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post #27541 of 27871 Old 09-20-2019, 03:31 PM
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Originally Posted by galonzo View Post
Sounds like you're watching with native refresh rate disabled, in which case you should also be using 4:2:0 for 4K/60Hz, otherwise I found you'll get banding with 4K/60Hz.
Very good point. If it's outputting 4K60, then there's a grave danger of it using 8bit RGB/4:4:4 instead of what you want, which is 10bit 4:2:0 or 12bit 4:4:4.

But it shouldn't be outputting a 24Hz stream at 60Hz. There's no need to do that and you severely restrict your options.

You want to use 4K24, so that you can have the choice of 10bit RGB/4:4:4 or 12bit RGB/4:4:4/4:2:2.

So - check using the TV's Info display that it is receiving a 24Hz 10/12bit input signal, not 60Hz 8bit.

Conversion to and from 12 bit is a red herring. Remember that 12bit is just 0-4095 instead of 0-1023. It provides more "resolution", but the original 10bit signal does not ever use it!


So that original 10-bit input in the range:
0, 1, 2, 3, 4, […], 1019, 1020, 1021, 1022, 1023

is converted with no rounding and no errors to
0, 4, 8, 12, 16, […], 4076, 4080, 4084, 4088, 4092

and is then converted back, again with with no rounding and no errors to
0, 1, 2, 3, 4, […], 1019, 1020, 1021, 1022, 1023

[edit: argh, my first example was 8 vs 10, instead of 10 vs 12]

Details of these modes are in the first link of my sig...
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post #27542 of 27871 Old 09-20-2019, 05:22 PM
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Originally Posted by lujan View Post
I'm almost the complete opposite as knowing something about a movie usually doesn't affect how well I'm going to like it. In fact I like to know as much as I can about a movie before I see it so I'll go into detailed synopsis or I'll ask in these forums about it. I saw "Spiderman: Far From Home" in the theater before I saw "Avengers: Endgame" and it didn't affect how well I liked "Endgame" but to each his/her own I guess.
I totally agree with you. I started going to movies when I was 16 years old because at that age you could take the bus downtown without being accompanied by a parent. There were three movie theaters in the city and I would usually catch two movies before heading back home for supper.
It doesn't bother me to watch movie previews or read movie reviews.

It makes no difference to me because the only thing that matters is whether or not I like the movie. I believe that everyone experiences life differently and I never argue with anybody who dislikes a movie that I happen to like - to each his own! I used to go to the movie theater twice a week with friends and then they invented the cell phone!#$#.

I stopped going a few years ago and built a movie theater in my basement with Dolby ATMOS surround sound - three rows of ceiling speakers - and a 100" screen!
No cellphones allowed!

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post #27543 of 27871 Old 09-21-2019, 12:00 AM - Thread Starter
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You guys are gonna laugh at me, but I just picked up my new iPhone 11 pro max, Now I just wish this phone was 65” lol.


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post #27544 of 27871 Old 09-21-2019, 02:49 AM
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I just watched "Aladdin" 2019 4k Dolby Vision last night and have to say this one is total visual eye candy. The colors just pop and the picture is crisp and clean. I enjoyed the story and well so I highly recommend this one.

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post #27545 of 27871 Old 09-21-2019, 04:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mrtickleuk View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by galonzo View Post
Sounds like you're watching with native refresh rate disabled, in which case you should also be using 4:2:0 for 4K/60Hz, otherwise I found you'll get banding with 4K/60Hz.
Very good point. If it's outputting 4K60, then there's a grave danger of it using 8bit RGB/4:4:4 instead of what you want, which is 10bit 4:2:0 or 12bit 4:4:4.

But it shouldn't be outputting a 24Hz stream at 60Hz. There's no need to do that and you severely restrict your options.

You want to use 4K24, so that you can have the choice of 10bit RGB/4:4:4 or 12bit RGB/4:4:4/4:2:2.

So - check using the TV's Info display that it is receiving a 24Hz 10/12bit input signal, not 60Hz 8bit.

Conversion to and from 12 bit is a red herring. Remember that 12bit is just 0-4095 instead of 0-1023. It provides more "resolution", but the original 10bit signal does not ever use it!


