Master List of currently available 4k HDR titles, will be updated often. - Page 432 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
Forum Jump: 
 35123Likes
Reply
 
Thread Tools
post #12931 of 30262 Old 02-01-2017, 10:43 PM
Newbie
 
Join Date: Feb 2016
Posts: 5
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
Liked: 3
I can't figure out how to edit posts here on avsforums. I was going to add to my past post:

HDR is going to be much more noticeable an upgrade than an 8K or 16K tv. I completely agree we should focus on HDR as an upgrade in 2017.

I just wanted to make sure people didn't think we had reached the limit of human eyes for resolution, (don't need more people like those who think humans can only see 24fps...)
twgz is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #12932 of 30262 Old 02-01-2017, 10:50 PM
Newbie
 
Join Date: Feb 2016
Posts: 5
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
Liked: 3
Wow edits are really needed here.

CORRECTION to my post 2 above, I accidentally divided the number of horizontal pixels by the 65" diagonal, rather you should use the width, which for a 65" TV is according to rtings 56.7".

With the corrected calculation:
  • 1080p 65" TV has pixels of 750um ~9x diameter of average human hair (80um)
  • 4K 65" TV has pixels of 375um ~4.5x diameter of average human hair (80um)
  • 8K 65" TV has pixels of 187.5um ~2x diameter of average human hair (80um)
  • 16K 65" TV has pixels of 93.76um ~1x diameter of average human hair (80um)
twgz is offline  
post #12933 of 30262 Old 02-02-2017, 12:41 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
morphinapg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 4,243
Mentioned: 43 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2593 Post(s)
Liked: 2303
Quote:
Originally Posted by twgz View Post
I always see people make statements like this or based on the confusing pixels per degree of arc, so I wanted to test it myself using an easy real world test.

I taped a hair from my head to a piece of paper and stuck the paper onto my TV, then I sat on my couch (~3 meters away).

I could definitely see the hair at that distance, the average diameter of human hair is 80um, thus I can at least see things with 80um width.

Calculating using wolframalpha the pixels on an 8K 65" TV are 215um thus ~3x the diameter of a human hair, its only until you get to 16K 65" TV where the pixels are aprox the same as the diameter of a hair.

wolframalpha.com/input/?i=65%22+%2F+(3840*2)

I am just demonstrating that for a 4k 65" TV at 3 meters, the human eye can definitely still discern even a single pixel.

Caveats:
  • I understand the human vision is complex, thus maybe a black hair on a white piece of paper is easier to discern. But there are scenarios where there are some black pixels surrounded with lots of white like this in movies (e.g. black text on white paper), or if the TV is used as a computer monitor.
  • I also understand it may not seem crisper subjectively when considering an entire image.
I have a cool test I designed that may be more appropriate for this. Create a grid of checkerboarded white/black pixels in mspaint, at the exact size as your screen resolution. View that grid in full screen so that every pixel is directly mapped 1:1 to your screen. Next, start moving backwards slowly. Eventually, this grid will appear to become a fully solid grey screen. Move closer, and while you won't be able to make out every pixel, you'll be able to tell it isn't quite solid. Try to find the crossover point between the two. Measure that. Next, compare that measurement to the dpi of your screen. Let's say you used a computer monitor and it had the standard 96dpi. Let's say the measured crossover point was 3.5ft away. Now you have a ratio of 96dpi @ 3.5ft. Multiply the two, and you get 336dpi @ 1ft, which you can then use to find how much dpi you should be able to see at any given distance. For example, if you sit 10ft away, that is 336 / 10 = 33.6 dpi, which means you would need a ~131" screen to see the full resolution of 4K.

Feel free to test your own eyes this way. The measurement for someone with 20/20 vision is typically around 300dpi @ 1ft.

Quote:
Originally Posted by twgz View Post
I just wanted to make sure people didn't think we had reached the limit of human eyes for resolution, (don't need more people like those who think humans can only see 24fps...)
I would like to repeat that nobody seriously believes we can't see past 24fps. That was an internet joke, exaggerating the original claim of 60fps, which has some scientific basis for live action footage, which means it would also apply to games with realistic motion blur, but not to games with no motion blur or unrealistic motion blur.

