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post #151 of 198 Old 05-03-2020, 10:47 AM
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I say everyone in these Corona threads get back to their old hobbies of Audio and Video.
You first.

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post #152 of 198 Old 05-03-2020, 11:10 AM
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Spoiler!

Yep, believe whatever you want to believe based on whatever evidence you choose to believe. Most of the points brought up here have been previously addressed. Just to point out a couple of the more obvious, the number of deaths from COVID-19 vs. flu in a single medical facility is not representative of the country as a whole. The CDC estimates that ~61,000 died of flu in the US in the worst full (12-month) flu season of the past decade while even with widespread social distancing >61,000 have died of COVID-19 in the US in the first 3 months of the pandemic.

As for reporting COVID-19 as possible cause of death even without a test, that's from the CDC's Guidance for Certifying Deaths Due to Coronavirus Disease 2019 (COVID–19) which is similar to how the CDC estimates annual flu deaths:

Quote:
In cases where a definite diagnosis of COVID–19 cannot
be made, but it is suspected or likely (e.g., the circumstances
are compelling within a reasonable degree of certainty), it
is acceptable to report COVID–19 on a death certificate as
“probable” or “presumed.” In these instances, certifiers should
use their best clinical judgement in determining if a COVID–19
infection was likely. However, please note that testing for
COVID–19 should be conducted whenever possible.
cdc.gov/nchs/data/nvss/vsrg/vsrg03-508.pdf
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post #153 of 198 Old 05-03-2020, 11:37 AM
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Originally Posted by D Bone View Post
Somewhere in this thread I read that someone said "The government already bailed us out"???? Really?? That $1,200 "bailed" you out?? Tell that to my Southern Californian based family owned and operated business of 43 years.

I don't watch any of the propaganda machine that some of you call 24hr news..... Red/Blue/Left/Right.... none of it.

I live in a SoCal city of over 268,000 people and only 2 hospitals, and my long time specialist Dr not only owns a successful private practice, but is also the head of a department in one of those hospitals. The department treats an organ in our bodies that if it stops working, you are usually dead in minutes.

5 days ago, I decided to make an apt at their private practice for not only a check up, but to get some 1st hand, no BS, no agenda, no fake news information from the HEAD of a hospital to hear what he/she has seen.

The Dr told me that as of that day, there were 31 C19 patients currently at the hospital and that they have had 4 deaths in the total days since C19 became a thing, and "Not just from the day CA was forced into lock down". He said that he predicts that "3 of those 31 patients will never leave the hospital", while "The other 28 are in varying stages of recovery and all have good prognoses".

He/she also told me that they're being "Strongly encouraged by the hospital's BoDs to add COVID to the possible causes of any future non traumatic deaths - even when NOT TESTED", which they are "Absolutely opposed to doing", but says they know why, "It's all a money thing" they said as they rubbed their thumb and finger together. EDIT to add: They also said that they have spoken to "Several of their colleagues throughout the country, and they have reported the same "encouragement" by their hospitals."

He/she also told me that from Oct 1 2019 to before COVID ("somewhere in mid to late Feb 2020") that the same hospital had 27 deaths related from the everyday, seasonal flu.

He/she also said that "When people do get really sick from 19, they do get REALLY sick". They also said that "Every, single one of the 4 deaths were all stage 2 or higher in obesity, and they all shared various previous breathing issues as well", but did not go into detail.

He/She is also very worried about the future, "Because like every other virus on the planet, 19 is going to morph consistently", and calls the media's claims of a possible upcoming vaccine, "A nice wish".

They also worry that this is "Our new normal", and that "The politicians will close the country again, and again now that they have seen how easily we are controlled"......."Give those rats a cookie, and they're gonna drink a gallon of milk".

He/she also thinks that CA should reopen immediately, and like for the previous 200,000 plus years before us, "Heard immunity is the one true defense we all have."


So there you go, that's the current state in my town. I'm just some other faceless dude on the internet, and you're free to not believe a word I have said and go on watching that glorious fear mongering propaganda machine, or digest some of a Dr's first hand experience and do some of your own thinking..... I sure as hell know which one I'm believing, but it's your call.
lol.. what $1200?.. a bunch of us that "should" have received direct deposit payments are still waiting...
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post #154 of 198 Old 05-03-2020, 11:55 AM
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A doctor wanting to let 'heard' immunity kick in? I'd check out his diploma, see where he/she bought it. Do you have kids and take them to that ignorant piece of ****? jesus effing christ, FFS, my forehead is begging for me to leave it alone. This fool wants to go with the quality of medical care we've had for the last 200,000 years. Me, I prefer the care we've gotten at least since antibiotics were around myself [antibiotics don't work on viruses, yes I know, but vaccines been around for 100s of years]. Ask yourself what it might take for herd immunity to kick in. If you can't figure out how brain dead your 'doctor' truly is, get back with me and I'll explain.
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post #155 of 198 Old 05-03-2020, 12:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Art Sonneborn View Post
You first.

