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-   -   Portland ,Ore. / Vancouver ,Wa. - first meet done , next one coming soon ... (https://www.avsforum.com/forum/61-area-home-theater-meets/125163-portland-ore-vancouver-wa-first-meet-done-next-one-coming-soon.html)

RedTalon 03-25-2002 01:30 AM

Just found this thread about 2 minutes ago. I live in Battle Ground (15 minutes north of Vancouver). I'm really happy to find a good sized (more than 2) group of people in this area!!! I'd like to attend any future meetings to get some tips and to be humbled by higher end equipment :-)

Here's my setup:
53" Hitachi 16:9 HDTV
Sony DB975 A/V Receiver (soon to be replaced with Denon)
Acoustic Research S50 mains
Acoustic Research AR2C center
POS surrounds (future replaced with AR's)
SVS 16-46+ sub /w Samson S1000 amp
Sony NS700P DVD player

I'm a lowly 22yo bachelor and I'm slowly building/replacing and learning this great "hobby" of mine I've recently picked up. Perhaps after a few more upgrades and when I have time to clean the house I'll even host a meeting or two! hehe

I'll keep an eye on this thread for more details, but if you want to email me, you can catch me at [email protected] or on ICQ 1405358 (I'm on 24/7, but am in invis mode)

Catch ya later!


DaGamePimp 03-25-2002 12:48 PM

Rick ,
-- yeah , I was thinking the CAT 5e solid copper would be better too but I couldn't find any on short notice [ close by ] . I am going to get some and try it however as the resulting cable should increase PQ even more .
-- I am sure you had fun with Curt . We should all do what makes the most sense for our HT system [ as you have done ] . I think the Sony 10HT is a great PJ and I am sure that you will be happy with it for many years to come . The 9" crt pj's are not an easy undertaking , as I am sure you discovered .
-- Have you thought about what type of screen you are going to try ?
Matt ,
-- welcome , glad to have you here .
-- SVS sub , nice ! [ a fellow bass lover , like Greg and I ] .
-- Next meet should be April 21st [Sunday afternoon] , we just have to decide now WHO is hosting since several offers have been presented .
------ Best Wishes All ,
----- Jason B.

Greg_R 03-25-2002 02:40 PM

No, this system was in a private residence. The owner was showing the Superbit of 5th Element and the image didn't look 3D at all. It was definitely being upsampled but the owner didn't know the details. Since he was my boss's boss's boss I asked a few polite questions and moved on (I didn't want to ask how much he paid!)...

ramick 03-25-2002 05:04 PM

As for the screen, ... maybe a greyhawk or some other grey screen to try to combat the light leak from the projector. I think this might improve contrast and make the blacks look really black(er). Maybe even mask pixel structure a little more. I cannot see the screen door unless I am ~5 feet away or zoom the thing to the max. I currently sit ~15 feet from the image and it works well.

ramick 03-25-2002 10:22 PM

OK. After a bit of viewing, I have to back off of my previous statement.

I have a 110" wide 16:9 display.

I CAN see screendoor at 12 feet (a tape tells the tale), if I look really hard.
It really depends upon what I am looking at. SDTV is more telling than HD, but, again, if I look for it, I can see it.

When you see what I've got, you can be the judge.

krasmuzik 03-25-2002 11:26 PM


anybody want to get a real popcorn popper? The accessories forum is working a power buy - and I am thinking to upgrade from my 4oz to the 8oz model that fits the same cart.

They are doing a small discount - mine has been used less than a year if somebody wants to make a deal so I can satisfy my upgrade urges. I ordered kettle/glass cleaner so I can spiff it up and clean out all the old maids!

I cannot imagine shipping this without the original packing but it should fit in a car OK. Or maybe I should host next time and entice my buyers with the smell of freshly popped corn - you cannot resist!

I like to leave extra for during the week - plus want to start making flavored batches for gifts - thus the upgrade idea.

ramick 03-26-2002 01:31 PM

That is the same, exact one I have
Works very well, my wife gave it to me as a present, so I don't know how much she paid. Looks like a good deal, though.

