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post #8971 of 9431 Old 12-04-2018, 06:23 AM
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Could be a couple things. Most likely is a more sensitive tuner in the new TV. Could also be you didn't have your connection "complete" on your old set or your cable is old and reorienting it changed something.

Again, most likely is more sensitive tuner in new TV. My experience has been opposite that tuners are getting worse over time but that's a VERY SMALL SAMPLE and anecdotal only!

PS - if you haven't used your tuner in the old set for awhile it could also be the different weather and no leaves!!! I'm up in FloMo too and winter is the best reception season

PPS - I get all stations very well with an antenna in the attic.

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So why would my OTA reception in flower mound improve when the only thing that changed is moving from my g15 2009 Panasonic plasma to an lg oled 65” c8? I could always get a decent reception on cbs and fox but not on nbc or abc. Much better now. Thoughts?
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post #8972 of 9431 Old 12-05-2018, 07:01 PM
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Quote:
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Could be a couple things. Most likely is a more sensitive tuner in the new TV.

PPS - I get all stations very well with an antenna in the attic.
Hello flower mounded! I think you hit the nail on the head there. Must be better tuner. Just surprised at the difference. What tuner do you use in the attic? I would love to get all channels well and then set up a dvr as well.

I’m close to the Northshore fire station, if you know where that is.
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post #8973 of 9431 Old 12-05-2018, 08:02 PM
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The ATSC 3.0 SFN that was supposed to light up a while ago was stalled by the Sinclair/Tribune merger falling apart. KDAF was intended to be the host station for the 1.0 signals.


Explained at 6:30 in the video:
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post #8974 of 9431 Old 12-05-2018, 09:26 PM
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I've got a Winegard HD7697P which is an old school outdoor antenna and because of the long run to the distribution amplifiers I've also got a CM7777 pre-amp.

Do you currently have an antenna? If so, what kind and where? I have a neighbor who thought he needed a new antenna but after we cleaned up some of his cables and removed some passive splitters we got a good solid signal with just a 4 port distribution amp.

IF you decide you need to upgrade I'd start with the antenna, if that's not enough add a pre-amp, and if need be add a disti-amp. WARNING, over amplification is just as bad as a weak signal.

Use antennaweb.org and then pick "one size larger" to hep compensate for the attic. JHBradt is very knowledgeable (moreso than I) so check out the panel he suggested as well. Takes up a LOT less room.
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Hello flower mounded! I think you hit the nail on the head there. Must be better tuner. Just surprised at the difference. What tuner do you use in the attic? I would love to get all channels well and then set up a dvr as well.

I’m close to the Northshore fire station, if you know where that is.
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post #8975 of 9431 Old 12-06-2018, 01:19 PM
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Quote:
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The ATSC 3.0 SFN that was supposed to light up a while ago was stalled by the Sinclair/Tribune merger falling apart. KDAF was intended to be the host station for the 1.0 signals.
Well, that's fine by me. IIRC their original plan was to start ATSC 3.0 broadcasts last September, but ATSC 3.0 tuners weren't (and I guess still aren't) expected to be ready until at least next November. I don't think we would have enjoyed having channels 33 and 47 crammed onto a single ATSC 1.0 carrier for a year, with zero options to receive the higher-PQ versions on the ATSC 3.0 carrier while they "tested" for a year.

I'm still puzzled a bit, though; IIRC the original plan also involved Univision (channel 23), Unimas (channel 49), and a "mystery" broadcaster whose identity was never disclosed. Could those three stations now go ahead on their own? 3:2 sounds like a much better ratio than 2:1 to me.

Also, Dish Network was going to participate in the SFN; apparently they have a license to use RF 55 that they picked up in the analog/digital transition, and were planning to use it for some sort of ATSC 3.0 broadcast (I'm guessing perhaps subscription TV, a la the defunct Airbox service). So I wonder if the whole thing is off, or if at some point Univision & Dish are going to go ahead without Sinclair & Tribune?
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post #8976 of 9431 Old 12-06-2018, 11:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rakstr View Post
I've got a Winegard HD7697P which is an old school outdoor antenna and because of the long run to the distribution amplifiers I've also got a CM7777 pre-amp.