So that original 10-bit input in the range:
0, 1, 2, 3, 4, […], 1019, 1020, 1021, 1022, 1023

is converted with no rounding and no errors to
0, 4, 8, 12, 16, […], 4076, 4080, 4084, 4088, 4092

and is then converted back, again with with no rounding and no errors to
0, 1, 2, 3, 4, […], 1019, 1020, 1021, 1022, 1023

[edit: argh, my first example was 8 vs 10, instead of 10 vs 12]

Details of these modes are in the first link of my sig... [IMG class=inlineimg]/forum/images/smilies/smile.gif[/IMG]
Roku doesnt have the option of anything other than 4K HDR 60p or 4K HDR 30p.

And I tried changing all display settings in oppo as well but it made no difference. First episode of JR, anytime they are Greer's office, the entire background is jaggiedy and bandy. I am 99% its the content and not the settings. Everything else on netflix, vudu, discs, WWE app, PS4 seems fine.

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post #27546 of 27871 Old 09-21-2019, 05:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by b0rnarian View Post
Roku doesnt have the option of anything other than 4K HDR 60p or 4K HDR 30p.
Oh, sorry I didn't know that :-(

Quote:
And I tried changing all display settings in oppo as well but it made no difference. First episode of JR, anytime they are Greer's office, the entire background is jaggiedy and bandy. I am 99% its the content and not the settings. Everything else on netflix, vudu, discs, WWE app, PS4 seems fine.
In that case I would try to use the TV's internal apps as much as possible. Only use the Roku for things where there's no internal app.

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post #27547 of 27871 Old 09-21-2019, 05:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mrtickleuk View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by b0rnarian View Post
Roku doesnt have the option of anything other than 4K HDR 60p or 4K HDR 30p.
Oh, sorry I didn't know that 😞

Quote:
And I tried changing all display settings in oppo as well but it made no difference. First episode of JR, anytime they are Greer's office, the entire background is jaggiedy and bandy. I am 99% its the content and not the settings. Everything else on netflix, vudu, discs, WWE app, PS4 seems fine.
In that case I would try to use the TV's internal apps as much as possible. Only use the Roku for things where there's no internal app.
Lol definitely wont be doing that as Id rather have Atmos and banding on the two shows than 5.1 sound. All the other apps are just better on Roku as well.
Also, surprisingly my amazon app on the KS9800 doesnt even work for me to try, i click on the app and all i get is a black screen, all other apps work fine. Weird.

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post #27548 of 27871 Old 09-21-2019, 05:39 AM
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post #27549 of 27871 Old 09-21-2019, 07:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mrtickleuk View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by b0rnarian View Post
Roku doesnt have the option of anything other than 4K HDR 60p or 4K HDR 30p.
Oh, sorry I didn't know that :-(

In that case I would try to use the TV's internal apps as much as possible. Only use the Roku for things where there's no internal app.
Quote:
Originally Posted by b0rnarian View Post
Lol definitely wont be doing that as Id rather have Atmos and banding on the two shows than 5.1 sound. All the other apps are just better on Roku as well.
Also, surprisingly my amazon app on the KS9800 doesnt even work for me to try, i click on the app and all i get is a black screen, all other apps work fine. Weird.
Native refresh rate and "HDR subsampling" can be found under Settings >> System >> Advanced system settings >> Advanced display settings in the Roku, and I have my Oppo set to output Custom >> UHD Auto, Auto for "Color Depth", and "Color Space" set to 4:2:0 (for when the native signal is 4K/60Hz; it auto-defaults to a more "legal" 4:2:2 for 24Hz content).

Note that Roku (in their infinite wisdom), decided to change the Netflix app so that it doesn't respect the native refresh rate setting .
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post #27550 of 27871 Old 09-21-2019, 07:38 PM
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When to the Apple store to see the new iPhone 11 Pro Max. There were 2 clips on the phone Aquaman and Bumblebee. Aquaman looked incredible, I assume it was in Dolby Vision because the battle (clip) at the end looked incredibly vibrant. Bumblebee also looked fantastic. Warning to all if you see, it you will want one!


