Kansas City Area Home Theater Meets and Movie Night Events! - Page 187 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #5581 of 7903 Old 04-25-2017, 04:23 PM
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Originally Posted by Archaea View Post
Axpona tomorrow

Randy and I head out tomorrow. Some highlights should be

The Seaton Sound and JTR Speaker rooms. The JTR Speakers driven blues concert. Seeing the new 4k projectors in various rooms. I'm also interested in hearing Don Keeles line arrays that are sold assemble yourself for $1k at parts express. (As a potential 2 channel project).

I'm there for just tomorrow. Randy is there for two. If you know of anything else you think would be cool to check out let us know.

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/#/topics/2782657
How about a run down of the high lights?
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post #5582 of 7903 Old 04-26-2017, 06:51 AM
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I know Jonathan plans a write-up and I will write more later but...Here is a brief snippet.

Jeff's JTR setup was awesome. Imagic (Mark) has a write up on AVS so I would read his review. He also did a write up on the Emotiva demo which I thought was very good (both the sound and the write-up). Mark Seaton had a theater set-up and it was dynamic, clean, and impressive. Another awesome demo that I went back to several times. His Spark speakers are really interesting, passive, and at reasonable prices. That was the theater setups I visited.

Stereo impressions were a little harder to judge..unfamilar material, smaller hotel room setups etc. That said, HSU new little coaxial speakers sounded really good considering price of $695 a pair. Jim Salks new Song 3a I thought sounded terrific.

Finally, the Smyth Realiser headphone processor was impressive. I will let Jonathan give his impressions on that later (including Don Keeles line array from Parts Express).

More later.
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post #5583 of 7903 Old 04-26-2017, 08:46 AM
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I've heard good things about the Hsu coaxials as well. I loved his bookshelf speakers. They are great for smaller rooms.
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post #5584 of 7903 Old 04-26-2017, 08:52 AM - Thread Starter
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I've been head down working since Axpona. I worked with an excavator getting the pool removed Sunday (I helped with the labor to keep cost down), and yard replanted after the pool removal monday, and again last night. Dawn till dusk on Sunday and after work till dark both the last two nights. I'm beat.

I do plan to post some pictures and commentary from Axpona. I really enjoyed it and recommend it highly to those who haven't seen it! Randy's a good companion, and we had a good time visiting through the show as well.

In the meantime - these arrive today -- and I'm dreaming up options for finishing them.

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post #5585 of 7903 Old 04-26-2017, 09:57 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jedimastergrant View Post
How about a run down of the high lights?
Here's my stab

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/61-are...l#post52554841

I may make some future edits and I have a bunch of pictures to upload, but photobucket isn't letting me log in right now.
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post #5586 of 7903 Old 04-27-2017, 09:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Archaea View Post
Here's my stab

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/61-are...l#post52554841

I may make some future edits and I have a bunch of pictures to upload, but photobucket isn't letting me log in right now.
So, with that Realiser thing, you could theoretically take it to the best sounding theater in the world, sit in the sweet spot and set it up, and then go back home and emulate that theater using the headphones? Is that the gist of it?

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post #5587 of 7903 Old 04-27-2017, 10:04 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by ChldsPlay View Post
So, with that Realiser thing, you could theoretically take it to the best sounding theater in the world, sit in the sweet spot and set it up, and then go back home and emulate that theater using the headphones? Is that the gist of it?
Exactly

The team behind it will be releasing famous theater eq baselines, that your unique ear fingerprint is then applied to on your A16. You can switch rooms with the push of a button through saved EQs. I can't express enough praise of how amazingly accurate this technology is. I went in a complete skeptic, (expecting nothing more than a novelty) and emerged 100% convinced. If there were flaws I didn't hear them in my demo session. I think you can output for two people at once because if two outputs. The downside is the application is only good for you. You can't just throw the headphones on someone else and expect it to work. Each person has to do their own ear binaural calibration first (which fortunately only takes about three minutes.)

