Which PJ would would you recommend in this scenario? - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1 of 11 Old 09-26-2013, 05:38 PM - Thread Starter
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Having a house built that will not be complete until March. Want to buy a PJ and screen before the end of the year for a particular reason. So, going off my plans, the room is 15 wide and 21 feet long. The north and south walls slant inward at around 6 feet so I have to mount the screen on the east wall that has a window. The east wall is 21 ft from the west wall and I will mount the screen over the window. There is a bump out/dormer on the south wall with a window. I will be able to control lighting with curtains, but would like to be able to have light, etc with sports and daytime use with the kids. Anyhow, ambient lighting is not a huge concern, but its there. Ceiling is 8ft.

Anyhow, due to the north and south walls angling inward, I have to go with a 100in screen. Thinking this: http://www.amazon.com/Elite-Screens-ER100GH1-Projection-Screen/dp/B00856XG2K

My question is do I need to go with a light cannon (2500 lumens+) or will 1500 get it done for me? I am also thinking of shelf mounting the PJ on the west wall to keep it lower since there could be some lighting issues. But this would require a 21 ft throw or so. Any suggestions? Ceiling mount make more sense? I'll have to offset the screen to the north so I can offset the PJ due to the door if I shelf mount.

Also, hoping to pick something up around Black Friday. Thanks for any advice! Also, would like to keep the cost under $1500, but that is negotiable for the right PJ.

BTW - I have an Infocus back in 2005-2008 on a 96in GreyWolf screen and am just getting back into them. One divorce and a new house later!
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post #2 of 11 Old 09-26-2013, 05:44 PM - Thread Starter
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post #3 of 11 Old 09-27-2013, 01:40 PM - Thread Starter
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Anyone? Would appreciate any insight you could provide. smile.gif
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post #4 of 11 Old 09-27-2013, 02:16 PM
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Most all the projectors in that price range have enough lumens to deal with some ambient light, but the question is not answerable since it depends on the direction of the light, the exact intensity, the type of lighting, the painting of the room, the distance the light is from the screen. That is why we hate ambient light questions in here.

Generally speaking, if the frequent preferred experience is more geared towards when the ambient light is controlled, then you should be ok with just about any projector out there, maybe even a dimmer but better at movies projector like a B-Stock JVC (though that would run just a tad over $1,500 probably, but not too much more). The B-Stock JVC's are by far and way the best deals for movies in this price range. They come with the standard 2-year warranty. They do not have a torch mode though, so then I lean towards recommending a Benq w1070 instead (or maybe a Benq w1500 since I think it has Frame Interpolation which you might find useful for sports).

$1,500 is an awkward budget point because there really isn't that many choices between say $1200 and $1500, most of the choices are over $1500 or under $1100. You really have to push the budget well up over $2000 to over $2500 for a significant improvement in image quality over a $900 - $1,500 projector. It is more about feature-set than image quality until you get over $2000. The one exception being the B-Stock and used projectors, especially B-Stock JVC's which is the best deal IMO overall, but sounds a bit too borderline in your setup (meaning the JVC's lack of torch mode would make sports viewing in ambient light tougher).

Also the choice depends if you will be doing any lag-sensitive gaming.

A few projectors that can work:
B-Stock JVC RS-46 or B-Stock RS-45 (from AVS or Ebay's JVC official Refurb Store), they both have 2 year warranties, and B-stocks are mostly like new
Refurbished Epson 5010 (good but refurbs are riskier on Epsons than they are on a JVC, so probably not worth it)
Refurb or Used Benq w7000 (getting harder to find at this price point)

New:(in no particular order)
Benq w1070, w1080st, w1500
Optoma hd131xe, Optoma hd25, Optoma hd25-lv (all DLP's)
Viewsonic PJD7820hd DLP
Acer h6510bd DLP
Epson 2030 LCD

The Benq w1070 sounds like a good bet if you definitely want to keep it under $1,500. The Optomas are also a good bet if you want slightly better contrast in 3D.

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post #5 of 11 Old 09-27-2013, 02:39 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks! I don't care about 3D so Ill check out the BenQ.