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post #156 of 198 Old 05-04-2020, 09:39 AM
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Jersey

I live in New Jersey and it's terrible here...
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post #157 of 198 Old 05-04-2020, 09:56 AM
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I live in a small tourist town in the desert SW. Friday May 1st our state allowed some non-essential business open with the usual safety requirements.


Until now, we only had 3 cases. 2 of which we know were absolutely brought in from people visiting friends from out of town. Our town (with some grumbling) absolutely did a fantastic job. We had a few classic symptom cases early and we contact traced and kept it under complete control.


From Friday, there were definitely people coming in from out of town. I could tell some of the people (western independent mentality) that they thought this lockdown was all garbage - I estimate now it's about 10% of the people. There is still plenty of spacing easily possible among everyone.


What we have here is a perfect experiment. So, we'll see who is right here in about 2 or 3 weeks as we only have one hospital here within 100 miles. Stay tuned.
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post #158 of 198 Old 05-04-2020, 12:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ratman View Post
After the keyboard doctors, lawyers, politicians, mercenaries and those crying for attention.
I may resemble that remark.... I may also just be trying to learn and put (what I believe is) a reasonable viewpoint out there. One driven, I hope at least, more by actual science and numbers. Despite recognizing that those with agendas can always toy with the numbers -- the raw data itself is only as good as the people analyzing it.
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post #159 of 198 Old 05-04-2020, 02:50 PM
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I’m not going to get into what is a not so thinly veiled political discussion since the government itself seems to be playing that game. If we, as a country, can’t come together at a time like this, our future doesn’t look too promising.

I live in the NYC metro region and had 2 friends who have died from this. I spoke to one 3 weeks before he got sick and he joked he would probably have to put off his vacation this year. We weren't even allowed even go to his funeral.

It’s one thing to speak about the virus in the abstract, but when it hits close to home, it changes things.


I know things aren’t as bad elsewhere as in NY, but the way we’re treating this, the possibility of a disaster is so much potentially worse. The US has 4% of the world’s population but we have over 25% of the world’s COVID deaths.

It doesn't care if you believe in it or not. It doesn't care what political ideas you have. It doesn't care about our economy. It doesn't think. It just looks for a place to reproduce.

Right now, we are doing everything we can to help it out.
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post #160 of 198 Old 05-04-2020, 03:31 PM
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Originally Posted by ti-triodes View Post
I’m not going to get into what is a not so thinly veiled political discussion since the government itself seems to be playing that game. If we, as a country, can’t come together at a time like this, our future doesn’t look too promising.
The odds are pretty dim, not surprising when that orange thing in the oval office and his supporters insist on a reality not in evidence. It's never a good strategy to deny reality. It's an even worse strategy to live in a reality that is ever shifting but absurd most of the time.
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post #161 of 198 Old 05-04-2020, 04:16 PM
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Originally Posted by ti-triodes View Post

I know things aren’t as bad elsewhere as in NY, but the way we’re treating this, the possibility of a disaster is so much potentially worse. The US has 4% of the world’s population but we have over 25% of the world’s COVID deaths.

It doesn't care if you believe in it or not. It doesn't care what political ideas you have. It doesn't care about our economy. It doesn't think. It just looks for a place to reproduce.

I've been checking in around the world. There are going to be some real disasters out there - but based on large populations and how they are going to deal with it - the big numbers will be in Russia (they won't give accurate numbers but some people are connected to the outside world we'll be somewhat informed), India (no running water in so many places, crowding, there are so many without internet, we'll never know), Pakistan (they're all crammed in together) and Brazil. It won't be pretty in each of those places but it'll take time. Huge numbers there if anyone cares.
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post #162 of 198 Old 05-04-2020, 08:19 PM
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It's tough in the big apple.



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post #163 of 198 Old 05-04-2020, 10:40 PM
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It's tough in the big apple.

OK, I'll bite.