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post #27551 of 27871 Old 09-22-2019, 12:46 AM
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When to the Apple store to see the new iPhone 11 Pro Max. There were 2 clips on the phone Aquaman and Bumblebee. Aquaman looked incredible, I assume it was in Dolby Vision because the battle (clip) at the end looked incredibly vibrant. Bumblebee also looked fantastic. Warning to all if you see, it you will want one!

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I don't know about others but I don't ever watch full length movies on my phone... Even on a plane I may watch on an iPad but not a phone.

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post #27552 of 27871 Old 09-22-2019, 05:42 AM
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I don't know about others but I don't ever watch full length movies on my phone... Even on a plane I may watch on an iPad but not a phone.


Agree, I’ve done it in a pinch but prefer my iPad.


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post #27553 of 27871 Old 09-22-2019, 07:17 AM
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I don't know about others but I don't ever watch full length movies on my phone... Even on a plane I may watch on an iPad but not a phone.
Agreed, I wouldn't watch a movie on my telephone. In the same way I don't listen to music from a single mono speaker. I'm patient enough to wait until I am in front of a TV
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post #27554 of 27871 Old 09-22-2019, 09:34 AM
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Target is running a promotion now with "Buy 2, get one free" so I was able to order 3 of the new Marvel titles on 4k disc at 1/3 off.

I ordered:

Guardians of the Galaxy
Ant Man
Doctor Strange

Just a heads up if anyone might be interested.

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post #27555 of 27871 Old 09-22-2019, 12:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lujan View Post
Target is running a promotion now with "Buy 2, get one free" so I was able to order 3 of the new Marvel titles on 4k disc at 1/3 off.



I ordered:



Guardians of the Galaxy

Ant Man

Doctor Strange



Just a heads up if anyone might be interested.


Are they shipping those now or is it pre-order only?


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post #27556 of 27871 Old 09-22-2019, 12:18 PM
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Are they shipping those now or is it pre-order only?

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Pre-order, but usually these "get one free" promotions don't include pre-orders so I'm taking advantage now.
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post #27557 of 27871 Old 09-22-2019, 12:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by galonzo View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrtickleuk View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by b0rnarian View Post
Roku doesnt have the option of anything other than 4K HDR 60p or 4K HDR 30p.
Oh, sorry I didn't know that 😞

In that case I would try to use the TV's internal apps as much as possible. Only use the Roku for things where there's no internal app.
Quote:
Originally Posted by b0rnarian View Post
Lol definitely wont be doing that as Id rather have Atmos and banding on the two shows than 5.1 sound. All the other apps are just better on Roku as well.
Also, surprisingly my amazon app on the KS9800 doesnt even work for me to try, i click on the app and all i get is a black screen, all other apps work fine. Weird.
Native refresh rate and "HDR subsampling" can be found under Settings >> System >> Advanced system settings >> Advanced display settings in the Roku, and I have my Oppo set to output Custom >> UHD Auto, Auto for "Color Depth", and "Color Space" set to 4:2:0 (for when the native signal is 4K/60Hz; it auto-defaults to a more "legal" 4:2:2 for 24Hz content).

Note that Roku (in their infinite wisdom), decided to change the Netflix app so that it doesn't respect the native refresh rate setting [IMG class=inlineimg]/forum/images/smilies/mad.gif[/IMG].
Thank you for that little Roku secret. And I tried it all with different oppo and roku combinations and had zero luck getting rid of the banding. I finally got my internal tv app to work and saw the same banding in same exact places so im gonna chalk this up to the programming for once and all and not any settings i have on the tv/players.
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post #27558 of 27871 Old 09-22-2019, 02:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lujan View Post
Target is running a promotion now with "Buy 2, get one free" so I was able to order 3 of the new Marvel titles on 4k disc at 1/3 off.



I ordered:



Guardians of the Galaxy

Ant Man

Doctor Strange



Just a heads up if anyone might be interested.


Great deal but I signed up for 3 years for Disney+ w/ the D23 discount rate. Will those titles be offered with Dolby Vision or its too soon to know.


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post #27559 of 27871 Old 09-22-2019, 03:10 PM
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Originally Posted by helvetica bold View Post
Great deal but I signed up for 3 years for Disney+ w/ the D23 discount rate. Will those titles be offered with Dolby Vision or its too soon to know.

