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post #15151 of 15192 Old 12-09-2019, 12:55 PM
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The reception graphs, here, show a possible problem Sunday afternoon, but Trip has mentioned before that WMPT's signal is lacking at his location.



https://rabbitears.info/tvdx/signal_...F4/tuner1/WMPT


Otherwise, don't know. Seems normal to me now.
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post #15152 of 15192 Old 12-09-2019, 01:06 PM
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The other receivers look okay.

https://www.rabbitears.info/tvdx/sig...83/tuner0/WMPT

https://www.rabbitears.info/tvdx/sig...57/tuner1/WMPT

https://www.rabbitears.info/tvdx/sig...33/tuner1/WMPT

- Trip

N4MJC

Comments are my own and not that of the FCC (my employer) or anyone else.

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"Ignorance and prejudice and fear walk hand in hand..." - Rush "Witch Hunt"

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post #15153 of 15192 Old 12-09-2019, 01:21 PM
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Originally Posted by captain_video View Post
Interesting. The antenna on the right used to be the one that I had pointed at DC. I had a similar model with just two circular elements (ClearStream 2) aimed at Baltimore. I do have a newer ClearStream 2MAX with the two circular elements plus the two dipole antennas minus the screen reflector that I had intended to use for the Baltimore stations. I may give that a try and see if it pulls in the Baltimore VHF channels any better.
I rotated the two antennas so that they now point to the opposite sets of towers. The ClearStream 4MAX with the dipoles is now pointed towards Baltimore and the ClearStream 4 with the reflector is now pointed at DC. The only difference is that I am now getting channel 7.1 in DC, but not channel 9.1. Channel 13.1 in Baltimore is still breaking up on me. I'm a little discouraged by this considering that the repack of channels 11 and 13 are just shifting them to adjacent VHF channels instead of UHF. I'm hoping that they can boost their transmitter output after the switch. I thought I read that they are using a lower power output prior to the transition.
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post #15154 of 15192 Old 12-09-2019, 10:16 PM
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So the friend rescanned the Samsung for the nth time, and bingo... 22 is back.

Also resolved is a mystery that plagued us Sunday. After attaching a D-A to the TOS output and running it to an old Sherwood amp, suddenly the remote's commands were delayed by 5-6 seconds:

  1. Hit MUTE
  2. count 12345
  3. MUTE shows on screen.

Ditto raising/lowering the volume, etc.

BUT.. not if in the TV's setup menu pages. Go Figure.

But after removing the TOS D-A, resetting the remote, and power-cycling the TV did little good, the problem vanished after the rescan. All I say is: I see Rod Serling....


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post #15155 of 15192 Old 12-10-2019, 07:04 PM
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Originally Posted by captain_video View Post
I rotated the two antennas so that they now point to the opposite sets of towers. The ClearStream 4MAX with the dipoles is now pointed towards Baltimore and the ClearStream 4 with the reflector is now pointed at DC. The only difference is that I am now getting channel 7.1 in DC, but not channel 9.1. Channel 13.1 in Baltimore is still breaking up on me. I'm a little discouraged by this considering that the repack of channels 11 and 13 are just shifting them to adjacent VHF channels instead of UHF. I'm hoping that they can boost their transmitter output after the switch. I thought I read that they are using a lower power output prior to the transition.
Yikes, no CBS! I was perplexed as to why you are having trouble with RF channel 13 on your 4MAX (with the VHF dipoles) pointed at it from only ten miles away. I then reread your thread. You never answered on whether you could be having a problem with multipath. When you tune your TV to RF 13, do you get wild swings in strength on your signal meter? If so, that's a good sign you're experiencing a multipath problem. Since you're in a low spot between nearby obstructions on both sides of you, there is a good chance that could be possible.

By May 1st, both of the Baltimore VHF TV stations will have changed frequencies. Unfortunately, they will be at about the same power on their new channels. But, if WBAL (RF 11) is locking in for you now, then WJZ will likely do the same when they take over that frequency. Anyway, this would be SO much easier to diagnose if you can confirm whether or not you have multipathing problems at your location.
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post #15156 of 15192 Old 12-11-2019, 07:11 AM
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Originally Posted by Brian in CT View Post
Yikes, no CBS! I was perplexed as to why you are having trouble with RF channel 13 on your 4MAX (with the VHF dipoles) pointed at it from only ten miles away. I then reread your thread. You never answered on whether you could be having a problem with multipath. When you tune your TV to RF 13, do you get wild swings in strength on your signal meter? If so, that's a good sign you're experiencing a multipath problem. Since you're in a low spot between nearby obstructions on both sides of you, there is a good chance that could be possible.

