearers of bad news telling me it will be a long time. I just want my WYFF 4 and NBC back unless I get my new outdoor antennas installed as my last resort.

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post #11481 of 12893 Old 01-01-2017, 05:23 AM
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What am I going to do without WYFF 4? What am I going to do without my favorite network NBC?
Unless you're the only person on Earth who has a rare illness whereby you will quickly die without access to certain television programming, you will either:

1) Get an outdoor antenna and never have to worry about it again.

2) Watch the news online, from one of the other half-dozen news stations you receive, or read the news in a newspaper or on a news website.

3) Watch non-news programming on other stations or on DVD/Blu-Ray/online.

4) Turn the TV off and read a book/do an outdoor activity/etc.

Ending the ability for stations to collect money via retransmission consent, as you seem to imply is your preferred solution, will rapidly bring network TV to an end. The networks will flee the local stations in favor of owned and operated cable networks that can collect such fees, and without that programming, many of the local stations will go out of business.

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post #11482 of 12893 Old 01-01-2017, 06:41 AM
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Unless you're the only person on Earth who has a rare illness whereby you will quickly die without access to certain television programming, you will either:

1) Get an outdoor antenna and never have to worry about it again.

2) Watch the news online, from one of the other half-dozen news stations you receive, or read the news in a newspaper or on a news website.

3) Watch non-news programming on other stations or on DVD/Blu-Ray/online.

4) Turn the TV off and read a book/do an outdoor activity/etc.

Ending the ability for stations to collect money via retransmission consent, as you seem to imply is your preferred solution, will rapidly bring network TV to an end. The networks will flee the local stations in favor of owned and operated cable networks that can collect such fees, and without that programming, many of the local stations will go out of business.

- Trip
Trip In VA,

Whose side are you on? The innocent viewers treated as pawns and tired of broadcaster blackouts or the greedy broadcasters and the NAB? I do have issues with the NAB and the controversial Retransmission Consent blackouts. I do care and concerned. Retransmission Consent is not common sense. I hate blackouts and greed with a passion. Sorry, I hate to say this, I hate the National Association of Broadcasters (NAB) with a passion, they don't want silly laws be eliminated like Exclusivity Rules and previously mentioned Retransmission Consent.

Retransmission Consent is a cancer to Cable TV and Satellite and I hope the FCC and lawmakers in Washington, DC come to their senses and find a cure to this cancer known as Retransmission Consent by reforming the 1992 Cable Act (25 years old) or abolishing it. Speaking of autism, I do have feelings.

Fortunately I have outdoor antennas too. And I did get a book for Christmas titled Turnbull & Asser 130 Year History. I love fashion too, but that's another story!

Still, NAB's We Are Broadcasters is a JOKE! Not all over the air TV signals are equal. People in rural, mountain, and hilly areas are forced to subscribe to Pay-TV to get their local channels and local news, is this fair? No!


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post #11483 of 12893 Old 01-01-2017, 07:37 AM
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Whose side are you on? The innocent viewers treated as pawns and tired of broadcaster blackouts or the greedy broadcasters and the NAB? I do have issues with the NAB and the controversial Retransmission Consent blackouts. I do care and concerned. Retransmission Consent is not common sense. I hate blackouts and greed with a passion. Sorry, I hate to say this, I hate the National Association of Broadcasters (NAB) with a passion, they don't want silly laws be eliminated like Exclusivity Rules and previously mentioned Retransmission Consent.

Retransmission Consent is a cancer to Cable TV and Satellite and I hope the FCC and lawmakers in Washington, DC come to their senses and find a cure to this cancer known as Retransmission Consent by reforming the 1992 Cable Act (25 years old) or abolishing it.
If you haven't noticed, blackouts impact cable networks too. If retransmission consent is eliminated, all of the desirable programming will move to cable. The OTA networks will probably shut down, leaving local stations in the lurch. Those stations, having nothing to fill many hours of the day and draw viewers to their stations, will go out of business. Local OTA will be dead.

ESPN gets $6 per cable subscriber per month, whether they actually watch ESPN or it just happens to be included in the tier they subscribe to, and assuming 100 million subscribers, that is $600 million per month or $7.2 billion per year. That's a lot of money they get to throw at programming rights to sports events. How, exactly, is OTA supposed to make up the difference and pay for rights to sports programming if it cannot similarly charge cable subscribers?

I mention sports because it's the biggest dollar amount, but other programming is the same way. TNT charges more than $1 per cable subscriber per month, but lets round down to $1. That's $1.2 billion per year they can put into programming that broadcasters, in your world, do not have. When a producer wants to make a show, do you think he'll go to the company which can make a large down payment due to subscription fees, or one that can't?

If OTA-only households were 50% of the market, then the extra reach of the ads on the OTA networks would outweigh the lack of rights fees in many instances. When OTA-only households are 10%? Companies are willing to write them off. Someone who is willing to pay $50+ per month for TV is more likely to spend money on an advertised service than someone who gets their TV for free. GetTV, for instance, pays its affiliates based on number of cable households reached. Meaning that if you watch over the air, you don't make WYCW one single penny no matter how many 1-800 numbers you call from the ads. If an affiliate of GetTV reaches no cable households, GetTV doesn't pay them a cent.

Eliminating the Cable Act would mean that must-carry goes away (good-bye, WGGS!) and all carriage is handled through negotiations--you'll be in worse shape than you're in now because the must-carry stations will go away while the retrans stations will continue negotiating for retrans. Eliminating exclusivity means that the cable companies will stop carrying your local stations like WYFF in favor of paying a station in Montana for NBC nationwide and letting WYFF go out of business due to no viewers on cable--at least until NBC shortly thereafter ends its OTA network entirely and creates "NBC Cable" which carries all of the former NBC OTA programming. And WYFF is still out of business.

