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post #9631 of 9665 Old 11-19-2019, 11:59 AM
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Originally Posted by rakstr View Post
I just did a scan on my TV and saw ThisTV show up (21.3) but by the time I finished marking stations to not show it was gone.

Am I seeing things through wishful thinking or is it "blinking in and out"?
Maybe This TV is in pulsar mode...

I just scanned RF 18 again and got squat.

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Originally Posted by JHBrandt View Post
Yeah that would be for experimental purposes only. And if you have to get up on the roof it's probably not worth the trouble.
Your comment made me think back to when I was a kid. I remember helping my dad set up the awesome device known as an antenna rotor, which added up to three additional channels to our spectacular lineup of about...7. If there were channels I could receive that weren't duplicates of local channels I would probably install an antenna rotor on my setup. In theory, I might be able to pick up channels from Mineral Wells, Stephenville, Waco and maybe even up north to the state line. I guess one of the "drawbacks" of being in the #5 market is that we are going to get pretty much every OTA network that is offered. Every network but Classic Arts Showcase, which is still a burr in my butt that it isn't broadcast here. You'd think at least one of the stations that has a blank channel would air it, considering that it's free for the transmitting.
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post #9632 of 9665 Old 11-19-2019, 12:19 PM
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BTW, my scan netted 84 channels today when I saw the pulsar

Thought I'd try my Hauppauge Quad-PCI tuners in my PLEX/EMBY server. These tuners are typically less sensitive than the TV I just tried but low and behold I got 83 (no ThisTV).

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Originally Posted by Greasemonkey View Post
Maybe This TV is in pulsar mode...

I just scanned RF 18 again and got squat.



Your comment made me think back to when I was a kid. I remember helping my dad set up the awesome device known as an antenna rotor, which added up to three additional channels to our spectacular lineup of about...7. If there were channels I could receive that weren't duplicates of local channels I would probably install an antenna rotor on my setup. In theory, I might be able to pick up channels from Mineral Wells, Stephenville, Waco and maybe even up north to the state line. I guess one of the "drawbacks" of being in the #5 market is that we are going to get pretty much every OTA network that is offered. Every network but Classic Arts Showcase, which is still a burr in my butt that it isn't broadcast here. You'd think at least one of the stations that has a blank channel would air it, considering that it's free for the transmitting.
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post #9633 of 9665 Old 11-19-2019, 06:20 PM
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Firing up TSReader, the duplicate MeTV stream that KTXA was carrying has changed. It's no longer a duplicate of MeTV, instead just a black screen & silent audio. At least this is a sign that they're actually moving things along with getting ThisTV added.
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post #9634 of 9665 Old 11-20-2019, 02:47 AM
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Originally Posted by JHBrandt View Post
Weird: KODF filed a silent STA with the FCC on Nov. 7.

They've been off the air since June 18.

Better late than never, I guess.

With one exception, other area LPTV stations that went off the air during the repack filed silent STAs much sooner:

  • KWDA never filed a silent STA
  • KPFW filed one on June 28
  • K25FW filed one on April 22 (KPXD moved early), and has since filed for a renewal
  • KUVN-CD filed one on July 1
  • KJJM filed one on June 17
So none of these stations are on the air right now? Just wondering whether to look for them whenever I get that better antenna.
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post #9635 of 9665 Old 11-20-2019, 06:43 AM
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Originally Posted by east-tx-tv View Post
So none of these stations are on the air right now? Just wondering whether to look for them whenever I get that better antenna.
Correct, they are off the air while they build their new facilities on their displacement channels. KUVN-CD should be back before the new year (not that it matters, since KUVN-DT is broadcasting), but when the other stations will be done is anyone's guess. Check Rabbitears for the current DFW TV landscape: https://www.rabbitears.info/market.php?mktid=5
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post #9636 of 9665 Old 11-21-2019, 10:42 AM
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ThisTV is live on 21.3 again. You can actually tune to it now, and it's showing ThisTV programming. However, I think they're still working on getting everything configured properly, as it does not have any EPG data yet. The EIT is generating CRC errors (only see info for .1 and .2, no .3), and seeing some continuity errors as well.

At least it's getting there!

EDIT: And now they have captions hardcoded onto the video.
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Last edited by PlnOTA; 11-21-2019 at 03:29 PM.
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post #9637 of 9665 Old 11-21-2019, 11:06 AM
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I am seeing it as well

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Originally Posted by PlnOTA View Post
ThisTV is live on 21.3 again. You can actually tune to it now, and it's showing ThisTV programming. However, I think they're still working on getting everything configured properly, as it does not have any EPG data yet. The EIT is generating CRC errors (only see info for .1 and .2, no .3), and seeing some continuity errors as well.