Living Room: Sony XBR65X930D, Sony HT-Z9F, Philips BDP7501
Bedroom: LG OLED55C6P, Denon AVR-X1300W (5.1.2), PS4 Pro, Sony UBP-X700, Chromecast Ultra
Check out my video game movie edits
morphinapg is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #12934 of 30262 Old 02-02-2017, 05:18 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
Gillietalls's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 2,259
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1589 Post(s)
Liked: 1647
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigck417 View Post
Have to say I'm really looking forward to Fantastic Beasts coming out in March. Looks like it has a 4K DI and some of that stuff should really "wow"


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Yes, sir! And add to that Billy Lynn's Long Halftime Walk. And no so much for the movie, but I want to see how much difference the higher frame rate will make. I'm hoping/guessing this movie becomes the new reference so other studios will follow suit.

LG 77C8, Sony 75x940E, LG 65B7, LG 65EF9500, TCL 65 8 Series, LG 55E6, LG 55UB8200, 2 TCL 49S515's
2 Apple 4K TVs, Nvidia Shield, 2 LG UP970's, 2 Samsung UBD-K8500s

WD 16TB NAS, WD 8TB NAS
Gillietalls is offline  
post #12935 of 30262 Old 02-02-2017, 06:07 AM
UHD Addict
 
aaronwt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Northern VA(Woodbridge)
Posts: 36,839
Mentioned: 78 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 9926 Post(s)
Liked: 6563
Quote:
Originally Posted by lujan View Post
I finally got this corrected but had to contact UV as instructed by Sony today. I now have 4 copies of Resident Evil: Afterlife on my Sony account. 3 of them are UHD and one is HD. I have 3 copies at the UV site (2 at HD and one at UHD). I originally redeemed the HD version at Vudu so that why it's 3 (one from Vudu and 2 from Sony).
I hadn't checked in over a week. I just looked and see that the UHD version of Afterlife was added to my UV account on January 25th. I'm just glad they kept their word and did finally add the UHD streaming rights to my UV library.

I have multiple copies in my accounts too. But I originally redeemed from the Sony Ultra app. And so far the other seventeen UHD movies that I redeemed from either the Ultra app or the SonyPicturesStore, all gave me the UHD streaming rights. Only Afterlife caused major issues for some reason.

Hopefully they don't have these issues with Billy Lynn's Long Halftime Walk. I plan on getting that because it is the first UHD title to use 60FPS. Plus it also comes with the 3D BD, UHD BD, 2D BD, and UHD UV streaming rights. So my plan is to reward Sony by purchasing every title that Sony releases this way.(with the 3D BD included with the UHD BD)
King Richard likes this.

57TB unRAID1a--49TB unRAID2--76TB unRAID3
TCL 6 Series--Sony UBP-X800--Philips BDP7502--Onkyo HT-S7800
XBL/PSN: WormholeXtreme
aaronwt is offline  
post #12936 of 30262 Old 02-02-2017, 06:10 AM
Advanced Member
 
Mr. Wonderful's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 561
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 116 Post(s)
Liked: 79
Quote:
Originally Posted by ray0414 View Post
Slightly off topic but not completely...because everyone has been curious how Dolby Vision will pass through devices if at all..

Denon and Marantz has announced that some of their receivers are being updated for Dolby Vision and HLG. unfortunately, it is only their current models.


The D + M Group will publish selected for AV receivers and preamplifiers their brands Denon and Marantz, a firmware update that allows the devices, metadata according to the HDR specifications "Dolby Vision" and "HLG" (Hybrid Log Gamma ). However, this update is only available for the current Denon models AVR-X1300W, AVR-X2300W, AVR-X3300W, AVR-X4300H and AVR-X6300H as well as the current Marantz models NR1607, SR5011, SR6011, SR7011 and AV7703. In addition, D + M intends to make it available only at the end of 2017 or early 2018; Extensive tests are planned.




https://www.heise.de/newsticker/meld...e-3614979.html
That's incredible. Good on them. Video codecs, interfaces, DRM, and other technologies are moving too fast and out of sync, screwing over consumers. This might mean that I won't HAVE to necessarily update my receiver when I buy an ATSC 3.0 TV in 2-3 years.
cmdrdredd likes this.
Mr. Wonderful is offline  
post #12937 of 30262 Old 02-02-2017, 06:39 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
b0rnarian's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Indiana
Posts: 2,873
Mentioned: 20 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2243 Post(s)
Liked: 1415
Quote:
Originally Posted by ray0414 View Post
Slightly off topic but not completely...because everyone has been curious how Dolby Vision will pass through devices if at all..

Denon and Marantz has announced that some of their receivers are being updated for Dolby Vision and HLG. unfortunately, it is only their current models.