By May 1st, both of the Baltimore VHF TV stations will have changed frequencies. Unfortunately, they will be at about the same power on their new channels. But, if WBAL (RF 11) is locking in for you now, then WJZ will likely do the same when they take over that frequency. Anyway, this would be SO much easier to diagnose if you can confirm whether or not you have multipathing problems at your location.
I was always under the impression that digital TV was more or less immune from multi-path interference, or at least less susceptible to it. I haven't checked the signal strength for channel 13.1 other than doing it in Windows Media Center which tends to scan through all of the channels and update each one as it rescans it. It appears that I'm getting a fairly strong signal (i.e., 5 or 6 out of 6 bars on pretty much every channel) when it scans the Baltimore VHF channels. The only weak channels are channels 7.1 and 9.1 out of DC. I only get one bar on each of them.
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post #15157 of 15192 Old 12-11-2019, 10:38 AM
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I was always under the impression that digital TV was more or less immune from multi-path interference, or at least less susceptible to it.
If the multi-path signals are much lower in amplitude than the strongest amplitude path, they may not be strong enough to affect the final result at all. That's the good part.

Whereas you used to see "ghosting" and other artifacts on "analog" TV, even at low interference signal strengths.

But when multi-path or anything else does interfere, it tends to mess more up, partly because ATSC digital TV is compressed, which means that a very small number of bad bits can mess up everything completely for a while - even though, last I knew, if I have this right, everything was transmitted twice. The result is that "analog" TV was effectively more robust, in that you could often still figure out what was happening.

Resistance to such problems isn't why the FCC chose digital - quite the contrary. They went digital to make it easier to perform high levels of compression, so that TV signals could be transmitted in less bandwidth, so that the FCC could auction off that bandwidth for other uses, providing more money to the FCC, which is not taxpayer supported. Compression also had the side effects of improving achievable resolution (# of pixels) within a given bandwidth, simplifying encryption (which various content providers and cable operators liked), and digitization and compression made it more practical to transmit the signal over digital networks, such as the Internet and some communications satellites. And it gave AV equipment and chip manufacturers a way to make extra money, because digital outdated a lot of old equipment. Perhaps most importantly, for a while at least, it mostly killed the VCR and DVR markets on OTA signals, making it harder to skip commercials, which the content providers and advertisers, who provide the user fees that largely support the FCC (along with income from auctioned bandwidth), loved.

Anyway, digital is not immune to interference in general. Just look at how sensitive HDTV is to minor HDMI cable connection problems.

Add to that: ATSC "digital" is actually analog-encoded-digital, and old NTSC "analog" contained some digital components, and included some forms of analog compression. Nothing is simple.
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post #15158 of 15192 Old 12-11-2019, 11:07 AM
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Cool

By the way, I think you can usually reduce multi-path and signal strength problems by using a higher mounted and higher gain antenna. If you don't want to annoy your neighbors too much, you can disguise the antenna as a tree (or put it in a high tree), or a flagpole. Just make sure you deal with lightning issues properly, because the higher up, the more likely an antenna is to be hit. High gain antennas also have a lot of sharp elements that concentrate electric fields, which can also attract lightning.

Someone should make a solar-powered tree-top antenna system that beams the antenna signal over IR to a IR receiver on a window!

If neighbors and nearby airports aren't a problem, you could also put a big antenna tower in your yard, like some ham radio operators have done. Higher is almost always better.

(EDIT: I also love the idea of keeping a drone mounted antenna high above my home, which beams the signal back to me. Not sure I could make it work, and there are some dangers, but it would be fun to try. Alas, I'm planning to move somewhere in a valley it would have to be thousands of feet high in the sky to work. The FAA would be seriously annoyed.)