I know ambient lighting questions are not favored here, but thought I would play the fool anyhow. I will be painting the room a darker color. Not black or anything like that, but something certainly darker than white that will still look good for full time use. Perhaps a grey of some sort.

ONe last question, do you think shelf or wall mounting is the way to go or should I ceiling mount? Or is it six of one, half dozen of another?
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post #6 of 11 Old 09-27-2013, 02:49 PM - Thread Starter
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Looking at the BenQ calculator, looks like I would have to ceiling mount. Thats fine. I can run cables before drywall.
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post #7 of 11 Old 09-28-2013, 12:00 PM
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Here's my $0.02 --

Blocking a window with a display screen feels -- well, just wrong. Can make the place feel like a bunker or tunnel during the daytime.

As an alternative, you could suspend the screen from the north wall. I say "suspend" because you mentioned that the north (and south) walls are leaning in six feet (three feet each, I would assume -- this must be a second-story location). Put the viewing couch under the south dormer window, and mount the PJ above the couch on the ceiling. You would end up with a nine-foot throw to the display screen, which would probably be around 100-110 inches diagonally at a ten-foot viewing distance.

Even though the long (21-foot) dimension of the room would be adequate for side-flanking loudspeakers, you could also drop an AT screen and place the speakers (especially center channel) behind the screen.

Also: If that dormer/alcove recess extends to the ceiling, then you have an ideal spot to mount the PJ up there.
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post #8 of 11 Old 09-28-2013, 12:09 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PrimeTime View Post

Here's my $0.02 --

Blocking a window with a display screen feels -- well, just wrong. Can make the place feel like a bunker or tunnel during the daytime.

As an alternative, you could suspend the screen from the north wall. I say "suspend" because you mentioned that the north (and south) walls are leaning in six feet (three feet each, I would assume -- this must be a second-story location). Put the viewing couch under the south dormer window, and mount the PJ above the couch on the ceiling. You would end up with a nine-foot throw to the display screen, which would probably be around 100-110 inches diagonally at a ten-foot viewing distance.

Even though the long (21-foot) dimension of the room would be adequate for side-flanking loudspeakers, you could also drop an AT screen and place the speakers (especially center channel) behind the screen.

Also: If that dormer/alcove recess extends to the ceiling, then you have an ideal spot to mount the PJ up there.

My builder just sent this drawing. I was wrong when I calculated based on what I had before. It appears the walls lean inward just shy of 5 feet. Are you suggesting I mount a manual or motorized screen on the ceiling where it begins to slant down on the north wall? If I could have my druthers, I would mount a motorized tension screen on the east wall as mentioned above. BUT, I do not think it will be wide enough for as high as I would have to mount it. That way, Icould use the window when needed and drop the screen down in front (with black out curtains behind the screen). However, I just dont think I have the width I need since, if my math is correct, the width of the ceiling is only 66.25 inches. Of course, for every foot you drop, it widens by 30 inches or so. HOwever, I am getting closer to the floor at that point.
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post #9 of 11 Old 09-28-2013, 03:59 PM
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Using your number (5-1/2 feet), with the pitch of the sidewalls approximately 4:5 (39:50), dropping two feet below the eight-foot ceiling (screen bottom about two feet off the floor), your wall width would increase from 66 inches to over ten feet -- plenty wide enough for a large (>130 inches) screen size. Even at 18 inches below ceiling top you'd end up with something like nine feet, which would accept up to a 120-inch diagonal screen. So, plenty of wall space there. The Optoma or BenQ have suitable vertical image offsets to allow them to hug the ceiling; the newer Epsons (zero vertical offset) would have to drop down another foot or so from the ceiling, which might be awkward. (However, if the screen is large enough, you might be able to shelf-mount an Epson on the west wall and shoot it across the room -- might require moving the screen a couple of feet forward from that east window).