The D + M Group will publish selected for AV receivers and preamplifiers their brands Denon and Marantz, a firmware update that allows the devices, metadata according to the HDR specifications "Dolby Vision" and "HLG" (Hybrid Log Gamma ). However, this update is only available for the current Denon models AVR-X1300W, AVR-X2300W, AVR-X3300W, AVR-X4300H and AVR-X6300H as well as the current Marantz models NR1607, SR5011, SR6011, SR7011 and AV7703. In addition, D + M intends to make it available only at the end of 2017 or early 2018; Extensive tests are planned.


https://www.heise.de/newsticker/meld...e-3614979.html
Shouldn't be a big issue as most UHD Players come with Dual HDMI Outputs so that you don't need to go through the non-compatible AV Receivers. BUT good to see they are implementing convenience for the future.

Samsung 65 KS9800 + Denon X4500H (11.2) + OPPO 203 + PS4 + Roku
Disc Lot For SALE : HERE!

Last edited by b0rnarian; 02-02-2017 at 06:43 AM.
b0rnarian is online now  
post #12938 of 30262 Old 02-02-2017, 06:49 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 1,161
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 845 Post(s)
Liked: 364
So I preordered the 4K Blu-ray for John Wick from Walmart.com and the automatically gave me the digital HDX copy on Vudu. Although it's not the UHD, I thought it was cool for them to do that. Hopefully the digital code will redeem in UHD when I pick up next week.

65JS8500, Vizio P50-C1, 55C6P, Nvidia Shield, XB1S, PS4 Pro, KS8500
buju22 is offline  
post #12939 of 30262 Old 02-02-2017, 07:57 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
b0rnarian's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Indiana
Posts: 2,873
Mentioned: 20 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2243 Post(s)
Liked: 1415
Quote:
Originally Posted by buju22 View Post
So I preordered the 4K Blu-ray for John Wick from Walmart.com and the automatically gave me the digital HDX copy on Vudu. Although it's not the UHD, I thought it was cool for them to do that. Hopefully the digital code will redeem in UHD when I pick up next week.

65JS8500, Vizio P50-C1, 55C6P, Nvidia Shield, XB1S, PS4 Pro, KS8500
Do the Lionsgate titles usually redeem in UHD? I pre-ordered from Amazon.

Samsung 65 KS9800 + Denon X4500H (11.2) + OPPO 203 + PS4 + Roku
Disc Lot For SALE : HERE!
b0rnarian is online now  
post #12940 of 30262 Old 02-02-2017, 08:50 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
lujan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: SW USA
Posts: 9,704
Mentioned: 50 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5154 Post(s)
Liked: 3167
Quote:
Originally Posted by twgz View Post
Wow edits are really needed here.

CORRECTION to my post 2 above, I accidentally divided the number of horizontal pixels by the 65" diagonal, rather you should use the width, which for a 65" TV is according to rtings 56.7".

With the corrected calculation:
  • 1080p 65" TV has pixels of 750um ~9x diameter of average human hair (80um)
  • 4K 65" TV has pixels of 375um ~4.5x diameter of average human hair (80um)
  • 8K 65" TV has pixels of 187.5um ~2x diameter of average human hair (80um)
  • 16K 65" TV has pixels of 93.76um ~1x diameter of average human hair (80um)
Now can you tell us in english? What is the viewing distance for the screen measurements for each of the resolutions?
aaronwt likes this.

lujan
679 Ultra HD
733 HD
4 SD
lujan is online now  
post #12941 of 30262 Old 02-02-2017, 08:53 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
lujan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: SW USA
Posts: 9,704
Mentioned: 50 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5154 Post(s)
Liked: 3167
Quote:
Originally Posted by b0rnarian View Post
Do the Lionsgate titles usually redeem in UHD? I pre-ordered from Amazon.
Not always. For instance, I just got Deepwater Horizon a couple of weeks ago but haven't been able to redeem anywhere because the only place that usually redeems in UHD is Flixster and they haven't added it to their catalog. I chatted with them yesterday and they told me there is some issue with streaming rights that is preventing them from adding it and they don't know when/if they'll add it in the future.

lujan
679 Ultra HD
733 HD
4 SD
lujan is online now  
post #12942 of 30262 Old 02-02-2017, 09:59 AM
Oppo Beta Group
 
RichB's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 1999
Location: Massachusetts
Posts: 11,400
Mentioned: 48 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2139 Post(s)
Liked: 1582
Quote:
Originally Posted by lujan View Post
Now can you tell us in english? What is the viewing distance for the screen measurements for each of the resolutions?

UHD BD and streaming has a greater bit-rate which can reduce compression artifacts visible from a greater distance than the charts indicate.


- Rich
King Richard likes this.