Yes it is, to the core!
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post #164 of 198 Old 05-06-2020, 08:12 AM
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It's almost none existent here in Sonoma Co. [211 cases 2 deaths] the same goes for all the neighboring counties, in fact the entire SF Bay area has 7307 cases with 255 death for a metro area of 5 million. SoCal is a different story, but new cases are declining nonetheless at least for now.


https://www.covidus.com/coronavirus/usa/california/

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post #165 of 198 Old 05-06-2020, 12:05 PM
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post #166 of 198 Old 05-06-2020, 01:45 PM
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It's tough in the big apple.

Favorite tenderizer?




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post #167 of 198 Old 05-10-2020, 09:20 AM
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Is there a Pandemic????

I know all the media Scream Pandemic but looking at the numbers??

The part being left out is percentage of the population affected.
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post #168 of 198 Old 05-10-2020, 09:29 AM
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Pandemic has to do with spread more than numbers. We experience pandemics every year when an epidemic spreads over countries or continents across the world. Flu, measles, etc.
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post #169 of 198 Old 05-10-2020, 10:01 AM
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Of course we have yearly Flu's and such but why shut down the Whole Country when the numbers show us that here in the US we only 0.40% have been affected? And World Wide numbers are 0.052%

Is this Flu a bad one? Sure, this is not to minimize those who have been affected but to shut down the Whole US and World economies, seems like severe over reaction and make's me question validity of the decision.

And as far as a vaccine go's When have they ever released a yearly Flu vaccine that hit the mark in the last 20 years? They always have excuses on why it did not hit the mark.

Something seems real fishy.
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post #170 of 198 Old 05-10-2020, 10:09 AM
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Depends on who you believe, the medical community or some clever anonymous person on social media whose medical expertise ends at applying a band-aid.

In the beginning a pandemic may not affect an exceptionally high proportion of the population. So let's go back to Webster's dictionary for another definition:

Quote:
exponential: characterized by or being an extremely rapid increase (as in size or extent); an exponential growth rate
The exponential growth rate of a disease depends on its transmissibility, the amount of herd immunity to the disease and the density and proximity of the population for spreading the disease. The medical community has identified SARS-CoV-2 as highly transmissible and there is zero herd immunity to this novel coronavirus. The only thing slowing its spread is social distancing. But it will eventually spread to every corner of the globe and no community will be untouched.

And that's why the medical community identifies SARS-CoV-2 not only as a pandemic but a public health emergency of international concern.
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post #171 of 198 Old 05-10-2020, 10:11 AM
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Thanks guys, this is a huge contribution to AVS forum. I am not a moderator, but there is a thread for this stuff on the entrance page to clean up the forum.

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post #172 of 198 Old 05-10-2020, 10:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rew452 View Post
Of course we have yearly Flu's and such but why shut down the Whole Country when the numbers show us that here in the US we only 0.40% have been affected? And World Wide numbers are 0.052%

Is this Flu a bad one? Sure, this is not to minimize those who have been affected but to shut down the Whole US and World economies, seems like severe over reaction and make's me question validity of the decision.

And as far as a vaccine go's When have they ever released a yearly Flu vaccine that hit the mark in the last 20 years? They always have excuses on why it did not hit the mark.

Something seems real fishy.

Until there is wide spread testing, we don't know how much of the population is infected/impacted. I'll give you Kansas for example, if you test asymptomatic, they do not count you as part of their Covid-19 numbers.

https://www.kcur.org/news/2020-05-08...counting-cases

When I see a title like this thread, I often ask "what is the OP trying to say or maybe better stated... prove?" I understand the frustration of being out of work etc, and concern and push back coming from that point of reference. But, this view of it's not a serious as ppl are saying boggles my mind.

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post #173 of 198 Old 05-10-2020, 10:15 AM
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Originally Posted by Rew452 View Post
I know all the media Scream Pandemic but looking at the numbers??

The part being left out is percentage of the population affected.
Yeah....the impression I get when comparing some of those numbers is... so what's all the hubbub... bub.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rew452 View Post
Of course we have yearly Flu's and such but why shut down the Whole Country when the numbers show us that here in the US we only 0.40% have been affected? And World Wide numbers are 0.052%

Is this Flu a bad one? Sure, this is not to minimize those who have been affected but to shut down the Whole US and World economies, seems like severe over reaction and make's me question validity of the decision.

And as far as a vaccine go's When have they ever released a yearly Flu vaccine that hit the mark in the last 20 years? They always have excuses on why it did not hit the mark.