Alternatively, rotating the setup 90 degrees as I mentioned, placing the top of the screen along the north wall at two feet below ceiling height would mean that the top of the screen intersects the slanting wall about 20 inches out from the parapet (vertical) section of that wall. That is to say, there would be about twenty inches of space behind that screen. The horizontal throw from that screen to a PJ mounted on the opposite (south) slanting wall would be roughly between eleven and twelve feet (depending on the PJ's vertical offset or shift). That's a sweet spot for most PJs for screens anywhere from 100 to 120 inches diagonal. Assuming a couch against the south parapet (vertical) wall, the corresponding viewing distance would be around eleven feet. And the window to the east would be uncovered.

So, either setup can work.
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post #10 of 11 Old 09-28-2013, 04:33 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PrimeTime View Post

Using your number (5-1/2 feet), with the pitch of the sidewalls approximately 4:5 (39:50), dropping two feet below the eight-foot ceiling (screen bottom about two feet off the floor), your wall width would increase from 66 inches to over ten feet -- plenty wide enough for a large (>130 inches) screen size. Even at 18 inches below ceiling top you'd end up with something like nine feet, which would accept up to a 120-inch diagonal screen. So, plenty of wall space there. The Optoma or BenQ have suitable vertical image offsets to allow them to hug the ceiling; the newer Epsons (zero vertical offset) would have to drop down another foot or so from the ceiling, which might be awkward. (However, if the screen is large enough, you might be able to shelf-mount an Epson on the west wall and shoot it across the room -- might require moving the screen a couple of feet forward from that east window).

Alternatively, rotating the setup 90 degrees as I mentioned, placing the top of the screen along the north wall at two feet below ceiling height would mean that the top of the screen intersects the slanting wall about 20 inches out from the parapet (vertical) section of that wall. That is to say, there would be about twenty inches of space behind that screen. The horizontal throw from that screen to a PJ mounted on the opposite (south) slanting wall would be roughly between eleven and twelve feet (depending on the PJ's vertical offset or shift). That's a sweet spot for most PJs for screens anywhere from 100 to 120 inches diagonal. Assuming a couch against the south parapet (vertical) wall, the corresponding viewing distance would be around eleven feet. And the window to the east would be uncovered.

So, either setup can work.

1) Our math is the same it appears. I guess I've just been paranoid. Also, I would have to worry about the height of the screen so I could use my center channel below the screen.

2) So I would mount the screen on the angled portion of the wall? I assume there are mount that would accommodate an electric tension drop down screen in this situation. I also wonder about an AT screen in this set up. My concern would be cost. But, so inches from the wall certainly is not a problem at all. Any suggestions on a screen in this scenario?
Of course, an AT screen may not actually be needed since it would be 20 inches from the wall and the center could likely fit below it depending on drop down length.

3) I appreciate you walking me through this!
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post #11 of 11 Old 09-28-2013, 06:58 PM
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I can't comment on a tensioned drop-down screen. Don't know how that would work. We have Screen forums (forii?) that discuss things like that.

An AT (Acoustically Transparent) screen is a popular project over at the DIY Screen forum. Basically, you build a simple frame out of 1x4 poplar, groove it (either with a sawblade or attached plastic valences) to accept screendoor rubber strips, and then stretch/press the fabric into the grooves with the rubber strips like you're making a big screen door. The go-to fabric these days is white milliskin Spandex. If you're game, you can do it in a day for well under a hundred bucks. It's especially attractive for screens under 120 inches (diagonal) that might be too bright with a "normal" screen. Personally, I like the idea of having dialogue seeming to emerge from the actors themselves, just like in a commercial theater.

If you're serious enough about audio to be thinking this way, you should also be thinking about prepping the space so that it sounds good. That usually comes down to using surface materials that absorb sound and make the room less reverberant. You will hear dialogue more clearly, and if you want more reverberation and "liveness," you can usually just dial that in with the digital surround effects present in most modern surround sound receivers.

In your case, I would stuff the ceiling with fiberglass insulation between the rafters (you should do that anyway) and then cover them with acoustic tile. Walls are usually the real issue, but your space has cathedral-like slanted walls that lend themselves to this approach. There are things you can do to the walls themselves (carpet, HVAC insulatiion panels) to help them absorb sound, but that's probably worthy of a later post.

Mounting is mounting -- find a stud, put an anchor in, suspend from the anchor.
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