Oppo UPD-205 x 2 | UPD-203 | Sonica DAC | Emotiva RMC-1 | Revel Salon2s, Voice2, Studio2s | Benchmark AHB2 x 5 | ATI AT522NC | Velodyne HGS-15 | LG 77C9 | Lumagen 2020 | HDFury Vertex2 x 2
RichB is online now  
post #12943 of 30262 Old 02-02-2017, 10:28 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
mrtickleuk's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2016
Location: Birmingham, UK - you know, the original one!
Posts: 8,747
Mentioned: 211 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6095 Post(s)
Liked: 8826
Quote:
Originally Posted by RichB View Post
UHD BD and streaming has a greater bit-rate which can reduce compression artifacts visible from a greater distance than the charts indicate.


- Rich
I don't know why you lumped "UHD BD and streaming" together. The bitrates on UHD BD normally dwarf the bitrates on streaming services, sometimes by a factor of 4:1.
galonzo likes this.

_______________
Denon AVR-X4200W, Arcam Alpha 8P; 5.1.4 setup: Mission 702e, M7C1i, 77DS, 731. Rel T5 Sub. Monitor Audio CT165 4 Tops | LG OLED55C8PLA TV | Samsung UBD-K8500 UHD Blu-Ray

HDMI 2.0 4K modes | Dolby & DTS core+outer audio tracks on (UHD) Blu-Rays | Hello to Jason Isaacs
mrtickleuk is online now  
post #12944 of 30262 Old 02-02-2017, 11:04 AM
Oppo Beta Group
 
RichB's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 1999
Location: Massachusetts
Posts: 11,400
Mentioned: 48 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2139 Post(s)
Liked: 1582
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrtickleuk View Post
I don't know why you lumped "UHD BD and streaming" together. The bitrates on UHD BD normally dwarf the bitrates on streaming services, sometimes by a factor of 4:1.
I lumped them together is that regardless of their native bandwidth UHD always uses more which can provide have less artifacts. All 4K content I have viewed on Netflix, for example, looks considerably better than the 1080p version.

This difference has more to do with compression than with eye charts.

- Rich

Oppo UPD-205 x 2 | UPD-203 | Sonica DAC | Emotiva RMC-1 | Revel Salon2s, Voice2, Studio2s | Benchmark AHB2 x 5 | ATI AT522NC | Velodyne HGS-15 | LG 77C9 | Lumagen 2020 | HDFury Vertex2 x 2
RichB is online now  
post #12945 of 30262 Old 02-02-2017, 11:30 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
morphinapg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 4,243
Mentioned: 43 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2593 Post(s)
Liked: 2303
Quote:
Originally Posted by RichB View Post
UHD BD and streaming has a greater bit-rate which can reduce compression artifacts visible from a greater distance than the charts indicate.


- Rich
That's definitely true. Even if you're only seeing 1080p worth of detail, that detail will still look better than a 1080p encode because of the greater bitrate, although I don't think UHD streaming would be better bitrate than 1080p Blu-ray in most cases. Also, like I said before, the better chroma subsampling and obviously the HDR.

Living Room: Sony XBR65X930D, Sony HT-Z9F, Philips BDP7501
Bedroom: LG OLED55C6P, Denon AVR-X1300W (5.1.2), PS4 Pro, Sony UBP-X700, Chromecast Ultra
Check out my video game movie edits
morphinapg is offline  
post #12946 of 30262 Old 02-02-2017, 12:32 PM
Advanced Member
 
OLED4UNME's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 643
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 544 Post(s)
Liked: 451
Quote:
Originally Posted by alexanderg823 View Post
saw jack reacher in DV on vudu. looked alright.
can't help but just not really be blown away most of the 4k UHD stuff recently. seems like such a marginal upgrade compared to when 1080p Blu Ray dropped ~10 years ago, the impact lasted for years afterwards.
Perhaps it's not the original HDR source which is marginal; rather what is marginal are the displays that folks are using to view their HDR content, combined with a streaming service that further compresses the signal.

You did not mention what display you used.

The Vizio P-series cannot get anywhere near bright enough to do HDR any justice, and neither do the OLEDs, although they are better than the Vizios. Neither these nor the Sony X940D come anywhere close to 1000 nits, so none of these could be considered stellar HDR performers.

So it is not surprising that some are not wowed by HDR, when they are streaming it to displays which are not stellar HDR performers.