DaGamePimp 03-26-2002 04:49 PM

Rick , is that 110" wide or diagonal ? If that is the width then that is HUGE . Not too many CRT users out there with that size image [ at least not a very bright image ] .
-- Popcorn Machine , I wish I had the room for one . Looks like the Air Popper and the Microwave will have to do for me .
-- Is anyone interested in a FoosBall table , it is almost new [ purchased at Christmas time ] . I just don't play it enough to justify having it in the middle of my living area [ so why did I buy it .... ] . I will sell it for $100.00 as long as you pick it up , it was $250.00 new .
-- So who is hosting this next meet anyway ??? I know Greg , Rick & krag [ maybe - amp relay ] have offered so we need to draw straws or something .
--- Best Wishes All ,
-- Jason B.

ramick 03-26-2002 08:59 PM

Actual tape measure reveals:
85" wide for 4:3
106" wide for 16:9
115" wide for 2.35 - I zoom this

A popcorn machine is alot smaller than a foosball table - even smells better.

We have a foosball table at work and I don't have the space in my gameroom . [The one at work was 350 - 100 is a good deal - why sell?]

DaGamePimp 03-27-2002 12:42 PM

RIck ,
-- that is huge , must take up most of your wall .
-- I would want the popcorn machine in the HT room and as you know there is not much room left in there unless I were to place it right in front of the wall with the Heater [ guess I could cook it twice as fast that way ] . I was thinking of putting a mini fridge in there for a while but I just don't have the room for one .
-- Does anyone have an Extron 109e/plus or a 202 that they would be willing to sell or let me try out . I am trying to up my Voltage from the HTPC/Radeon to the PJ from .7 to 1.0 [ hopefully to save on my contrast ratio setting which is above 50% now ] . I think the 109e/plus only goes to .9 but that would be an improvement over the Radeon's .7 .
-- Best Wishes All ,
-- Jason B.

ramick 03-27-2002 12:49 PM

My popcorn machine is in my game room right next to the kegerator

I was thinking about the same thing for my LCD (correcting the voltage), but unsure if this work. Seems to me the way an LCD works is with little "doors" for each pixel; the amount of voltage applied opens the door more for more voltage - 0 volts would be totally closed door. So, if the voltage is low, the doors would never open fully sacrificing brightness and contrast.

krasmuzik 03-27-2002 03:10 PM

That is what your contrast control is for on digital projectors! The idea of using the color filters is to run the panels at full range, then correct the colour temp optically. If you in can increase your voltage - then you are improving the signal to noise ratio of the digitization. But if the increase in voltage comes through digitization it may not be worth it - is the extron box a pure analog amplifier?

DaGamePimp 03-27-2002 03:45 PM

Rick & krag ,
-- The Extron 109e/plus is totally analog and as far as I know the 202 is as well [ no DVI/SDI ] . I don't think the gain would be as significant with an LCD as it would be with a CRT PJ . But for what these units cost [ 109e/plus can be found for under $50.00 ] it would be a worth while investment IMO [ if indeed it does not bring too much noise to the PJ ] . Color saturation should increase but possibly at the cost of some sharpness/detail , not sure on that one just yet .
-- Best Wishes ,
-- Jason B.

ramick 03-27-2002 05:49 PM

I think forum member mp20748 (Mike Parker) has done some mods to the radeon in this direction. I haven't seen anyone else with his mods, but his personel card seems to be all the rage (pun intended).

I would like to try the Extron idea, as well. Every little bit counts.

I have seen the 202xi on ebay for ~$300. This unit has adjustments for level & boost (like contrast), peaking (sharpness) and centering.

I have also read that Mike is working on a gamma correction circuit for the radeon.

krasmuzik 03-27-2002 06:07 PM

So why are you trying to pump up the VGA to 1v? I thought the standard was 0.7v - isn't this going to overdrive the VGA input?

ramick 03-27-2002 09:34 PM

For the 10HT, that is true (.7v); for others (most CRT) it is 1v.
I haven't scoped my Radeon outputs, yet - I tried using a multimeter and thinking about this, that won't work. The multimeter is RMS - I need peak to peak.

krasmuzik 03-30-2002 12:31 PM

Any local takers on my popcorn popper so I can get upgraded on the ACS/ht-express.com power buy? Know anybody that wants one?