Do you currently have an antenna? If so, what kind and where?
Rakstr - not ignoring...been reading. Was trying to find the forum that describes how to use antennaweb.org and how to post full information here in this forum about my results. Can you point me to that so I can come back with some real information?
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post #8977 of 9431 Old 12-07-2018, 07:40 AM
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Just go to the website https://antennaweb.org/

You enter your address and it's pretty much self explanatory from there. If you have any specific questions just ask.

The website will show you a color code for each station based on the address and height that you entered which can be decoded here.
https://support.channelmaster.com/hc...enna-Selection

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Rakstr - not ignoring...been reading. Was trying to find the forum that describes how to use antennaweb.org and how to post full information here in this forum about my results. Can you point me to that so I can come back with some real information?
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post #8978 of 9431 Old 12-07-2018, 08:58 AM
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Originally Posted by internet seeker View Post
Rakstr - not ignoring...been reading. Was trying to find the forum that describes how to use antennaweb.org and how to post full information here in this forum about my results. Can you point me to that so I can come back with some real information?
In addition to antennaweb, also try https://www.tvfool.com/index.php?opt...pper&Itemid=29. Idea is very similar: enter your address (and antenna height, if known) and it gives you a chart & report showing your local stations.

TVFool.com can also map your location at https://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=90.

You can post the results from the first link here without revealing your address. TVFool.com gives your chart & report a hex key so the link can pull them again without knowing the address. (That won't really work for the second link, of course, since it's a map of your location....)

Both sites have a few database errors. TVFool in particular is missing a few stations that got "lost" due to the upcoming spectrum repacking. Hopefully they will reappear soon.
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post #8979 of 9431 Old 12-07-2018, 09:34 AM
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Thanks, I meant to include tvfool but got distracted.

FYI to all - that reception map I put in my post is a generic zipcode map.

PS - I have found antennaweb to better account for terrain and obstructions but I have no "scientific proof" of that

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In addition to antennaweb, also try https://www.tvfool.com/index.php?opt...pper&Itemid=29. Idea is very similar: enter your address (and antenna height, if known) and it gives you a chart & report showing your local stations.

TVFool.com can also map your location at https://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=90.

You can post the results from the first link here without revealing your address. TVFool.com gives your chart & report a hex key so the link can pull them again without knowing the address. (That won't really work for the second link, of course, since it's a map of your location....)

Both sites have a few database errors. TVFool in particular is missing a few stations that got "lost" due to the upcoming spectrum repacking. Hopefully they will reappear soon.
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post #8980 of 9431 Old 12-07-2018, 10:08 AM
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The most accurate site for me seems to be https://www.rabbitears.info/search.php but at the moment you can only do zip code searches. Entering any address just pops up a "not found" message. I sent Trip an email about it....
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post #8981 of 9431 Old 12-07-2018, 08:30 PM
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JHBrandt and rakstr. Below is my tvfool url. I've got a 12.5" x 11.5" RCA leaf antenna (don't know the model / doesn't say on the product), connect to my LG OLED C8. The antenna has a 6 foot cable to the tv and is about 6 feet up, taped to a nearby window that faces a house very close to the northeast. I typically get CBS / FOX / PBS decently, but not ABC and NBC.

I do have coax throughout the house, and they all seem to terminate behind the TV (not sure but large box in the drywall with lots of coax). When I had satellite TV in the past, they would put it on the roof near where I have my TV/antenna now. That could be an option. Attic is a run of 60 ft and not easy to get cable to tv area, though I want to run cat6 there too, so may attempt.

http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wr...903823f3a0d37a

Let me know what your trained eyes see. Thank you.
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post #8982 of 9431 Old 12-08-2018, 01:28 AM
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You can reuse that cable they used for satellite TV. Basically you've got to determine the best place where you can put an antenna and point it in the direction given you in your report (165ish magnetic). You must be more east in FloMo towards Lewisville based on your directional orientation. I'm going to guess your east of 2499 (see my lake comment below).