Of course it goes without saying that not all content is well suited for showing off HDR. If the film has many dark and dim scenes and not a lot of outdoor daylight scenes, than the HDR version may not be all that impressive.
King Richard and mrtickleuk like this.
OLED4UNME is offline  
post #12947 of 30262 Old 02-02-2017, 12:37 PM
UHD Addict
 
aaronwt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Northern VA(Woodbridge)
Posts: 36,839
Mentioned: 78 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 9926 Post(s)
Liked: 6563
I've always been amazed at how good HDR looks from my low end Sony 850C. I figured since it looks so good from my TV, something like the Sony 940D or Z series must look mind boggling.

Especially since my TV can't get anywhere near 1000 nits. Many times I already need to turn away because things can get too bright with my Sony 850C(Like happened a few times last night when I watched the Deep Water Horizon UHD BD). So I couldn't imagine a TV that has three times brightness. It seems like I would be almost blinded by it.
tmdorsey, gwsat and kwhite666 like this.

57TB unRAID1a--49TB unRAID2--76TB unRAID3
TCL 6 Series--Sony UBP-X800--Philips BDP7502--Onkyo HT-S7800
XBL/PSN: WormholeXtreme
aaronwt is offline  
post #12948 of 30262 Old 02-02-2017, 12:48 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
puddy77's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 2,330
Mentioned: 12 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1230 Post(s)
Liked: 2677
Quote:
Originally Posted by OLED4UNME View Post
Perhaps it's not the original HDR source which is marginal; rather what is marginal are the displays that folks are using to view their HDR content, combined with a streaming service that further compresses the signal.

You did not mention what display you used.

The Vizio P-series cannot get anywhere near bright enough to do HDR any justice, and neither do the OLEDs, although they are better than the Vizios. Neither these nor the Sony X940D come anywhere close to 1000 nits, so none of these could be considered stellar HDR performers.

So it is not surprising that some are not wowed by HDR, when they are streaming it to displays which are not stellar HDR performers.

Of course it goes without saying that not all content is well suited for showing off HDR. If the film has many dark and dim scenes and not a lot of outdoor daylight scenes, than the HDR version may not be all that impressive.
No, it is the source. I saw Jack Reacher: Never Go Back in a Dolby Cinema. It was not impressive. It looked like a better than average SDR grade.
puddy77 is offline  
post #12949 of 30262 Old 02-02-2017, 01:12 PM
AVS Forum Addicted Member
 
gwsat's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Tulsa
Posts: 21,163
Mentioned: 101 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4550 Post(s)
Liked: 6054
Quote:
Originally Posted by aaronwt View Post
I've always been amazed at how good HDR looks from my low end Sony 850C. I figured since it looks so good from my TV, something like the Sony 940D or Z series must look mind boggling.

Especially since my TV can't get anywhere near 1000 nits. Many times I already need to turn away because things can get too bright with my Sony 850C(Like happened a few times last night when I watched the Deep Water Horizon UHD BD). So I couldn't imagine a TV that has three times brightness. It seems like I would be almost blinded by it.
I bought the Deepwater Horizon UHD HDR disk. I played it on an Oppo UDP-203 player and viewed it on a Sony 75XBR X940D. It looks startlingly wonderful, to my eyes at least, but I agree that I wouldn't want the brightest images to have been any brighter.

Speaking of good UHD HDR, I really liked how good the UHD HDR version of Inferno looked. I might add that its Atmos soundtrack is terrific too.
hsinnott, ray0414 and King Richard like this.

HT setup: Sony 75XBR X940D UHD HDR TV; Kaleidescape Strato Movie Server 6 TB and Terra Server 24 TB; Yamaha RX-A3060 AV receiver; Sonamp 2-1 2channel 100W power amp; Crestron Control System; 2 Rythmik FV18 subwoofers, 6 Hsu HB-1 Bookshelf speakers, 1 Hsu HC-1 Center speaker, 4 Focal ICW8 in-ceiling Atmos speakers; Oppo UDP-203 4K HDR BD player. TiVO Bolt 1TB DVR; TiVo Premiere Elite 2 TB DVR; Roku Premiere+; Apple TV 4K
gwsat is offline  
post #12950 of 30262 Old 02-02-2017, 01:20 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 2,938
Mentioned: 18 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1932 Post(s)
Liked: 1159
Quote:
Originally Posted by OLED4UNME View Post
Perhaps it's not the original HDR source which is marginal; rather what is marginal are the displays that folks are using to view their HDR content, combined with a streaming service that further compresses the signal.

You did not mention what display you used.

The Vizio P-series cannot get anywhere near bright enough to do HDR any justice, and neither do the OLEDs, although they are better than the Vizios. Neither these nor the Sony X940D come anywhere close to 1000 nits, so none of these could be considered stellar HDR performers.