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Who knows? I signed up as well but mostly for the original TV shows rather than movies.
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post #27560 of 27871 Old 09-22-2019, 03:24 PM
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Originally Posted by helvetica bold View Post
Great deal but I signed up for 3 years for Disney+ w/ the D23 discount rate. Will those titles be offered with Dolby Vision or its too soon to know.


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Much too soon. Titles will have Dolby Vision/Atmos “when available”...the one title that is on there now that has no disc yet is Rogue One. We should know more in November on release and December/January when NetFlix’s contract ends.
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post #27561 of 27871 Old 09-22-2019, 03:27 PM
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Much too soon. Titles will have Dolby Vision/Atmos “when available”...the one title that is on there now that has no disc yet is Rogue One. We should know more in November on release and December/January when NetFlix’s contract ends.
Yeah, who knows if some other movies might be available on D23 and not on disc in 4k? I will be watching those if this is the case.

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post #27562 of 27871 Old 09-22-2019, 03:38 PM
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Not strictly about a title, but this will interest some people here I'm sure.

Nice mini-rant from Vincent about Dolby's poor labelling on Dolby Vision discs:

(10m 54s in)
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post #27563 of 27871 Old 09-22-2019, 06:23 PM
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Originally Posted by lujan View Post
Yeah, who knows if some other movies might be available on D23 and not on disc in 4k? I will be watching those if this is the case.


I doubt we’d see something without some kind of release (Digital/Physical), but they now have the ability to offer exclusives or early window access.
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post #27564 of 27871 Old 09-23-2019, 03:03 AM
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Great deal but I signed up for 3 years for Disney+ w/ the D23 discount rate. Will those titles be offered with Dolby Vision or its too soon to know.


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Not to derail the thread, but is Disney+ going to have new movies right away? For example, when a movie is released to buy/rent, it will instantly be on Disney+? Or will it be similar to Netflix and be a few months later? Just trying to determine if buying Disney movies even makes sense if they will be available day 1 on Disney+
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post #27565 of 27871 Old 09-23-2019, 03:05 AM
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Not to derail the thread, but is Disney+ going to have new movies right away? For example, when a movie is released to buy/rent, it will instantly be on Disney+? Or will it be similar to Netflix and be a few months later? Just trying to determine if buying Disney movies even makes sense if they will be available day 1 on Disney+
I can't imagine it will be day one. That would hurt their sales. But then again, that's what happened with music streaming so who knows.
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post #27566 of 27871 Old 09-23-2019, 06:16 AM
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It's hard to say until we get to the point where Disney+ is launched, a movie has finished its theatrical run, and there are no other licensing concerns.

I have to imagine though that the release schedule for new movies is probably going to be less about not cannibalizing the disc/digital sales market and more about getting people to keep their sub through original content lulls.
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post #27567 of 27871 Old 09-23-2019, 06:28 AM
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I also think people are probably overestimating what movies will have HDR. I don't necessarily think every movie available on 4K Blu-ray will have HDR on D+. "Where available" doesn't necessarily mean every movie that happens to have an HDR grade out there somewhere. I just know Disney has a history of not living up to our expectations about a lot of their 4K releases, so I'm lowering my expectations.

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post #27568 of 27871 Old 09-23-2019, 06:34 AM
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All we can do is go by the evidence we've seen so far with the trail launch in Netherlands. That actually has more HDR content than what's available on disc currently (Rogue One.)
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post #27569 of 27871 Old 09-23-2019, 07:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mattopotamus View Post
Not to derail the thread, but is Disney+ going to have new movies right away? For example, when a movie is released to buy/rent, it will instantly be on Disney+? Or will it be similar to Netflix and be a few months later? Just trying to determine if buying Disney movies even makes sense if they will be available day 1 on Disney+


No difference from what I have heard, which is why Endgame comes in December, not at launch. This could change at anytime, but as it’s been said earlier, Disney still makes money of Physical/Digital sales, so no need to ruin that.
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post #27570 of 27871 Old 09-23-2019, 08:00 AM
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All we can do is go by the evidence we've seen so far with the trail launch in Netherlands. That actually has more HDR content than what's available on disc currently (Rogue One.)
That's great to hear! Do you have more details on what's available with that?

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