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post #2371 of 2420 Old 05-20-2020, 09:55 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by rhale64L7 View Post
Ok cool. I'm also interested in that Runco projector.

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The LED models are very hard to find. I think I saw one fleabay. That said, mine is white and gray, as I understand it from my friend it was installed in peep hole in the back of their 2 rows of seating. The Runco have onboard ISF calibration setting that is close to spot on. I thought my Sim2 Mico 50 was huge........this thing is bigger. 60,000 is the the least you will get out of it. There's a guy on the high end projector thread of AVS that has over 30,000 on his. He measured the light output and he measure very low brightness lost. The only thing I don't like about it is I can't find the hour counter anywhere. I think it's in the service menu.

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post #2372 of 2420 Old 05-20-2020, 10:16 AM
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Hello all,

I have been a member of this site for years but just stumbled across this thread. Always nice to be able to talk to other "locals" about the theater hobby.

I am finally at a point where I am happy with my equipment setup and going to start experimenting with room treatments. I plan on rockwooling my basement drop ceiling to start with and them make some of the DIY wall panels with the movie poster printed cloth fronts. Looks like a few members of this group have been doing the panels somewhat recently. Did room treatments make a big difference for anyone?

Fusion 12 Tempest LCR, Volt 10-LX side and rear surrounds, RSL C34E front and rear Height/Atmos, 2X PSA V1500, Denon X6300H, Epson 5040UB, Panasonic DP-UB820, Stewart Cima Neve 120" screen
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post #2373 of 2420 Old 05-20-2020, 03:15 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by steve0742003 View Post
Hello all,

I have been a member of this site for years but just stumbled across this thread. Always nice to be able to talk to other "locals" about the theater hobby.

I am finally at a point where I am happy with my equipment setup and going to start experimenting with room treatments. I plan on rockwooling my basement drop ceiling to start with and them make some of the DIY wall panels with the movie poster printed cloth fronts. Looks like a few members of this group have been doing the panels somewhat recently. Did room treatments make a big difference for anyone?

Welcome to the Family,

Room treatment make a difference, but if you do the clap test to hear if you have an echo you can decide from there if you to do panels from floor to ceiling or do small panel place in locations that take the echo out. If you decide to go floor to ceiling you don't need to do the front and rear walls. In closing the forum team is more than willing to vicariously live through your build. i.e they'll help

In closing plan plan plan, and more planning. Try to do a built-in equipment option if you can to save on space.

tony4k

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post #2374 of 2420 Old 05-22-2020, 05:48 AM
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Originally Posted by steve0742003 View Post
Hello all,

I have been a member of this site for years but just stumbled across this thread. Always nice to be able to talk to other "locals" about the theater hobby.

I am finally at a point where I am happy with my equipment setup and going to start experimenting with room treatments. I plan on rockwooling my basement drop ceiling to start with and them make some of the DIY wall panels with the movie poster printed cloth fronts. Looks like a few members of this group have been doing the panels somewhat recently. Did room treatments make a big difference for anyone?

I'd start with the 1st reflection points of the main L/R speakers. Place some sort of acoustical absorber or diffusing panel at each reflection point on the wall next to each speaker. To find those points have someone hold a mirror to the wall while you are seated in the main listening position. Have the other person move the mirror until you see the speaker's reflection. That's the reflection point.


Once you have that treated, listen and evaluate. Go from there. It's easy to go overboard and just add treatments, but you can easily over treat the room if you are not careful. I started with the 1st reflection points in my listening room. After that I placed panels to address the slap echo that tbase mentioned. My most recent treatment was DIY corner bass traps inspired by Ron (Rhale). These are made by cutting Rockwool(Safe'n Sound) batts into triangle wedges and stacking them in the front 2 corners. I just used the width of the batts as my size, something around 15". I then framed in the room corners and made grills similar to speaker grills using speaker cloth stretched over frames and attached those to the corner framing. These traps tightened up the bass and helped with definition.


So, my advice is to take a step by step approach to room treatment. Become familiar with how everything sounds after each change rather than making multiple changes at once. That way you will know how each thing effects the sound.


Hope this makes sense!
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post #2375 of 2420 Old 05-22-2020, 06:05 AM
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Oh yeah, almost forgot....