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post #15159 of 15192 Old 12-11-2019, 06:48 PM
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MRG1, well stated. Robust is a good word for the old NTSC analog system. In contrast, you can call ATSC 1.0 a temperamental transmission system. Much of the interference that caused artifacts on a NTSC picture, would cause an ATSC 1.0 signal to drop out entirely (especially in the VHF-Lo band). I'm waiting for ATSC 3.0 to roll out sooner rather than later.

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Originally Posted by captain_video View Post
It appears that I'm getting a fairly strong signal (i.e., 5 or 6 out of 6 bars on pretty much every channel) when it scans the Baltimore VHF channels. The only weak channels are channels 7.1 and 9.1 out of DC. I only get one bar on each of them.
In your last two posts, you said the RF channel 13 signal is coming in strong but pixelating. Before you do anything rash (or expensive), try bypassing your signal combiner and just hook your 4MAX antenna line directly to the TV. Any multipathing you are experiencing might be getting exacerbated by having the two antennas combined into one feed. I figure it's worth a shot. Using a VHF/UHF splitter to combine the signals of both antennas is not exactly textbook to begin with, so that might be part of the problem.
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post #15160 of 15192 Old 12-11-2019, 06:58 PM
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In your last two posts, you said the RF channel 13 signal is coming in strong but pixelating. Before you do anything rash (or expensive), try bypassing your signal combiner and just hook your 4MAX antenna line directly to the TV. Any multipathing you are experiencing might be getting exacerbated by having the two antennas combined into one feed. I figure it's worth a shot. Using a VHF/UHF splitter to combine the signals of both antennas is not exactly textbook to begin with, so that might be part of the problem.
That thought had occurred to me too, which is why I replaced the splitter/combiner with a Channel Master CM-0500 JOINtenna TV Antenna Combiner. I did that at the same time that I reversed the direction of the two antennas to point at the opposite towers. Both antennas that I was originally using were directional and aimed almost 180 degrees apart so I figured any multi-path other type of interference would be minimal at best with this type of setup.

I can't put up a taller mast because the wife would have a cow and make me take it down. She's already on my case about having "ugly" antennas on the roof. A tower antenna in the back yard is totally out of the question because of the homeowner's association (and the wife). As much as I would love to cut the cord, the wife likes to watch certain channels on FIOS that aren't available via OTA or any streaming service so I'm still stuck with cable for now. The good news is that I can still get my CBS feed from FIOS.

I love the idea of using a drone at higher altitude, but it would be difficult to keep it aloft for extended periods. A tethered balloon would be an option as long as it's not too windy.

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post #15161 of 15192 Old 12-12-2019, 06:24 PM
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That thought had occurred to me too, which is why I replaced the splitter/combiner with a Channel Master CM-0500 JOINtenna TV Antenna Combiner.
Sorry none of our tricks worked out for you. If I were you (and the wife doesn't mind), I'd keep the 4MAX antenna up there pointed at Baltimore as backup in case the FIOS goes out. When the Baltimore TV stations change frequency, you might luck out with better reception for the VHF stations. Since the VHF dipoles are not very directional, you might get the D.C. VHF stations off the back. Good luck.
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post #15162 of 15192 Old 12-13-2019, 06:29 AM
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Sorry none of our tricks worked out for you. If I were you (and the wife doesn't mind), I'd keep the 4MAX antenna up there pointed at Baltimore as backup in case the FIOS goes out. When the Baltimore TV stations change frequency, you might luck out with better reception for the VHF stations. Since the VHF dipoles are not very directional, you might get the D.C. VHF stations off the back. Good luck.
I plan on keeping the current setup with the 4MAX pointed at Baltimore and the 4 aimed at DC. I may look into getting a dedicated VHF antenna to combine with the 4MAX to see if I can pick up channel 13.1 without the pixelation.

Thanks for all of your suggestions. I learned a few things along the way so it wasn't all in vain.
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post #15163 of 15192 Old 12-14-2019, 01:14 PM
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I decided to try a different antenna for the Baltimore channels. I found this one on Amazon that's supposed to be better suited for VHF but also gets the UHF channels and it's not too expensive:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

I didn't want to get a huge Yagi antenna. This one is fairly compact but probably has more than enough range to pull in all of the Baltimore channels. I just need something that works well in the high VHF range. The UHF channels all come in with no problems. It's supposed to arrive on Sunday. I plan on replacing the 4MAX that's aimed at Baltimore with the RCA. Hopefully it will have enough gain for the VHF channels to pull in channel 13.1. I'll let you know how it goes.