Their web site has the 4oz outta stock, while the 8oz is in stock. I checked their site and they are charging $36 for shipping. However I cannot get such a deal - Mail Box Etc wants ~$100 to pack/ship. Which means my used deal would go for $350 shipped - which is about what it would cost to get a new discount one shipped. ;-( It will cost me $522 shipped to get the discounted 8oz

I have three AVS response - but shipping will kill the deal for me. Trying to find somebody local. Any ideas of a good quick local advertising board - the power buy deal is only good for a month so I need a quick sell here.

Greg_R 04-01-2002 02:25 PM

The newsgroup pdx.forsale gets decent traffic...

(The Oregonian also has an online classified's section for $$$).

krasmuzik 04-01-2002 03:47 PM

I guess I will just keep the smaller popper. Just feeling tax return upgrade mania. One advantage of it is making kettle corn - the small batches make it easy to switch sugar colors. Did that for my easter party and the easter popcorn was a huge hit!

DaGamePimp 04-03-2002 04:02 PM

krag ,
-- I wish I had the room [ and the Tax return ] to get that popper from you . My wife thinks it would be silly to have such a huge popcorn popper sitting in the way - oh well ...
Rick ,
-- I may have an Extron 109plus here in a week [ with adjustable peak up to 1.0v output ] so if you would like to try it out let me know . Nevermind , I lost the auction on Ebay .
-- Ok , I guess we need to pick numbers to see who is Hosting on the 21st [ unless somebody has to drop out and wait for next time ] . I have a number picked between 1 and 20 so whoever gets it or the closest to it will be the lucky guy ....
-- Best Wishes All ,
--- Jason B.

krasmuzik 04-03-2002 04:31 PM

Well maybe you will have to bring your wife to the next meet - the smell of freshly popped corn the old fashioned way in an old fashioned cart might change her mind! Worked for my neighbor's wife!

I'll withdraw my hosting offer - want my setup to be ready before I show it off.

I just heard back from Proceed - as I expected the high end brands are suffering from being under the Harman Kardon umbrella. They said my amp is fine and their are shipping it back. Of course they did not read my problem report that said the amp IS fine - it just has a blown relay and will not turn OFF. Need to get the dealer that I bought it from seven years ago involved now - they are in another state so I doubt they will be helpful since I am no longer a customer. The local dealer here have dropped Proceed recently so they are no help as I did not buy it there. ;-(

I also just bought a Panasonic HDTV settop box - am also sending it back based on all the problems reported in the HDTV forum. But since they are selling it for half MSRP I could not pass it up - since it does conversion to all formats. It would make a great scaler if it had a video input. Use it on my 480P bedroom TV until I upgrade some day to a true HDTV projector.

ramick 04-03-2002 10:19 PM

krag, sorry to hear 'bout the problems with your amp.

DaGamePimp, sorry to hear about the lose of the Extron - I don't think it would have done much for me. But, again, every little bit may help. I want the best this proj can do - I'll be keeping it for at least another year.

My system is doing better with the Radeon - the colors are more vibrant.

The disk swapping thing is working well; I have some (~160G) of HD material that I can watch anytime and am adding DVDs with SmartRipper & HD movies.

I also just got some double faced commando cloth for "drapes" over the windows from PNTA. That should take care of the light problem!

I am also looking into a masking system (at the lens). For 4:3 video, the LCD has grey bars on the sides; for 2.35 there are bars on the top and bottom. I am thinking about building two little "windows" cut out of balsa wood and putting one of these in front of the lens to try to minimize this.

I still have no screen and looking at the Stewart products scared me - too expensive. From what I saw at Jason's, the plastic panel may be the way to go.

Another thing I am working on is getting a lens filter. It seems that the Sony bulb is heavy on the red. I think if I filter some of the red, recalibrate the red to ~100% and up the green and blue, I will get a better pic. This is called "munsilation" (sp?) and has been proven to provide better contrast and better blacks.

I am having some problems with ADTV and XP crashing and have not found the problem, yet. It seems stable for ~3 hours with ADTV and over 12 without it. I still think I can put on a pretty good show - and I have a popcorn maker!