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post #5588 of 7903 Old 04-27-2017, 10:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Archaea View Post
Exactly

The team behind it will be releasing famous theater eq baselines, that your unique ear fingerprint is then applied to on your A16. You can switch rooms with the push of a button through saved EQs. I can't express enough praise of how amazingly accurate this technology is. I went in a complete skeptic, (expecting nothing more than a novelty) and emerged 100% convinced. If there were flaws I didn't hear them in my demo session. I think you can output for two people at once because if two outputs. The downside is the application is only good for you. You can't just throw the headphones on someone else and expect it to work. Each person has to do their own ear binaural calibration first (which fortunately only takes about three minutes.)
I watched the video on their website and at first I thought $1700 for a pair of headphones then just after seeing the video I would love to check them out. They would be great for my living room when I want better sound and not have to turn up the TV. My wife's comment would then be you don't need the theater anymore right, and that is not a question.

I liked your write up Jonathan, very informative and makes me want to go sometime in the future. Your new speakers look interesting and look forward to hearing them someday.

It sounds like a fun time.

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post #5589 of 7903 Old 04-27-2017, 10:51 AM - Thread Starter
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@Ladeback ,


To be clear, the $1700 is just for the A16 processor, binaural mics, and gyro sensor and reader that keep the speakers anchored.(everything you need, short of the headphones).
You have to use/buy your own headphones to use with the A16. You can use anything, of course, but obviously you want the most neutral headphones you can find -- or you'll end up coloring the sound with the quality of the headphone. They recommended Sennheiser HD800 or Stax from what I understood - as generally at a approachable pricepoint - those are considered about as neutral a headphone as one can find. Randy said some people saved money by using the Sennheiser HD600, which are also regarded and designed as neutral. The HD600 can be found on sale, on occasion, for as little as about $250, but normally price out closer to $400. The HD800 are significantly more expensive, at a bit over $1k. I think the Stax cost more still. So figure that into your overall cost analysis. These would be incredibly useful for cinematic viewing where external volume was a problem, but they do have wires, both for the headphones, and for the gyro sensors you put on the headband. It's all super lightweight --- but it's not a mobile setup. Randy is getting his later in the year, and if you are interested, you should see if you can arrange a demo. It's so impressive you'll be startled.

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post #5590 of 7903 Old 04-27-2017, 10:54 AM
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Quote:
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So, with that Realiser thing, you could theoretically take it to the best sounding theater in the world, sit in the sweet spot and set it up, and then go back home and emulate that theater using the headphones? Is that the gist of it?
The Realiser 8 was released several years ago and the new one is just a further iteration with Atmos,, DTSX, Auro support. Many of the original buyers did just what you suggest. AIX and another studio were favorites in LA. If it is still up, Kalman Rubinson (who was a skeptic) did a review in his in the round section of Stereophile. Worth a read.

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post #5591 of 7903 Old 04-27-2017, 02:03 PM
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post #5592 of 7903 Old 04-27-2017, 02:48 PM
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These sound very cool and I would love to have a demo asafp!
On Sunday, I ran into Lorr (as we were exiting McDonalds) who has been with Smyth for years. He said the ship date for production units will probably slip from the announced August of this year. My guess is end of year for mine. But when it comes in, you will get a demo as well as any other KC guys that have an interest.
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post #5593 of 7903 Old 04-27-2017, 03:15 PM
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Note to self: Start sucking up to Randy.
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post #5594 of 7903 Old 04-27-2017, 03:30 PM
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Note to self: Start sucking up to Randy.
LOL! Well, it works two ways. People can get a demo but then I get to emulate and save their theater for my at home listening pleasure. Hmm, should I listen to Carp's tonight or maybe d_c..so many choices
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post #5595 of 7903 Old 04-27-2017, 04:09 PM
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LOL! Well, it works two ways. People can get a demo but then I get to emulate and save their theater for my at home listening pleasure. Hmm, should I listen to Carp's tonight or maybe d_c..so many choices
This would be a cool way to do a pseudo-kc crawl. Hear these setups one after the other while watching the same material. It would be really helpful for those who are building or wanting to upgrade. You do a blind test and pick the one you like the most,then try to mimic that at your house. Something tells me that those headphones won't punch me in the chest like carp's subs or rattle my teeth like jonathan's. But nonetheless, it will be cool.
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post #5596 of 7903 Old 04-27-2017, 04:19 PM
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Correct. You need some tactile enhancements to help with that. Headphone guys who are into the Smyth have various things they have tried. Subpac is one way to help with that, but it will not duplicate 8 18" subs
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post #5597 of 7903 Old 04-27-2017, 06:45 PM
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This sounds amazing. I remember you guys talking about these quite a while ago (maybe it was Tim). I would think that if you had the headphones in and combined it with Crowsons and a nearfield sub you would be good to go! Of course it would be tough to get the timing exactly right but I bet with trial and error you could dial in the transducers and sub to match whatever "room" you are listening to.