After further research and consideration, plus reading a few recommendations over at the TV Fool forums, I'm thinking a ClearStream 5 antenna is just what I need. It's a relatively high gain antenna for the high VHF band which is where I'm having my issues. I'm thinking I can use it in conjunction with the Clearstream 2 antenna (or possibly keep the CS 4MAX but remove the two VHF dipole elements) for the Baltimore stations and then combine them with the Clearstream 4 aimed at DC. The 5 comes with a VHF/UHF combiner that I can use with the CS 2 and then output the combined VHF/UHF feed to the antenna combiner with the CS 4 for a single coax download to my tuners. This will only potentially solve my problem with the Baltimore channel 13.1, but at least it will get me CBS without having to rely on FIOS. I can probably readjust the CS 4 to bring in channel 9.1 from DC as I was able to get it quite clearly before I started moving things around. I'll try it without the CS 2 or 4MAX connected to see how it fares with the Baltimore UHF channels first as it is also supposed to receive UHF as well. I also have a preamp that I may insert into the line to see if that helps.

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post #15164 of 15192 Old 12-14-2019, 08:12 PM
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Originally Posted by captain_video View Post
I decided to try a different antenna for the Baltimore channels. I found this one on Amazon that's supposed to be better suited for VHF but also gets the UHF channels and it's not too expensive:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

I didn't want to get a huge Yagi antenna. This one is fairly compact but probably has more than enough range to pull in all of the Baltimore channels. I just need something that works well in the high VHF range. The UHF channels all come in with no problems. It's supposed to arrive on Sunday. I plan on replacing the 4MAX that's aimed at Baltimore with the RCA. Hopefully it will have enough gain for the VHF channels to pull in channel 13.1. I'll let you know how it goes.
Now THAT looks like an antenna better suited for the job (at least for VHF). The 70 mile range boast is B.S. I have a large Channel Master antenna on my roof (and live on a hill), and it never had a 70 mile range in typical conditions. I'd say, just by looking at your new antenna, you would have a 35-40 mile range over FLAT TERRAIN. By comparison, the range of a cheap pair of rabbit ears would be 15-20 miles over FLAT TERRAIN. Unfortunately, you live in a low point between two obstructions. This antenna DOES give you a better chance at the Baltimore VHF stations, and I'm hoping I'm wrong about the extent of your multipathing problem, but keep the receipt just in case. Again, good luck.
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post #15165 of 15192 Old 12-14-2019, 08:34 PM
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Now THAT looks like an antenna better suited for the job (at least for VHF). The 70 mile range boast is B.S. I have a large Channel Master antenna on my roof (and live on a hill), and it never had a 70 mile range in typical conditions. I'd say, just by looking at your new antenna, you would have a 35-40 mile range over FLAT TERRAIN. By comparison, the range of a cheap pair of rabbit ears would be 15-20 miles over FLAT TERRAIN. Unfortunately, you live in a low point between two obstructions. This antenna DOES give you a better chance at the Baltimore VHF stations, and I'm hoping I'm wrong about the extent of your multipathing problem, but keep the receipt just in case. Again, good luck.
I saw your reply and it took me a minute to realize you were talking about the RCA antenna and not the CS 5. I've actually ordered both of them but I will be more inclined to use the CS 5 vs. the RCA simply because it says it will work better for VHF even if there is lots of foliage between the antenna and LOS with the towers, which I have.

What's odd is that I have the Channels app on my iPhone that allows me to watch live TV via my HDHomeRun tuners and my wireless home network. I rarely use it but for some reason I was playing around with it and decided to try channel 13.1. I watched it for several minutes and the picture was rock solid with no pixelation. I decided to try it on my main TV and so far it's been running for over 10 minutes with a clear picture. It usually starts to pixelate within about 30 seconds or so but so far it looks stable. I'm really not sure what to do with it at this point, but I'm inclined to give the CS 5 a shot when it arrives and see how it goes. The weather is clear tonight so I'm sure that's helping with the reception. There's rain in the forecast for Tuesday so I'll check it then and see how the picture looks. I won't be home but I'll try to record some shows and see how they turn out. The CS 5 won't arrive before then anyway. It's coming from a dealer in Indianapolis. The RCA was purchased on Amazon so I can return that with no problem.

