Originally Posted by soundwave_rider
I will try to break these down as they were asked. As far as goals I am really not sure. Want to get new LRC and move my current bookshelves as surrounds until later on where I may change those but that is much further down the road. As far as order I was thinking subs (just because they would be easiest for first DIY) then LRC. But this was before the UM18 was out of stock until 3/8. Atmos would be the last speakers in my current list I think.
Budget: Probably looking at like 1,000 for the LRC and an additional 1,000 for subs/amp (plus I plan to sell my current sub to add to that total)
Additional furniture may just be like coffee table but the couch and recliner in the photos will be staying where they are.
Listening levels for general TV are usually around 40-50 (Onkyo their volume from 0-100), movies usually 55-60 (if the wifey is not home I watch louder 60-70)
A projector would be sweet but never considered it before. Your suggestion of dropping it over the hallway would work. I have niches on both sides of living room. This would probably come at the very end due to the cost, but lets just say TV for now.
I would be open to a equipment tower for sure but most I have found online are pricey. Tried looking on craigslist but have not found any recently.
I completely agree with the size and sensitivity. Was thinking 10" was as small as I wanted to go but with a 1,000 budget for the LRC it seemed like 12" would push it higher. The Mrs. is pretty cool but I am not sure how keen she would be on having a center like a HTM or Fusion speaker, may have to look more like a dedicated center. The 88 Special from DIYSG may be better cause the sensitivity is close to the HTM and Fusions.
You kind of lost me here but thats why I am looking forward to hearing Chads and possibly others before deciding. I know I made some poor decisions when getting my first AVR, wish I knew more about preamps when I bought.
May take you up on this later down the road. I think a drop down would be sweet.
Honestly we hate the A/V case, we have had it for like 7 years and always talk about getting rid of it but never do just because it has served its purpose. Moving on to a new tower would be more than fine with me, just need to find a good option.
Yes it is a large room and yes its not the most ideal setup. We love our gigantic couch but it is always a problem to fit it in a rental house so yea the positioning of everything is by necessity. 5 channels would be a huge upgrade for me so that is a plus and the addition of ATMOS would be sweet and not all that expensive compared to my first 2 big upgrades.
Dang straight to 4 subs. This is why I love you people. I was thinking more like 2 at first. I have never listened to sealed subs before and never heard HT subs bigger than 12" as well so once again I am going to be getting a lot of use out of the GTG at Chad's place. I would need to ask how most people run their cables? I have pulled up the carpet in my hallway to get speaker wire underneath but with subs wouldn't the cable be much thicker? I do like the thought about using them as speaker stands and could probably get WAF for that but not sure about going ported due to the size, but maybe I'll have to ask for forgiveness rather than permission and see how she handles it
What do you usually use for room diagrams? I work with AutoCAD so I can knock up some layouts in there with dimensions no problem.
Thanks for the all the help so far and so much easier to go through everything on here.
OK, so now that we have some idea of your goals and budget, lets get started.
If you want to do subs first, that's cool. You don't have to do 4 at first, lol, but it may be cheaper. And no worries about the UM being out of stock. I have another idea. You should consider the Dayton HO's. Chad and Matt can chime in here as they're more familiar with them and that's what Chad uses in his sealed boxes up front. They're cheaper than the UM's too. Supposedly they hit a little more in the mid-upper sub freq range while the UM's hit more down low. But when you hear them at Chad's place, you'll see they perform pretty well.
Next you need to decide which enclosure you want to put them in. Then we can talk about pricing options as sealed vs ported are a little different but either should keep you around $1k for a pair all in with drivers, boxes/wood, parts and the amp. What's the WAF for sub boxes? You should discuss this with her. Sealed will most likely be easiest and cheapest (a couple options from PE and DIYSG) to put them in one of them 4 cu ft boxes with External dimensions: 23" H x 20" W x 20.75" D.
Ported will give you more output, and that would help as you have a large room to pressurize, but are generally much bigger boxes and take more time to build. See the Marty sub thread, https://www.avsforum.com/forum/155-di...tysub-faq.html
, for more info. You can get a couple boxes that are close in size to the sealed 4cu ft box. I have a pair of mini-martys w/ the UM's and they rock. But really, if size is important to you just go with the smaller boxes the the Cube or Micro.
Now I'll also add this. You may want to start a thread and ask for some help in the DIY sub-forum. I haven't learned how to use WinISD yet, but other there have. You could ask them to show you how to model the UM and HO in the sealed vs the ported options using the iNuke6k as a power source and see what they come up with. That may also sway your decision.