PS - looks like ABC and NBC are both at 166ish magnetic on your report. I'll also note that ABC is VHF so you need to ensure your antenna is both VHF/UHF.

PPS - I'll note that even for my address, TvFool is much more optimistic than Antennaweb Run them both for your location. Where TvFool shows green, antennaweb shows yellow for the antenna type. I can tell you that at my address a TV top antenna may get many of the stations up here on an ideal day, it doesn't get me much outside of ideal conditions That's why I have one in the attic but YMMV. I shoot directly over the center of Lake Grapevine.

Look for the Model of your antenna as perhaps letters on a smooth spot somewhere on the injection molded case. It should be somewhere on the antenna. Can't say much about it without a make/model.

JHBrandt may have more help.
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JHBrandt and rakstr. Below is my tvfool url. I've got a 12.5" x 11.5" RCA leaf antenna (don't know the model / doesn't say on the product), connect to my LG OLED C8. The antenna has a 6 foot cable to the tv and is about 6 feet up, taped to a nearby window that faces a house very close to the northeast. I typically get CBS / FOX / PBS decently, but not ABC and NBC.

I do have coax throughout the house, and they all seem to terminate behind the TV (not sure but large box in the drywall with lots of coax). When I had satellite TV in the past, they would put it on the roof near where I have my TV/antenna now. That could be an option. Attic is a run of 60 ft and not easy to get cable to tv area, though I want to run cat6 there too, so may attempt.

http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wr...903823f3a0d37a

Let me know what your trained eyes see. Thank you.
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post #8983 of 9431 Old 12-08-2018, 02:37 PM
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I've got a 12.5" x 11.5" RCA leaf antenna (don't know the model / doesn't say on the product), connect to my LG OLED C8. The antenna has a 6 foot cable to the tv and is about 6 feet up, taped to a nearby window that faces a house very close to the northeast. I typically get CBS / FOX / PBS decently, but not ABC and NBC.

http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wr...903823f3a0d37a

Let me know what your trained eyes see. Thank you.
You're about the same distance from the towers as me, but you have a higher elevation, so an indoor antenna may be good enough. But a small outdoor antenna would be even better. You could put one either on the roof or in the attic (as long as your attic doesn't have a "radiant barrier" - those block radio/TV signals).

The problem with ABC is easier to explain. It's the only major network on a VHF channel, and those leaf antennas don't do well with VHF. You might be able to pick up the ABC station with rabbit ears (you'd use a UHF/VHF combiner with the rabbit ears hooked to the VHF input and the leaf antenna hooked to the UHF input). For an attic or rooftop antenna, a Channel Master 4228HD, or a ClearStream 2MAX with the optional VHF dipole, should pick it up.

NBC is a little tougher. KXAS is on RF 24 now (even though they're "channel 5"). TVFool shows them on RF 41 but that's out-of-date; they moved to RF 24 last summer. Anyway, they're a UHF station that your leaf antenna should pick up as well as CBS, Fox, and PBS. There may be a problem with multi-path interference though; that's common with indoor antennas. You said the antenna is on a window that faces northeast? You might have better luck if it could face south/southeast where the signals are coming from; that way the direct signal would be stronger than any reflections. If you set up an attic or rooftop antenna it should face south/southeast as well.
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post #8984 of 9431 Old 12-08-2018, 08:33 PM
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Thank you both. Might take me a little but you've given me enough info. to make this work. The explanations help make sense as to which channels I can get and which don't come in well. Tonight, ABC won't come in at all, but NBC is great.

Rakstr - I am further east of you, but west of 2499. Just west of the Neighborhood Walmart.