I'm just here scratching my head wondering WTF is going on with this thing. It's enough to make me want to read a book instead of watching TV.

On top of that I decided to check out channels 7.1 and 9.1 and now both of them are coming in just fine. I watched a good part of the Chiefs-Broncos game Sunday afternoon on channel 13.1 and only saw a couple of minor glitches in about an hour that were pretty much negligible.

I tried recording and watching the Bills-Steelers game on channel 11.1 last night but got no signal. It was fine on channel 4.1 in DC. This is frustrating the heck out of me. Channels 13.1 and 11.1 broadcast from the same tower array so if I get one then I should be able to get the other. This isn't making any sense.

Last edited by captain_video; 12-16-2019 at 06:57 AM.
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post #15166 of 15192 Old 12-17-2019, 01:05 PM
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Yes, that is the issue. When I scanned the OTA channels on my new 65" TCL I was able to view the MPEG4 video for 45.4. None off my older TV's can do MPEG4. Thanks for everyone's input.
I am now able to get 45-4 on my older TVs. Guess they changed the output.
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post #15167 of 15192 Old 12-21-2019, 01:52 PM
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Channels 13.1 and 11.1 broadcast from the same tower array so if I get one then I should be able to get the other. This isn't making any sense.


If you are having problems with Channel 13 and not Channel 11, it may be due to your location.


WJZ-TV transmits on Digital RF Channel 13 and appears on Digital Virtual Channel 13. It transmits from the Television Hill candelabra tower array and uses a 33.8 kW directional antenna pattern. This is the WJZ-TV antenna pattern:


https://www.rabbitears.info/pattern....ion=0&erp=33.8


WBAL-TV transmits on Digital RF Channel 11 and appears on Digital Virtual Channel 11. It also transmits from the Television Hill candelabra tower array and uses a 26.6 kW non-directional antenna pattern.


On May 1, 2020, WJZ-TV is scheduled to switch to RF 11 and maintain Virtual 13 and WBAL-TV is scheduled to switch to RF 12 and maintain Virtual 11. Both stations will broadcast 30 kW signals and use non-directional antenna patterns from the Television Hill candelabra tower array.

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post #15168 of 15192 Old 12-21-2019, 02:31 PM
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If you are having problems with Channel 13 and not Channel 11, it may be due to your location.


WJZ-TV transmits on Digital RF Channel 13 and appears on Digital Virtual Channel 13. It transmits from the Television Hill candelabra tower array and uses a 33.8 kW directional antenna pattern:


https://www.rabbitears.info/pattern....ion=0&erp=33.8


WBAL-TV transmits on Digital RF Channel 11 and appears on Digital Virtual Channel 11. It also transmits from the Television Hill candelabra tower array and uses a 26.6 kW non-directional antenna pattern.


On May 1, 2020, WJZ-TV is scheduled to switch to RF 11 and maintain Virtual 13 and WBAL-TV is scheduled to switch to RF 12 and maintain Virtual 11. Both stations will broadcast 30 kW signals and use non-directional antenna patterns from the Television Hill candelabra tower array.
The irony here is that I had literally just climbed down off the roof after installing a new ClearStream 5 antenna (the one on the left in the attached photo) aimed at Baltimore when I got the email alerting me to your post. I appreciate your comment but I was already aware of everything you just posted. My previous post indicated that I had lost channel 11.1, but that was only temporary for some reason. I checked it the next day and it was back again.