At least it's getting there!
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post #9638 of 9665 Old 11-21-2019, 04:45 PM
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Originally Posted by PlnOTA View Post
ThisTV is live on 21.3 again...EDIT: And now they have captions hardcoded onto the video.
And what big, giant captions they are! I've also noticed that there is zero PSIP information for ThisTV on all of my devices. But the channels on all of them do show "ThisTV" as being the name of the channel.
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post #9639 of 9665 Old 11-23-2019, 11:10 AM
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Originally Posted by Greasemonkey View Post
And what big, giant captions they are! I've also noticed that there is zero PSIP information for ThisTV on all of my devices. But the channels on all of them do show "ThisTV" as being the name of the channel.
Looks like they have the PSIP program guide for ThisTV working now.

Also, it's a minor point, but KLEG/44 finally has their channel labels matching the content on all their subchannels (you may need to rescan RF 28 to pick up the changes):

  1. SWAGAT (label unchanged, but for quite some time aired a simulcast of SAB TV from 44.4)
  2. KBS DFW
  3. JCBS DF (used to read SAB TV)
  4. SAB TV (used to read "44.4")
  5. DIYA TV

I assume DF and DFW both refer to Dallas/Ft. Worth. The labels are only 7 characters so they didn't have room for the "W" on 44.3.
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post #9640 of 9665 Old 11-23-2019, 11:19 AM
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Glad so see KTXA 21 turned Off the closed captioning on "This".

I do wish they would set This TV to 4:3 aspect ratio. The stretched out geometrically distorted picture bugs me. I can fix that on my old analog 4:3 TV by vertically stretching the picture with settings in the DTVPal's "SD" converter, but can't do that on my HD TV, can only make it worse with the TV or DTVPal settings.
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post #9641 of 9665 Old 11-23-2019, 12:15 PM
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I agree; everyone has the "fathead" look. I wonder if they did it that way because some of the commercials they air are 16:9, and they have to get the commercials right to get paid?

In theory, I suppose a station can change a channel's aspect ratio at any time, but in practice it only seems to get changed when the station (re)does the subchannel's setup. I wonder what it would take for a station to change aspect ratio dynamically, switching from 4:3 to 16:9 for commercials and back for content originally broadcast in 4:3?

Then again, ThisTV is a movie channel, and most of those movies were shot in 16:9 or an even wider aspect ratio, which makes me wonder why they're airing the "formatted for (NTSC) TV" versions of those movies instead of the "formatted for DVD" 16:9 versions?

Also, why aren't any movie channels broadcast in 480p? It's not HD but it'd still be an improvement....
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post #9642 of 9665 Old 11-23-2019, 12:52 PM
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Originally Posted by ed_in_tx View Post
Glad so see KTXA 21 turned Off the closed captioning on "This".

I do wish they would set This TV to 4:3 aspect ratio. The stretched out geometrically distorted picture bugs me. I can fix that on my old analog 4:3 TV by vertically stretching the picture with settings in the DTVPal's "SD" converter, but can't do that on my HD TV, can only make it worse with the TV or DTVPal settings.
You would think that This TV would have converted to 16:9 by now. Why are they still in 4:3 when supposedly they have access to 16:9 prints? Justice & Quest also stretches 4:3 produced programming, even though 16:9 content is displayed correctly. I really wish the Weigel networks would stop zooming in on 4:3 shows and presenting them in that fake widescreen format. I see they got rid of their bugs.

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post #9643 of 9665 Old 11-23-2019, 03:59 PM
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Right now, Justice and Quest in wide screen look normal to me. I think they used to look stretched.
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post #9644 of 9665 Old 11-23-2019, 05:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ed_in_tx View Post
Right now, Justice and Quest in wide screen look normal to me. I think they used to look stretched.
The show that is on Justice right now is a 4:3 aspect that's stretched to 16:9. Also note that their stretched aspect doesn't exactly fit vertically, so those who watch without overscanning can see thin black bars on the top & bottom as well as the datacasting line in the vertical blanking interval.

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post #9645 of 9665 Old 11-23-2019, 08:50 PM
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Looking at both ThisTV and Justice, I think I was right about the commercials. The shows look stretched but the commercials look normal.

What's really irritating is when This takes a 16:9 show, letterboxes it to fit 4:3, then stretches it back out to 16:9 again, resulting in an image that's both stretched and letterboxed!

Of course if they didn't stretch it, it would be windowboxed! But either way, how ridiculous!