Can't wait for this demo Randy!!

I wonder if there is a closed headphone that is neutral enough for this to work. It would be so cool to not have to be in the house to get great sound on the headphones.

Hmmm how interesting would that be to compare the sound of the actual headphones with the 2 channel sound of your own speakers for music.
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post #5598 of 7903 Old 04-28-2017, 01:50 PM
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A friend sent me this. 3D Audio Headphones Kickstarter It would be good to compare to the Realiser. Also, has anyone noticed the Sonic Surround Sound and Atmos options for the new Windows 10 Creators Update? I installed it and started playing some demo clips with atmos and 7.1. It did an okay job with surround, but didn't impress me at all for Atmos. Maybe my over the ear shenzhen special headphones from Amazon didn't help. My Headphones Someone with nicer headphones should give it a try. The atmos plugin costs money, but it also has a 30 day trial. I think the Sonic Surround Sound is free. Windows Spatial Surround for Headphones
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post #5599 of 7903 Old 04-28-2017, 02:04 PM
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One thing to realize is that the Realiser has the 3d codecs in the unit as I understand it. Markus67 has mentioned that it can be actually used as a preamp and that may have been how Archaea and I auditioned it. The speakers used were Yamaha active speakers. I don't see how the Ossic can be as immersive but will see. In addition, it is not an emulator and seems to be more directed toward gaming. Scott Wilkinson here on AVS did a brief writeup on it from his audition at Canjam LA a couple weeks ago.
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post #5600 of 7903 Old 04-28-2017, 02:36 PM - Thread Starter
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I won't be tricked by headphones with multiple small drivers meant to simulate multichannel ever again.


Thank you Zalman for that life lesson.

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post #5601 of 7903 Old 04-28-2017, 06:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Archaea View Post
I won't be tricked by headphones with multiple small drivers meant to simulate multichannel ever again.


Thank you Zalman for that life lesson.
Maybe you just have weird ears and it wasn't customized for you...
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post #5602 of 7903 Old 04-28-2017, 06:17 PM - Thread Starter
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Maybe you just have weird ears and it wasn't customized for you...
I retract my strong comment since I haven't heard them - especially in the light of my unanticipated super amazement with the a16.

My strong rejection for multiple small drivers in a set of earphones is driven by a concept along similar (though not as an advanced idea)

Three small drivers in each earpiece. Positioned so you could actually hook pc analog headphone outputs for each pair of channels into the proper place on the old 5.1 sound blaster cards. Two in front for center, two in middle for left right, two in back for surrounds. It sounded absolutely awful even if the concept sounded reasonable. No bass, tin filled Cracker Jack box sound and the positional audio functionality was still pretty poor. Reviews were mixed with some raving about it, and some panning it. After I bought my pair all I could figure was the guys that loved it had never heard a good headphone. My mid grade sennheisers demolished them in every way -- including positional audio. To me, it was a sham. (I felt strongly about wasting the money - after high hopes. This was college years timeframe).

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Last edited by Archaea; 04-28-2017 at 06:21 PM.
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post #5603 of 7903 Old 04-30-2017, 02:03 PM
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I retract my strong comment since I haven't heard them - especially in the light of my unanticipated super amazement with the a16.

My strong rejection for multiple small drivers in a set of earphones is driven by a concept along similar (though not as an advanced idea)

Three small drivers in each earpiece. Positioned so you could actually hook pc analog headphone outputs for each pair of channels into the proper place on the old 5.1 sound blaster cards. Two in front for center, two in middle for left right, two in back for surrounds. It sounded absolutely awful even if the concept sounded reasonable. No bass, tin filled Cracker Jack box sound and the positional audio functionality was still pretty poor. Reviews were mixed with some raving about it, and some panning it. After I bought my pair all I could figure was the guys that loved it had never heard a good headphone. My mid grade sennheisers demolished them in every way -- including positional audio. To me, it was a sham. (I felt strongly about wasting the money - after high hopes. This was college years timeframe).
Around 10 years ago I bought the SpeedLink Medusa 5.1 headphones for PC gaming.

http://www.trustedreviews.com/Speed-...Headset-review

I actually quite liked them. Possibly higher quality than the Zalman I don't know.