JHBrandt - Not sure I could get away with rabbit ears in the living room aesthetically, but I'll take a look at the attic/rooftop antenna. i was wrong about the direction: right now it is on a window facing NW; my only other option is NE. If I put it on roof where the satellite used to be, I could face it south, southwest, but it would need to go through the roof.
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post #8985 of 9431 Old 12-08-2018, 09:51 PM
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I wouldn't put it outside unless it's specifically made for outdoor use. Were you able to find any model number on the antenna?

Did you look in the attic for a place to mount the antenna to point 165 degrees magnetic? Many times the cables from the satellite dish enter the attic from under the eaves. If you can get into the attic at that entry point you'll often find barrel connectors to the coax where you can unscrew the coax and then use it for your antenna.
Other methods would be cutting the coax and adding new "ENDS" but that's a more advanced piece of surgery. Not difficult but requires some tools and know how!!!

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Thank you both. Might take me a little but you've given me enough info. to make this work. The explanations help make sense as to which channels I can get and which don't come in well. Tonight, ABC won't come in at all, but NBC is great.

Rakstr - I am further east of you, but west of 2499. Just west of the Neighborhood Walmart.

JHBrandt - Not sure I could get away with rabbit ears in the living room aesthetically, but I'll take a look at the attic/rooftop antenna. i was wrong about the direction: right now it is on a window facing NW; my only other option is NE. If I put it on roof where the satellite used to be, I could face it south, southwest, but it would need to go through the roof.
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post #8986 of 9431 Old 12-10-2018, 12:45 PM
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A new diginet, Court TV, is coming to KDAF in May 2019. It will probably replace Charge on 33-4.


https://www.broadcastingcable.com/ne...aunch-court-tv
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post #8987 of 9431 Old 12-10-2018, 12:54 PM
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Makes sense because Charge! is also on 47-3. No need for it to be broadcast twice.

Court TV used to be a cable channel. (They morphed into TruTV about 10 years ago.) Be interesting to see how it does in the OTA market.
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post #8988 of 9431 Old 12-10-2018, 01:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by internet seeker View Post
Not sure I could get away with rabbit ears in the living room aesthetically, but I'll take a look at the attic/rooftop antenna. i was wrong about the direction: right now it is on a window facing NW; my only other option is NE. If I put it on roof where the satellite used to be, I could face it south, southwest, but it would need to go through the roof.
I understand. Rabbit ears aren't pretty. An antenna in the attic sounds like your best bet; that way the signals would only have to penetrate the roof once instead of twice.

Since an attic is shielded from wind and rain, you could try putting your leaf antenna and rabbit ears up there. They may not work but it's cheap enough to try. If they don't work well enough, you can always go with one of the outdoor antennas instead.
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post #8989 of 9431 Old 12-10-2018, 03:01 PM
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Red face back w/ pictures

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I understand. Rabbit ears aren't pretty. An antenna in the attic sounds like your best bet; that way the signals would only have to penetrate the roof once instead of twice. Since an attic is shielded from wind and rain, you could try putting your leaf antenna and rabbit ears up there. They may not work but it's cheap enough to try. If they don't work well enough, you can always go with one of the outdoor antennas instead.
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I wouldn't put it outside unless it's specifically made for outdoor use. Were you able to find any model number on the antenna? Did you look in the attic for a place to mount the antenna to point 165 degrees magnetic? Many times the cables from the satellite dish enter the attic from under the eaves. If you can get into the attic at that entry point you'll often find barrel connectors to the coax where you can unscrew the coax and then use it for your antenna. Other methods would be cutting the coax and adding new "ENDS" but that's a more advanced piece of surgery. Not difficult but requires some tools and know how!!!

Yes, I double checked the leaf antenna. Nothing except RCA. 100%. I think that I've found that I have coax running from my TV area to my attic (and then, a connection - not split - down to my utility room; guessing at one point that was for cable) Then there is coax coming from just outside the house where the TV is at, through the brick wall to the TV area (what I call the "box near the tv" in my pictures). So, it looks possible (once I figure out which connection is hot in the "box near the tv") to stick the leaf antenna in the attic (or buy some rabbits to test). The run from the attic is probably 75 feet so probably need something to amplify the signal down the coax.

