Samsung DLP -N- series tweaks thread - Page 51 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1501 of 1754 Old 07-22-2005, 02:49 PM
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sparklies and grainy hd cable.
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post #1502 of 1754 Old 07-22-2005, 02:54 PM
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sparklies
LL
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post #1503 of 1754 Old 07-22-2005, 03:01 PM
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What cable provider are you using? Are you sure you are outputting 1080i/720p etc. to your set?

That picture looks like it has a lot of compression noise, like it was upscaled to a hd resolution from a regular SD camera/source. Does it look like that all the time?
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post #1504 of 1754 Old 07-22-2005, 04:02 PM
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no but it does look edgy
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post #1505 of 1754 Old 07-22-2005, 04:08 PM
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post #1506 of 1754 Old 07-22-2005, 04:12 PM
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background fuzzy
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post #1507 of 1754 Old 07-22-2005, 04:16 PM
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Take it to PM
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post #1508 of 1754 Old 07-22-2005, 04:19 PM
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I'd say start a new thread in Rear Projection Units asking about the issues you are seeing with your picture.
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post #1509 of 1754 Old 07-22-2005, 04:20 PM
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heres a color test i think yellow is like mustard and green is like lime.
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post #1510 of 1754 Old 07-22-2005, 04:21 PM
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ok sorry
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post #1511 of 1754 Old 08-13-2005, 05:40 PM
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I had the color wheel in my HLN507W replaced last week because the squeal was driving my wife crazy. Afterward, I looked at the PQ, particularly on HD channels and I thought the color was sharper and deeper than before the color wheel change. I didn't say anything to my wife about it and that night, she made the same comment. Does that make any sense?

My Sammy was purchased in July 2003 and a prior color wheel replacement was done 10/03. I currently have 7,700 hours on the original lamp.
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post #1512 of 1754 Old 08-13-2005, 10:01 PM
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Sure, if the color wheel was spinning at a slower than "ideal" speed this would affect the picture quality and probably make "rainbows" more prominent.
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post #1513 of 1754 Old 08-14-2005, 04:32 PM
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what is ideal speed?
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post #1514 of 1754 Old 08-14-2005, 05:46 PM
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I don't remember the numbers for the ideal speed. I believe it varies with the type of color wheel which varied from model to model, 6 segments vs 7 segments. I remember the speed of the color wheel being discussed a few months ago with the switch from the 6 to 7 segment wheel.
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post #1515 of 1754 Old 08-14-2005, 06:50 PM
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chazklf,

I would not use those THX Optimizers to check the color, I don't think most of them are accurate. I had my set ISF calibrated and checking the color bars on Avia or DVE the colors are dead on but, the THX Optimizers always say that the colors are off. I'm not saying that you don't have a problem just don't trust those THX Optimizers, use DVE or Avia.

I would also second the opinion about getting it ISF calibrated. I was a constant tweaker and was never 100% satisfied before I had my set calibrated. Since the calibration I'm 150% satisfied and I no longer have to tweak the settings anymore.

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post #1516 of 1754 Old 09-01-2005, 11:12 PM
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Has anyone installed a ND filter on a Samsung HLN series? If so, what type and where, and what kind of results did it give? I've seen other threads where it really seemed to improve blacks.

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post #1517 of 1754 Old 09-01-2005, 11:35 PM
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I have an HLN4365W, made in October 2003, and an SA 8000HD cable box in which the DVI output was only recently activated by my cable supplier, Videotron. When connected by DVI, the box displays a message that the DVI is blocked. I have heard the problem is that the HLN4365 is HDCP version 1.0, and the cable box uses HDCP version 1.1. Has anyone had compatibility problems with DVI connections? I'm surely not the first to have this problem. Is there a firmware update which can fix it?

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post #1518 of 1754 Old 09-06-2005, 10:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fussy viewer View Post

I have an HLN4365W, made in October 2003, and an SA 8000HD cable box in which the DVI output was only recently activated by my cable supplier, Videotron. When connected by DVI, the box displays a message that the DVI is blocked. I have heard the problem is that the HLN4365 is HDCP version 1.0, and the cable box uses HDCP version 1.1. Has anyone had compatibility problems with DVI connections? I'm surely not the first to have this problem. Is there a firmware update which can fix it?

This is an issue your cable co needs to addess. Their box is not programed to work with your DVI input. Call up their service reps and explain that the DVI connection is not working with as much detail as you can give them. There's nothing you can do to your TV to make it work. The problem is theirs and has to do with programming their box and they generally can do this without making a service call. They can download a new program from their headquarters while you are on the phone with them.
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post #1519 of 1754 Old 09-06-2005, 05:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rolltide1017 View Post

chazklf,

I would also second the opinion about getting it ISF calibrated. I was a constant tweaker and was never 100% satisfied before I had my set calibrated. Since the calibration I'm 150% satisfied and I no longer have to tweak the settings anymore.