So it is not surprising that some are not wowed by HDR, when they are streaming it to displays which are not stellar HDR performers.

Of course it goes without saying that not all content is well suited for showing off HDR. If the film has many dark and dim scenes and not a lot of outdoor daylight scenes, than the HDR version may not be all that impressive.
That would be true if most films used 1000 nits or more, for more than 25-30 percent over the duration of the film. If peak nits were full screen, that would be another thing.

HDR is much more than nits and brightness, I think being able to maintain color saturation at higher nits without the color desaturating to white is much more HDR then blinding brightness on a display.

Dark scenes can look a amazing, all content depends on the source. The colorist and director intent.

Sent from my 5054N using Tapatalk
mrtickleuk likes this.

Last edited by DisplayCalNoob; 02-02-2017 at 01:24 PM.
DisplayCalNoob is offline  
post #12951 of 30262 Old 02-02-2017, 02:22 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
cmdrdredd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: FL
Posts: 7,114
Mentioned: 39 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4262 Post(s)
Liked: 4574
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigck417 View Post
Have to say I'm really looking forward to Fantastic Beasts coming out in March. Looks like it has a 4K DI and some of that stuff should really "wow"


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Saw it in IMAX with the dual laser projectors and it was legitimately good visually
King Richard likes this.

LG 65" B7A OLED, Samsung 55" JS9000, Sony 43" x800e, Denon AVR-X2200w 5.1.2, PS4 Pro, Nintendo Switch, Gaming PC(GTX 1080ti + 4.7Ghz 8700k), Sony UBP-x800, Philips BDP-7501, Oppo BDP-203, Nvidia Shield TV
2x Elac F5/Elac C5/2x AR PS2052/2x Pioneer SP-T22A-LR/Power Sound Audio 15v w/ Anti-Mode 8033S-II
cmdrdredd is offline  
post #12952 of 30262 Old 02-02-2017, 02:25 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
cmdrdredd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: FL
Posts: 7,114
Mentioned: 39 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4262 Post(s)
Liked: 4574
Master List of currently available 4k HDR titles, will be updated often.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ray0414 View Post
Slightly off topic but not completely...because everyone has been curious how Dolby Vision will pass through devices if at all..



Denon and Marantz has announced that some of their receivers are being updated for Dolby Vision and HLG. unfortunately, it is only their current models.





The D + M Group will publish selected for AV receivers and preamplifiers their brands Denon and Marantz, a firmware update that allows the devices, metadata according to the HDR specifications "Dolby Vision" and "HLG" (Hybrid Log Gamma ). However, this update is only available for the current Denon models AVR-X1300W, AVR-X2300W, AVR-X3300W, AVR-X4300H and AVR-X6300H as well as the current Marantz models NR1607, SR5011, SR6011, SR7011 and AV7703. In addition, D + M intends to make it available only at the end of 2017 or early 2018; Extensive tests are planned.








https://www.heise.de/newsticker/meld...e-3614979.html


That press release doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me. The fact that Dolby and the various pre-pro and AVR manufacturers have not mentioned anything about it prior to this makes me skeptical about what they are trying to say. I mean how could Onkyo, Yamaha, Emotiva and others be silent on this when we are about a month and a half away from projected DV disc releases? Especially odd considering they expect it to release late 2017 or early 2018. I remember their promises for DTS:X firmware updates that took about half a year longer to release than they said.

Though as someone mentioned before the dual hdmi output from most UHD players makes this not much of an issue but it would be nice to know it works. Guess we will wait and see what happens in the long run.
captainbrent likes this.

LG 65" B7A OLED, Samsung 55" JS9000, Sony 43" x800e, Denon AVR-X2200w 5.1.2, PS4 Pro, Nintendo Switch, Gaming PC(GTX 1080ti + 4.7Ghz 8700k), Sony UBP-x800, Philips BDP-7501, Oppo BDP-203, Nvidia Shield TV
2x Elac F5/Elac C5/2x AR PS2052/2x Pioneer SP-T22A-LR/Power Sound Audio 15v w/ Anti-Mode 8033S-II

Last edited by cmdrdredd; 02-02-2017 at 02:38 PM.
cmdrdredd is offline  
post #12953 of 30262 Old 02-02-2017, 02:27 PM
Advanced Member
 
Masterbrew2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 510
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 167 Post(s)
Liked: 195
Quote:
Originally Posted by cmdrdredd View Post
Saw it in IMAX with the dual laser projectors and it was legitimately good visually
I'm worried all the CGI (which I'm guessing there's a lot of) will look soft and unnatural as usual compared to the 4K camera footage?