My latest "toy" that came Wednesday is the Dayton Audio DSP-LF Bass contoller from Parts Express. It is like a poor man's MiniDSP EQ. Rather than requiring a UMIK-1 or similar outboard mic along with REW, it uses your Apple iPhone mic and is calibrated to correct for the mic's accuracy. You must use the "Pro" version of the app it uses to utilize the iPhone mic since there is a basic app that does not use the mic. There is not a "Pro" version of the app available for Android users as the mics used are inconsistent and cannot reliably be corrected for, so you would still need a way to measure the room response with software like REW. Using the iPhone mic, the DSP-LF app takes a nearfield response sweep of the sub, then takes a sweep at the listening position then tries to correct so it closely matches the nearfield response. There are 3 EQ curves it can correct to...... Boomy Region, Near Field, and Linear. Each will give a different sound charateristic so you can try all 3 and choose which you prefer.


It's pretty slick. I'm still evaluating but so far it has cleaned up the bass with fantastic speed, timing, impact, and accuracy.

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post #2376 of 2420 Old 05-22-2020, 06:12 AM
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Cool Eddy! Well did your room have that null like we were getting without the cal files?

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65" LG B8 Oled,Emotiva RMC1L Processor, Digital Amp Co. 5 and 4 Cherry King amplifiers, Dish Net Hopper, Panasonic UB 820, Sotm SMS 200 ultra Neo and SPS 500 power supply, Rythmik E15HP SE sub, Aerial 6t mains, Aerial 5T surrounds, Aerial cc3B center, ISO Acoustics under all the Aerials 4 Goldenear HTR 7000 ceiling speakers for Atmos All in a dedicated theater with bass traps in all corners and soffits.
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post #2377 of 2420 Old 05-22-2020, 06:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eddy_Z View Post
I'd start with the 1st reflection points of the main L/R speakers. Place some sort of acoustical absorber or diffusing panel at each reflection point on the wall next to each speaker. To find those points have someone hold a mirror to the wall while you are seated in the main listening position. Have the other person move the mirror until you see the speaker's reflection. That's the reflection point.


Once you have that treated, listen and evaluate. Go from there. It's easy to go overboard and just add treatments, but you can easily over treat the room if you are not careful. I started with the 1st reflection points in my listening room. After that I placed panels to address the slap echo that tbase mentioned. My most recent treatment was DIY corner bass traps inspired by Ron (Rhale). These are made by cutting Rockwool(Safe'n Sound) batts into triangle wedges and stacking them in the front 2 corners. I just used the width of the batts as my size, something around 15". I then framed in the room corners and made grills similar to speaker grills using speaker cloth stretched over frames and attached those to the corner framing. These traps tightened up the bass and helped with definition.


So, my advice is to take a step by step approach to room treatment. Become familiar with how everything sounds after each change rather than making multiple changes at once. That way you will know how each thing effects the sound.


Hope this makes sense!
Thanks for the reply. I am definitely taking a step by step approach as time and money allows. I am starting to get nervous about being about being furloughed for a bit with my job. My place of employment took out one of the small business loans which kept all of out jobs safe for 8 weeks. That 8 week period is up at the end of next week and last I heard our sales were down 41%. Hopefully whatever happens will be temporary as things recover but I am going to watch my pennies until then. My job will most likely be safe but better to be safe than sorry I suppose.

My first point of attack is going to be the drop ceiling in my basement. I am getting some panel vibrations from the subwoofers that can be extremely distracting while watching movies. I plan on cutting Rockwool Safe N Sound to size for each panel and placing on top. I have read another forum recently did this with very good results on eliminating his vibrations and it also helped tighten up his bass. I planned on tackling reflection points after that.

I have tried the slap echo test in my room and to my ears there is no discernable echo so I may have lucked out with that.

I attached some pics to give an idea of what I am working with. Thanks for you recommendations!

Try not to be jealous of my red 70's carpet! I redid the room after purchasing my house and decided to keep it since it is still in good shape and kind of went with the theater theme
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post #2378 of 2420 Old 05-22-2020, 06:59 AM
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Originally Posted by rhale64L7 View Post
Cool Eddy! Well did your room have that null like we were getting without the cal files?

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Ron, it looks like that null is still present at the listening position. That null region actually had a slightly rising curve in the near field measurement.. I know I'm going to end up messing with sub placement to try to minimize that but I just don't have the right cabling to do so right now.