It's easy to jump up and down about blackouts and the "big mean broadcasters" against the "poor innocent cable companies" and ask whose side people are on, but the problem is not easy to solve without damaging or destroying OTA TV in the process. You can only deal with the world as it is, not the world as you wish it to be.

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Speaking of autism, I do have feelings.
Who was speaking of autism? I certainly never mentioned it.

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Fortunately I have outdoor antennas too.
Then you will be able to continue watching WYFF and your entire argument is moot.

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Originally Posted by SpencerKarter85 View Post
Still, NAB's We Are Broadcasters is a JOKE! Not all over the air TV signals are equal. People in rural, mountain, and hilly areas are forced to subscribe to Pay-TV to get their local channels and local news, is this fair? No!

As has always been the case. There is no requirement to provide every viewer with a free signal. Community Access TV, the predecessor of cable TV, came about because the handful of people in those cases stuck an antenna on the mountain and ran wires down to the homes in the valley. You expect the TV broadcasters to spend thousands of dollars per valley on equipment to make sure every last person in the mountains gets a free TV signal that they may not even use? Then expect the TV stations in mountainous areas to go off the air entirely rather than expend millions of dollars to make that happen.

- Trip

N4MJC

Comments are my own and not that of the FCC (my employer) or anyone else.

RabbitEars

"Ignorance and prejudice and fear walk hand in hand..." - Rush "Witch Hunt"


Last edited by Trip in VA; 01-01-2017 at 07:42 AM.
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post #11484 of 12893 Old 01-01-2017, 12:08 PM
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Usually these retransmission disputes are temporary and some last minute agreement is reached. I would guess WYFF-4 and other Hearst stations should soon reappear on DirecTV. As is often the case when these disputes are usually resolved.

But I do agree it can be very frustrating and it does seem as if corporate greed indeed comes into play here. I remember back when the cable systems carried most of the local channels, as well as some of the neighboring markets. Less of a concern for market boundaries. Revenues were based on advertising for the local stations, and the cable companies charged a fee to subscribers, as well as advertising. Now it is all more and more about money and exclusive rights. But despite the current business model, I do strongly support OTA broadcasting and reception.
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post #11485 of 12893 Old 01-01-2017, 12:23 PM
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And although you are in a fringe area SpencerKarter, I would still think you should get WYFF-4 with a good UHF antenna and preamp. Consider a 91XG or a DB8e. And a Juice preamp. And a separate High VHF antenna from MCM. Or Winegard 7698 combo antenna.

And you should be able to get NBC on WIS-10 from Columbia. Or perhaps the Augusta affiliate. And perhaps consider a Roku box or streaming option for News 4. I watch WSOC Channel 9 Eyewitness on the Roku and it looks great.
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post #11486 of 12893 Old 01-01-2017, 01:21 PM
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Since notice says NBC Universal, I would assume it only applies to the cable channels owned by NBC Universal.
Not the local NBC affiliate which as been noticed is owned by Hearst.
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post #11487 of 12893 Old 01-02-2017, 01:36 AM
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Originally Posted by rtripboy View Post
Since notice says NBC Universal, I would assume it only applies to the cable channels owned by NBC Universal.
Not the local NBC affiliate which as been noticed is owned by Hearst.
Yes those are 2 separate issues.
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post #11488 of 12893 Old 01-02-2017, 04:07 AM
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Speaking of NBC, great this morning to see Katie Couric back on Today Show with Matt Lauer. Just like old times filling in for Savannah Guthrie on maternity leave. Always thought Katie was best on morning TV rather than evening news. Wish they would keep her on there.
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post #11489 of 12893 Old 01-02-2017, 07:49 PM
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I have a very weird situation here in Spruce Pine in which my WYFF NBC that I receive ota from a translator here in the area has been showing a screen saying the owner has removed this channel from the directv lineup despite our repeated requests to keep it available to you. It's not a big deal as I still receive wyff through my cable provider as well as nbc Charlotte and Bristol TN via antenna, just a really weird message to see popping up as you're flipping through antenna channels and see the big directv logo and message. Anybody else seeing this on other wyff translators or the main transmitter or is it just here, this translator seems to always have something going on with it, some days no sound, some days no picture or a buzzing sound, we also don't get subchannels with the main station like we do with the wspa translator at the same tower site.
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post #11490 of 12893 Old 01-03-2017, 04:23 AM
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Originally Posted by wncbraves View Post
I have a very weird situation here in Spruce Pine in which my WYFF NBC that I receive ota from a translator here in the area has been showing a screen saying the owner has removed this channel from the directv lineup despite our repeated requests to keep it available to you. It's not a big deal as I still receive wyff through my cable provider as well as nbc Charlotte and Bristol TN via antenna, just a really weird message to see popping up as you're flipping through antenna channels and see the big directv logo and message. Anybody else seeing this on other wyff translators or the main transmitter or is it just here, this translator seems to always have something going on with it, some days no sound, some days no picture or a buzzing sound, we also don't get subchannels with the main station like we do with the wspa translator at the same tower site.
I agree this is strange, but my only thought would be that WYFF is feeding the Spruce Pine translator with DirectTV instead of an OTA signal from the main WYFF transmitter in the SC mountains northwest of Greenville. This scenario would also explain the absence of sub-channels, as satellite does not offer these. Furthermore - unless WYFF has special permission from the FCC - I would think using satellite to feed a translator is illegal, though I could be wrong. By technical definition, a translator simply relays an OTA signal onto a different channel though that definition may have changed since the analog days. I will have to consult my friendly neighborhood engineer :-)

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