LG 55EA970 OLED
LG OLED65C6P
LG OLED77C9
Masterbrew2 is offline  
post #12954 of 30262 Old 02-02-2017, 02:31 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
cmdrdredd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: FL
Posts: 7,114
Mentioned: 39 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4262 Post(s)
Liked: 4574
Master List of currently available 4k HDR titles, will be updated often.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Masterbrew2 View Post
I'm worried all the CGI (which I'm guessing there's a lot of) will look soft and unnatural as usual compared to the 4K camera footage?


It might but in the theater it didn't look bad at all. I don't know if the cgi used a 4k workflow or not on this one.

LG 65" B7A OLED, Samsung 55" JS9000, Sony 43" x800e, Denon AVR-X2200w 5.1.2, PS4 Pro, Nintendo Switch, Gaming PC(GTX 1080ti + 4.7Ghz 8700k), Sony UBP-x800, Philips BDP-7501, Oppo BDP-203, Nvidia Shield TV
2x Elac F5/Elac C5/2x AR PS2052/2x Pioneer SP-T22A-LR/Power Sound Audio 15v w/ Anti-Mode 8033S-II
cmdrdredd is offline  
post #12955 of 30262 Old 02-02-2017, 03:19 PM
Senior Member
 
reanimator's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 416
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 19 Post(s)
Liked: 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by DisplayCalNoob View Post
HDR is much more than nits and brightness, I think being able to maintain color saturation at higher nits without the color desaturating to white is much more HDR then blinding brightness on a display.
Exactly. "Good HDR" doesn't mean my retinas have to get fried.
reanimator is offline  
post #12956 of 30262 Old 02-02-2017, 03:20 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
mrtickleuk's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2016
Location: Birmingham, UK - you know, the original one!
Posts: 8,747
Mentioned: 211 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6095 Post(s)
Liked: 8826
Quote:
Originally Posted by DisplayCalNoob View Post
That would be true if most films used 1000 nits or more, for more than 25-30 percent over the duration of the film. If peak nits were full screen, that would be another thing.

HDR is much more than nits and brightness, I think being able to maintain color saturation at higher nits without the color desaturating to white is much more HDR then blinding brightness on a display.

Dark scenes can look a amazing, all content depends on the source. The colorist and director intent.
Absolutely agree with all of that. Also, specular highlights! A few 1000 nits pixels on the edges of things works wonders. And the reflected lights visible in the pupils of people's eyes. It's not going to be in danger of blinding the viewer, but it makes such a difference if it's properly bright and not a wimp (ish) 400 nits.

_______________
Denon AVR-X4200W, Arcam Alpha 8P; 5.1.4 setup: Mission 702e, M7C1i, 77DS, 731. Rel T5 Sub. Monitor Audio CT165 4 Tops | LG OLED55C8PLA TV | Samsung UBD-K8500 UHD Blu-Ray

HDMI 2.0 4K modes | Dolby & DTS core+outer audio tracks on (UHD) Blu-Rays | Hello to Jason Isaacs
mrtickleuk is online now  
post #12957 of 30262 Old 02-02-2017, 03:38 PM
Advanced Member
 
OLED4UNME's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 643
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 544 Post(s)
Liked: 451
Quote:
Originally Posted by puddy77 View Post
No, it is the source. I saw Jack Reacher: Never Go Back in a Dolby Cinema. It was not impressive. It looked like a better than average SDR grade.
Dolby Cinema at around only 100 nits compared to Dolby "Pulsar" monitor at 4000 nits?? Once again, the theater is not nearly bright enough to show-off HDR in all its full splendor and glory. HDR will be more impressive on flagship consumer displays in your home, like the ~2000 nit Sony Z9D.

Having said that, perhaps the Jack Reacher film is not all that well graded or simply doesn't have the right scenery to take full advantage of the benefit of HDR. But certainly HDR content can look spectacular/dazzling with the right content properly displayed.

For HDR to be more than a "marginal" improvement, one will need the right content, graded/mastered properly, and a display capable of rendering it fully.

Most of us simply do not yet own displays that show off the full capabilities of HDR. If you saw Jack Reacher: Never Go Back on a properly set-up Z9D and told me it was meh, then I would take your word for it.