Even though I was now able to get channels 11.1 and 13.1 in the clear, I still saw just a brief bit of pixelation on channel 13.1 when I watched it for about 45 minutes or so, but that was with perfectly clear weather. The ClearStream 5 is supposed to be better at picking up high VHF channels if you're in an area with tall trees, which I am. The signal strength meter didn't fluctuate even when I rotated the antenna in an arc of about 45-60 degrees before it dropped off so it was difficult to pinpoint the exact direction that I needed to aim it. I used the AntennaPoint app on my cell phone to aim the antenna in the general direction of the broadcast towers in Baltimore. Doing a cursory check of the Baltimore and Washington stations I am able to get channels 11.1 and 13.1 as well as 9.1 with a stable, clear picture. I can also get channel 7.1, but with a good bit of pixelation. I already get a good signal for ABC on channel 2.1 so 7.1 is basically redundant anyway. I'm keeping my fingers crossed that I have finally achieved a stable solution to receive all of my local network stations. All of the local Baltimore UHF channels come in with no problem as well as most of the DC UHF channels. I don't have my guide setup to show channels 26.1 or 32.1 and their sub channels so I wasn't able to check them. I don't watch that much on PBS anyway so it's not a big deal for me.
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post #15169 of 15192 Old 12-21-2019, 07:46 PM
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I appreciate your comment but I was already aware of everything you just posted.

If you were indeed aware of everything that I had posted then at no time did your previous comments indicate to me that you were aware that WJZ-TV uses a directional antenna. Were you aware that WJZ uses a directional antenna? Were you aware that WBAL is omni-directional? Your comments had indicated to me only that you were perplexed as to why two separate channels with comparable broadcast power using the same broadcast tower should yield different reception performances. You made no mention of your knowledge of different broadcast patterns for the two channels. Correct me if I am wrong. Were you aware that your location is on the weak side of WJZ's signal? None of your previous comments gave me that confidence. In any event, good luck with your reception.
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post #15170 of 15192 Old 12-21-2019, 08:18 PM
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If you were indeed aware of everything that I had posted then at no time did your previous comments indicate to me that you were aware that WJZ-TV uses a directional antenna. Were you aware that WJZ uses a directional antenna? Were you aware that WBAL is omni-directional? Your comments had indicated to me only that you were perplexed as to why two separate channels with comparable broadcast power using the same broadcast tower should yield different reception performances. You made no mention of your knowledge of different broadcast patterns for the two channels. Correct me if I am wrong. Were you aware that your location is on the weak side of WJZ's signal? None of your previous comments gave me that confidence. In any event, good luck with your reception.
The only part of your previous response that had not already been discussed was the part about the directionality of the antennas. I was not aware that WBAL was omni-directional and WJZ was directional so thank you for that information. That certainly explains why I was having so much difficulty with reception on channel 13.1. Although looking at the signal map from the link you posted on rabbitears.info it's near impossible to tell where my location falls in relation to the beam pattern without having some sort of scale to judge distance and location. However, if I had to hazard a guess I would have to say that my location falls directly in the lower part of the broadcast beam that appears to be quite strong (I'm only about 10.3 miles from the broadcast towers). According to TVFool.com and other sites I am supposed to aim my antenna approximately 47 degrees to the northeast of my location. I had assumed that they all broadcast on an omni-directional array so that they could reach more viewers.

Here's a quote from one of my previous posts regarding the repack of both WBAL and WJZ:

Quote:
I'm a little discouraged by this considering that the repack of channels 11 and 13 are just shifting them to adjacent VHF channels instead of UHF.
In any case, my current setup seems to have cured the problem for the time being. I'll have to keep a close eye on it to see if it fixes it in the long term.

I watched the entire Ravens-Browns game today on channel 13.1 without a single glitch. I checked all of my local VHF and UHF channels and their associated sub-channels and everything is coming through except for channel 7.1 which suffers from severe pixelation. I'm getting channels now that I didn't think I was able to receive in my location. Since I have access to two major markets I have a lot of redundant channels, but it's nice to have backups. Channel 7.1 is the ABC affiliate in DC whereas I get the Baltimore ABC channel on 2.1 which is actually on a UHF frequency so I haven't actually lost anything. The ClearStream 5 seems to be performing as advertised.
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post #15171 of 15192 Old 12-22-2019, 06:02 PM
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If you are having problems with Channel 13 and not Channel 11, it may be due to your location.