Regardless of which enclosure you decide, I'd plan on getting the Behringer iNuke6000DSP. The extra power is worth it and so is getting the DSP. When you look how much the drop in price is for a non-DSP or 3k model, it's negligible. It can be had for ~$340 new. Sometimes you can find people selling them used but honestly, they are known to occasionally have issues so it's worth it to just get new and have the warranty to back you up. Plus, good news for you is they have a service center right by you guys up in Jax. And noise likely won't be a concern for you if you get that a/v cabinet.
I have the HTM and so does Matt so I'm a little partial to them. Chad has the Fusions and loves them but I think they are a little more in your face. We really haven't had a true comparison with them side by side and level matched for sound output to tell though. Regardless, I personally would suggest keeping the front 3 LCR the same so as not to have any sound differences. Then keep the surrounds/ATMOS the same. But that may be up to you and the WAF.
But I'll also say this, you should measure the front of the wall where they will go, how much space is there, and then see how much gap there is where the center will go from the MLP. That may also be important for how and where you will fit your subs. The HTM's are also much lighter than the Fusions. Different MDF and lighter driver is used. That may or may not be important to you, but you should know all the angles just the same.
As far as other options, I'm not sure. I know the HTM's were designed for HT while many others were for full range audio and music. You also may not use the full capability of some of those MTM designs like the 1099's. Might need to do some reading on the forums and ask the questions. But pricing should keep at or below your budget of $1k with driver, flat pack, parts and assembled xover. And you could always take a design like the F10 or HTM10 and do a custom box for the center so it looks more wider than taller.
We'll get more in detail about those later since they're further down on your to-do list. But I'll say you'll likely go for the volts. You have a larger space so I wouldn't recommend anything less than 8-10" on the driver size. I personally like to have all speakers crossed over at 80Hz. I would be worried anything less than 8" and you might have issues. Chad has the 6" version but he has a much smaller room and not sure what xover he has them set at.
I'd also recommend considering the Concentric8's. I really love them. Again, we haven't had a chance to pit them against Matt's Volt10's (he's too lazy to climb a ladder
) so not able to say much there. But they're supposedly made with higher grade material/components. And DIYSG was having a blow out on them with ready to go cabinets. But I don't see them on the new website. That may be worth looking into and if they still have them, moving them up in line of priority before they sell out. They can be used for LCR.
Hmmm... it's been a while since I had an Onkyo. but normally there is 2 different ways a receiver has the volume set. Usually with a negative sign in front that indicates the level of sound below reference, with 0 being at reference. And to answer your question from before, what I was talking about what the SPL, sound pressure level, which is measured in decibels, dB. THX has a recommended level of 85dB with peaks (ie explosions) of 105dB. With subs, that level is 10dB hotter. So 95dB with peaks of 115dB. This is considered reference level. In your case, it should be on a scale, like you said, of 0-100. that should be the amount of dB. Also, as you crank up the volume and hit reference, it should say on the display screen of the receiver. So to test this: without anything playing, turn up the volume on the receiver and see if "Ref" or "reference" flashes on the screen when you go somewhere above 75. Sometimes receivers will reset what reference is based on their own room correction algorithms.
But more to the point, I'll bring my sound meter and also Chris' Omnimic so we can test it and you get an idea of what it sounds like. I'll ask Matt to bring his too cuz I think it's more accurate than mine. Now reference can be considered loud, but often it's because of distortion that causes fatigue in the ear. A clean signal and speakers and amps that can handle that and you will see it can be listened to much louder than most realize and/or are used to. And I gurantee your Polk's cannot do anywhere near reference with that listening distance and power source.
We'll get to that, but no worries, It's definitely doable. Besides, I'd wait and see what the fall brings after most HT versions are announced at CEDIA. But I'll say you'll likely need to look for an ALR screen being in the living room. And since it's a drop down, it most likely will be a tab-tensioned. Maybe ask in the official thread for some info if their ALR screen material is thick enough for a regular motorized drop down. Otherwise, the only ALR tab-tensioned I know of that's cheap is Elite's Starling. But it might be a good idea to get head start in your research there. Tab-tensioned can get expensive so may want to keep an eye on the used market.
Look's like you're off to a good start there. But let me still suggest that you plan to move it off to the side. A lot of LED lights can be distracting/annoying. Especially when you move to a projector. Also, that tower may interfere with placement of the speakers and/or subs. Having it off to the side make things a lot easier.
The best way I can say to do this is measure everything. Angles and distances from MLP to where subs, LCR, surrounds, AMTOS might go. Distances between expected speakers/subs and furniture. Everything. Makes it easier to figure out what size boxes you can fit and optimum placements for sound.