But, then I purchased a pair of Grado SR80 and I realized that there was just no comparison. The Grado just trounced them in every possible category.

https://www.amazon.com/Grado-SR80i-H.../dp/B0055P9K38

Anyway this was just before the inclusion of Dolby headphone stuff in modern AVR's and at the time I didn't want to wake my wife up so I rigged up my own system using this.

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produ..._Surround.html

It was a niche product from JVC and I don't think it ever caught on but it worked amazingly well. So along with the Grado's I did well for myself in those instances where the wife was in bed.

The only problem was the Grado's can be tough on the ears after a 2 hour movie so eventually I purchased a pair of over the ear headphones from Audio Technica and it was much more comfortable.

But going back to the Smyth tech which is mind boggling......

As previously mentioned the company has been doing this kind of thing for some time. Here is a review of the Realiser A8 from 2010. https://www.cnet.com/news/smyth-real...er-headphones/

This might be similar to VR in that it needs to be experienced for you to buy in. I would love to try it. However, I don't see myself using it much because 9 times out of 10 I am watching with others and there is no need for me to keep the volume down any longer.
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post #5604 of 7903 Old 04-30-2017, 05:24 PM
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Put your headphones on and check this out. Who needs more than one driver per ear when the mix is done to simulate surround sound correctly?

On and close your eyes. It helps.
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post #5605 of 7903 Old 04-30-2017, 05:31 PM - Thread Starter
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I found an old post of mine from 2005 about those zalman 5.1 headphones.

Third to last post
https://hardforum.com/threads/sennhe....906072/page-2
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post #5606 of 7903 Old 05-01-2017, 07:09 AM
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The family and I went to see Boss Baby and I notice the Dolby Cinema sign when I was waiting in line for kids food pack and drinks. I thought this was kind of funny. I guess they didn't have enough room to write Furious maybe.

Boss Baby was pretty funny and my son and I laughed a lot. My said it was good, butter didn't find the humor as funny as we did. If you have kids it is a good family movie to go with everyone or a rental if you want to wait.
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post #5607 of 7903 Old 05-01-2017, 07:22 PM
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So, who wants to go to Town Center Dolby at 11PM on Saturday? Only showtime with good seats that I see.

The Hodor Theater - Now with Atmos
Projector - JVC D-ILA NX7/Panasonic PT-AE8000U; Receiver - Yamaha Adventage A3050
LCR speakers - JTR Noesis 228 HT (3); Surr./Back - Klipsch Pro Cinema KPT-8000M (4)
Atmos In-ceiling - Niles DS8HD (4); Subs - Passive JTR Captivator Pro (2)
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post #5608 of 7903 Old 05-06-2017, 07:13 AM
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Originally Posted by ChldsPlay View Post
So, with that Realiser thing, you could theoretically take it to the best sounding theater in the world, sit in the sweet spot and set it up, and then go back home and emulate that theater using the headphones? Is that the gist of it?
Scott Wilkinson in his weekly podcast talks to a scientist that works at Ossic. At about the 33 minute point, he discusses how well the Smyth Realiser works in their demos. However, he points out something I have thought about. Visual cues are important so if I woukd take a measurement in another theater and listen to it in my room under headphones, the visual cues may confuse the brain. Probably best to then close ones eyes and try to visualize the other room. Interesting podcast so far.
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post #5609 of 7903 Old 05-08-2017, 11:02 AM
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Can we just decide to rename the classifieds section to "Derek @stoked _21's theater stuff for sale"

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Belly of the Beast: Bass Bunker Theater
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post #5610 of 7903 Old 05-08-2017, 12:59 PM
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Can we just decide to rename the classifieds section to "Derek @stoked _21's theater stuff for sale"
Or we could rename it to....Stokes's next big build! Won't meet your woofage!!! But I have plans....to be continued. Lol.

Ftr your post made me laugh my ass off!
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