WJZ-TV transmits on Digital RF Channel 13 and appears on Digital Virtual Channel 13. It transmits from the Television Hill candelabra tower array and uses a 33.8 kW directional antenna pattern. This is the WJZ-TV antenna pattern:


https://www.rabbitears.info/pattern....ion=0&erp=33.8


WBAL-TV transmits on Digital RF Channel 11 and appears on Digital Virtual Channel 11. It also transmits from the Television Hill candelabra tower array and uses a 26.6 kW non-directional antenna pattern.


On May 1, 2020, WJZ-TV is scheduled to switch to RF 11 and maintain Virtual 13 and WBAL-TV is scheduled to switch to RF 12 and maintain Virtual 11. Both stations will broadcast 30 kW signals and use non-directional antenna patterns from the Television Hill candelabra tower array.
This is good information. Thanks for posting. I live in Dillsburg, pa. Have the huge antennacraft in my attack. I get both of these pretty well with occasional dropouts. According to the pattern for WJZ my area is hardly getting any signal. I’m really looking forward to the switch And increased power.
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post #15172 of 15192 Old 12-24-2019, 12:00 PM
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This is good information. Thanks for posting. I live in Dillsburg, pa. Have the huge antennacraft in my attack. I get both of these pretty well with occasional dropouts. According to the pattern for WJZ my area is hardly getting any signal. I’m really looking forward to the switch And increased power.

You're welcome. Actually, the new approved ERP of 30 kW ND for WJZ for RF-11 is a 3.8 kW decrease from the present 33.8 kW DA ERP now on RF-13. You'll just be receiving a more evenly distributed signal. The new non-directional WJZ transmitter also will be placed 10 meters higher on the Television Hill candelabra tower than at present. It also occurs to me that the lower RF-11 channel frequency will be a slight advantage over RF-13. WBAL is moving from RF-11 to RF-12. Their present 26.6 kW ND ERP will increase to 30 kW ND ERP and the new transmitter will be placed 9 meters higher. At present, WJZ's directional antenna is designed to protect the lower RF-12 channel, WWPX in Martinsburg, WV. Since WWPX will be moving from RF-12 to RF-13 in order to accomodate WBAL's move from RF-11 to RF-12, WWPX's new directional pattern will now protect WBAL. Also, WHYY in Wilmington, DE, which is currently using RF-12 will also switch to RF-13. WHYY's new directional pattern will also now protect WBAL. It appears that the new WJZ and WBAL both non-directional will both be given a priority status in the region. Reception for both should be excellent.
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You're welcome. Actually, the new approved ERP of 30 kW ND for WJZ for RF-11 is a 3.8 kW decrease from the present 33.8 kW DA ERP now on RF-13. You'll just be receiving a more evenly distributed signal. The new non-directional WJZ transmitter also will be placed 10 meters higher on the Television Hill candelabra tower than at present. It also occurs to me that the lower RF-11 channel frequency will be a slight advantage over RF-13. WBAL is moving from RF-11 to RF-12. Their present 26.6 kW ND ERP will increase to 30 kW ND ERP and the new transmitter will be placed 9 meters higher. At present, WJZ's directional antenna is designed to protect the lower RF-12 channel, WWPX in Martinsburg, WV. Since WWPX will be moving from RF-12 to RF-13 in order to accomodate WBAL's move from RF-11 to RF-12, WWPX's new directional pattern will now protect WBAL. Also, WHYY in Wilmington, DE, which is currently using RF-12 will also switch to RF-13. WHYY's new directional pattern will also now protect WBAL. It appears that the new WJZ and WBAL both non-directional will both be given a priority status in the region. Reception for both should be excellent.
That’s what I am hoping for. I’ve had issues with both since they went digital. Not horrible but occasional dropouts. Of course I realize my antennas in the attic play a negative role in reception. According to your data both stations should improve. Unfortunately for me Harrisburg stations are blocked by the mountain so I have to aim for Baltimore. It will be interesting to see real world results when these stations move their frequencies. Thanks again for the information.
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post #15174 of 15192 Old 12-25-2019, 06:50 PM
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I live in Bowie and was wondering whether anyone has a recommended indoor antenna for getting the major network signals. Ch 22 and 45 are really close and can come in with just about anything, but DC channels and a few other Baltimore are a bit problematic at times.