You'd think 10 years after the transition to digital, they'd have pretty much worked all this out by now.
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post #9646 of 9665 Old 11-23-2019, 11:03 PM
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Geeez.. KDAF Ch 33.1 sure has a bad case of the stutters tonight. Messing up my Pawn Stars recordings!
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post #9647 of 9665 Old 11-24-2019, 09:57 AM
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Originally Posted by snowdog 88 View Post
The show that is on Justice right now is a 4:3 aspect that's stretched to 16:9. Also note that their stretched aspect doesn't exactly fit vertically, so those who watch without overscanning can see thin black bars on the top & bottom as well as the datacasting line in the vertical blanking interval.
Right now Justice has a program running with the sides of the 4:3 filled with blue-gray bars.

I guess I can't set my Sony TV to not overscan because I sure don't see any data stuff going on. I have seen that before on another channel but it's been a while, so I know what you're talking about.
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post #9648 of 9665 Old 11-24-2019, 12:41 PM
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Justice on WFAA is better than ThisTV on KTXA. Some of Justice's content is 16:9 and some of the 4:3 content is pillarboxed as Ed noted. They don't get it right every time but it's probably right most of the time.

On my little 23" bedroom TV, the only setting that gets the aspect ratio right on ThisTV is "Zoom 2" which is way overscanned, even with letterboxed content. I have to zoom it back down to see the DTVPal's overlays. But at least the "fathead" effect is gone.
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post #9649 of 9665 Old 11-24-2019, 03:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JHBrandt View Post
Justice on WFAA is better than ThisTV on KTXA. Some of Justice's content is 16:9 and some of the 4:3 content is pillarboxed as Ed noted. They don't get it right every time but it's probably right most of the time.

On my little 23" bedroom TV, the only setting that gets the aspect ratio right on ThisTV is "Zoom 2" which is way overscanned, even with letterboxed content. I have to zoom it back down to see the DTVPal's overlays. But at least the "fathead" effect is gone.
I have never seen any pillar-boxing on Justice or even Quest (both are operated by the same company). I know that my affiliate has everything correct on their end because the bug in the corner is always visible and never distorted, regardless of the program's aspect. Yes, it can be corrected by adjusting the TV's picture size settings, but it is annoying and some TV's like my Samsung NU7100 lack convenient resizing options like these. Really wished that the majority of TV manufactures implanted the feature to remember your zoom settings for each channel rather than by resolution. (Like the Zenith converter boxes).

Newer is not always better.
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post #9650 of 9665 Old 11-24-2019, 05:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ed_in_tx View Post
Right now Justice has a program running with the sides of the 4:3 filled with blue-gray bars.
Quote:
Originally Posted by snowdog 88 View Post
I have never seen any pillar-boxing on Justice or even Quest (both are operated by the same company). I know that my affiliate has everything correct on their end because the bug in the corner is always visible and never distorted, regardless of the program's aspect.
I've seen 16:9 content on Justice, but it's Ed who has seen 4:3 pillarboxed content (I don't know which show that was). So it sounds to me like the feed from Justice is mixed formats: sometimes Justice sends 4:3 content and sometimes 16:9.

Both of our affiliates have their broadcasts set to 16:9, so it sounds like where they differ is in how they handle 4:3 content coming from Justice. WFAA pillarboxes it (at least sometimes) and your affiliate always stretches it. Either way, the stations' respective bugs are added in last, so they always look correct no matter what.
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post #9651 of 9665 Old 11-24-2019, 05:22 PM
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I've seen 16:9 content on Justice, but it's Ed who has seen 4:3 pillarboxed content (I don't know which show that was)...
That would be Dog Tales, some of their E/I Sunday morning programming, between 10:30 and 11 AM.
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post #9652 of 9665 Old 11-24-2019, 06:23 PM
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That would be Dog Tales, some of their E/I Sunday morning programming, between 10:30 and 11 AM.
In that case, those are old reruns of the show that have been re-formatted to the 16:9 aspect ratio by the distributor. All they do is apply a graphical pillar-box to maintain the 4:3 aspect, probably so that networks like Justice display it correctly. (I kind of miss those graphical pillar-bars, which were mainly seen during news stories).

Speaking of messed up ratios, has anyone noticed that Qubo letterboxes Inspector Gadget? The aspect ratio is maintained, but there are black bars on the top & bottom that cut off the picture, mimicking a zoomed in 16:9 crop. My guess is that the distributor supplied them zoomed in 16:9 prints, and the network automatically letterboxes them for their 4:3 broadcast, resulting in this effect. Stupid!