But on a Vizio, which can't even do 500 nits windowed and does not meet the requirements for UHD Premium certification?
Bandyka likes this.
OLED4UNME is offline  
post #12958 of 30262 Old 02-02-2017, 04:25 PM
Advanced Member
 
OLED4UNME's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 643
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 544 Post(s)
Liked: 451
Quote:
Originally Posted by reanimator View Post
Exactly. "Good HDR" doesn't mean my retinas have to get fried.
Why not, at least in certain examples? You don't have to have an OLED to have "good" blacks. Many displays can do merely "good" blacks. But there is something extra-special about the perfect blacks of OLED, which videophiles crave, now isn't there?

Well it is the same for HDR. Sure, a few consumer displays today can give a "good" HDR performance, but there is something extra-special about a "superb" or "spectacular" HDR performance, just like there is something extra-special about those OLED blacks. The best consumer display for HDR is the Z9D, hands down, and even with that there is quite a bit of room for improvement, so we are a long way from "perfect HDR".

Yesterday was a beautiful clear sunny day, and I went for a walk along the river, to see the eagles. The sun was shining and reflecting off the water, and it was so blindingly bright that I had to turn away and not stare at it too long. If the ultimate goal is to have displays reproduce scenery as close as possible to the real world, then why wouldn't you want your display to be retina-frying, since that is how the sun and reflections from the sun look like in real life?

I think folks who say "My TV is bright enough, I don't need or want any more brightness" either have not experienced or don't fully understand or appreciate the full benefits of HDR, or are jealous that their display cannot get bright enough to compete with the ones which can do 1500-2000 nits (for now), so they attempt to convince themselves that the increased luminance capabilities are superfluous and unnecessary.

Last edited by OLED4UNME; 02-02-2017 at 04:28 PM.
OLED4UNME is offline  
post #12959 of 30262 Old 02-02-2017, 05:13 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
cmdrdredd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: FL
Posts: 7,114
Mentioned: 39 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4262 Post(s)
Liked: 4574
Master List of currently available 4k HDR titles, will be updated often.

Quote:
Originally Posted by OLED4UNME View Post



Yesterday was a beautiful clear sunny day, and I went for a walk along the river, to see the eagles. The sun was shining and reflecting off the water, and it was so blindingly bright that I had to turn away and not stare at it too long. If the ultimate goal is to have displays reproduce scenery as close as possible to the real world, then why wouldn't you want your display to be retina-frying, since that is how the sun and reflections from the sun look like in real life?



I think folks who say "My TV is bright enough, I don't need or want any more brightness" either have not experienced or don't fully understand or appreciate the full benefits of HDR, or are jealous that their display cannot get bright enough to compete with the ones which can do 1500-2000 nits (for now), so they attempt to convince themselves that the increased luminance capabilities are superfluous and unnecessary.

It just not necessary to have the screen so bright you can't look at it. Think about it this way, when outside you have a 360 degree view. If you put a sun reflection on screen as bright as real life you couldn't even look at the screen because it's not large enough for there to be any place to look at that isn't going to be blinding. Further, when you watch a movie in a darkened environment there is no need for it. Insinuating that people are jealous is ridiculous. The brightness is only necessary because most consumers are using LCD tvs in bright living rooms. The black levels of most LCD sets is not that great so a brighter image is going to help the contrast ratio for hdr and the bright room almost requires it. Take an OLED in a room with controlled lighting with its perfect blacks and the contrast ratio between the brightest highlights and the darkest shadow area will easily give the same effect as a LCD with 1000nits.

Black levels help all content and is much more important than brightness. Having blacks that read .5 but the tv goes to 10,000nits would be infinitely worse than perfect blacks at 700nits.

LG 65" B7A OLED, Samsung 55" JS9000, Sony 43" x800e, Denon AVR-X2200w 5.1.2, PS4 Pro, Nintendo Switch, Gaming PC(GTX 1080ti + 4.7Ghz 8700k), Sony UBP-x800, Philips BDP-7501, Oppo BDP-203, Nvidia Shield TV
2x Elac F5/Elac C5/2x AR PS2052/2x Pioneer SP-T22A-LR/Power Sound Audio 15v w/ Anti-Mode 8033S-II
cmdrdredd is offline  
post #12960 of 30262 Old 02-02-2017, 06:42 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
puddy77's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 2,330
Mentioned: 12 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1230 Post(s)
Liked: 2677
Hey everyone, I think Netflix HDR is acting a little bit wonky right now. I don't know if it applies to the HDR10 versions, or just the DV versions. Can anyone with HDR10 check episode 1 of Jessica Jones? Then episode 2 or any other? Ep 1 is only SDR for me, but all the rest are DV.
puddy77 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply High Dynamic Range (HDR) & Wide Color Gamut (WCG)

Tags
dolby vision , hdr10 , JS8500 , KS9800 , ultra hd blu-ray

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off