I had some rabbit ears that I was using with an older TV and could usually adjust them, but there is no place to put those on this newer TV I just received today for use in the kitchen.

Thanks,

Neil

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post #15175 of 15192 Old 12-25-2019, 07:13 PM
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Channel 45 is broadcast from a tower right next to channels 2, 11, and 13. The DC TV towers are on the opposite side of DC from you so you may need to get either a separate antenna aimed at them or one that's more omni-directional. If you can get channel 45 then you should also be able to get channel 2. An indoor antenna may not be what you need at your location, especially a set of rabbit ears. You should consider putting one in the attic or better yet on the roof.
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post #15176 of 15192 Old 12-25-2019, 08:11 PM
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I live in Bowie and was wondering whether anyone has a recommended indoor antenna for getting the major network signals. Ch 22 and 45 are really close and can come in with just about anything, but DC channels and a few other Baltimore are a bit problematic at times.

I had some rabbit ears that I was using with an older TV and could usually adjust them, but there is no place to put those on this newer TV I just received today for use in the kitchen.

Thanks,

Neil

If rabbit ears aren't practical, what style of antenna might work for you?


I have good luck with a Channel Master Flatenna 35 and can pick up all the full power DC (26 miles) and Baltimore (13 miles) stations including VHFers 7, 9, 11, and 13, surprisingly. Not expensive to try. I found a sweet spot on a shelf near the TV for it that only needs minimal adjustments.



https://www.channelmaster.com/Flaten...m-4001hdbw.htm


Sharing the results from a https://rabbitears.info/ Search Map might be helpful for more advice.
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post #15177 of 15192 Old 12-25-2019, 08:23 PM
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If rabbit ears aren't practical, what style of antenna might work for you?


I have good luck with a Channel Master Flatenna 35 and can pick up all the full power DC (26 miles) and Baltimore (13 miles) stations including VHFers 7, 9, 11, and 13, surprisingly. Not expensive to try. I found a sweet spot on a shelf near the TV for it that only needs minimal adjustments.



https://www.channelmaster.com/Flaten...m-4001hdbw.htm


Sharing the results from a https://rabbitears.info/ Search Map might be helpful for more advice.
I just don't have a place to affix or hold the rabbit ears on this new TV. Unless there is some rabbit ear holder you can buy somewhere.

That antenna looks promising and worth a try.

Here is the search map.

https://rabbitears.info/searchmap.ph...study_id=37944

Thanks.
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post #15178 of 15192 Old 12-25-2019, 09:49 PM
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I was just reading about rabbit ears and antennas and it said that it might do better further away from the digital TV. I have an RCA ANT1308 rabbit ears with a UHF loop on a base that has given me mixed results for years (on a different TV) that I was trying. I moved it about 3 feet away from this TV and closer to a window and in addition to Ch 2 (which I had been getting where it was), picked up Ch 4, 5 and 7 really well and Ch 9 okay. So, maybe I can just play with this and it will be good enough. Or I can get that Channel Master and perhaps get even better results.

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post #15179 of 15192 Old 12-26-2019, 07:11 AM
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I just don't have a place to affix or hold the rabbit ears on this new TV. Unless there is some rabbit ear holder you can buy somewhere.
Young whipper snapper. What you need is one of these:



Note the missing loop antenna.
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post #15180 of 15192 Old 12-26-2019, 11:25 AM
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I was just reading about rabbit ears and antennas and it said that it might do better further away from the digital TV. I have an RCA ANT1308 rabbit ears with a UHF loop on a base that has given me mixed results for years (on a different TV) that I was trying. I moved it about 3 feet away from this TV and closer to a window and in addition to Ch 2 (which I had been getting where it was), picked up Ch 4, 5 and 7 really well and Ch 9 okay. So, maybe I can just play with this and it will be good enough. Or I can get that Channel Master and perhaps get even better results.

These flat panel interior antennas are not known for their VHF (7-13, in our area) performance, so "luck" is the operative word in my situation. It's on a shelf on an exterior wall on the side of the house nearest DC. It doesn't do so well in other rooms. But maybe it will work and be out of the way for you, too. Your rabbit ears reports shows you have pretty good line-of-sight to both DC and Balt towers. (Click on the distance fields in the chart it produces.)
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