If I am chosen, feel free to bring your wife(s)/SO(s). I choose luckey number 7.

Greg_R 04-04-2002 06:06 PM

I'll pick the number 16. If the meet is at my house it will feature my audio system (the subwoofers are operational and getting their finishing touches) and we can discuss how to implement a CRT/HTPC based video system in my current room (current display is a 55" 4:3 set). My main concern is the tradeoff between speaker placement and screen width (I have a long, narrow room).

DaGamePimp 04-04-2002 08:15 PM

Well , my number was 9 so it looks like Rick is the Host to be . Greg will be next on the list which should give krag [ what is your real name ] ample time to deal with his amp [ what a pain - sorry to hear that krag ] .
-- So maybe we should work out a CarPool plan to Rick's since it is about 45 minutes from Vancouver and well over an hour for Greg and Martin . Does anyone have a Van or an SUV that wouldn't mind the drive .
-- Best Wishes All ,
--- Jason B .
----- Heres to hoping that I can make it , my wife is starting a new job this week and we are not sure about the 21st as of yet .

ramick 04-04-2002 10:07 PM

The pressure is on me, now

Greg, what size room do you have? Front projectors usually like to be between 1 and 1.5 times the width of the screen back - you will want to sit between 1.3 and 1.6 times the width of the screen. Another rule of thumb is ~7 feet screen width is the max for a 7" CRT, 8 feet for 8", 9' for 9".

You will want at least 15 foot/Lamberts of brightness, also.

Greg_R 04-05-2002 03:31 PM

I'll measure tonight to get the exact dimensions. My system is currently setup with ~6ft between the main speakers. Spacing them further apart will worsen (sound) reflections. A 6' screen seems kind of small so I'm going to have to move my speakers or get an acoustically transparent screen (not good for the budget or video). I'll have to measure the width of the room and see if I can work a system in that direction...

ramick 04-05-2002 09:06 PM

Don't worry about the size of the screen so much as the viewing distance; a 6' screen is nothing to sneeze at - much bigger than any direct view or rear projection!

Just sit closer; maybe 9 or 10' away. Also, be sure the projector you choose will look good at that distance. A CRT may be the only way to go for that.

I don't remember what Jason's screen width was, but I don't think it was much over 7' and that looked very good.

DaGamePimp 04-06-2002 03:29 AM

My screen width is 80" [ 45" x 80" ] and I feel that it is plenty big for a room the size of mine . I sit about 10 feet away from the screen while sitting on the couch , if I sit behind the couch where the HTPC is [ I have a small step stool back there ] then I am at about 12' away which looks a little better to me . I wish I could hang the PJ and move the couch back against the wall , I think that would give me a better perception of the 92" diagonal image . I would love to have a 10' wide image [ like Rick does ] but that would require a 9" crt pj and I just don't have the room or the cash flow for a 9". I thought about digital PJ's for a while but I have yet to see one that was really pleasing to look at [ DLP or LCD ] as I notice all the little issues and it drives me crazy . Although the best that I have seen was a Sony VW10HT on a Stewart 8' wide gray screen [ black actually almost looked black ] .
-- Greg ,
I really don't think you should want to go more than 45"x80" with a 7" crt pj anyway . Much bigger than an 80" width really decreases the PQ and the brightness IMO [ unless you are going with a top-o-the-line 7" like a Sony G70 or a Vision 3 ] .
-- Best Wishes All ,
--- Jason B.

ramick 04-06-2002 11:31 AM

All of this is VERY dependent upon what you feed the projector.

I was watching Alien3 last night (DVD) and it was almost unwatchable - terrible transfer. OTOH, I watched First Monday (HD-CBS) and it looked awesome.

IMOHO, most DVD xfers are crap once you see HD. HD has spoiled me rotten I will even watch shows that are garbage in HD.

DaGamePimp 04-06-2002 02:32 PM

Rick ,
-- you are 100% correct , it is all about the source material . I have seen HD on a 10' wide screen with a 7" Runco crt pj and it was incredible to say the least ... dvd on the same system however was not too hot . I really need some HD .
-- Best Wishes ,
--- Jason B.

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