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post #2379 of 2420 Old 05-22-2020, 07:22 AM
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Let
Me know how that works out. I never stepped foot into the REW calibration process. And can never find anyone to do it for me haha. A simple app sounds easy
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post #2380 of 2420 Old 05-22-2020, 07:41 AM
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Originally Posted by Eddy_Z View Post
Ron, it looks like that null is still present at the listening position. That null region actually had a slightly rising curve in the near field measurement.. I know I'm going to end up messing with sub placement to try to minimize that but I just don't have the right cabling to do so right now.
I have a long rca cable if you need one. I think it is at least a 20 footer.

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post #2381 of 2420 Old 05-22-2020, 07:43 AM
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Nice room Steve. I especially like your cool 70's red carpet.

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post #2382 of 2420 Old 05-22-2020, 07:53 AM
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I have a long rca cable if you need one. I think it is at least a 20 footer.

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Thanks Ron. It uses two 3.5mm pigtails to male RCA's which aren't very long, so would have to consider those.

HT - 5.2.2 ATMOS With: Klipsch DS Series In-wall/In-ceiling Speakers|2x Rythmik LV12F|Denon AVR-X3300W|Sony UBP-X800|Sony XBR-85X900F|AppleTV 4K
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post #2383 of 2420 Old 05-22-2020, 01:44 PM - Thread Starter
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Nice room Eddy........The Epson is a nice projo too.

tony4k
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post #2384 of 2420 Old 05-23-2020, 07:47 AM
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Originally Posted by rhale64L7 View Post
I have a long rca cable if you need one. I think it is at least a 20 footer.
General note: for any long RCA analog interconnect, it should be a coax cable with a heavy braided shield.
I have read of A/V people using the coax off the cables TV truck. Which has the exact opposite of a heavy braided shield.

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post #2385 of 2420 Old 05-23-2020, 08:09 AM - Thread Starter
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Ok cool. I'm also interested in that Runco projector.

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Very nice projector. Not better than my Sim2 Mico 50, but I love the LED/DLP projectors.......no lamps and they're rated at 60,000 hours. They have color management, and you can pick them up used under 2 grand. If you have a screen I can bring it over to demo it before you buy one on the net or any other members. There's one on ebay now. That will also give me a chance to hear your setup

tony4k

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post #2386 of 2420 Old 05-23-2020, 03:26 PM
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Not going to lie always wanted to see a difference in projectors . Inalways owners Jvc
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post #2387 of 2420 Old 05-23-2020, 04:04 PM - Thread Starter
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Not going to lie always wanted to see a difference in projectors . Inalways owners Jvc
I've owned 3 JVC's, and have to say I was always happy with them. But when I had the chance to get a Sim2 LED it was game over. I still would like to get it ISF calibrated, but the image looks great enough for me so i just sit back and enjoy. As to Runco this is my 4th Runco, but I never owned a high end one. The thing that I like the most is "NO" lamps, and the hours are insane 60,000 plus. When you do the math....the average lamp time in low mode is around 4,000 hours at a around $300 - $400 dollars a pop.....well that's 15 lamps to get to 60,000 hours at $4,500 - $6,000 minus the lamp that came with it. At the price in lamps you can buy 3 of these if you're lucky. Sorry shameless plug.

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post #2388 of 2420 Old 05-23-2020, 04:39 PM
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Very nice projector. Not better than my Sim2 Mico 50, but I love the LED/DLP projectors.......no lamps and they're rated at 60,000 hours. They have color management, and you can pick them up used under 2 grand. If you have a screen I can bring it over to demo it before you buy one on the net or any other members. There's one on ebay now. That will also give me a chance to hear your setup
I don't have a screen anymore unfortunately. I am just going to try to be happy with my Oled.

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post #2389 of 2420 Old 05-23-2020, 04:52 PM - Thread Starter
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I don't have a screen anymore unfortunately. I am just going to try to be happy with my Oled.

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That's all that counts........enjoy and try your best not to get audio/video virus, because trust me......there's no vaccine for it....EVER!

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post #2390 of 2420 Old 05-23-2020, 06:28 PM
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That's all that counts........enjoy and try your best not to get audio/video virus, because trust me......there's no vaccine for it....EVER!
Haha ask Eddy and Greg they will tell you how bad mine is also. Or my wife . After this is all over I will be glad to have you over for a listen.