Do you think the coax all over my house (they even built it in to the master bath near the commode, along with CAT3) terminate at the box by the TV?

Some pictures. they are numbered 1-8, from TV, to outside by TV, to attic. and a cool something I found in the attic for #8 . Thanks for looking at this with me.
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post #8990 of 9431 Old 12-10-2018, 06:43 PM
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In picture 6 in the attic, is that white line on the right a COAX and if so, does it go to the TV?

And your other question, I'll bet you can get all the runs in all the rooms connected but you'll need to solve the puzzle of where they all go so you can connect things properly. It can by done with patience and a multi-meter or purchase a wire tracer. I have this Greenlee but there are less expensive alternatives.

https://www.amazon.com/Greenlee-701K...ee+wire+tracer
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post #8991 of 9431 Old 12-16-2018, 12:42 PM
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Dropping like flies

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At 4:40 PM today, KFWD/52 and low-power KBOP/20 both went off the air at the same time.

KHPK/28 is still off the air since they died back on 11/1.

KNAV/22 has been off the air even longer, but at least they have an excuse (upgrading to digital and expanding their coverage).

Both KFWD/52 and KBOP/20 came back on shortly after 8 PM today. I guess there was a power outage that somehow affected both transmitters.
Due to an overly-aggressive LTE filter, I don't normally get this station, but I just noticed that KHFD/51 has been off the air since 12/12. After all the trouble they've had, are they finally ready to move to RF 13? (I don't see any new FCC filings, but they don't need one; their CP is good until 2021.) Seems like at this point, it'd be better to wait until spring for better weather, but I guess if they did, they'd be getting pretty close to the pre-repacking construction rush we're likely to see.

Edit: And [12/18] at noon, KXDA/41 went off the air too.

Edit 2: Back on as of 12/19 at noon. Was off the air almost exactly 24 hours.

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post #8992 of 9431 Old 12-19-2018, 04:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rakstr View Post
In picture 6 in the attic, is that white line on the right a COAX and if so, does it go to the TV?

And your other question, I'll bet you can get all the runs in all the rooms connected but you'll need to solve the puzzle of where they all go so you can connect things properly. It can by done with patience and a multi-meter or purchase a wire tracer. I have this Greenlee but there are less expensive alternatives.

https://www.amazon.com/Greenlee-701K...ee+wire+tracer
No, the white is power.

I finally had time to check out my theories and I was able to connect the leaf antenna in the attic and get a signal on the TV...very cool. The coax in the attic runs all the way to the box behind the tv. However, the only channels that came in were NBC and PBS - strange. No other channels showed anything at all. I tried a few different positions in the attic with the leaf antenna. Guessing it is time to move on to trying a stronger antenna. With the amount that I am from the farms, is it worth trying the rabbit ears or just go for one of the better ones?
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post #8993 of 9431 Old 12-19-2018, 06:03 PM
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Rabbit ears might be worth experimenting with, but since you'll be getting a bigger antenna anyway, might as well get one that does VHF out of the box. The CM-4228HD is one possibility. If you get the 2MAX you can get a VHF dipole (essentially "rabbit ears" for this specific antenna) as an accessory. Either of those antennas should pick up ABC.

From your photos, it looks like you don't have a radiant barrier in your attic. For TV, this is good! A radiant barrier would block TV signals and you'd have to go up on the roof. Since you don't have one, the attic should work OK.
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post #8994 of 9431 Old 12-20-2018, 09:46 PM
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I’ll check out those models. Why do you think i could get fox and cbs really well with the antenna downstairs but now only get nbc and pbs with it in attic? Was expecting better reception from the attic.