I keep reading about professional callibration but can't find anyone who actually performs this task. The repair guy Best Buy sent out to screw up my color wheel and lamp replacement didn't know what "callibration" was. Where do I find one of these guys, and are any of them in the boondocks? (west Texas)

"Talk is cheap, until you hire a lawyer"
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post #1520 of 1754 Old 09-06-2005, 07:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mjblaw View Post

I keep reading about professional callibration but can't find anyone who actually performs this task. The repair guy Best Buy sent out to screw up my color wheel and lamp replacement didn't know what "callibration" was. Where do I find one of these guys, and are any of them in the boondocks? (west Texas)

You've stumbled upon a very valid point. Just about everyone agrees that these sets need calibration even the Best Buy sales people. In fact mine said that was a great reason to get the extended warranty, their repair guy could calibrate the colors for you. Unfortunately their repair guy couldn't spell calibration. His idea of calibration was to use the user menu settings on the remore control. You call up Samsung and they don't even know who to send your way.

To find a calibrator go to a high end AV dealer in your town. If that doesn't work then try this:

http://www.milori.com/community/calibrator/
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post #1521 of 1754 Old 09-30-2005, 10:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mjblaw View Post

I keep reading about professional callibration but can't find anyone who actually performs this task. The repair guy Best Buy sent out to screw up my color wheel and lamp replacement didn't know what "callibration" was. Where do I find one of these guys, and are any of them in the boondocks? (west Texas)

Try Googling the Imaging Science Foundation
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post #1522 of 1754 Old 09-30-2005, 11:01 AM
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Try Googling the Imaging Science Foundation.....I'd post a link but the board won't let me.

Here's the link to their search page:

Imaging Science Foundation
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post #1523 of 1754 Old 11-10-2005, 11:08 AM
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Time to bring this thread back to life:
I discovered something while replacing my color wheel that I haven't seen addressed in this tread before:

The Service Menu Delay adjustment (Color Wheel Phase) should precede any other adjustment; and, regretably, it can only be accurately done with a Color Analyzer. Unlike Red purity on a CRT the correct setting is not visually obvious; by eye (with a Red field) there appears to be a continuum from Magenta thru Red to Orange, but with a color analyzer you can see there is a small "flat spot" several counts wide where the CIE x value is at peak (most Red) and the y value is unchanging. With the new Color Wheel the correct setting was 10 counts off the nominal, and the flat spot is much smaller, so simply setting to the default is not a workable solution. All three Primaries were nicely placed when Delay is set on Red as noted. I'm more than a little curious as what servicemen are doing when they change a Color Wheel, and whether professional calibrators are checking it. . .

Clyde Washburn
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post #1524 of 1754 Old 11-10-2005, 11:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by k2ue View Post

Time to bring this thread back to life:
I discovered something while replacing my color wheel that I haven't seen addressed in this tread before:

The Service Menu Delay adjustment (Color Wheel Phase) should precede any other adjustment; and, regretably, it can only be accurately done with a Color Analyzer. Unlike Red purity on a CRT the correct setting is not visually obvious; by eye (with a Red field) there appears to be a continuum from Magenta thru Red to Orange, but with a color analyzer you can see there is a small "flat spot" several counts wide where the CIE x value is at peak (most Red) and the y value is unchanging. With the new Color Wheel the correct setting was 10 counts off the nominal, and the flat spot is much smaller, so simply setting to the default is not a workable solution. All three Primaries were nicely placed when Delay is set on Red as noted. I'm more than a little curious as what servicemen are doing when they change a Color Wheel, and whether professional calibrators are checking it. . .

Well hello there Clyde! Its really good to see you again! Your calibration tips for max red output have remained the best way to tweak these sets. Thanks again for sharing that clever idea. I moved on to a different model (HLP4674W) but still use the same calibration technique.

As for the color wheel's "DELAY" setting, many servicemen are not adjusting it, and those who do, simply set it to the old value! I've been through 4 light-engine replacements with 2 different sets, and only once did the guy know to do the adjustment. Until I discovered that the delay was way off, the picture was HORRIBLE, and couldn't be calibrated (for obvious reason).

I do not have a color analyser, so I have to do it by eye, just guessing where the "flat spot" is. Definitely not ideal. Nevertheless, with enough staring at the red screen, I became more sensitive to the magenta/orange shift, and I also noticed a bit of a "flat spot". So I noted where the shift first began on each side (about 10 clicks apart) then I set the "DELAY" in the middle. I'm fairly confident that I'm somewhere on the "flat spot", but who knows for sure? And yes, some of the new light engines had a completely different "DELAY" setting. I certainly hope the pro calibrators are checking it!

Gary
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post #1525 of 1754 Old 11-10-2005, 11:49 AM
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How often does the guy who's replacing the color wheel or light engine also have access to and training in using a color analyzer? Seems to me what you're saying is after replacing a color wheel, it is imperative to have it recalibrated with an Analyzer. In defense of these techs if they're not trained in calibration they ought not re-set the color wheel timing as they're replacing the color wheel.