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post #2391 of 2420 Old 05-23-2020, 06:33 PM - Thread Starter
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Kool.....my audio virus has given way to my video virus. My crazy video friend is trying to get me hooked again by doing a JVC trade. Dammit
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post #2392 of 2420 Old 05-23-2020, 07:00 PM
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Awesome! I loved my JVC X790R and Stewart Screen that I sold last year.

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post #2393 of 2420 Old 05-24-2020, 03:08 PM
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Haha ask Eddy and Greg they will tell you how bad mine is also. Or my wife . After this is all over I will be glad to have you over for a listen.

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I can vouch for Ron's low immunity to the upgraditis bug 🐜!! He could've put my daughter through a couple years of college the last few years😱

Ron, your old audio rack looks great with my equipment on it!
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post #2394 of 2420 Old 05-24-2020, 06:50 PM
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I can vouch for Ron's low immunity to the upgraditis bug !! He could've put my daughter through a couple years of college the last few years



Ron, your old audio rack looks great with my equipment on it!
I knew you could explain my seriously terrible case of upgradeitus. Hehe

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post #2395 of 2420 Old 05-25-2020, 05:01 AM - Thread Starter
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Happy Memorial Day to the brave men and women that gave their life so we can have one. We salute you and will never forget what you gave and continue to give every day all day, and may God bless your family too.
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post #2396 of 2420 Old 05-25-2020, 03:30 PM
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I'd like to up my projector game some day but I'm good with my Optpma 1080p projector for now. I use my system for music much more often than movies so that's where my budget went. I'm afraid to look at an elite projector image, I'm sure I'll catch the bug. I do need to retire eventually...

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post #2397 of 2420 Old 05-26-2020, 04:24 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by g_bartman View Post
I'd like to up my projector game some day but I'm good with my Optpma 1080p projector for now. I use my system for music much more often than movies so that's where my budget went. I'm afraid to look at an elite projector image, I'm sure I'll catch the bug. I do need to retire eventually...
Reference Video is more about accuracy in colors and the contrast within them to give the viewer a more life like experience without the need for trickery such as frame interpolation ( soap opera effect ), over drawn sharpness which leads to the illusion of realism that the eye normally don't see under normal eye to image viewing. My main focus is to see the movie in it's natural setting instead of having the display play jedi mind games with me which is what I try to achieve with my audio, but that's another subject. I've only had the pleasure of hearing Your system and George's and have to say you guys know your sound.

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post #2398 of 2420 Old 05-27-2020, 06:52 AM
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I've been out of commission since the heavy rains a week and a half ago. Water only got 10" high this time, but there's a lot I have to clean still. Luckily I was home when the water started coming up trough the drain so I was able to get my subs out before the water got too high. I probably lost my surge protector since it was under water, but I did kill the power before it was so maybe I'll luck out.

I had to work on the washer and dryer, etc before I could worry about the garage. Still have some stuff to do before I can really hit the garage. I did install a new door opener because the water killed my sensors and since my old opener was old the sensors were $130. So I upgraded to a new WiFi opener with battery backup, and it's much quieter so that's a bonus.

Anyway, I'm really missing being able to watch things and listen to music. I bought Top Gun and was looking forward to watching the 4k. In time.
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post #2399 of 2420 Old 05-27-2020, 02:53 PM - Thread Starter
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WOW George....sorry to hear about that. Good to see you caught it before it got worst than what your picture shows.

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post #2400 of 2420 Old 05-27-2020, 06:25 PM
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Wow George that sucks. Hopefully not to bad. And hopefully soon you can get back up and running. Keep us posted.

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65" LG B8 Oled,Emotiva RMC1L Processor, Digital Amp Co. 5 and 4 Cherry King amplifiers, Dish Net Hopper, Panasonic UB 820, Sotm SMS 200 ultra Neo and SPS 500 power supply, Rythmik E15HP SE sub, Aerial 6t mains, Aerial 5T surrounds, Aerial cc3B center, ISO Acoustics under all the Aerials 4 Goldenear HTR 7000 ceiling speakers for Atmos All in a dedicated theater with bass traps in all corners and soffits.
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