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post #9653 of 9665 Old 11-25-2019, 09:14 AM
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Originally Posted by ed_in_tx View Post
Just checked my DTVPal DVR's clock. It's only 4 seconds fast. So somehow it is able to calculate the correct time, today anyway.
That didn't last long. Just noticed my main Pal's clock is now exactly 2 minutes slow. The 'Pal tried to autotune at 10 AM a timer that was set for Noon. Some of the timers got messed up too, whatever happened.
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post #9654 of 9665 Old 11-25-2019, 01:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by snowdog 88 View Post
In that case, those are old reruns of the show that have been re-formatted to the 16:9 aspect ratio by the distributor. All they do is apply a graphical pillar-box to maintain the 4:3 aspect, probably so that networks like Justice display it correctly. (I kind of miss those graphical pillar-bars, which were mainly seen during news stories).

Speaking of messed up ratios, has anyone noticed that Qubo letterboxes Inspector Gadget? The aspect ratio is maintained, but there are black bars on the top & bottom that cut off the picture, mimicking a zoomed in 16:9 crop. My guess is that the distributor supplied them zoomed in 16:9 prints, and the network automatically letterboxes them for their 4:3 broadcast, resulting in this effect. Stupid!
I saw that a while back when I flipped through Qubo on WHPX (which had just gotten a souped up signal thanks to the repack). I don't know why WildBrain did that, but they're not alone. It's the same thing FX does with The Simpsons, and that unfortunately bled into Disney+.
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post #9655 of 9665 Old 11-25-2019, 03:44 PM
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I saw that a while back when I flipped through Qubo on WHPX (which had just gotten a souped up signal thanks to the repack). I don't know why WildBrain did that, but they're not alone. It's the same thing FX does with The Simpsons, and that unfortunately bled into Disney+.
I don't have access to FX, but I did see the re-airing of The Simpson's Christmas Special last year on FOX. Picture enhancement and cleanup was nice, which is full of composite artifacting and analog noise on my season 1 DVD...But at least show in it's original aspect ratio. At least this "fake widescreen" effect was never applied to previous DVD releases, which is good because everything after season 20 was produced in widescreen. (Let's just hope it stays that way for the upcoming season 19 release).

M*A*S*H on MeTV is another show that has been zoomed in by the distributor, at least I think that it is... The reason I say that is that the credits appear to fit perfectly in the 4:3 safe zone without being distorted in any way. Ed Sulivan on Decades also has the fake widescreen treatment, and it shows because there is vertical panning of the image so that the captions at the bottom are visible, which still get hacked off to a degree. Wonder Woman on MeTV could also be zoomed in too, even though for the longest time I thought that they re-transferred the series from it's original film masters, which were shot with a panoramic lens. Also, Weigel needs to turn off the noise reduction and interpolation on their networks. Those are two features that I immediately turn off when I get a new TV because I hate the effects, and yet they force it upon us because they think people are too dumb to adjust their picture settings.

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post #9656 of 9665 Old 11-26-2019, 06:16 PM
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RF34 popped up today long enough to cause my DTVPal DVR to add duplicates of several channels (23-1, etc.) Then it went away leaving me to clean up their mess.
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post #9657 of 9665 Old 11-26-2019, 06:39 PM
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RF34 popped up today long enough to cause my DTVPal DVR to add duplicates of several channels (23-1, etc.) Then it went away leaving me to clean up their mess.
Interesting, guessing it was a test of KSTR's new main transmitter (their CP is good until the 18th). They have been broadcasting in ATSC 3.0 on their aux. transmitter since the phase 3 repack in July. Wonder if they plan on continuing ATSC 3.0 broadcasts on their main transmitter, or if they plan on returning to normal 1.0 operations.
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post #9658 of 9665 Old 11-27-2019, 07:48 AM
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I saw nothing out here in Garland except the usual solid 100 signal strength. Maybe the SFN transmitter near here stayed on throughout, blocking any chance of receiving an ATSC 1.0 signal from Cedar Hill on the same frequency.
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post #9659 of 9665 Old 12-03-2019, 05:31 AM
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I am now awaiting 1 of those GE antennas, 1 booster amp, and a Roku Ultra. Once I get them all, I'll see how I do, and let you all know. Since I don't have any outdoor options or an attic, I'm looking at maybe some kind of tripod to hold the antenna up indoors, and aim it SW-SSW toward my front window.
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post #9660 of 9665 Old 12-04-2019, 12:24 AM
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Well, to my amazement, all 3 items showed up at my door yesterday. Now, to figure everything out, especially the antenna. Had no idea it was going to be tab-a-into-slot-b fun, unlike unfolding the dipoles of a big Channel Master right out of a box years ago. Surely all of my goodies (after I find coax cable, as well as whatever I need to connect the Roku) will get me closer to Cedar Hill than the floppy thing I've had for an antenna.
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