Something seems real fishy.
It's your posts that seems fishy. It only took two for you to cut to the chase of suggesting a global plot--how many more before you link to a "plandemic" video?
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post #175 of 198 Old 05-10-2020, 10:21 AM
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Until there is wide spread testing, we don't know how much of the population is infected/impacted. I'll give you Kansas for example, if you test asymptomatic, they do not count you as part of their Covid-19 numbers.

https://www.kcur.org/news/2020-05-08...counting-cases

When I see a title like this thread, I often ask "what is the OP trying to say or maybe better stated... prove?" I understand the frustration of being out of work etc, and concern and push back coming from that point of reference. But, this view of it's not a serious as ppl are saying boggles my mind.
What he is saying is what a lot of us have been saying in Michigan ,half of the known cases are in three or four counties but the state is being treated as one size fits all.The upper peninsula of Michigan has almost no cases and is being held to the same standards. It will be interesting when some of the lockdown is lifted what the response is. Will this just be one lockdown after another since unless she leaves the lockdown as a permanent thing (which I'm starting to be surprised at nothing anymore) we will see large numbers of cases as folks get out..this is inevitable. Are we going to close everything every four months for periods or three months? Not saying this isn't serious and the vulnerable need to get the needed resources but frankly sooner or later most of us are going to be exposed.

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post #176 of 198 Old 05-10-2020, 10:25 AM
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Not sure why this new thread was started in the first place. The misconceptions being presented here have already been addressed in other currently active coronavirus threads. In AV terms this is like a re-run thread.

EDIT: Thanks to the moderators I see now that this has been merged with an existing thread.
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post #177 of 198 Old 05-10-2020, 10:29 AM
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Not sure why this new thread was started in the first place. The misconceptions being presented here have already been addressed in other currently active coronavirus threads. In AV terms this is like a re-run thread.
Not a misconception the hard numbers of cases their distribution and the economic impact are all real.
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post #178 of 198 Old 05-10-2020, 10:41 AM
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What's the point? It's widespread regardless of how one defines the word. A larger issue that intelligent folks understand beyond the transmission rates, death rates, and recovery rates that we have no idea about the lasting effects or later recurring effects this disease may (and most likely will) have on people who we'd like to think have fully recovered or carry the disease with no symptoms. It would be patently ignorant for any leaders or the general population to assume it's a "once and done" disease. Historically the masses will do the very same things they have always done during epidemics, pandemics and plagues while a smaller percentage of intelligent and able people will continue to protect themselves.
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post #179 of 198 Old 05-10-2020, 10:43 AM
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Not a misconception the hard numbers of cases their distribution and the economic impact are all real.
As you well know I and many others have acknowledged the economic impact in other threads where it's still being discussed. Saying the current numbers disqualify SARS-CoV-2 as a pandemic and referring to it as a "flu" are obvious misconceptions.
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post #180 of 198 Old 05-10-2020, 10:44 AM
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Unhappy No, Basic Facts Show There's Nothing Fishy About How COVID-19 Is Hitting The U.S.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rew452 View Post
Of course we have yearly Flu's and such but why shut down the Whole Country when the numbers show us that here in the US we only 0.40% have been affected? And World Wide numbers are 0.052%

Is this Flu a bad one? Sure, this is not to minimize those who have been affected but to shut down the Whole US and World economies, seems like severe over reaction and make's me question validity of the decision.

And as far as a vaccine go's When have they ever released a yearly Flu vaccine that hit the mark in the last 20 years? They always have excuses on why it did not hit the mark.

Something seems real fishy.

No, there's nothing fishy about this situation. Because the plain reality that America has been experiencing a pandemic that has killed, and continues to kill, tens of thousands of Americans, is clearly shown by comparing the average number of daily deaths that occurred in the U.S. in April of 2019, with the much larger number of daily American deaths that occurred on each day of last month, April 2020. The large increase in the number of deaths seen last month vs. those seen in April of last year, will have any medical expert, who possesses a solid reputation, telling you that the spread of the coronavirus in the U.S. is THE factor that accounts for the increase in the amount of deaths that's been observed in comparing April 2019 & April 2020.

So despite various conspiracy theories that some people want to believe in (I'm NOT saying you believe them) in order to be able to minimize the amount of harm COVID-19 is doing to America, as far as I can see, since the number of U.S. COVID-19 related deaths that are STILL occurring about every 40 hours, exceeds 9/11's awful death toll, that means the COVID-19 pandemic is 1 huge, horrible tragedy for our country. I just don't know how anyone could deny that basic fact, especially when we see that the U.S. has 27% of the World's COVID-19 deaths, although the U.S. ONLY has 4% of the World's Population!



Mike Boone

Last edited by sarahb75; 05-10-2020 at 10:54 AM. Reason: missing word
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