Will i need an amplifier. Run is about 60-75 ft

I don’t see any optional vhf stuff with this.
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B074CQ5LCJ..._U6hhCbPX27ZX0

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post #8995 of 9431 Old 12-21-2018, 02:53 AM
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Are you pointing your antenna in the right direction? From memory your report says you should point it at about 165 degrees magnetic.
Don't necessarily trust a compass app on your cell phone. Find your trusty Boy Scout compass. Also, if there are taller structures or trees in your line of sight (straight line between your antenna and the broadcast antennas) then you may be having reflection/signal issues. Start by first ensuring it's pointed as noted above and go from there.

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I’ll check out those models. Why do you think i could get fox and cbs really well with the antenna downstairs but now only get nbc and pbs with it in attic? Was expecting better reception from the attic.

Will i need an amplifier. Run is about 60-75 ft

I don’t see any optional vhf stuff with this.
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B074CQ5LCJ..._U6hhCbPX27ZX0
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post #8996 of 9431 Old 12-21-2018, 01:01 PM
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Why do you think i could get fox and cbs really well with the antenna downstairs but now only get nbc and pbs with it in attic? Was expecting better reception from the attic.
You'll probably have to hunt for a "hot spot." Make sure to keep the broad side of the antenna roughly SSE (the CM-4228 is the only antenna that's somewhat fussy about aiming; the others don't need to be exact) and move around until you find a spot with good reception. If you have or can borrow a portable TV, it will help speed up the trial-and-error process.
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Will i need an amplifier. Run is about 60-75 ft
That's long enough that you may need an amp. Look for one with a low noise figure. Your amp won't need much gain. I'd estimate 15 dB gain should be plenty. A Winegard "Boost" (model LNA-100) should be more than enough.
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I don’t see any optional vhf stuff with this.
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B074CQ5LCJ..._U6hhCbPX27ZX0
The picture shows the VHF dipole attached. I thought it had to be bought separately, but I guess it comes with one and you just have to attach it if you need it. Looks like it's just screwed onto the back with two screws.

There is an optional reflector you can get too; don't know if you need that or not. (The older 2V came with it but the newer 2MAX doesn't.) I'd probably try to do without it. I think you can get a reflector directly from ClearStream if the antenna doesn't quite perform up to snuff. It will add a few dB of sensitivity, at the cost of blocking signals from behind the antenna.
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post #8997 of 9431 Old 12-21-2018, 06:45 PM
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Well, I didn't expect this

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KHPK/28 is still off the air since they died back on 11/1.

KNAV/22 has been off the air even longer, but at least they have an excuse (upgrading to digital and expanding their coverage).
It looks like KNAV/22 is back on the air - and it's still in analog! Airing Jewelry TV.

Hope their still on schedule to switch to digital. In the meantime, let it snow....
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post #8998 of 9431 Old 12-22-2018, 06:48 AM
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DTVPal tuner added 38.1 through .4 overnight. No return of "Retro" though.
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post #8999 of 9431 Old 12-22-2018, 11:47 AM
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Yes. From live bandscans it looks like the RF 38 carrier reappeared yesterday, just before 3 PM.

I found the return of channel 38 even more shocking than the return of 22 to analog broadcasting. To be fair, though, KVFW was running out of time on their silent STA, and the post-transition channel they want (RF 7) is tied up in a dispute with K25FW and K31GL. So they may have had to turn 38 back on to keep their license.

Signal quality sucks at my home. I can barely lock it. Video is all but unwatchable. Audio is better but not by much. They really need to move to RF 7 and/or share a carrier with someone. That said:

  • 38.2 - 38.4 are just black screens AFAICS. But even the black screen pixelates, with random white rectangular macroblocks appearing randomly (I guess it's the digital equivalent of snow).
  • 38.1 is airing a religious channel. Edit: Signal is a bit better now. It looks like 38.1 is repeatedly airing a locally-produced religious show entitled "Today with God." I think I've seen that show on TBN too.
I guess they had to put some programming on.

Last edited by JHBrandt; 12-22-2018 at 06:29 PM.
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post #9000 of 9431 Old 12-26-2018, 02:52 PM
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Noticed starting about an hour ago KXAS 5 (and KXTX 39 too) seem to be having transmission difficulties with the rain. Roof leak?
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