One more question: Is it your opinion that these sets "hold" their calibration indefinitely assuming no other work is done on them? I find myself tweaking mine months after I felt it was perfect. I'm wondering if it is just me or if as the light ages or whatever color changes do occur.

In other words, if you hooked a DLP to a color analyzer a year or two later would you get the exact same readings or might it have changed?
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post #1526 of 1754 Old 11-10-2005, 12:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sea Ray View Post

How often does the guy who's replacing the color wheel or light engine also have access to and training in using a color analyzer? Seems to me what you're saying is after replacing a color wheel, it is imperative to have it recalibrated with an Analyzer. In defense of these techs if they're not trained in calibration they ought not re-set the color wheel timing as they're replacing the color wheel.

One more question: Is it your opinion that these sets "hold" their calibration indefinitely assuming no other work is done on them? I find myself tweaking mine months after I felt it was perfect. I'm wondering if it is just me or if as the light ages or whatever color changes do occur.

In other words, if you hooked a DLP to a color analyzer a year or two later would you get the exact same readings or might it have changed?

Unless parts are replaced, calibration is pretty much permanent on an HLN. The only color shift that can happen is due to spectral shift in the lamp, which uniformly affects gray scale, so it should be very hard to notice unless extreme. In a year and a half I haven't seen enough shift to make me even think of breaking out the Color Analyzer, until the color wheel when noisy and recalibration was required. Differences in filter density on the wheel from one wheel to another can also give a noticeable shift when replaced, but then you're ready to recal anyway because of the need to set Phase.

Clyde Washburn
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post #1527 of 1754 Old 12-23-2005, 03:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GSB View Post

As for the color wheel's "DELAY" setting...

I do not have a color analyser, so I have to do it by eye, just guessing where the "flat spot" is. Definitely not ideal. Nevertheless, with enough staring at the red screen, I became more sensitive to the magenta/orange shift, and I also noticed a bit of a "flat spot". So I noted where the shift first began on each side (about 10 clicks apart) then I set the "DELAY" in the middle. I'm fairly confident that I'm somewhere on the "flat spot", but who knows for sure?

I tried something interesting to verify the color wheel "DELAY" setting that I had earlier picked by eye.

I biased a phototransistor with a 100k resistor and a 9V battery, then hooked it to an oscilliscope. I found that it produced a signal that could quite easily substitute for a color analyser in this application. I displayed a 100% red field from Avia/DVE. Then I boosted the contrast until there was absolutely no more increase in light output. The scope measured a short rectangular pulse of red light, every 300th of a second or so.

As I adjusted the DELAY setting, the square pulse would start to change shape, forming a spike on the leading or trailing edge of the pulse, depending which way I adjusted the DELAY. As the red field became more orange, the spike would appear on one end of the pulse, and as the red field became more magenta, the spike would appear on the other end of the pulse. As Clyde also mentioned, there was a bit of a "flat spot" where the pulse remained square, with no change.

And the point of this post? The middle of that "flat spot" was in exactly the same spot that I had picked by eye, using the technique in my last post. So it is possible to set the DELAY reasonably accurately by eye, if you have the patience, and if you are able to discern a fairly small color shift.

Once DELAY is set correctly, you will need to recalibrate the set.

Gary
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post #1528 of 1754 Old 12-23-2005, 03:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GSB View Post

II biased a phototransistor with a 100k resistor and a 9V battery, then hooked it to an oscilliscope. I found that it produced a signal that could quite easily substitute for a color analyser in this application. I displayed a 100% red field from Avia/DVE. Then I boosted the contrast until there was absolutely no more increase in light output. The scope measured a short rectangular pulse of red light, every 360th of a second or so.

Gary

Glad we've stimulated creativity out there! Putting a red filter from an Avia or DVE disk box in front of the phototransistor might make it even easier to tune red for max, since it will filter out the light thru the wrong wheel segments, and might make for a peak-for-max on a DVM, rather than with a scope, practical.

Clyde Washburn
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post #1529 of 1754 Old 12-23-2005, 04:27 PM
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Great idea! That might just work. I'll give it a try sometime.

Gary
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post #1530 of 1754 Old 01-07-2006, 05:14 PM
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I have an HLN6167 and recently had some issues with it. Through my extended warranty they changed the lamp and color wheel. When I got it back there was some color issues so another company came out and changed I think the light engine. I received the tv back and I was still not happy with the picture quality as it looked grainy/blurry. I read through the forum and was not able to pinpoint an exact issue. I also downloaded the phillips test pattern and ran through the various screens just to see if anything looked terribly off. What I found was the vertical resolution bars werent clear. I havent been able to get a screen shot of it to post but basically the black lines are not solid and they look like they are moving from right to left and vice versa in constant motion. I was hoping someone could tell me what would cause that and if there was any adjustments I could make to rectify it. Attached is a screen shot from my laptop of the pattern I was using off my desktop on my tv just so you know the pattern I was referring too. Any info would be appreciated.

 

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